Has ATS Become Useless?

Please reserve judgment until reading fully...

Over the past few years I have noticed a disturbing yet potentially crucial swing in UFO and/or paranormal posts, discussions, and possible proof. That being we have gone beyond the threshold where just about anything can be faked to a degree where nothing can be taken as 'proof' anymore. Not a single photo, video, or anything can be put forth that could not be dismissed by the 'reasonable' premis of forgery and/or hoax. Not a single document can be posted that could be above suspicion, and no one gives a rats bum for personal expierence anymore.

Point being, ATS is the place where we converge to try and validate paranormal activities, conspiracies, and other worldly phenomona. Yet the mission is a fruitless one. NOTHING can hold up anymore, everything can be hoaxed, technology has ushered that in. Even a live feed of a mass UFO landing witnessed by millions can be dismissed by TPTB using holographic and/or technological and genetic advancments beyond the common knowledge barrior.

So, if all ATS can only offer post after post of opinion, political arguments, and mild entertainment, whats the point? I know this may come off as a 'half empty' type of opinion but I'm trying my hardest to believe we still have hope of validation, but I just can not see it... Maybe it's time for ATS to simply become a Facebook page where opinion, argument, and rehashed "news" is there forte. Unless of course you still believe we stand above such things with the possability of actual proof or validation towards the ATS theme(s) we all crave? Do we still need ATS aside from just another site to bicker about, is the hope to 'deny ignorance' and to find the truth dead?

Originally posted by HomeBrew
Please reserve judgment before reading fully...

Over the past few years I have noticed a disturbing yet potentially crucial swing in UFO and/or paranormal posts, discussions, and possible proof. That being we have gone beyond the threshold where just about anything can be faked to a degree where nothing can be taken as 'proof' anymore. Not a single photo, video, or anything can be put forth that could not be dismissed by the 'reasonable' premis of forgery and/or hoax. Not a single document can be posted that could be above suspicion, and no one gives a rats bum for personal expierence anymore.

Point being, ATS is the place where we converge to try and validate paranormal activities, conspiracies, and other worldly phenomona. Yet the mission is a fruitless one. NOTHING can hold up anymore, everything can be hoaxed, technology has ushered that in. Even a live feed of a mass UFO landing witnessed by millions can be dismissed by TPTB using holographic and/or technological and genetic advancments beyond the common knowledge barrior.

So, if all ATS can only offer post after post of opinion, political arguments, and mild entertainment, whats the point? I know this may come off as a 'half empty' type of opinion but I'm trying my hardest to believe we still have hope of validation, but I just can not see it... Maybe it's time for ATS to simply become a Facebook page where opinion, argument, and rehashed "news" is there forte. Unless of course you still believe we stand above such things with the possability of actual proof or validation towards the ATS theme(s) we all crave? Do we still need ATS aside from just another site to bicker about, is the hope to 'deny ignorance' and to find the truth dead?

Think of it this way -- We may not be able to root out all the legit/fake UFO/Paranormal threads, but at least we have the other sub forums where we can figure out the conspracies within the governments

ATS is about questioning everything. That's the whole point of it's site. The owners username is SkepticOverlord and the motto is deny ignorance.

Everything should be try to be debunked first. To assume it something is paranormal before going through logical outcomes is silly.

reply to post by HomeBrew

Please reserve judgment before reading fully...

I know you meant 'after', but I just wanted to politely point this out to you.

I wouldn't say ATS is useless for this subject. Personally, I'm hoping that someone some day will post a pic and say "I just saw this over (city), Georgia. It was heading north. Then, another member spots it in South Carolina and also posts a photo. So on and so forth.

I realize that this can be hoaxed, too. But in a perfect world, these sightings and photos would be posted by respected members who aren't known to hoax or create fictional photos.

In a perfect world....

It has, IMO. I came here for UFO discussion, but have been seriously put off by the politics of it. It seems to me in most threads if you don't take a hard right or left position, you will be laughed (or ridiculed) out of the thread.

Originally posted by HomeBrew
Point being, ATS is the place where we converge to try and validate paranormal activities, conspiracies, and other worldly phenomona. Yet the mission is a fruitless one.

The biggest problem just might be that the craziness, conspiracy and the paranormal is so rampant in regular news and entertainment outlets that ATS is really no longer "alternative." Where does a good chunk of the Breaking News come from? Yahoo! News.

So what ATS becomes, kind of by default is a place to go to see the nonsense debunked, not flourish. And sometimes that's not all that entertaining.

Originally posted by RealSpoke
ATS is about questioning everything. That's the whole point of it's site. The owners username is SkepticOverlord and the motto is deny ignorance.

Everything should be try to be debunked first. To assume it something is paranormal before going through logical outcomes is silly.

I agree and this is somewhat my point, I do not believe there is anything that can not be reasonably debunked. Or at the very lease unprovable beyond a shadow of doubt. Seems somewhat fruitless then... But still entertaining I guess!

Originally posted by Afterthought
reply to post by HomeBrew

 

Please reserve judgment before reading fully...

I know you meant 'after', but I just wanted to politely point this out to you.

I wouldn't say ATS is useless for this subject. Personally, I'm hoping that someone some day will post a pic and say "I just saw this over (city), Georgia. It was heading north. Then, another member spots it in South Carolina and also posts a photo. So on and so forth.

I realize that this can be hoaxed, too. But in a perfect world, these sightings and photos would be posted by respected members who aren't known to hoax or create fictional photos.

In a perfect world....

Thanks for the heads up! (Fixed)

And I too still come here for that breaking news, but also know that just about anything can be hoaxed. Kinda sad to think about really...

Originally posted by DarkKnight76
It has, IMO. I came here for UFO discussion, but have been seriously put off by the politics of it. It seems to me in most threads if you don't take a hard right or left position, you will be laughed (or ridiculed) out of the thread.

I can see that too, however I guess it's just the nature of this forum. I just read more than I post

Originally posted by Afterthought
reply to post by HomeBrew

 

Please reserve judgment before reading fully...

I know you meant 'after', but I just wanted to politely point this out to you.

I think (s)he meant exactly what (s)he said: Don't judge what (s)he's saying until you read it all.

A UFO video or photograph is only as good as the corroborating evidence. In other words as part of real research. There doesn't seem to be much of that happening here. Maybe I'm missing it but most of the UFO talk frequently is about anonymous Youtube videos.

I dont think much has changed in that everything has always been able to be faked, faking photographs has been around for as long as photography and the same with video / film.

Our ability to recognise forgeries also seems to evolve along with the technology, Arthur Conan Doyle for example saw this photograph (an obvious fake to most people now)

completely at face value as being evidence of paranormal phenomena and he was by no means a stupid man.

A picture, as a poster above said can only ever be a piece of evidence, not proof by its self and just as in a court room people are free to discuss the evidence and its reliability, the ufo forum will always be useful for those discussions

The "proof" submitted here at ATS when it comes to UFOs and paranormal activities is ASININE at best the majority of the time.

We have folks screaming "ALIENS" at every photo or video of an aircraft up in the sky. Every craft up in the sky has some of the UFO-freaks here screaming "ALIENS" from their rooftops.

AND, even IF such craft may not be immediately identifiable, that doesnt AUTOMATICALLY mean that there are "aliens" or "outer galactic beings" piloting them.

In FACT, any odd craft up there are HUMAN pilots 99% of the time if not 100% of the time. Just because folks have never heard of these new classified craft, that DOESNT mean that they are not out there and MAN-MADE. Meaning NOT being driven by "aliens" and "martians".

And the "paranormal activities" photos submitted here, well... What can you say?

The HUGE majority of "ghost" photos here make our "ghost hunters" look like immature kids, or mentally-defective adults having WILD, overactive imaginations. The CRAP that folks claim to see in ORDINARY photos is FRIGHTENING to say the least. Borderline INSANE...

ATS has become a joke for many "ghost" and "alien" hunters. And its NOT the fault of the skeptics... Guess WHOSE fault it is??

Guess.

I think it has lost alot of value to me.

There has been a decline in threads with substance. And threads with substance get no attention, because people actually have to read, so they get buried.

The most dicussed threads are usually threads that have less than 10 lines, or a video and 2 lines.

It has become quite the chore to find interesting, intelligent threads on here.
Alot of shock value threads for star and flag hunting.

I have never even been on below topsecret, and won't go, that is not why I came here in the first place.

Even though it has lost alot of the value it once held for me I still check in from time to time, because I know there are some hard working people who make quality threads with good information.

Even if i don't agree with what soemone has to say, if they put effort into making a good thread, interesting information or opinion, with multiple sources and corraberations, I am more than happy to S&F.

The replies to OP's are also in decline, but I digress.

Good thought in the OP, but just like anything else the quality will decline as the site grows.

P.S. I don't blame the moderators, I understand how hard it is to follow so many threads.

reply to post by HomeBrew

Has ATS Become Useless?

I don't think so.

From what I have seen, ATS has a unique and powerful asset, it's members.

That was clearly noticeable on the last ATS game, that was supposed to last for a couple of days but was solved in some hours. For those that were following the game from "behind the scenes" (like I did) could see that just after some two or three hours some three or four members had already all the details needed, they only needed to join their conclusions, and that only took some hours to do, even if some were from a different time zone.

That's why I think that, if we are faced with a real paranormal and/or Aliens or UFOs related situation, we can also ask for the help of all members.

The combined mind power of thousands of people is not something that can be considered useless.

PS: and everything was "hoaxeable" before, the difference is that now we have a higher percentage of people that think that they can make a convincing hoax because it looks easier.

Nothing original or new to see here, please move on. Eating the same garbage(news) every day, what do you expect from the masses? No more fantasy, no more imagination, just programmed to take it in what they feed us. Oh, wanted to add, I see that there is a New "Three Stooges" coming out, maybe it is the END, because if tht isns't a sign I don't know what else is. Peace! Xenongod

I don't think this site has become useless, but I do believe it's been taken over by the 2012 crowd. By that I mean, everytime there's an earthquake, sunspot, or weather event, this board is filled with "proof" of the Mayan calendar. It's as if these events have never occurred before! I'm thinking the board will get back on track by 1 Jan 2013.

Also, as far as the political issues go, this is an election year and it's to be expected. Especially with those gun stealing liberals in office! What do you mean I can't buy a Stinger missle? Dang you liberals!

One last, seems everytime someone sees a "military" vehicle, whether on a train or on the road, we get the panicked souls crying out that martial law is imminent. And again, the gov't is coming for our guns...

Again, on 1 Jan 2013, I think this site will see a sharp decrease in users...unless someone comes up with a new tranlation of the Mayan calendar or a new shard of pottery is discovered with the date 11/12/13 stamped in it.

I still think there are good discussions on this board, you just have to wade through the bad to get to them. Just give it a few more months.

Useless? Well that's dependant on the membership.

ATS is a member generated content website, if there's an issue with content, it's the membership who are causing that issue.

IMO it hasn't. ATS is still very unique among internet forums for a variety of reasons. I think that if we feel like ATS is less than it should be, then first step is evaluating our own contributions to the site and see if they are up to our own standards for other's content.

It's the old mantra of " Be the change you'd like to see."

~Tenth

Thanks for all the comments, but allow me to digress...

Although the title was made part in jest, my main point here was that any political or conspirital conversation for any topic seems to always just be bickering. Any kind of evidence for anything simply can not be held as beyond a reasonable doubt anymore due to technology. ATS to me is the place to sift through the rubble in hopes of finding the smoking gun, proof... But the catch is that nothing can ever be considered so.

I agree that the staff and member base here are the top of the food chain with regards to the theme, and to this end ATS is still a place I frequent almost daily. I just can't help but feel that it has become entirely entertainment with no real hope of proof. Personal experience of a paranormal nature is always bunk at face value, photos or videos or any kind of evidence is always suspect and easily dismissed, if not out of hand then with worldly possibility.

I guess I am just frustrated. Half of the positive experience of this, to me, is the hope and wonder it brings. Unfortunately many do not share in this and do whatever it takes to kill all that off as soon as possible. Yet, I understand that's the function. Cyclical I know...

There was a time when I wanted to have my gold member banner and such.
www.abovetopsecret.com...
www.abovetopsecret.com...

I am capable of making a good thread. There are many subjects that I want to do a good thread about.

The question is why? After spending hours of doing research, dotting the I's annd crossing the T's, the thread will be passed up and buried for some ignorant thread about some racial "happening" or complete and utter unrational thread.

After my short, getting longer, stay here at ATS, I have learned that it isn't what you put in "it". It is how popular or inflammatory your post is......

For a site that has a motto of "Deny Ignorance". Ignorance seems to be plentiful around here.
www.abovetopsecret.com...

So you see, Lj01 has the want and desire to be a good ATS member, but I really feel that it is a waste of time and sanity.

Because of this, sometimes the troll word gets thrown around when I make a good point and go "against the grain".(just a troll question I had when I messed up once)
www.abovetopsecret.com...
I do try to stay within T&C's and I have a good time trying to put some Junkie logic into the equation.

I am not trying to pimp out my threads. I just wanted to show that I do want to be a good contributing 'ATS'er". But I feel the time and effort is really not worth it.