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A Lesson in Jumping to Conclusions (the Trayvon Martin shooting)

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posted on Mar, 28 2012 @ 05:03 AM
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Originally posted by FFS4000
Zimmerman allegedly did the exact opposite of what he was told to do by the police, he went looking to make trouble IMO, if he doesn't get a fair trial most of that fact is down to him doing the exact opposite of what was expected of him as a neighbourhood watcher, numpty. Lets see how long a white kid walking through the projects would last

If you listened to the whole 911 call www.sanfordfl.gov..., rather the the selective edits played in the media, you would know that you have been misled.
1. He wasn't told by the police not to chase Martin. It was a suggestion: "We don't need you to do that!"
2. Zimmerman said, "OK" and his breathing changed noticeably.
3. Zimmerman made a comment about him getting away towards the other exit of the community.
4. Zimmerman said he was going back to his SUV.

IF your neighborhood had had a series of break ins and your were going out on an errand (not patrolling the neighborhood) and it was just past sunset and rainy and you saw a white guy in a business suit walking around checking out the residences, you would be suspicious also.

What really bothers me about this story is even some of the reporters that I used to respect the most fell for the lies, initially, and even those who have seen the light haven't apologized for initially spreading lies.
edit on 28-3-2012 by CharlesMartel because: added link




posted on Mar, 28 2012 @ 05:11 AM
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reply to post by DJW001
 


See there you go again, Zimmerman is 170 pounds, the media has been showing an old picture of him before his diet, and as the information rolls out it indicates he was on his way back to his vehicle when he was attacked, the info you are still bogged down with is from knee jerk assumptions, stirred up by eronious reports from people with a slanted view and an excuse to whip up on a poor Hispanic guy who rthought he was doing good for his community, that is why the police did not arrest the guy, and now witness reports are finally being leaked to the mainstream media and the truth will prevail, i guess the old "act in haste and repent in leisure" is a pretty good quote for this media circus.



posted on Mar, 28 2012 @ 05:13 AM
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Originally posted by popsmayhem

Originally posted by Thunder heart woman
We are getting ONE person's account, because the other one is dead.

Why are we discounting the account of Trayvon's girlfriend, who was on the phone with him? I guess she is not credible enough, because.....?

Zimmerman could have easily avoided killing Trayvon, by NOT following him, and heeding to the advice of dispatch. But NO. He made the choice to take the law into his own hands. And IF he did get jumped by Trayvon, THAT would not have happened either had Zimmerman not insisting on playing hero of the day.

His ego got in the way, he told dispatch "These a$%$^ always get away".

Zimmerman was DETERMINED RIGHT THEN go to after Trayvon, regardless....... and that is HIS mistake, not Trayvon's.

I'd bet my farm on Trayvon seeing a guy with a gun and decided to fight like hell. I would.


edit on 28-3-2012 by Thunder heart woman because: (no reason given)

edit on 28-3-2012 by Thunder heart woman because: (no reason given)



PLEASE GROW UP QUIT WASTING OUR TIME



JUST IGNORING THE FACTS
Which proves martin was the agressor,
proves zimmerman acted in self defense,
proves that treyvon thugged up his last victim.
Please this is not just one account..
The truth is coming out, and you hang whitey
folks are sick.


That's one man's account. Trayvon won't be able to give his. My husband is white, thank you very much. Those coming over here from stormfront, flooding these forums with propaganda against blacks is real obvious.
edit on 28-3-2012 by Thunder heart woman because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 28 2012 @ 05:16 AM
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reply to post by Thunder heart woman
 


NOT one mans account.
numerous 911 calls back this up
fact is zimmerman screaming for help on the tapes.
they all back up the story, eye witness acounts
back up the story, the reason zimmerman
has not been charged or arrested is because
it all adds up to him acting in self defense.
Now i would like to see you prove zimmerman
did not act in self defense against this
dumb punk thief named treyvon who was attacking him.
STOP BELIEVING THE PROPAGANDA THE MSM
IS FEEDING YOU! DONT BUY INTO THE HATE
edit on 28-3-2012 by popsmayhem because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 28 2012 @ 05:24 AM
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reply to post by AwakeinNM
 


I went out yesterday to run errands in town and decided to make a mental note of how many people I saw wearing hoodies and their age ranges.

Stopped off at meals on wheels - noticed a handful of senior citizens wearing hoodies

Delivered some meals to my 6 clients - oops, again, saw one woman, in her 70's, you guessed it..... a hoodie.

Went to the grocery store - too many to count, but the age ranges were toddlers to seniors.... hoodies

Took my daughter to the park - spied 2 teens girls and their male friend wearing a hoodie......

Who else wore hoodies? Me, my daughter.... my husband. We've always worn hoodies.

Sometimes I like to dress up in a long black skirt and black shirt, doesn't make me a wiccan or a witch
And when my husband wears all black, doesn't make him Johnny Cash

Ah and our liquor store recently got robbed by a white 16 year old kid...... was he wearing a hoodie? NOPE. he was wearing a jean jacket and a ski mask.

As far as I'm concerned, the hoodie is not the fashion choice for criminals......

So, what was Zimmerman wearing that night? What's the fashion stigma for latinos gunning down teen boys?



posted on Mar, 28 2012 @ 05:25 AM
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Originally posted by popsmayhem
reply to post by Thunder heart woman
 


NOT one mans account.
numerous 911 calls back this up
fact is zimmerman screaming for help on the tapes.
they all back up the story, eye witness acounts
back up the story, the reason zimmerman
has not been charged or arrested is because
it all adds up to him acting in self defense.
Now i would like to see you prove zimmerman
did not act in self defense against this
dumb punk thief named treyvon who was attacking him.
STOP BELIEVING THE PROPAGANDA THE MSM
IS FEEDING YOU! DONT BUY INTO THE HATE
edit on 28-3-2012 by popsmayhem because: (no reason given)


I don't watch the MSM. I don't subscribe to cable or satellite tv.

Where's your proof that Trayvon was dumb? I mean...... wow.



posted on Mar, 28 2012 @ 05:32 AM
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Originally posted by DerepentLEstranger
reply to post by FlyersFan
 



The latest 'facts' out make Zimmerman look innocent (or stupid ... take your pick).

and now who's jumping to conclusions?


LEARN to read what people post. I didn't say Zimmerman was innocent. I said that the original information made him look guilty and then the latest information made him look innocent. Everyone who jumped to conclusions that this guy was guilty of racially motivated murder now have egg on their face because there are other facts that they didn't know about. And probably .. in a few days .. more facts will come out that make Zimmerman look guilty. Then .. in a few more days .. more facts will probably come out that make him look innocent again.


Trayvon Martin is dead, and George Zimmerman is free. Therein lies the problem. Justice has not been served.

Grab the torches and pitchforkes eh? Wrong. We have a system of justice in this country. At this time Zimmerman is free because HE IS INNOCENT UNTIL PROVEN GUILTY IN A COURT OF LAW. NOT the court of public opinion based upon whatever 'facts' or 'spin' is in the press at the moment ... not the public court of law based on what posturing politicians say ... but a REAL court of law where all the evidence will be weighed.



posted on Mar, 28 2012 @ 05:32 AM
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reply to post by dreamstalker
 



See there you go again, Zimmerman is 170 pounds, the media has been showing an old picture of him before his diet, and as the information rolls out it indicates he was on his way back to his vehicle when he was attacked, the info you are still bogged down with is from knee jerk assumptions, stirred up by eronious reports from people with a slanted view and an excuse to whip up on a poor Hispanic guy who rthought he was doing good for his community, that is why the police did not arrest the guy, and now witness reports are finally being leaked to the mainstream media and the truth will prevail, i guess the old "act in haste and repent in leisure" is a pretty good quote for this media circus.


We don't know why the police really let him go, and we don't know which, if any, of the "witness reports" being "leaked" are true. You might be right about Zimmerman having gone on a diet and now weighing 170 pounds. Do you think we'll be seeing him doing endorsements for Subway now?



posted on Mar, 28 2012 @ 05:35 AM
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reply to post by FlyersFan
 


Grab the torches and pitchforkes eh? Wrong. We have a system of justice in this country. At this time Zimmerman is free because HE IS INNOCENT UNTIL PROVEN GUILTY IN A COURT OF LAW. NOT the court of public opinion based upon whatever 'facts' or 'spin' is in the press at the moment ... not the public court of law based on what posturing politicians say ... but a REAL court of law where all the evidence will be weighed.


He didn't even have to post bail. That's not how the system is supposed to work, and you know it.



posted on Mar, 28 2012 @ 05:36 AM
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Originally posted by DJW001
And what's Martin's account? Oh, wait, he can't tell his side of the story because he's dead. This entire affair has become a media circus, and the Police Department is doing everything it can to cover up the fact that it dropped the ball. It is not a question of race, it is a question of the use of deadly force when it was not necessary.


It was necessary for Mr Zimmerman, or he may well have ended up dead with his head bashed in against the sidewalk.



posted on Mar, 28 2012 @ 05:44 AM
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reply to post by macaronicaesar
 

Perfect example of what I was talking about .. jumping to conclusions based cherry picking of the 'facts' and spin and political posturing that is coming from the politicians. Again .. we don't know all the facts. Zimmerman may be guilty or he may be innocent. Martin may be perfectly innocent or he may have been a thief caught in the act of casing a neighborhood. WE DO NOT HAVE THE FACTS. We only have the spin ...

reply to post by GhostLancer
 

IF those are the facts ... and in this case the facts keep getting trumped by other facts .. then the courts can decide if he is guilty of murder or manslaughter or whatever. (I'm betting on involuntary manslaughter) IF those are the facts, at the very least the guy is guilty of being a dumb-a$$.


Originally posted by RSF77
Zimmerman made it about a murder. Anyone who thinks he shouldn't be arrested is WRONG.

Are we sure? The 'facts' and the hype and the spin are so deep and thick .. how could any of us out here know for sure what happened? We have heard many different versions of 'truth' on this. Those who should make the decision are in Florida and have their hands on the absolute evidence ...

Anyone who neglects to realize that the media needs to be held accountable for their actions in creating this situation is WRONG.

That's for damn sure.



posted on Mar, 28 2012 @ 05:46 AM
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Some...people do not understand that a hispanic man shot a black kid in basketball shorts "jk", ask him the definition of "cracker" 99% of people alone do not understand the term of the racial word. It goes back to slavery days when "massa" crack whip known as ...cracka. Please if anyone calls me a racial slur and is at least educated about it. Know the meaning unless it is without merit.


The "N" word... dare not say it, is a taboo word, nobody really knows where it came from yet they deem it powerful, words are weapons. The media plays on the the divide and conquer role. Yet black people can be hijacked by this word as if supernatural force was to ensue and take upon wrath and vengeance blindly lol.

Who knew?

The populous must turn on itself while the SHTF takes place. The oldest recipe, the most successful method in conquering a people and nations.

Divide and Conquer

period
edit on 28-3-2012 by Unknown Soldier because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 28 2012 @ 05:51 AM
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Originally posted by nunya13
Why is it okay for you to jump to the conclusion Zimmerman is innocent, but we can't jump to a different one.

I'm not jumping to the conclusion that Zimmerman is innocent. Did you read the thread?
I'm saying that the initial 'facts' showed him to be very guilty. But now there are new 'facts'
that show him to be very innocent. People immediately jumped to the conclusion that he
was guilty without seeing all the facts ... just the hype and spin that the media put out.
Zimmerman could easily be guilty ... or he could easily be innocent. WE DO NOT KNOW.
It is impossible to know for sure because of the very muddy situation that has been created
by the press and the politicians.

Originally posted by Evanzsayz
Doesn't matter...fact is that Zimmerman murdered a 17 year old KID period.

You are jumping to a conclusion. Again .. we don't know that. The 'facts' keep going back
and forth and are very muddied. Did he murder .. was it self defense .. was he attacked ...
was he a complete dumb-a$$ .... we have heard it from all angles and the 'facts' keep coming in.

If he gets out of jail it wont be but a couple weeks or months that they find him dead.

This guy ... be he innocent or guilty ... is a dead man walking. The antics of the press and politicians
and 'black groups and black leaders' have put a big bullseye on his back. Someone will be nailing him
I'm sure. That's not a threat ... that's a prediction.



posted on Mar, 28 2012 @ 06:07 AM
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reply to post by PlatinumShatinum
 



It was necessary for Mr Zimmerman, or he may well have ended up dead with his head bashed in against the sidewalk.


In your humble, unbiased opinion, you mean. We only have Zimmerman's side of the story, and that's the only fact.



posted on Mar, 28 2012 @ 06:10 AM
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Originally posted by SpectreDC

Originally posted by FlyersFan
He's probably a victim twice over .. once by Trayvon Martin


A Lesson in Jumping to Conclusions

I lol'd, OP should take his thread's title's advice.
edit on 27-3-2012 by SpectreDC because: (no reason given)


Read that in context .... I was talking about the 'new facts' that are out. That's how it looks.
If you wait a week or so there will be new 'facts' that probably cancel the Zimmerman-Innocent
'facts'. Then wait a few more days and there will be more 'Zimmerman-Innocent' facts ...

reply to post by Furbs
 

You know he's a racist eh? Jumping to conclusions. Another perfect example.


Originally posted by bunnydisaster
I rwmember the good ol days when ats was a left-leaning board mostly concerned with ufos. oh well.

ATS isn't 'left wing' .. it isn't 'right wing' .... it's more anti-stupid-politicians. (which are most of 'em)


Originally posted by Blaine91555
This Lynch Mob mentality is insane.

TOTALLY AGREE!


Originally posted by Kylearan
You don't think it had anything to do with Zimmerman saying "They always get away." and "F--king Coons" might have a little something to do with making this a race issue?

1 - We don't know if that actually happened. There is conflicting info about if that's true or not.
2 - People made up their minds before that 'information' came out.


Originally posted by Kylearan
This was Zimmerman's fault any way you slice it.

That the incident got raised to the level that it did? Probably. But I'm not going to jump to that conclusion because we don't have all the facts. We only have what the media and the spin doctors are putting out. We just don't know what happened ...


Originally posted by Annee
A Vigilante created and escalated a situation that caused the death of a 17 year old boy.

Maybe. OR maybe not. There are conflicting reports. We have to wait for the facts.



posted on Mar, 28 2012 @ 06:13 AM
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Originally posted by DJW001
reply to post by popsmayhem
 

I find your language personally offensive. You are an embarrassment to your "race."


You mean an embarrassment to the human race right ?
afterall there really is only one race of humans on this planet



posted on Mar, 28 2012 @ 06:14 AM
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I know anytime, Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton, or the Black Panthers are involved that you must absolutely take anything said with a grain of salt. Jesse Jackson is a racist, who abuses white people at every turn. Moreover, Al Sharpton is just a sensationalist and a headline grabber. Neither of these men have the best interests of race relations at heart.

The reality is, the NAACP and the Black Panther party are no better than the KKK or the Skinheads and more dangerous because they are protected by political correctness.



posted on Mar, 28 2012 @ 06:20 AM
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Originally posted by whisperindave
reply to post by FlyersFan
 
Excuse me? You have any evidence the New Black Panther Party has murdered anyone? I thought not. If Mr. Zimmerman is going to become a vigilante and be allowed to shoot an unarmed civilian, then perhaps the Black Panthers have a right to do likewise.

:shk: PERFECT example of what I'm talking about. The New Black Panther party has called for the murder of Zimmerman .. but this fella here thinks it's just fine ... all based on two things - jumping to conclusions AND probably his own racist attitudes. :shk:
to you .

Originally posted by trutrutru
you speak about not jumping to conclusions. But you seem to suggest that he was found with stolen jewlery and a screwdriver. This is not true at all.

I thought I was very clear .. those were found in his locker at school. He denied they were his.
'honest dad, those aren't my cigarettes in my coat pocket'
yeah .. right son.

Originally posted by Mclaneinc
The simple fact is that we will never really know what the 100% truth was,

We definately don't know what the truth is at this point. Absolutely. There is too much spin and hype and political posturing. It'll take time. That's why we can't JUMP TO CONCLUSIONS.


Richard Jewell case ring a bell anyone?
WE DO NOT KNOW THE FACTS.
WE SHOULD NOT JUMP TO CONCLUSIONS.
Let them unfold.



posted on Mar, 28 2012 @ 06:22 AM
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Originally posted by DJW001
And what's Martin's account? Oh, wait, he can't tell his side of the story because he's dead. This entire affair has become a media circus, and the Police Department is doing everything it can to cover up the fact that it dropped the ball. It is not a question of race, it is a question of the use of deadly force when it was not necessary.


A sensible person talking.

My question is what provoked Martin's to do that? End of the day, if someone is following me, I will get nervous and I will no doubt become the aggressor - we become like animals in situations like this but the one and only issue here is that Zimmerman used excessive force suggesting he had every intention to from the beginning which is why I believe he provoked the situation (intentionally or unintentionally because he was being a jobs worth).



posted on Mar, 28 2012 @ 06:25 AM
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Originally posted by old_god

Originally posted by DJW001
And what's Martin's account? Oh, wait, he can't tell his side of the story because he's dead. This entire affair has become a media circus, and the Police Department is doing everything it can to cover up the fact that it dropped the ball. It is not a question of race, it is a question of the use of deadly force when it was not necessary.


A sensible person talking.

My question is what provoked Martin's to do that? End of the day, if someone is following me, I will get nervous and I will no doubt become the aggressor - we become like animals in situations like this but the one and only issue here is that Zimmerman used excessive force suggesting he had every intention to from the beginning which is why I believe he provoked the situation (intentionally or unintentionally because he was being a jobs worth).


Quoting my own post, I want to be clear though, I am not saying anyone is innocent here - no one is but the public has already acted as judge and jury after following the bread crumbs, making assumptions, some real so a little too far a jump.

Either way its done and it has raised many questions about American society which hopefully will be answered by someone who deserves to be in power.



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