Debunkers: Irrational, Uninformed and Ignorant By Stanton Friedman

reply to post by Frank Warren


Has anyone considered the possibility that some aspects of the UFO and abduction phenomena are fronts for mind control and genetic experiments of Earth bound forces? They do not necessarily have to be "governments." Shadowy networks have amassed tremendous power and wealthy financing at this point in human history.

Why would aliens need our DNA when they could manufacture their own. But, Earthbound eugenics experiments would definitely need our DNA.

Aliens are probably out there, and some may be able to circumvent the light issue through physics beyond our understanding and come here. We may even have been genetically tampered with. But, aliens who have sexual relations with humans? How would that be possible when they would be from a separate genetic tree?

Bill Nye 'the science guy' is the one who always got to me. I don't mind people actually using their brain to logically explain something but this guy is the type of guy that an alien could walk up to and tap on the shoulder and he still wouldn't get it. Some people can be very smart in some ways but dumber than a rock in many others.

reply to post by WingedBull

Of course I meant it. However, you lied about the meaning and context of it.

Your entire argument rests on calling me a liar....

At the VERY MOST, I misunderstood your post.

I thought you were talking about the "belief in UFOs and Aliens", as that was the post you had quoted and were responding to. I thought you were calling UFO evidence "purposeful misreading/misinterpretation".

You used an out of context quote about a different matter, that being UFOs as a religion

It was in a thread about disclosure. I thought you were specifically responding to when someone said "the belief in UFOs and aliens...." when you said what you did.


If I misrepresented you I apologize, it was not intended.

reply to post by WingedBull

That is wonderful circular reasoning.

Yep, I know...

I know with Roswell the evidence really isn't completely on my side, but I think there's something to that story.

Originally posted by thesearchfortruth
I agree with you, you're totally right. But, I think this could be a result of the government cover up. I would really suggest reading the thread I mentioned in my last post. It details some very suspicious stuff.

You are right, there was a "cover up" in this case........only it's far more probable a cover up due to the high sensitivity and National security than anything ET.

You have to remember the climate of 1947...........it's at a time when the biggest and most violent war in history had only just concluded.........memories of warfare and the likely hood of something similar happening were quite likely high on every ones' mind .
Remember the aftermath of 9/11?
Years after 9/11 everyone particularly in the US were very wary that something similar could happen again......the aftermath of the Second World War would have been very similar although on a much more increased scale.
The US military were desperate to get the military advantage over the Russians and anything they were secretly testing would have been sensitive and not for public eyes......not surprisingly the government mounted a cover up.
And bearing in mind the absolute horrors and seriousness of the second world war and the unleashing of the world's first nuclear weapon.........any announcement that "Aliens" had landed on Earth at that time would probably not quite be as big news as it normally might have.

Originally posted by Logical one

You are right, there was a "cover up" in this case........only it's far more probable a cover up due to the high sensitivity and National security than anything ET.

That climate is rarely considered when looking at supposed UFO cover-ups during the Cold War. Far too often UFO researchers prefer to look at these cases in a vacuum and ignore history.

I would like to recommend to everyone this excellent website called "SCEPCOP - Scientific Committee to Evaluate Pseudo-Skeptic Criticism of the Paranormal":

www.debunkingskeptics.com...

Their URL is "DebunkingSkeptics.com". I love that URL!

They debunk the Pseudo-Skeptics very well there! Debunk the debunkers!

Originally posted by GLontra
They debunk the Pseudo-Skeptics very well there! Debunk the debunkers!

If by very well, you mean "by engaging in logical fallacies and generalities" then yes, they do it very well.

Originally posted by WingedBull

That climate is rarely considered when looking at supposed UFO cover-ups during the Cold War. Far too often UFO researchers prefer to look at these cases in a vacuum and ignore history.

That's very true, take the famous "Battle of Los Angeles" case of 1942.
Many UFO enthusiasts make the case that this is clear evidence of ET, what they fail to take into account is that the incident took place only a couple of months after Pearl Harbour!

And 70 years after the battle of LA..............ET has failed to launch another "attack"!
So if they were really ETs then we should have no fear of invasion if they are that easily rappelled by our 1940s World War 2 armaments.

It's funny how the scientific community takes the stance that UFOs are simply unidentified phenomena but then goes off and completely refuses to engage or investigate any of the scenarios or cases. Surely those cases that have corroborative physical and visual evidence would be amongst the top priorities of anything in the world for the scientific community to investigate. You know; something UNKNOWN? Something that occurs to MILLIONS?

only it's far more probable a cover up due to the high sensitivity and National security than anything ET.

reply to post by Logical one


They are in fact one and the same.

Many UFO enthusiasts make the case that this is clear evidence of ET, what they fail to take into account is that the incident took place only a couple of months after Pearl Harbour! And 70 years after the battle of LA..............ET has failed to launch another "attack"! So if they were really ETs then we should have no fear of invasion if they are that easily rappelled by our 1940s World War 2 armaments.

Ah yes! The good old "war nerves" cop out. Strong war nerves those, strong enough to manifest on radar.

Who exactly was attacked in that incident? This UFO certainly didn't attack anyone.

It's not that it was rappelled by 1940s armaments, it's that whatever it was was NOT rappelled by thousands upon thousands of explosive anti-aircraft shells.

Originally posted by Morg234

only it's far more probable a cover up due to the high sensitivity and National security than anything ET.

reply to post by Logical one

 

They are in fact one and the same.

There are no facts regarding this.. Or is there!? Maybe you know something we don't... Pray tell

Originally posted by EarthEvolves
Shadowy networks have amassed tremendous power and wealthy financing at this point in human history.

How do you 'know' this? All due respect but your words are based on assumptions & conjecture IMO....

Originally posted by Morg234
Ah yes! The good old "war nerves" cop out. Strong war nerves those, strong enough to manifest on radar.

So you missed the part that Pearl Harbour had just occurred 2 months earlier?

Don't you think that is highly significant?

Think about it, the US had never before been attacked from the air it's no wonder the US military would be on high alert.
Don't you think the US military would like to test out their own air defences following Pearl Harbour?

In a recent documentary SR-71 Blackbird pilots admitted that they deliberately flew past their own military installations without telling them.......just to both test out whether the installation could pick them up on radar and also to test out the capabilities of the Black bird.
I wouldn't be surprised if something similar occurred over the skies of LA that night.

Originally posted by Logical one
In a recent documentary SR-71 Blackbird pilots admitted that they deliberately flew past their own military installations without telling them.......just to both test out whether the installation could pick them up on radar and also to test out the capabilities of the Black bird.

That's my field of interest-what is the name of that program? I hope you didn't get that from T.D. Barnes, as he's just repeating mistaken anecdotes he got from CIA articles.

Originally posted by CardDown

Originally posted by Logical one
In a recent documentary SR-71 Blackbird pilots admitted that they deliberately flew past their own military installations without telling them.......just to both test out whether the installation could pick them up on radar and also to test out the capabilities of the Black bird.

That's my field of interest-what is the name of that program? I hope you didn't get that from T.D. Barnes, as he's just repeating mistaken anecdotes he got from CIA articles.

National Geographic's " Area 51: I was there"

natgeotv.com...

It was one of the pilots, I have no knowledge of TD Barnes so I Googled him, I gather he was an engineer not a pilot so it wasn't him.

reply to post by Logical one
Hiya LO, nice to see you posting.

Think about it, the US had never before been attacked from the air it's no wonder the US military would be on high alert.
Don't you think the US military would like to test out their own air defences following Pearl Harbour?

Whatever happened that night remains 'unknown' with the the more favourable explanation being a straying weather balloon (meteorological) being hit under war jitters. There's no great evidence of US forces testing their own defences and, at the time, nobody had any certainty over what they had been shooting at...



US energies were focused on Hawaiin and Pacific defenses as paranoia and fleeting reports of Japanese vessels increased. Long before the 'Battle of LA' people were shooting at whales and foreign nationals were being detained in camps.

The 'Foo Fighters' that began to be reported in 1944/45 were more likely to be the opening salvo of what would become the 'UFO phenomena.' As such, whatever was being fired upon over LA, I believe, has been wrongly claimed by UFO researchers and enthusiasts.

Originally posted by thesearchfortruth
reply to post by WingedBull

 

That is wonderful circular reasoning.

Yep, I know...

I know with Roswell the evidence really isn't completely on my side, but I think there's something to that story.

The only side the Roswell even is on is truth. No matter who says what or presents a ton of documents, no one can produce any evidence for any kind of alien craft or bodies. Modern thinking people accept the fantasy bs because it's easier to do so than to get into real deep research. Those who have done so always arrive at the truth of a secret military project to spy on the Russians who were getting hot under the collar with nuclear research.

Everyone has a right to their opinion but those acceptin a UFO crash with or without bodies is just kidding themselves and Friedman has built an industry around the bs 'cause it has put him on easy street and he doesn't have to convince anyone of anything. Just opening his big, boring mouth satisfies his audience which is built up of totally gullible non-thinkers.

What else can Stan say? He's a career ufologist. If he were to accept many of the facts that the debunkers present he'd have to go back to watching dials and pushing buttons in the capacity of a nuclear physicist.

There's no need for him to rant and rave against those who provide rational explanations for supposedly mysterious events. He should counter the debunkers with solid evidence of aliens or flying saucers but as such evidence is lacking he can only speculate, guess, and grasp at straws. This may be entertaining but repeated anecdotes, poorly sourced material, and blacked-out FBI documents don't cut it anymore.

Sadly, Stan is on the verge of metamorphosing from a career ufologist into a radicalised ufologist!

reply to post by The Shrike

Just opening his big, boring mouth satisfies his audience which is built up of totally gullible non-thinkers.

I laughed, but I don't agree.

If it was a Mogul Balloon, how come experienced officers such as Jesse Marcel could not identify it as such?

Other Mogul crashes were recovered quickly without incident, how come only the one at Roswell was misidentified?

Anyways, we don't need to have a whole discussion about it. I think aliens crashed, 90 percent of the world doesn't lol