ObamaCare Vs Repubs

Hey Guys,

I need a little help getting my head round an issue regarding Health care. I'm not American so forgive me for being ignorant to how your systems work.

Over here in the UK as you all know, we have free health care, not completely free, as if you are in work you must pay for your prescriptions etc.

However, any one who finds them selves out of work, or financially unable to afford treatment, our nifty little system called the NHS steps in to take care of you.

Now I know the NHS isn't perfect, nothing is in this bureaucracy, I'll give you one example from an investigation lead by channel 4 the other month: For every child in the children's hospital they had a budget of 23p per child per day to be fed. The staffs budget turned out to be 80p or so.

Anyway, I love Ron Paul, the guys a legend and I hope he continues to make an impact until its his time to pass. The only thing I don't understand is how the republic can be against free health care

I suppose if I was an American I'd be Democratic.

I raise the issue now as I just watched this vid: LINKY

Actually hearing Rons views on this (I hate Morgan BTW).

Now over here in the UK, we often scratch our heads at you guys, many people even joke that if you were rushed into AnE in America, bleeding from a gun shot wound to the neck, the first thing they'll ask is if you have insurance, and leave you there bleeding out if you haven't. Not very funny I know, but you see where I'm coming from.

Ron did raise a few interesting points however: Its NOT free health care. The government TAKES the money off us whether we like it or not, in the form of tax. He said, nothing is free, we are just allowing the government to take OUR money and distribute it as they see fit. He said that cannot happen in a country that calls its self FREE.

So technically Rons very correct.

Peirce also raised a good point however: Its like car insurance and its for your OWN GOOD.

So I'm personally in a catch 22. Freedom or do I want the gov to provide me with health care??

I would be lying if I didn't say the NHS was a "God"send over here, and the view of many UKers is, "The Government does not take my money, I willingly give it to provide my neighbor with basic health care, the same thing any decent human being would do"

However Ron also says that since the Gov has been interfering with your services over in the US, the cost is rising and quality is lowering, hence it should remain privatized.

To finish up, as I'm rambling now, what is the solution? Unless you socialize the medical system a wee bit, anyone who cannot afford help is left....surely that's not right in the 21st century?

Or is Obamacare the way forward with this one? Providing you reign in your Government and make them to get it to function properly?

I dunno, but so far that's the only thing holding me back from loving Paul 100%

Thoughts please?

I sure do wish America would get it's derrière in gear, and support nationalized health care. I know that the republicans are against it because they don't want the government to control what kind of insurance they get, but with all do respect they probably already have the income to afford insurance. What about the MILLIONS who cannot afford it? What about us? I love the Idea of governmental health care. Who doesn't you ask? Doctors who profit wildly from our current system, independently owned insurance companies, and big-pharma... Not the common man. Not us at all...

reply to post by Sinny


It's not really as bad as letting someone without insurance bleed out on the floor, but if you were to contract cancer, and had no insurance, your financial life is pretty much ruined. The bills are astronomical. That being said, Obamacare is not the really fixing that. Also, most insurance in America will not cover a pre-existing condition. Therefore, if you have a bad heart, and try to get insurance you will be denied coverage. Obamacare does attempt to change that practice.

Unfortunately, healthcare in America is much more about making money and much less about helping the sick and injured.

I like Ron Paul as a person but Libertarianism is as bad as totalitarianism. It creates a financial "un-freedom", as long as you have money you are free. Life isn't lollipops and gumdrops, there are people that fall on bad luck. There are people that would not have the money to pay for private firemen and their house would burn down. Sounds great huh? Already happened

www.wpsdlocal6.com...


If you are a 18 in the USA and get something as simple as a Bronchitis it can run you into the thousands in debt. It is ridiculous, if you don't have parents that don't have insurance YOU are screwed. There is no way for a young adult to afford healthcare.

A lot of Americans are brainwashed into thinking the government is stealing from them to fund social programs like food stamps. It is kind of silly, a lot have no real sense of community or wanting to help others. They get more upset over foodstamps than banker bail outs.

And yes, I get both sides of the argument. Big government is bad bla bla bla

The truth is, is you are rushed into an emergency room for any life threatening condition, you will be treated regardless if you have insurance or not.

The cancer part is true.

If the US wanted to socialize health care for all Americans, and slap a tax on us that is commiserate with our wages, I don't have a problem with that.

However, we are already paying just for the poor and the elderly to have insurance (Medicaid and Medicare), and the vast majority of us, if we are working or self-employed, have to pay a great deal for crappy insurance with high deductibles, PLUS still pay for the poor.

The idea that we would be FORCED to buy a product offered by a private corporation is a bunch of B.S. The Obamacare legislation was written by health insurance lobbyists and is nothing but a boondoggle of epic proportions for those private corporations. Plus, if you don't buy the insurance, you are slapped upside the head each year at tax time with a penalty.

I find this to be obscene and the antithesis of a free society. I do not have health insurance, and I will not buy any, either. They can kiss my angry American ass on that one.

And no, it is not the same as car insurance. A vehicle is a potentially deadly weapon. One is not forced to own and drive a vehicle, so if one does, they need the insurance in case of accidents, which happen all the time.

However, forcing Americans to purchase a product simply because they are alive and citizens of this country is against every principle a free society stands for.

If they want to change the entire system, and provide a socialized system like the UK, I would be for it. However, because it is just a way to fatten the bottom lines of insurance companies, I am completely against it. I have an ugly suspicion the Supreme Idiots in the Supreme Court will say that Obamacare is legal and push it through.

That action will be where the rubber hits the road when it comes to our freedoms. As for me, I will not support forced purchases of a private industry product, and I will not file taxes anymore if they want to rape me in my wallet because of my refusal.

reply to post by FissionSurplus


You say that through taxes you are already paying for the poor's health insurance? Then I ask you where is my insurance? If that is the case then you are paying for nothing...

I have a bad cavity I have no money for. I'm in constant pain It just sucks because if I had the extra 300$ to fix it it'd be gone. It's like living with a splinter knowing you can get rid of it but you have no tweezers to get it out.

Ahhh life

As Nancy Polosi said "the health care law will allow you to quit your job and the government will take care of you"

What a bunch of crap, just another way for lazy people to get yet another handout.

reply to post by boot2theface


Taxes go for Medicaid (or, in California, Medi-Cal) and Social Security taxes go for Medicare. Medicaid has some loopholes in it, so that the working poor, and people without children who are poor, fall through the cracks.

I stand by my original statement. You are somebody who has fallen through the cracks. These cracks could be sealed up by opening up the eligibility rules to include more of the working poor and those without children. There is no need to screw over the entire country and make a bunch of health insurance companies rich as Midas to accomplish this.

I don't have health insurance either, which you may have gleaned if you read my entire post. Nobody will insure either my husband or myself. I am 50 and he is 55. They refused to insure me because I had a hysterectomy and also rheumatoid arthritis. They won't insure him because he smokes.

So, technically, you and I are in the same boat. However, I take many herbs, vitamins and supplements to make sure that I remain healthy. We have already decided that if we get cancer we will fight it naturally and stay away from the doctor.

I have found that a great many things I used to run to the doctor for can be cured with home remedies.

Instead of being angry that you don't have insurance, try to keep yourself as healthy as possible, and educate yourself on treating basic ailments yourself. Most people in my shoes have insane medical bills due to RA. I don't take as much as an aspirin for it, because I control it with herbs. Am I pissed because I can't get insurance? Not anymore. I realized that I didn't need it as much as I thought I did.

reply to post by rlrsar


Lazy? Urghh. I cannot stand republican logic. God forbid anyone care about fellow countrymen who are doing horribly financially. I mean by all means you made your money. it's yours. but just know that there are others who aren't doing as well, and it's not because they are lazy.

reply to post by RealSpoke


There are dentists who will take payments for fixing your cavity. You may have to shop around a bit, but there are some who do, because they are hurting for business because people cannot afford to get regular dental care anymore. Their greed is now biting them on the backside.

Typically "chain" stores for dentistry are more likely to accept payments (ones that have many locations).

Originally posted by usernameconspiracy
reply to post by Sinny

 

Also, most insurance in America will not cover a pre-existing condition. Therefore, if you have a bad heart, and try to get insurance you will be denied coverage. Obamacare does attempt to change that practice.

This is quite possibly the most important part of Obamacare. Seeing so many people opposed to it makes me sick.

reply to post by Sinny


The GOP has a problem with it. Most democrats don't. The GOP only worry about their dollar being spent on someone else.

What they don't understand is that a healthy population benefits everybody.

A healthy pregnancy means a healthy child that will do better in school.

Studies have shown that people who can see a doctor are sick a lot less.

All of the reasons for a healthier population make for a better economy. Period.

That kid that was allowed to be healthy may grow up to be a great teacher.

"I pity the fool who doesn't have health care! I do. That's ridiculous. That's a third-world problem. We're a first-world country. WTF

~ Wyatt Cenac

reply to post by nixie_nox


I'm sorry for the blatant off topic post, but dude, I love your signature. peace.

reply to post by RealSpoke


Check out any of the dentistry schools in Ohio. They may be able to help. But consider this. You will be a Guinia pig for some student.

That's scary, but the pain may just drive me to look at that route.