The Chemtrail Hoax

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posted on Feb, 12 2005 @ 01:47 PM
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HAHAHA! i love you guys. you're so 'persistent'!

i'm not a 'chemtrail believer', as i've stated many times. i am a chemtrail suspecter. one of the main cases which gives me 'persistence', is that of espagnola, ont. a whole town was sickened by low flying military planes which performed aerial spraying over the town. a petition was signed by almost the entire town, asking the government for an explanation about the planes and spraying. the government's official reply? 'they're not ours'.

there are other cases.

as i've said. i'm not interested in rehashing the whole thing.

howard, despite your repeated cries of 'victory!', ALL of our arguments have ended in a stalemate.

here's something for both of you....please accept it as my 'argument' to BOTH chemtrails and 911.....

The Law of Incompatibility: 'as complexity rises, precise statements lose meaning and meaningful statements lose precision'. -lofti zadeh, father of fuzzy logic









[edit on 12-2-2005 by billybob]



dh

posted on Feb, 12 2005 @ 05:13 PM
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Not much was discussed about chemtrails when they were in the process of destroying the health of countless millions of people but now that they’re no more than innocuous skywriting in most cases the disinformation nabobs on the net are having a field day telling us that these spiderwebs in the sky are signs of our imminent doom ;-)
CIA-payrolled crocodile-tear shedding, handwringing Twits. Chicken Littles.
I believe that what you’re seeing now is mainly done for psychological effect, with a few exceptions. The exception is when the chemtrails spread out to white out the entire sky overhead but if you’re one of the few folks who are still experiencing this you can follow the simple Gifting Recommendations on ethericwarriors.com (Tips and Strategies section) and put an end to that for a few dollars and a little of your time and effort, as thousands of us around the world have done. You won’t ever see more than a smidgeon of chemspew in our skies, even when there are eight of those white, unmarked jets trying to make a mess overhead all day long.

educate-yourself.org...



posted on Feb, 13 2005 @ 04:56 PM
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dh, only the truly deluded hang out on ethericwariors.com. That explains a lot.


dh

posted on Feb, 13 2005 @ 06:21 PM
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Originally posted by HowardRoark
dh, only the truly deluded hang out on ethericwariors.com. That explains a lot.


Actually it explains nothing, Howard
I've engaged with this technology and have been pushed out and banned except from the original lines eg
forums.cloud-busters.com...
Only the truly deluded are in denial of a world manipulation via CB and frequency



posted on Feb, 14 2005 @ 12:21 PM
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Your request for information about the goal of the project I am involved in is quite valid. In the 16th century, Europe experienced what is known as a little ice age. The results of which are well documented. Based on complex projections, it is highly likely that Earth is entering a much deeper and longer ice age. My project is focused on delaying that occurrence.

It is natural to ask for proof, I required reams of data as proof before I accepted my current position. The facts that convinced me may or may not be adequate for the membership of ATS. Please let me know what sort of proof you would like to see, and I will do my utmost to acquire it. Naturally, I will not put myself or my project in jeopardy. Outside of that caveat I will do what I can.



posted on Feb, 14 2005 @ 12:55 PM
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OK, Walter, I’ll bite.

Why don’t you answer a couple of simple questions.

1) What is the “Chemical” that is used to make “chemtrails?”

2) What are it’s physical properties. (i.e. melting point, boiling point, latent heat of formation, density, to name a few)

I look forward to you answers.



posted on Feb, 14 2005 @ 12:59 PM
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Walter, after you’ve answered the above questions, how about these two.

1) What caused the “little ice age?”

2) what climatic conditions are present today that are similar to the “Little Ice Age?”

3) How do persistent contrails affect those conditions?


Don't forget to go to the very beginning of this thread and address the issues brought up by OTS.



posted on Feb, 14 2005 @ 03:34 PM
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Walter, another question would be, given the fact that contrails persist and spread under an atmospheric regime of



posted on Feb, 15 2005 @ 03:51 PM
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Well they were at it again after a long break here in upstate NY. Saw the white jets laying down a few lines here and there and saw some really wide ones that were put in place when I wasn't watching. Have no clue what they are for but I can only imagine.


dh

posted on Feb, 15 2005 @ 07:13 PM
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These little white lines are at it again
Howard and off the street
Love to snort the twins together
Dont you?



posted on Feb, 15 2005 @ 07:39 PM
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Another Chemtrail thread from Off The Street....Hmmmmmmm
(sry I came a little late I've been away)
I was a little suspicious of your interest in this subject from the other threads. Now I'm really suspicious.
I can understand you replying to someones else's thread but starting your own. You work for the aerospace industry right? Specificaly in Arizona right?
Mesa Arizona, right?
I'm not accusing you of anything and I maybe be waaaay out of line but...

www.boeing.com...

BTW I know the chemtrails are not a haox...



posted on Feb, 17 2005 @ 12:22 AM
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Off_The_Street is a government disinformation agent. He is here to perpetually derail any thread the very real chemtrail plot and to make discussion difficult in general.

I just now realize the post above this is made along the same lines. It is quite suspiscious I agree.

[edit on 17-2-2005 by joepits]


dh

posted on Feb, 17 2005 @ 05:16 PM
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Originally posted by joepits
Off_The_Street is a government disinformation agent. He is here to perpetually derail any thread the very real chemtrail plot and to make discussion difficult in general.

I just now realize the post above this is made along the same lines. It is quite suspiscious I agree.

[edit on 17-2-2005 by joepits]


Well, that's a viewpoint, joe
What's undoubtedly true is that he always works in tandem with Howard on this issue
You have to ask yourself why if they think the chemtrails debate is all a load of stuff and nonsense - why don't they leave it alone to stuff its own posterior, as it were
Why bother to fight against a pifflingly stupid idea you know isn't right
The logic is - they feel they have to derail and 'debunk' consistently in thread after thread - perhaps it's their mission and/or their job


[edit on 17-2-2005 by dh]



posted on Feb, 17 2005 @ 05:31 PM
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Perhaps further explanation is required. The ATS audience is more skeptical than most, though I would expect increased decorum and respect from a few of its members.

In response to some of the more jaded and sarcastic comments, I am not an employee of any security agency of the US Government. For the last four years, my paychecks have come from the Department of the Interior. This is largely a ruse, of course. The source of my renumeration has changed often in the five decades I have given service to my country.

The scientific community has many workable theories as to the cause of the Little Ice Age. Increased volcanism resulting in an imbalance in the global carbon cycle and an increase in atmospheric particulates, is the most popular. A second, though equally valid theory, is that a slight global warming caused by the previously mentioned volcanism caused desalination in the North Atlantic through melted ice caps. This desalination altered the flow of various ocean currents, most importantly the North Atlantic Drift. Other theories include solar inactivity leading to an overall depreciation of thermal energy planet wide.

As to the cause of contrails, the length of time they are visible and any "spreading" or dissipation that occurs, this has been covered by many on this and other ATS topics. Ambient temperature, saturated humidity and atmospheric currents are the primary factors. The chemicals we work with do not alter the contrails in any way, nor do they alter the functioning of the engines they pass through. There is no visible difference between altered and unaltered contrails.

Your question about Dr. Minnis is somewhat confusing. The SRS on radiation and aerosols at NASA is Dr. Patrick Minnis. I am quite familiar with his many papers and impressed with Dr. Minnis on a professional level. To my recollection we have never met in person. Who is James Minnis?

The current research shows that the slight amount of global warming that we are experiencing has resulted in a decrease in ocean salt levels near the poles due to glacial recession. This, in conjunction with increased volcanization over the last century has increased the amount of carbon in the atmosphere. Human contribution to this has been a small factor. The engineers' solution to the researchers' problem was to alter those two factors by freeing terrestrially locked salt sources and aiding the ocean in its natural carbon absorption function. Shortly after the FAA was created in the late 1950's, a general increase in flight-miles led the way to the current solution. Obviously, the airline industry deregulation thirty years later exponentially increased the viability of our plan.

Since engine reliability and functionality is of primary concern, and project detail secrecy is required, we focused on the simplest solution possible. The addition of salt to certain selected ocean currents and carbon scrubbing ions to every overseas flight would be the obvious solution. The random introduction factor was determined to be the optimum solution. Pure salt and ion exchange resins tend to decrease the usefulness of jet engines. A mitigating factor was developed, one that would be non-reactive in kerosene, yet ultimately reactive within the target environment after burning. The actual operative chemical processes used are simple to understand. There is, however, a level of non-disclosure surrounding the delivery methods. I can say that the process relies heavily on buckminsterfullerene molecules.



posted on Feb, 18 2005 @ 08:54 AM
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Originally posted by waltersmith
There is no visible difference between altered and unaltered contrails.


If this is true, there would be no "chemtrail" conspiracy theories, since nobody would suspect any change.



posted on Feb, 18 2005 @ 12:35 PM
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Originally posted by snotbooger

Originally posted by waltersmith
There is no visible difference between altered and unaltered contrails.


If this is true, there would be no "chemtrail" conspiracy theories, since nobody would suspect any change.


Good point



Hey Walter, Have you ever heard of Jim Phelps? what you are claiming doesn't really agree with his claims.

(not that I believe either of you two.)



posted on Feb, 18 2005 @ 06:47 PM
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Originally posted by waltersmith

Since engine reliability and functionality is of primary concern, and project detail secrecy is required, we focused on the simplest solution possible. The addition of salt to certain selected ocean currents and carbon scrubbing ions to every overseas flight would be the obvious solution. The random introduction factor was determined to be the optimum solution. Pure salt and ion exchange resins tend to decrease the usefulness of jet engines. A mitigating factor was developed, one that would be non-reactive in kerosene, yet ultimately reactive within the target environment after burning. The actual operative chemical processes used are simple to understand. There is, however, a level of non-disclosure surrounding the delivery methods. I can say that the process relies heavily on buckminsterfullerene molecules.


bollocks



posted on Feb, 18 2005 @ 07:02 PM
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Originally posted by FatherLukeDuke
bollocks


Wow! The bastion of intellectualism has spoken...



posted on Feb, 18 2005 @ 07:44 PM
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I havent read through this thread but here is a somewhat funny story about the chemtrail stuff and the kind of people who believe in it.

A few years ago a family friend started dating this guy who is somewhat of conspiracy nut and would have all sorts of theories he has read about, from Wal-Mart trying to poison us to chemtrials and even had a few websites that made it sound somewhat believable. SO this guy isgoing on about how the gov't or some secret agency is putting chemicals in the air to make us sick or something in an attempt to kill of the weaker in the population and this guy I know who works out at Cape Canaveral(NASA) is there listening to what he has to say and instead of telling the guy he's a fool he goes along with it. He tells the poor guy he's seen all kinds of military aircraft at NASA getting fitted with an aperatus to spray chemicals while they're flying and just assumed it was mosquito control but noticed the same thing in California desert at a shuttle landing and didnt think any mosquitoes where in the desert. So this guy is more convinced than ever that the government is doing some sort of chemtrail experiment and I am do the best I can to keep a straight face while my friend tells this nut about what he sees going on at NASA. To make the guy even more foolish he tells the nut to call him when he sees a suspicious planes leaving chemtrails in the sky and when the guy calls him makes up more claims about what he sees, he even comes up with some toxic chemical name that is supposidly is being spread all because he cant help but feed this guys gulibility. I have not heard from that nut in years but as far as I know no one has told him he has getting his legged pulled and probaly still thinks the story is true.



posted on Feb, 18 2005 @ 08:34 PM
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Originally posted by jrod
I havent read through this thread but here is a somewhat funny story about the chemtrail stuff and the kind of people who believe in it.


Back in Germany in '41 a family friend started dating this guy who is somewhat of conspiracy nut and would have all sorts of theories he has read about. SO this guy is going on about how the gov't or some secret agency is putting people into gas chambers or something in an attempt to kill of the weaker in the population and this guy I know who is on leave from the front is there listening to what he has to say and instead of telling the guy he's a fool he goes along with it. He tells the poor guy he's seen all kinds of people getting loaded into trains to be shiped to death camps. So this guy is more convinced than ever that the government is doing some sort of genocide and I am doing the best I can to keep a straight face while my friend tells this nut about what he sees going on at the camps. To make the guy even more foolish he tells the nut to call him when he sees a suspicious train leaving loaded with people and when the guy calls him makes up more claims about what he sees, he even comes up with some toxic chemical name that is supposidly is being used in the gas chambers all because he cant help but feed this guys gulibility. I have not heard from that nut in years but as far as I know no one has told him he has getting his legged pulled and probaly still thinks the story is true.

(BTW bad grammer not mine)





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