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What does in God’s image mean? He created Adam & Eve without a moral sense.

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posted on Mar, 31 2012 @ 11:01 PM
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Originally posted by RSF77
reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


Wow, you are just incapable of answering my questions huh?

Your entire post is an exercise in inflating your ego. The only possible way of defending your belief is twisted semantics and complication.


I'll say it slowly...


This info comes from:

Dr. Jacques Vallee

and

Dr. J. Allen Hynek

They are NOT Christians or believers in God.


Are you simply pissed off you cannot claim "Christian Bias"? Seems so to me.


edit on 31-3-2012 by NOTurTypical because: (no reason given)




posted on Mar, 31 2012 @ 11:08 PM
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reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


What does that really have to do with anything? Do you assume I subscribe to their beliefs?

Do you even understand what I was trying to say to you in the last page?

Are you able to communicate like a normal person or is this all there is to it?
edit on 31-3-2012 by RSF77 because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 31 2012 @ 11:09 PM
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Originally posted by RSF77
reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


What does that really have to do with anything? Do you assume I subscribe to their beliefs?



Appealing to them in matters of UFOlogy is like appealing to Einstein in matters of E=mc^2.

That's why.



posted on Mar, 31 2012 @ 11:37 PM
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reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


Okay great, ufology, that's where you got that from... great.

Now, how about the rest of my post, care to answer those questions?

Maybe try and do it without your ego. Here, I'll give you a hand:


Originally posted by RSF77
So god does not have free will or is that exclusive to us? Or do you even know where we are going with this? Remember this whole thread is about us being created in gods image, whatever that means.

I suppose that means god has the ability to choose between good and evil too huh? How do you know your god isn't actually evil and deceiving you? If he is so omnipotent obviously hes a lot smarter than you and already knows what you're thinking.

What is your answer to that? What if your god (assuming he exists) is fooling you with all his omnipotence?


Do you have any answer to that or do you want to focus on personal insults some more?

My fault, you see I hold the belief you are a delusional bigot, so I probably added a lot of stuff in there I should have left out so it didn't become a holier than thou sideshow. I understand you have the tendency to focus on that kind of stuff, I should have omitted it.
edit on 31-3-2012 by RSF77 because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 02:02 AM
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It means just what it says.

wiki

An image (from Latin: imago) is an artifact, for example a two-dimensional picture, that has a similar appearance to some subject—usually a physical object or a person.

Kind of hard to argue with that. I like the inference that we are one less dimension than the "original".

I'll buy that.



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 06:33 AM
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reply to post by RSF77
 



Do you have any answer to that or do you want to focus on personal insults some more?


That sir is the epitome of irony. You made the above statement then go off into more insults of your own. Even your edit to add "apology" is another insult, not even thinly-veiled either. I actually think I'm going to ignore your posts until you stop doing what you demand others do. That's another fallacy of logic:


Special Pleading is a fallacy in which a person applies standards, principles, rules, etc. to others while taking herself (or those she has a special interest in) to be exempt, without providing adequate justification for the exemption. This sort of "reasoning" has the following form:


Special Pleading Fallacy.

I'll answer any question you have when you stop acting like a douchebag. You've done nothing but attack and insult. I have been very patient with you.

So,.. are you finished yet?



edit on 1-4-2012 by NOTurTypical because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 09:10 AM
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I feel that I cannot speak. So much faith so much faith. Maybe I need to grow my faith smaller, as Jesus said we only need faith as big as a mustard seed if it is real faith.



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 09:21 AM
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reply to post by RevelationGeneration
 

Well Jesus promised that he would return. And God has never left or forsaken us. Followers of Christ are filled with the Holy Spirit.

Too bad you can't see the irony in your own statement.
If Jesus never left, then how does he return?
If we are spiritually filled, what benefit is there to Jesus being physically with us?
Is the real reason why apocalypticists hold such beliefs is that they want to see a blood bath?
edit on 1-4-2012 by jmdewey60 because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 12:21 PM
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Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by RevelationGeneration
 

Well Jesus promised that he would return. And God has never left or forsaken us. Followers of Christ are filled with the Holy Spirit.

Too bad you can't see the irony in your own statement.
If Jesus never left, then how does he return?
If we are spiritually filled, what benefit is there to Jesus being physically with us?
Is the real reason why apocalypticists hold such beliefs is that they want to see a blood bath?
edit on 1-4-2012 by jmdewey60 because: (no reason given)


Do pregnant women look forward to their day of delivery because they enjoy the excruciating pain or is it a necessary thing to go through so they can finally hold their child in their arms?



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 12:56 PM
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reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


You seem to be unable to stay on topic, so I'll just reply with the same quote you never addressed, if that helps:


Originally posted by RSF77
So god does not have free will or is that exclusive to us? Or do you even know where we are going with this? Remember this whole thread is about us being created in gods image, whatever that means.

I suppose that means god has the ability to choose between good and evil too huh? How do you know your god isn't actually evil and deceiving you? If he is so omnipotent obviously hes a lot smarter than you and already knows what you're thinking.

What is your answer to that? What if your god (assuming he exists) is fooling you with all his omnipotence?



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 01:09 PM
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Originally posted by NOTurTypical
reply to post by RSF77
 



Do you have any answer to that or do you want to focus on personal insults some more?


That sir is the epitome of irony. You made the above statement then go off into more insults of your own.

I'll answer any question you have when you stop acting like a douchebag. You've done nothing but attack and insult. I have been very patient with you.


Oh the irony.


Actually that's not a statement, it's a question. Isn't that ironic? lol.

Since you want to play word lawyer all day, I got another one for you:


Definition of HYPOCRITE
1: a person who puts on a false appearance of virtue or religion
2: a person who acts in contradiction to his or her stated beliefs or feelings


Also, I love how people on ATS tend to use the word "fallacy" like nobody else else knows what it means, lol.
edit on 1-4-2012 by RSF77 because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 01:11 PM
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reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


I'm not talking about the antedeluvian world. Im talking post exodus Isrealite genocide of the "promised" land. The kill those guys and take their sh!t, land and foreskin part of the OT. Those were people right?



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 01:27 PM
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reply to post by RSF77
 


I didn't call you a douchebag, I said you've been acting like one. There is a difference.



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 01:29 PM
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Originally posted by Buddha1098
reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


I'm not talking about the antedeluvian world. Im talking post exodus Isrealite genocide of the "promised" land. The kill those guys and take their sh!t, land and foreskin part of the OT. Those were people right?


Genesis 6 says they were the demi-god offspring of fallen angels and human women. They were Nephillim and Rephaim. Read Genesis 6, it says fallen angels again did the same thing (verse 4) as they did before the flood. That's why the fallen angels are reserved now in chains in the Abyss awaiting their judgment.

Demons are the unclean spirits of those Nephillim and Rephaim, they aren't fallen angels. Angels never seek embodiment, they always appeared as humans.


4There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.


Then when Joshua and the spies were looking at the land (Cannan) what did they see dwelling there that terrified them? (Numbers 13:33)


And there we saw the Nephilim (the sons of Anak, who come from the Nephilim), and we seemed to ourselves like grasshoppers, and so we seemed to them.”



satan was trying to defile the human bloodline to prevent the "seed of the woman" prophecy from coming to pass that would "crush his head". Same thing he tried to do before the flood of Noah's day.



Genesis 6, Numbers 13, Joshua 15


edit on 1-4-2012 by NOTurTypical because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 01:44 PM
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Originally posted by NOTurTypical
reply to post by RSF77
 


I didn't call you a douchebag, I said you've been acting like one. There is a difference.


And I didn't say you were a delusional bigot, I said I hold that belief:


I hold the belief you are a delusional bigot


So, according to you does that qualify as an insult too or what? Or is it basically all the trash that comes out of you is pure gold and anything anyone else says is an insult because of specific ways in which you word it?

Give me a break... there is no difference, you are just playing lawyer. You put yourself on such a pedestal you can't even speak right and don't recognize you're own insults while you bash everyone else for theirs. Nothing you do is subject to your own little version of morality that you project on to everyone else. AKA you think your poop doesn't stink and that you are smarter than everyone else.

When I said you speak as if you are in possession of some divine knowledge, it doesn't really have anything to do with Hynak, Valle or ufology. The "EDs" aren't really relevant at all, you think you are better than everyone else because have delusional conversations with yourself whilst thinking you are speaking to god. I don't like people like you at all, you've taken religion and turned it into your own personal shield for committing bigotry free from idiots criticism. Well I am not an idiot and I see you for who you really are, free from any blinding religious idealism.

You cannot speak to me as a person, you hide behind your semantics. You want to ignore me because I don't respect your fantastical views and you refuse to accept the idea that if your god exists he may not be any "god" at all. You are only a man and you can't know anything one way or another, while you claim to be in possession of some knowledge "normal" people don't have, i.e. belief in god. You are religious because you have an inner desire to feel special or different than everyone else, in reality it makes you a delusional follower of the crowd.

You literally can't handle the truth, your ego doesn't permit you.

Again:


Originally posted by RSF77
So god does not have free will or is that exclusive to us? Or do you even know where we are going with this? Remember this whole thread is about us being created in gods image, whatever that means.

I suppose that means god has the ability to choose between good and evil too huh? How do you know your god isn't actually evil and deceiving you? If he is so omnipotent obviously hes a lot smarter than you and already knows what you're thinking.

What is your answer to that? What if your god (assuming he exists) is fooling you with all his omnipotence?

You refuse to question that. You are naive.


Just like I thought, you won't question that because it would bring your entire ego crashing down to Earth with the rest of us. You want to use excuses, sidestep the topic and ignore me. Regardless of if you answer me or not I know you'll read this, I hope you'll learn something from it but chances are you won't and probably never will.


Originally posted by NOTurTypical
Read 'sovereignty of man' as "free will". Your attempt at a rebuttal actually confirmed what I said. We're created with the free will to choose good or evil. We were not created robots.


You fail to understand the simple idea that if god has free will, he also can choose between good and evil. If he does not, then he is not what you think of as god. I was going to talk to you about this stuff, but you can't even get past step one without focusing on irrelevant bullcrap and trying to play grammatical debate team with me about stupid things like your subjective view of what an insult is and ufology.

What a joke, this is why you can never argue with Christian bigots, they just make up whatever they want and constantly play mind games.




edit on 1-4-2012 by RSF77 because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 02:19 PM
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reply to post by RSF77
 


Okay, fine, I'll play so you'll leave me alone.


So god does not have free will or is that exclusive to us?


Yes, God has both an active and passive will, He however will not violate the sovereignty He gave us as creatures in His image, He will not force anyone to love Him.


Or do you even know where we are going with this?


Not "we", and I have no idea where you're going with this. My original answer to op was a two-fold response, you didn't address the other half. You scanned for something to criticize instead of looking at the entire context. Anything taken out of context is actually a pretext for a proof-text.

Quoting out of Context.


Remember this whole thread is about us being created in gods image, whatever that means.


It means several things. Another meaning is we are 3 part entities (body, spirit, and soul), as He is a triune God.


I suppose that means god has the ability to choose between good and evil too huh?


There are certain things God cannot do. He cannot learn, He cannot lie, He cannot sin. He cannot be evil and good. That's a violation of the Law of Non-Contradiction.


How do you know your god isn't actually evil and deceiving you?


He'd violate the Law of Non Contradiction. He is omni-benevolent.


If he is so omnipotent obviously hes a lot smarter than you and already knows what you're thinking.


Knowing everything would be omniscience, not omnipotence. Omnipotence would be "all powerful".


What is your answer to that? What if your god (assuming he exists) is fooling you with all his omnipotence?


That makes no sense. He cannot violate His own nature. He cannot be both X and not X at the same time and same contextual organization.


You refuse to question that. You are naive.


Again, I wasn't born with a Bible in one hand and a rosary in the other. I've only been a believer for about a decade now. Questioning everything I had been taught and raised with is what got me to where I am today. I don't need to evaluate the other position, I came from the other position.


edit on 1-4-2012 by NOTurTypical because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 02:55 PM
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You'll "play" with me? Didn't you come to this thread to talk about this? Or is it that you only want to discuss things that re-enforce your view without criticism?

If so, you are in the wrong forum.


Originally posted by NOTurTypical

So god does not have free will or is that exclusive to us?


Yes, God has both an active and passive will, He however will not violate the sovereignty He gave us as creatures in His image, He will not force anyone to love Him.


Ah, great, so god is basically like sonar. What's the difference between his active will and his passive will?
If he will not violate our sovereignty, why do people pray for things?
Why do people ask god to help people, bless things, etc?
Why do people say "the lord works in mysterious ways" if he won't do anything anyways?
Wouldn't refusing to help someone in need when you can help them be a form of neglect and sort of wrong all in itself?

Once again I also beg the question that if we are made in his image, how can he not be at least somewhat inherently evil? Some people are seemingly evil, or at have no concept of morality and empathy, in fact I would say most people are like this. People are driven by their ego to commit wrongs, does god also have an ego?


Originally posted by NOTurTypical
Not "we", and I have no idea where you're going with this. My original answer to op was a two-fold response, you didn't address the other half. You scanned for something to criticize instead of looking at the entire context. Anything taken out of context is actually a pretext for a proof-text.


Of course I am criticizing you, what did you think I was doing?

I am omitting some things in your post because I don't see them as relevant to what I want to know. I've already responded to a bunch of bs I just should have ignored anyways. I have the freedom to respond or quote whatever I want, you can bash me for that all you want, I don't really care.


Originally posted by NOTurTypical
It means several things. Another meaning is we are 3 part entities (body, spirit, and soul), as He is a triune God.


As a human how is it possible for you to know these things as fact?

Don't say faith, that is an escapist answer. The bible was written and manipulated by humans, so you can't really use that as proof of anything, humans are far from truthful and tend to do whatever serves their own agenda. Especially considering the extent of time that all this information was passed through, it is almost impossible that the concepts have remained the same throughout time. In fact, they are probably completely different.

Also, if he is three gods (three parts?) why does he command his followers to worship him as only one? That is basically accepted by Christians correct?


Originally posted by NOTurTypical
There are certain things God cannot do. He cannot learn, He cannot lie, He cannot sin. He cannot be evil and good. That's a violation of the Law of Non-Contradiction.


I thought he was supposed to be god? If he cannot do some things, then he has some higher authority or he is not god. If god has a higher authority (god's god), then that would seem to imply that there are multiple gods while most Christians believe there is one god.

This doesn't make any sense at all. How is it possible that a single, omnipotent god cannot do something?


Originally posted by NOTurTypical
He'd violate the Law of Non Contradiction. He is omni-benevolent.


Unless hes tricking you, which is what I was saying. That answer doesn't explain it.

Of course an evil god would lead you to believe he is nothing but good. Adam and eve and the serpent for example, timeo danaos et dona ferentes, etc.


Originally posted by NOTurTypical
Knowing everything would be omniscience, not omnipotence. Omnipotence would be "all powerful".


Omnipotence would seem to include omniscience. If he lacked some knowledge then he wouldn't be all powerful.

Regardless, that wasn't the point. Omnipotent, omniscient or not he is obviously smarter than you if he is god, how do you know he isn't tricking you?

You didn't answer the question, you're playing word games again.


Originally posted by NOTurTypical
That makes no sense. He cannot violate His own nature. He cannot be both X and not X at the same time and same contextual organization.


Same as above, you aren't answering the question.

How is it possible you can know all these laws and restrictions for your god as fact? You can't, it's made up to try and close loopholes in logic.

Sidestepping the entire question of his existence, there is no way for you to know you aren't in fact worshiping an evil god. Given the blatant hypocrisy and violence of people who believe in god, I would say he probably is. Religion serves as justification.



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 02:57 PM
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reply to post by RSF77
 

What a joke, this is why you can never argue with Christian bigots, they just make up whatever they want and constantly play mind games.
"Christian bigot" would be an oxymoron.
What you are describing is an anti-christian, which is someone not actually converted, but who makes up a new definition of being "saved" to include people who act exactly the same as from before they started labeling themselves as a Christian. So they end up with a counter religion which bears a similarity because of a common vocabulary but all the words have different definitions.



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 03:08 PM
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reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


Do you have any scientific evidence for the existence of the Nephelim? Has there ever been a giant skeleton found in the area of Canaan? If so I'd love to see it and if not why do you believe the account of the perpetrators of a genocide?

If the Nazis had won the WWII and Hitler wrote a book about how God had told him to destroy the Czechs and when they got there they were Giants would you believe it? If not why do you believe the biblical account?

Militant Islamists claim to be divinely inspired. Why are they wrong and the Israelites right?



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 03:09 PM
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reply to post by jmdewey60
 


That seems to be the trend in religion. While some I would define some Christians as moral people, for the most part the religion doesn't seem to be doing it's apparent purpose of providing people with a righteous path to follow.

You would figure with the tendency for corruption and hypocrisy in the concept of the Christian religion, it would be seen as ineffective. If the religion is truth then god did a horrible job of creating a concept that drives people to do good. If man has corrupted and twisted the religion(which I would venture to say is the case), then god lacks foresight and is not omnipotent. If man has not and what we have now is the true nature of the religion, then god is not omni-benevolent and is in fact at least somewhat evil.

If you want to find the most true religion based on the quality of its followers and the ability of the religion to create a moral, empathic person, then I would say Buddhism is closer to the truth.


Originally posted by jmdewey60
"Christian bigot" would be an oxymoron.


I guess that depends on your own subjective view of the quality of a "Christian". You are suggesting that all Christians are free from bigotry?

That's a laugh.
edit on 1-4-2012 by RSF77 because: (no reason given)




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