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What a doctor knows about ObamaCare

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posted on Mar, 31 2012 @ 01:17 PM
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What a doctor knows about ObamaCare

A real Doctor has written an article that reveals some of the realities of an
ObamaCare style system.

He shows how "insurance" Does Not Guarantee good and timely health service.


By Dr. Marc Siegel
Published March 30, 2012
| FoxNews.com

At the heart of the multi-headed abominable creature known as Affordable Care Act aka ObamaCare, there resides a singular deceit. It is too easy for lawyers and even U.S. Supreme Court Justices to miss this deceit in the process of arguing abstractions, but I and other doctors experience this reality every day our offices:

Insurance does not equal care. One patient’s needs can get in the way of another’s needs. My waiting room is like so many others in America, and when it is clogged with several patients with low-paying highly-regulated insurance, the waiting time goes up and the access to quality medical care goes down.



And,

With all due respect to Supreme Court Justice Sonia Sotomayor, though it is true that everyone will get sick and need health care eventually, it is not true that health insurance automatically provides you with that care.

I can tell you as a practicing physician that the regulations and restrictions and red tape of health insurance (all increasing under ObamaCare) hamstring my office staff and interfere with my ability to take care of you.

What does provide an uninsured patient access to health care are laws that mandate that a hospital emergency room can’t turn you away when you are sick.

Doctor Doctor


We have seen a dramatic shift of thought by ObamaCare supporters within a very short week.

The political exposures have been devastating and numbing.

Many "supporters" have been awakened by the massive incompetence

displayed by the 111th Congress (2009/2010) concerning the "real" health issues.




posted on Mar, 31 2012 @ 01:41 PM
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Have a feeling it is going to get struck down. We won't know for a while, though. Justices have to do their arguments pro or co in private and have to write out their concurrence or opposing positions after the decision is made.
Business owners and doctors need to know as soon as possible.



posted on Mar, 31 2012 @ 01:44 PM
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That means nothing to the millions without health care or the ones who have lost their homes battling cancer or one accident.

We in Canada have appointments usually very swiftly unless doc is on vacation. Get hospital and if low income, medicines free or for very low monthly payments, and all lab work, and walk in clinics available as well.

The real culprit in American systems is the Insurance Corps. The US has this really odd way of taking tax dollars, and then giving it all away to Corporations for their profit, in other words, stealing tax payers to give the most pyramidal private corp service imaginable, to reward and enrich their friends, instead of using tax dollars to directly run the services, which anyone can figure out is the best and most cost efficient way and of course, universal.

But in the US, they call all direct use of tax dollars that way, PINK, RED, COMMIE RUN FOR THE HILLS......!!!!

Thus have fully brainwashed people into paying for their abuse and being fleeced.



posted on Mar, 31 2012 @ 01:52 PM
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I'm terribly confused over this Obamacare issue.
I thought at first it was some kind of govt subsidized ins that would be a step above medicaid
Now it seems like it is a forced issue, and all american citizens will be required to pay into it ?
If people like me cant afford insurance now, how can we afford to be forced to pay into it?

I broke my hand thursday, I'm sure of it. Because I'm terrified of the expense of going even to a doc in a box, I've just wrapped it up and am dealing with it. it sucks. my hand is so swollen i have no knuckles and it's swollen all the way into my wrist and up into my fingers. Advil is not phasing it.
the sorry thing is if I was an illegal immigrant and pregnant I would probably have free care. I don't get it.
edit on 31-3-2012 by horseplay because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 31 2012 @ 02:04 PM
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Originally posted by Unity_99
That means nothing to the millions without health care or the ones who have lost their homes battling cancer or one accident.

We in Canada have appointments usually very swiftly unless doc is on vacation. Get hospital and if low income, medicines free or for very low monthly payments, and all lab work, and walk in clinics available as well.

The real culprit in American systems is the Insurance Corps. The US has this really odd way of taking tax dollars, and then giving it all away to Corporations for their profit, in other words, stealing tax payers to give the most pyramidal private corp service imaginable, to reward and enrich their friends, instead of using tax dollars to directly run the services, which anyone can figure out is the best and most cost efficient way and of course, universal.

But in the US, they call all direct use of tax dollars that way, PINK, RED, COMMIE RUN FOR THE HILLS......!!!!

Thus have fully brainwashed people into paying for their abuse and being fleeced.



Believe it or not The Majority of Americans knows the insurance companies are a problem.

They also now know that ObamaCare was/is not going to repair that.

Many details of ObamaCare are slowly being exposed as scams.

The internal corruption and theft is the "Commie" part.

There has never been an "uncorrupt" Commie system.

We here in America have been trying to get details on the Canadian system, but it's like pulling teeth.

You mention above that some health service IS based on income.

Sounds pretty fair, can you lead us to water with some genuine links to details ?

thanks.



posted on Mar, 31 2012 @ 02:14 PM
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reply to post by Unity_99
 


I can add also...

A complete 100% "single payer" system is not constitutional in the U.S.

What "appears" to be a 100% government run system like Medicare and Medicaid are actually
only partly funded by the Federal Government.

Each "system" is slightly different from State to State.

Even some of the ObamaCare plans that are already in place have differences from State to State.

One very good real time example is: Pre-Existing Condition Insurance Plan (PCIP)

Notice how each State has a different plan !!!
(even the States on the "Federal Program" have different rates !!)

Many people early on were convinced this guarantee of insurance for pre existing conditions was universal....
It is not, although it may be closer to a "universal" plan starting in 2014.
(IF ObamaCare is still lawful and/or not completely butchered by then !)



posted on Mar, 31 2012 @ 02:14 PM
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Health insurance doesn't affect the quality of service provided, however it does affect other associated factors such as timeliness of service rendering and availability.

Once Obamacare is implemented I believe that we'll see a huge surge in the number of patients seeking medical attention/consultation. Rather than people coming in when needing care, the new attitude towards healthcare will be "if I'm going to be forced to pay for it, I'm going to get my moneys worth out of it." We will be inundated with otherwise frivolous issues that would normally be treated with a little bit common sense. I'm not saying that medical needs shouldn't be addressed, but rather that those truly needing urgent attention will find themselves in longer lines, and waiting a longer period for available appointment slots.



posted on Mar, 31 2012 @ 02:20 PM
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Originally posted by horseplay
I'm terribly confused over this Obamacare issue.
I thought at first it was some kind of govt subsidized ins that would be a step above medicaid
Now it seems like it is a forced issue, and all american citizens will be required to pay into it ?
If people like me cant afford insurance now, how can we afford to be forced to pay into it?

I broke my hand thursday, I'm sure of it. Because I'm terrified of the expense of going even to a doc in a box, I've just wrapped it up and am dealing with it. it sucks. my hand is so swollen i have no knuckles and it's swollen all the way into my wrist and up into my fingers. Advil is not phasing it.
the sorry thing is if I was an illegal immigrant and pregnant I would probably have free care. I don't get it.
edit on 31-3-2012 by horseplay because: (no reason given)


Do yourself a favor and seek medical attention NOW. Visit your local emergency room if you don't have insurance, but your problem needs to be addressed ASAP.



posted on Mar, 31 2012 @ 02:20 PM
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Originally posted by horseplay
I'm terribly confused over this Obamacare issue.
I thought at first it was some kind of govt subsidized ins that would be a step above medicaid
Now it seems like it is a forced issue, and all american citizens will be required to pay into it ?
If people like me cant afford insurance now, how can we afford to be forced to pay into it?

I broke my hand thursday, I'm sure of it. Because I'm terrified of the expense of going even to a doc in a box, I've just wrapped it up and am dealing with it. it sucks. my hand is so swollen i have no knuckles and it's swollen all the way into my wrist and up into my fingers. Advil is not phasing it.
the sorry thing is if I was an illegal immigrant and pregnant I would probably have free care. I don't get it.
edit on 31-3-2012 by horseplay because: (no reason given)


You my friend really need to read the threads here on ATS about all this.

You're not alone, many people have been hoodwinked by ObamaCare.

Just go to any hospital.....

They can't and won't turn you away.

That has been one of the sob-story sympathy myths generated by the ObamaCare agenda.
(the level of treatment may be the problem however, that's what this article is talking about)

When they send you a bill, then deal with it.

You can not be jailed for not paying a medical bill (yet) ....

ObamaCare does have some jail time involved if you don't pay a fine.

That takes effect in 2014 (I think).

BTW, you type pretty good one-handed.



posted on Mar, 31 2012 @ 02:20 PM
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You are smart. I'm so tired of my fellow Americans I don't even know where to start. USers always talk crap about the Canadian health care system and they have not even done research to find out what it is really like. They hear one story about someone waiting six months to see a doctor and assume the entire Canadian healthcare is messed up. I'm beginning to hate my countrymen. That is not good because I know I am not alone.



posted on Mar, 31 2012 @ 02:23 PM
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Originally posted by ~Vixen~
Health insurance doesn't affect the quality of service provided, however it does affect other associated factors such as timeliness of service rendering and availability.

Once Obamacare is implemented I believe that we'll see a huge surge in the number of patients seeking medical attention/consultation. Rather than people coming in when needing care, the new attitude towards healthcare will be "if I'm going to be forced to pay for it, I'm going to get my moneys worth out of it." We will be inundated with otherwise frivolous issues that would normally be treated with a little bit common sense. I'm not saying that medical needs shouldn't be addressed, but rather that those truly needing urgent attention will find themselves in longer lines, and waiting a longer period for available appointment slots.



[color=cyan]*****

Excellent post.

And we can be pretty certain there is no provisions in ObamaCare for this problem.



posted on Mar, 31 2012 @ 02:25 PM
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Doctors are money hungry frauds.

Sell the treatment, not the cure, then lie about why the cure was not suggested.



posted on Mar, 31 2012 @ 02:30 PM
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Originally posted by Gorsebeacon
You are smart. I'm so tired of my fellow Americans I don't even know where to start. USers always talk crap about the Canadian health care system and they have not even done research to find out what it is really like. They hear one story about someone waiting six months to see a doctor and assume the entire Canadian healthcare is messed up. I'm beginning to hate my countrymen. That is not good because I know I am not alone.


I think one problem in Canada might be the lack of capitalist insurance companies.
(maybe we should be so lucky ?) (if that in fact is even true ?)

That alone may be the source of resistance in the U.S.

That's why we need true and factual information from Canadians (and others) about their system(s).

Many people are convinced a combination plan could work.

I have heard about possibilities that the American companies could simply become
"contractors" and administrate the insurance system and get paid from a Medicare style government payment..

Complicated, but the Pharmacy Benefit companies are already handling Medicare prescriptions.



posted on Mar, 31 2012 @ 02:31 PM
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Originally posted by DaTroof
Doctors are money hungry frauds.

Sell the treatment, not the cure, then lie about why the cure was not suggested.


Well yes.

That as we all know,

is part of the problem.



posted on Mar, 31 2012 @ 02:36 PM
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Originally posted by DaTroof
Doctors are money hungry frauds.

Sell the treatment, not the cure, then lie about why the cure was not suggested.


Oh really? Thanks for convicting us all of unethical practices and professional incompetence. If that's been your experience, I'd suggest taking your concerns and allegations to your local medical review board.

*** edit to add ***

People think that we're all filthy rich, but such unfair allegations fail to take into consideration many pertinent factors. You complain about compulsory insurance, but we've been forced to pay astronomical (malpractice) insurance premiums for years just for the privilege of treating people like you. You have no clue how expensive malpractice insurance is, and the prices are getting worse. Why is it so expensive? In this modern age we have to contend with a lawsuit happy society that feels like they know it all. My professional knowledge is frequently questioned and doubted because an anonymous poster in a online forum who couldn't pass a A&P course says that I'm wrong. Even when we're exonerated by professional review, we suffer the stigma of having been sued. If I was a good doctor, nobody would ever sue me, right? WRONG

People say that we charge too much, but do you have any idea what a QUALITY education in medicine costs? It's a hell of a lot more expensive than your average degree, and we have to pay our educational costs too. My bill may have been for several thousand dollars, but take a guess at how much it costs me to reserve that space in the OR for your procedure. If you back out of the procedure at the last minute, I still get caught eating the cost of that now empty OR.

It may be assumed that medical diagnosis is a simple issue that can be as simple as following a flow chart of symptoms, but human physiology is a hell of a lot more complex than that. One has to weed through dozens of potential related symptoms, take into consideration current medications, (provided we're given a complete list of medications), then deal with people that can't remember crap about their own physical problems. It was my right side. Or was it on the left? I felt it in my chest, but the pain is actually behind my ovaries. Those aren't made up, I've heard those excuses multiple times. Many people also willfully fail to disclose other things they ingest out of fear that we'll know about their illegal activities. Medicine isn't as easy as you may think it is, and everything takes time and money.

Don't take my word for it though, because like this article, a doctor online is certainly more credible than one in an online forum.

edit on 3/31/2012 by ~Vixen~ because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 31 2012 @ 02:39 PM
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Here's what one Canadian doctor who got to practice in the United States has to say about the current state of our healthcare.


The patient in the emergency department smelled of advanced cancer. It is the smell of rotting flesh, but even more pungent. You only ever have to smell it once. She had been bleeding irregularly, but chalked it up to “the change.” Peri-menopausal hormonal mayhem is the most common cause of irregular vaginal bleeding, but unfortunately not the only cause. She hadn’t gone to the doctor because she had no health insurance. The only kind of work she could get in a struggling rural community was without benefits. Her coat and shoes beside the gurney were worn and her purse from another decade. She could never afford to buy it on her own. She didn’t qualify for Medicaid, the local doctor only took insurance, and there was no Planned Parenthood or County Clinic nearby.



I had never encountered this clinical scenario during my training in Canada. I had never seen a woman suffer because she couldn’t afford something as simple as a Pap smear, never mind deal with the indignities of shopping around her sorrow and hard luck to try to patch together what would inevitably be inadequate medical therapy. It is this reality of medical care in America for which I was wholly unprepared. Many times I found the residents comforting me.


drjengunter.wordpress.com...

The same people who rail against healthcare reform in this country are the same people who railed against Social Security and Medicaid, they were wrong then and they're wrong now.



posted on Mar, 31 2012 @ 02:40 PM
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reply to post by xuenchen
 


i hate typing 1 handed. im a fanatic over typos.
i may go somewhere today, it's killing me.
im just disgusted with the system. and i still believe my husband would be alive today if he would have had insurance.
guess that's part of my attitude problem.



posted on Mar, 31 2012 @ 03:10 PM
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Originally posted by horseplay
reply to post by xuenchen
 


i hate typing 1 handed. im a fanatic over typos.
i may go somewhere today, it's killing me.
im just disgusted with the system. and i still believe my husband would be alive today if he would have had insurance.
guess that's part of my attitude problem.



GO !!

Find the nearest County Hospital.

They actually get reimbursed by the government !!

If your income is low, you might be able to get Medicaid.



posted on Mar, 31 2012 @ 10:07 PM
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reply to post by horseplay
 


Don't know which state you're in but many states have emergency care clinics with doctors who treat walk-ins. I know in Oregon they do. They pretty much operate on business hours and many on saturdays during the days. If your state has one, please make a visit. Usually the visits are around $80.00 (they were the last time I went to one.) The docs can look at your hand, prescribe meds and recommend further medical advice. It's cheap and quick. A good alternative to the regular family physician or emergency room and, you don't need insurance. I say this because many medical clinics in Oregon won't see you if you don't have medical insurance. I had a regular family physician for 20 years. My employment changed and I no longer had health insurance. They would not give me an appointment even though I told them I would pay as I went. (Which I had been doing for some time because I lied and kept showing my insurance card which had not yet expired but was really no longer in effect, giving them excuses about something being wrong with the information etc.) I was furious that I could no longer see my regular physician of 20+ years and had to go to the county clinics. I had high BP so it wasn't that big a deal except they had crappy doctors. I had read up a lot on BP, meds I was taking etc plus my doc had told me a great deal about certain meds, why you can't have too much of this with that etc. So when a young doc re-did my meds, he mis-prescribed and I had to tell him he was prescribing too much of this and yada yada yada, which he agreed and altered his preiscription. The county clinics also don't give you a regular physician, you see whomever is available. That I don't like. Medical care is compromised when you see someone who is unfamiliar with you, because I have seen too many times where the doc doesn't read much of your medical chart and really knows nothing about you.



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 07:20 PM
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reply to post by Gridrebel
 


I am in a state program which lets me see an md for $20 which is a blessing. I'm on thyroid meds so I have to see someone. although she moved clinics, I have stayed with the same md for 4 years now and I just love her, even though I have to drive 1 hour to see her now.

I decided in lieu of doc in a box to go to my sisters yesterday, she's an RN with many years in ER. Her husband sells pharma supplies so he has a ton of supplies. I know, still inconclusive but she is pretty sure I broke my metacarpal bone. she wrapped me very professional like and I'm going to go see my md tomorrow just to verify I suppose. I really don't think docs will do anything else for me but wrap it also. maybe give me a tetanus and some painkillers would be nice.
I do know a local hospital will see me if I fill out gobs of forms. I just didn't feel like being stuck in a waiting room forever and hospital bills seem to keep perpetuating no many how many forms you fill out. Every person that looks at you has a separate bill...

My husband died in the hospital 2.5 years ago. despite filling out the' forms' I received a total of about $12000 for 10 hours in the hospital. and the doctor didn't even bill me because he died. I was forced to put things into a probate estate just to get out from under the bills, which although it is still ongoing is still better than bankruptcy.

BTW, back on topic. I often wonder if my husband would have had better treatment (and still be alive today) if he would have had insurance. although he went in for heart pains, they seemed to ignore that fact until 10 hours later - in ICU no less - he had a widow maker heart attack. If he would have had insurance, would they have been more aggressive in treating him ?





edit on 1-4-2012 by horseplay because: typo. pet peeve.

edit on 1-4-2012 by horseplay because: (no reason given)



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