Combat-themed games are not necessarily the most realistic in terms of simulating damage from combat; but they are very good for teaching/practicing
movement concepts as a team.
Before going on operations, when the situation and intelligence permits, any combat unit creates replicas of the environment and trains to the point
of nausea. Games help reduce the learning curves of those strategies (especially those with the "replay" game save/view features), and reduce the
cost of training entire teams (you can make more productive use of 'simmunition' and other training assets).
Or, in the case of terrorists - give your people just that extra little bit of information that keeps them from doing something blatantly stupid (and
making our job easy).
Of course, this is to get sensitive information from consoles that have already been acquired during various raids. Not your Xbox. Our our Xboxes.
We have a higher per-capita group of gamers (all young adults with a steady income and often confined to about one square mile when not on duty...
what do you think we do?)
US military wants to hack game consoles, page 2
reply posted on 28-3-2012 @ 03:54 PM by yourmaker
reply to post by XelNaga
nooooo not another!!
while you make excellent points, I was never trying to make the relation between playing war games and war.
think of it this way.
the military runs WAR game simulations on their supercomputers,
what I was trying to say was that maybe the military mass marketed video game consoles playing the newer war games for public use that were outfitted for data transfers, so that the military could take the data of all the battles played and work out tactics and other unforseen ideas that us normal people would never get out of playing it.
never for the people actually playing the games, they are merely giving the personalities to the characters.
that info would be correlated at another time WITH the previous info.
do you understand? I can try and detail it further if not.
nooooo not another!!
while you make excellent points, I was never trying to make the relation between playing war games and war.
think of it this way.
the military runs WAR game simulations on their supercomputers,
what I was trying to say was that maybe the military mass marketed video game consoles playing the newer war games for public use that were outfitted for data transfers, so that the military could take the data of all the battles played and work out tactics and other unforseen ideas that us normal people would never get out of playing it.
never for the people actually playing the games, they are merely giving the personalities to the characters.
that info would be correlated at another time WITH the previous info.
do you understand? I can try and detail it further if not.
edit on 28-3-2012 by yourmaker because: (no reason given)
reply posted on 28-3-2012 @ 03:57 PM by DaMod
reply to post by yourmaker
Wow..... I sure hope not...
I play Counterstrike...
Wow..... I sure hope not...
I play Counterstrike...
edit on 28-3-2012 by DaMod because: (no reason given)
reply posted on 28-3-2012 @ 04:00 PM by mrmedinet
reply to post by yourmaker
An obvious reference to "starcraft".
Although it's possible 'our' military war games this way it's also possible that it's not in 'our' military's best interest; so that leaves us to question who's best interest is it in?
An obvious reference to "starcraft".
Although it's possible 'our' military war games this way it's also possible that it's not in 'our' military's best interest; so that leaves us to question who's best interest is it in?
reply posted on 28-3-2012 @ 04:12 PM by RSF77
reply to post by yourmaker
I don't know, I've seen people on video games execute all kinds of tactical teamwork and co-ordinated assaults equal or greater than military precision. Perhaps the military even might have something to learn from the horde of obsessive compulsive 12 year olds that break down something like a raid on some urban environment into a science. Some people just get insanely good at some video games and where else do you see people voluntarily working together on such a level?
Makes sense that the military is gravitating toward remotely controlled vehicles like drones and such, there is an army of potentially skilled remote pilots.
I don't know, I've seen people on video games execute all kinds of tactical teamwork and co-ordinated assaults equal or greater than military precision. Perhaps the military even might have something to learn from the horde of obsessive compulsive 12 year olds that break down something like a raid on some urban environment into a science. Some people just get insanely good at some video games and where else do you see people voluntarily working together on such a level?
Makes sense that the military is gravitating toward remotely controlled vehicles like drones and such, there is an army of potentially skilled remote pilots.
reply posted on 28-3-2012 @ 04:24 PM by XelNaga
reply to post by yourmaker
no...?
what are they going to implement the wild tactics used in video games for real life?
this argument can go on for ever so im gonna end it here.
sure the military takes part in designing games. companies go to them for information on events, weapons, and so on to give the feel of realism in their video games. sure the military made a game specifically designed to recruit people.
but ask the average gamer, they will tell you they have no interest in fighting wars, killing people or whatever else. video games are games. nothing more. if they influence someone in some kind of way...well then those people shouldnt be playing in the first place.
the idea that video games are training simulators for the military is nothing more than media spin and "concerned" parents doing what they do best.
this whole argument has nothing to do with the OP to begin with...
no...?
what are they going to implement the wild tactics used in video games for real life?
this argument can go on for ever so im gonna end it here.
sure the military takes part in designing games. companies go to them for information on events, weapons, and so on to give the feel of realism in their video games. sure the military made a game specifically designed to recruit people.
but ask the average gamer, they will tell you they have no interest in fighting wars, killing people or whatever else. video games are games. nothing more. if they influence someone in some kind of way...well then those people shouldnt be playing in the first place.
the idea that video games are training simulators for the military is nothing more than media spin and "concerned" parents doing what they do best.
this whole argument has nothing to do with the OP to begin with...
reply posted on 28-3-2012 @ 04:31 PM by yourmaker
Originally posted by XelNaga
reply to post by yourmaker
but ask the average gamer, they will tell you they have no interest in fighting wars, killing people or whatever else. video games are games. nothing more. if they influence someone in some kind of way...well then those people shouldnt be playing in the first place.
the idea that video games are training simulators for the military is nothing more than media spin and "concerned" parents doing what they do best.
you are making my point for me while telling me i'm wrong.
the intended target for these games, would be gamers. i'm not saying the games are ment for TRAINING.
but that the actions of the gamers themselves in the game, giving personality to otherwise life-less sims, and leaving a trail of information for the military to come in and eat up that intel.
I've never once said that the gamers themselves are influenced by the games, which very well may be the case, such as Anders Breivik refrencing MW2 as a trainer.
reply posted on 28-3-2012 @ 04:53 PM by oniraug
Originally posted by thisguyrighthere
So how much is it going to cost the taxpayers to let the government read through pages and pages of racist and homophobic 12 year olds talking about "pwnage" and teabagging?
The way the government and all the respective alphabet agencies seem to focus on obvious nonsense like Twitter, Facebook and now game consoles leads me to believe they either have absolutely no idea what they're doing or they believe that the potential "threats" have no idea what they are doing hence plotting over Xbox Live and on their Facebook walls.
You get the age of the people and ignore all the underage ones? Lol
Originally posted by XelNaga
reply to post by yourmaker
no...?
what are they going to implement the wild tactics used in video games for real life?
this argument can go on for ever so im gonna end it here.
sure the military takes part in designing games. companies go to them for information on events, weapons, and so on to give the feel of realism in their video games. sure the military made a game specifically designed to recruit people.
but ask the average gamer, they will tell you they have no interest in fighting wars, killing people or whatever else. video games are games. nothing more. if they influence someone in some kind of way...well then those people shouldnt be playing in the first place.
the idea that video games are training simulators for the military is nothing more than media spin and "concerned" parents doing what they do best.
this whole argument has nothing to do with the OP to begin with...
Simple. The military trains and brainwashes them. You cant put it past people that tested '___' as a weapon
There are also people out there that have no clue they are good at these games.
What about a draft? They are guaranteed to never be put in harms way..
This thread reminded me of another video I have to post
edit on 28-3-2012 by oniraug because: (no reason given)
reply posted on 28-3-2012 @ 05:41 PM by Aim64C
reply to post by Maxmars
See Rule #31 www.megazone.org...
We've busted up all kinds of training camps while over there. It's a shame that more about what really goes on over there never makes the news (just when we screw up or they get lucky). When you bust up an AQ training compound and there are 20 Xbox 360s on a network hub, we confiscate them.
That has all been collected in the hopes that something could be learned from them - and this is the attempt.
You can bet they use the social networking functions of Xbox Live to organize - and even train. In all probability, pressure is finally getting put on the technologically illiterate chain of command that is now beginning to see these 'training camps' become more "cloud-like" and less centralized.
ARMA II is already used for a number of training simulations by military and paramilitary forces around the world. It is one of the most accurate ground combat simulations available, and can train members for anything from convoy actions to SERE.
Operation Flash Point 2 is also fairly accurate (though I have yet to actually play it).
Consider projects such as this: www.armaholic.com...
and this: tes.nexusmods.com...
terabytes of information and total conversions with both satellite generated and hand generated terrain - all done by volunteers.
I have more mods for Oblivion than the stock game.
It doesn't require computer geniuses. The tools released for these games to allow people to create their own content are quite powerful and require very little in the way of "genius" to utilize.
reply to post by oniraug
No. Top scoring players are meaningless by comparison to top performing teams.
Sit a group of Marines down on a game with squad based combat and watch them tear through a number of guilds like a tornado through a trailer park.
When you throw frag-counts out the window and go with pure objective taking (which is what real combat is) - then a lot of top-scoring players (and sometimes teams) will simply be unable to perform due to the lack of teamwork, coordination, and concerns over kill/death ratio.
So we 'contract' some 'company' to 'acquire' used consoles in certain countries.... perhaps ones that haven't been 'sanitized' prior to disposal.. because we know all terrorists love to leave clues everywhere, never covering their tracks, never applying safeguards against the very exploits they themselves employ... telegraphing their plans and details for anyone lucky enough to discover them...
See Rule #31 www.megazone.org...
The enemy never watches until you make a mistake.
We've busted up all kinds of training camps while over there. It's a shame that more about what really goes on over there never makes the news (just when we screw up or they get lucky). When you bust up an AQ training compound and there are 20 Xbox 360s on a network hub, we confiscate them.
That has all been collected in the hopes that something could be learned from them - and this is the attempt.
You can bet they use the social networking functions of Xbox Live to organize - and even train. In all probability, pressure is finally getting put on the technologically illiterate chain of command that is now beginning to see these 'training camps' become more "cloud-like" and less centralized.
Yes... paranoia (and a degree of imbecility) reigns supreme in the minds of those who think of nothing else.
ARMA II is already used for a number of training simulations by military and paramilitary forces around the world. It is one of the most accurate ground combat simulations available, and can train members for anything from convoy actions to SERE.
Operation Flash Point 2 is also fairly accurate (though I have yet to actually play it).
Consider projects such as this: www.armaholic.com...
and this: tes.nexusmods.com...
terabytes of information and total conversions with both satellite generated and hand generated terrain - all done by volunteers.
I have more mods for Oblivion than the stock game.
It doesn't require computer geniuses. The tools released for these games to allow people to create their own content are quite powerful and require very little in the way of "genius" to utilize.
reply to post by oniraug
Wouldn't the top scoring players be the best candidates for remote controlled soldiers or drones? Go google military robots..
No. Top scoring players are meaningless by comparison to top performing teams.
Sit a group of Marines down on a game with squad based combat and watch them tear through a number of guilds like a tornado through a trailer park.
When you throw frag-counts out the window and go with pure objective taking (which is what real combat is) - then a lot of top-scoring players (and sometimes teams) will simply be unable to perform due to the lack of teamwork, coordination, and concerns over kill/death ratio.
reply posted on 28-3-2012 @ 06:59 PM by Aim64C
reply to post by Sly1one
Unfortunately... that's not really the case.
In war, people die. No matter what course of action you take in war, someone you know will more than likely die. You have to make decisions that will accomplish the objective. They may not always be the best decisions - but stagnation is worse than a wrong decision... and arguing is worse than stagnation.
Marines aren't called bullet-soakers for nothing. That's part of the gig. You can't be squeamish about taking risks. That doesn't mean be careless - but as Wilbur Wright put it: "In flying I have learned that carelessness and overconfidence are usually far more dangerous than deliberately accepted risks."
That's why people often refer to the military types - particularly those in direct combat - as brainwashed. They aren't brainwashed - simply trained to be able to accept risks untrained people will not. The individual values himself. The Marine/Sailor/Soldier/Airman values the team (when the proverbial feces hit the atmosphere impeller).
I know I'm kind of on a soap-box, here... but that is part of any team endeavor - from sports to family. If you are unable to risk yourself for the team, then you aren't part of it. It's no good to keep yourself alive, no matter how many of the enemy you kill - if you fail to return fire in critical situations (where you need to suppress enemy fire so your team can get the hell out of Dodge).
Well you do have to admit though in Real Life Kill/Death ratio has to be a big concern...as it better be #/0
Unfortunately... that's not really the case.
In war, people die. No matter what course of action you take in war, someone you know will more than likely die. You have to make decisions that will accomplish the objective. They may not always be the best decisions - but stagnation is worse than a wrong decision... and arguing is worse than stagnation.
Marines aren't called bullet-soakers for nothing. That's part of the gig. You can't be squeamish about taking risks. That doesn't mean be careless - but as Wilbur Wright put it: "In flying I have learned that carelessness and overconfidence are usually far more dangerous than deliberately accepted risks."
That's why people often refer to the military types - particularly those in direct combat - as brainwashed. They aren't brainwashed - simply trained to be able to accept risks untrained people will not. The individual values himself. The Marine/Sailor/Soldier/Airman values the team (when the proverbial feces hit the atmosphere impeller).
I know I'm kind of on a soap-box, here... but that is part of any team endeavor - from sports to family. If you are unable to risk yourself for the team, then you aren't part of it. It's no good to keep yourself alive, no matter how many of the enemy you kill - if you fail to return fire in critical situations (where you need to suppress enemy fire so your team can get the hell out of Dodge).
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