Acts 2:22 = Jesus was a MAN approved by God

Originally posted by SisyphusRide
reply to post by jmdewey60

 

heck Logos to me meant like a type of sign language (drawing in dirt) before we learned a common grunts and growls. Was not drawing in the dirt (signing language) transformed into speech?

I think we were symbol minded before speech... evidenced by cavemen forming units.

edit on 28-3-2012 by SisyphusRide because: (no reason given)

The Gospel of John is a sophisticated book written for an educated and knowledgeable group of people. Logos is a Greek word and is commonly translated to the word, word, in John 1:1, but back when the book was originally written, the word, Logos, had taken on a life of its own and was used by about every form of philosophy that used the Greek language, to designate one of the most fundamental principles of the universe. To my way of thinking, the writer of John is not setting up a logical construct for people to look at later and sequence sections of it to make Jesus the equivalent of God. I believe he is stating that this fundamental principle of the universe is God. Then it goes on to elaborate the implications of that fact.

reply to post by NOTurTypical


Yes, Jesus told Satan to "Worship the Lord your God, and serve him only." in Matthew 4:10, but could this be because Satan was once an angel and not a man? Can you help me more by answering the other questions I have posted above?

Originally posted by Deetermined
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

Yes, Jesus told Satan to "Worship the Lord your God, and serve him only." in Matthew 4:10, but could this be because Satan was once an angel and not a man? Can you help me more by answering the other questions I have posted above?

satan will always be an angel (cherub), a fallen one, but an angel nonetheless. I did answer, what else would you like me to address?

Originally posted by Deetermined
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

Sorry, I don't understand fully what you're saying.

Can you please elaborate more? Lots more.

I'll direct you to the easiest teaching to date I've ever heard about the trinity:

Trinity.

Another good one, from Ravi Zacharias. He's one of the greatest apologists in Christianity.

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by SisyphusRide

Originally posted by DuecesxGeneral
“Jesus answered them and said, ‘My doctrine is not mine, but His who sent me.’” (John 7:16)
He is not God

it had to be addressed this way... you see what they tried to do in the temple first time he said it.

but he walked right through the center of the crowd from the edge of the cliff...

You missed something important in that account. Jesus was introducing the doctrine of election. Jesus used two examples of gentiles only getting the blessing and the healing over Jews.

thanks... I am going back over it now but I thought it was because he had said the prophecy had been fulfilled after reading to them Isaiah...

alot more reading is in store for me, of course I kind of watch alot of the movies more so than I have read first getting into the subject.

reply to post by NOTurTypical


Since I'm not in a position to watch the video at the moment, I looked up Chuck Missler's view on the Trinity here:

www.khouse.org...

So, you believe that God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit are separate, but all serve one purpose, so whether we're praying to God, Jesus or the Holy Spirit, we're praying to the same greater purpose, so it doesn't matter?

If I'm still misunderstanding what you're saying, let me know.

Originally posted by Deetermined
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

Since I'm not in a position to watch the video at the moment, I looked up Chuck Missler's view on the Trinity here:

www.khouse.org...

So, you believe that God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit are separate, but all serve one purpose, so whether we're praying to God, Jesus or the Holy Spirit, we're praying to the same greater purpose, so it doesn't matter?

If I'm still misunderstanding what you're saying, let me know.

Same thing, the video is not really a video per se but the recording from the 66/40 radio show which you've located at khouse. It's the exact same presentation. When you can watch a video, the one by Ravi Zacharias is excellent too and I suggest watching it when you can.

reply to post by jmdewey60


John the revealer !!!

I have the text highlighted in a bible from awhile back which was given to be by a music teacher at a church. The way I was feeling at the time and what I was looking for knocked me on my butt!

John is the same guy as the baptizing John right?

If you can listen to Podcasts here it is:

66/40 ~ Trinity

Originally posted by SisyphusRide
reply to post by jmdewey60

 

John the revealer !!!

I have the text highlighted in a bible from awhile back which was given to be by a music teacher at a church. The way I was feeling at the time and what I was looking for knocked me on my butt!

John is the same guy as the baptizing John right?

No. John the apostle. Domitian exiled him to Patmos. By that time JTB was long dead.

Originally posted by SisyphusRide

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by SisyphusRide

Originally posted by DuecesxGeneral
“Jesus answered them and said, ‘My doctrine is not mine, but His who sent me.’” (John 7:16)
He is not God

it had to be addressed this way... you see what they tried to do in the temple first time he said it.

but he walked right through the center of the crowd from the edge of the cliff...

You missed something important in that account. Jesus was introducing the doctrine of election. Jesus used two examples of gentiles only getting the blessing and the healing over Jews.

thanks... I am going back over it now but I thought it was because he had said the prophecy had been fulfilled after reading to them Isaiah...

alot more reading is in store for me, of course I kind of watch alot of the movies more so than I have read first getting into the subject.

Remember this. When we miss something the Jews and Pharisees always bail us out. lol We read that account and have no idea why they were so filled with wrath they tried to throw Him off a cliff.

He only used gentile examples.

reply to post by NOTurTypical


ok excellent, you guys are lots of help. The first time I felt some understanding of the bible was I believe 1:John you know the one before the revelation.

I will dig that bible out... I've since upgraded to a podium type of Bible, it's an excellent sight to look at even, it's a Analytical edition made by Crusade Publisher in Tenn so I assume it will be accurate? it came complete with a rose preserved at the beginning of Ecclesiastes and that I am gonna figure out what that means too eventually.

I am not trying to tick people off... some are just getting in my way of getting knowledge here. I am gonna be an old man soon in my late 30's and well it's kinda stupid to be asking questions around then ya know...

sometimes for a metal head analogy I view faith like a stage-dive...

atheist say what is faith and I say it is hoping that the crowd/sea don't part in front of you and they catch your arse!

that is "faith"

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by SisyphusRide

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by SisyphusRide

Originally posted by DuecesxGeneral
“Jesus answered them and said, ‘My doctrine is not mine, but His who sent me.’” (John 7:16)
He is not God

it had to be addressed this way... you see what they tried to do in the temple first time he said it.

but he walked right through the center of the crowd from the edge of the cliff...

You missed something important in that account. Jesus was introducing the doctrine of election. Jesus used two examples of gentiles only getting the blessing and the healing over Jews.

thanks... I am going back over it now but I thought it was because he had said the prophecy had been fulfilled after reading to them Isaiah...

alot more reading is in store for me, of course I kind of watch alot of the movies more so than I have read first getting into the subject.

Remember this. When we miss something the Jews and Pharisees always bail us out. lol We read that account and have no idea why they were so filled with wrath they tried to throw Him off a cliff.

He only used gentile examples.

that is what is good here... the blend. Even if all the atheist did more to mars and start their own so called civilization it probably just wouldn't be the same without them.

reply to post by Deetermined


My take on it is, that Jesus is Yahweh, or Yahweh was his original pre-human form. The entire bible from OT to NT tells you who he is. The old prophets tell you who he is. You read the OT and see what God teaches, and compare that to Jesus and it's a 100% match right down to his mannerism, speech and tolerance. Not to mention that whenever He made an appearance in his original form in the OT, he always showed up as three...but from Abraham's perspective there was only One. He and the Father are one, because they are the same. The entire concept of humanity was taken from the triune God. Man was made in his Image, and so we have Body, Spirit and Soul then so too must he. We see God through Jesus because it is like looking at a mirror image.

Notice how in John 10:11-16

11 “I am the good shepherd. The good shepherd gives His life for the sheep. 12 But a hireling, he who is not the shepherd, one who does not own the sheep, sees the wolf coming and leaves the sheep and flees; and the wolf catches the sheep and scatters them. 13 The hireling flees because he is a hireling and does not care about the sheep. 14 I am the good shepherd; and I know My sheep, and am known by My own. 15 As the Father knows Me, even so I know the Father; and I lay down My life for the sheep. 16 And other sheep I have which are not of this fold; them also I must bring, and they will hear My voice; and there will be one flock and one shepherd

He states right here that he is not some mere "hireling" who doesn't care about the sheep. Here he is claiming the sheep are his, both flocks belong to him.

Then you read the OT and all the titles God has, and you read the NT and Jesus is claiming those, so the OT is pointing right at who he is.

Then you look at John 1:1-10

Then Matthew 3:11-12
(John the Baptist speaking)

11 I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance, but He who is coming after me is mightier than I, whose sandals I am not worthy to carry. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire. 12 His winnowing fan is in His hand, and He will thoroughly clean out His threshing floor, and gather His wheat into the barn; but He will burn up the chaff with unquenchable fire.”

But if you notice in the OT, the prophets were the mouthpiece of God and they were temporarily given power from the Holy Spirit, which only God can give, yet when you flip back to the NT, it's Jesus doing this (but he grants him on a permanant basis). The OT is one giant foreshadowing of what was and still is to come.

The OT and the NT are 2 witnesses, and to what are they testifying to? The book of Revelation itself is not just the Revelation of Jesus Christ, the entire NT is revealing him to his believers, but the events in the book of Revelation reveal him to the world.

reply to post by lonewolf19792000


but in the story is there no redemption for the Jews? can't we all share the vineyard...

Originally posted by Iason321

Originally posted by Akragon
reply to post by Iason321

 

ugh... not this again.

Feel free to believe he was God, im tired of this arguement...

IF he was God he would have said he was... but he did not... EVER...

IF you call him God, you make him a liar by omition... Meaning he left it out of his teachings for some reason...

He was divine... being the son of God. He was NOT God in the flesh...

Post all the references you like... but if he didn't say it (which he did not) then he wasn't God... Its as simple as that...

Further more the idea of a triune God was introduced hundreds of years later... the appostles didn't teach it, nor did Jesus...

You're listening to your church instead of reading it for yourself...

John 14:7-10 If ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also: and from henceforth ye know him, and have seen him.

Philip saith unto him, Lord, show us the Father, and it sufficeth us.

Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Show us the Father?

Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works.


So what is Jesus saying there?

So, if you tell me that Jesus is in your heart, that you walk with Christ and Jesus and you are one, as I have heard so many Christians say, then you ARE Jesus?

reply to post by SisyphusRide


I think the Jews get blessed here on earth. They are Gods original elect people and so they are still blessed to this day on earth.

Look at the Jews in the world now - many of them are filthy rich and have wonderful lives here on earth.

The thing is, they do not accept the Christ. Therefore, they cannot enter Heaven.

Therefore, most Jews goto Hell.

Hell is not a place where they are kept alive in torment by a sadistic god though.

Hell is the common grave of mankind, sheol, the void, death.

Unless they accept that Jesus is the Christ, they will not be granted with the gift of God of eternal life.

reply to post by windword


In a way. The Christ is the light of the world. Jesus lives inside of me and you. He is every particle in the universe and every atom and fiber of our being, yet he is at the same time nowhere and nothing. He is the Being that is all yet transcends all.