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A toast, to the end of veganism and vegetarianism

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posted on Mar, 25 2012 @ 10:51 PM
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A toast, to the end of veganism and vegetarianism


Although the title can resemble a subtle distaste for the concept of vegan and vegetarian ideologies, I rather applaud the dedication and efforts in which these two populations put them selves through. The exertion in which is presented quite clearly through their accomplishments of such feats is outstanding to say the very least.

I am writing this letter to all who reside here on ATS to join me in a respectable toast to the end of these specific lifestyles. Before I state why, let's clarify on the more popular reasons as to why someone may make a choice to walk down the animal-less consumption path.



In point form, the usual reasons (but not all) are as follows:

~ Health (with the benefits of fruits, vegetables and other non-animal included products in mind)
~ Anti-Animal Cruelty [Ethical Reasons] (against testing on animals, using animal tested products, and consuming or in any other way using animal based foods and products)
~ To Diminish Ones Ecological Footprint [Environmental Impact] (more on this further down)
~ To Lessen Global Food Shortage


As some of you may already know, for a number of years scientists have been attempting to create lab grown meat. Some of you may also know that they have been very successful with their attempts.




This artificial meat is grown from myoblasts (special muscle cells which repair damage) incubated in a solution derived from the blood products of animal fetuses. Sounds gruesome, but scientists hope to eventually switch to a synthetic medium for culturing the cells. Mark Post, the head investigator for the project at Eindhoven University of Technology, believes that the artificial pork could be ready for use in sausage in as little as five years.

LINK




We’ve had artificial meat in other forms for almost a decade. Scientists at Touro College in New York worked with NASA to develop an artificial fish fillet for astronauts on long space voyages. In that experiment, fish muscles were coaxed to grow in a solution after being sliced off of goldfish. In contrast, the new Dutch work is so promising because the pork grown does not require any animal to be injured during production. If ultimately successful, the Eindhoven technique may lead to a whole range of artificially grown animal products including seafood, chicken, and beef.

LINK

What would this mean for Vegans and Vegetarians however? The implications of the introduction of non-animal, grown meats is impeccably massive.

For Health, we will have the ability to extract unnecessary, and potentially harmful hormones, pesticides and other environmental factors such as mercury and other toxins. Not only that, but we'll have the potential for additives such as additional vitamins and minerals that would render grown meat a must-have on the dinner plate due to its nutritional benefits.

The ethical arguments will quite obviously become void due to there not being any animals to be consumed, hurt or otherwise stressed and mistreated. No need for elaborate campaigns and vast spending of precious funds against commodity.

The environment would receive the biggest and best impact considering that livestock is worse than transportation with it's methane releases. Not to mention the extraordinary amount of land that is required to sustain such a large population of cattle. We also need to take into consideration that the processing plants, shipping, packaging and everything else in between that is required to keep this meat clean, edible, and readily available to the public.

Lastly, with technology being exponential, the development of lab-grown meats will become increasingly easier and cheaper to make as time goes on. This means that very shortly the cost of meat will fall - ever quickening at that - to the point that we will essentially be able to abolish world hunger in this aspect.


My question to the vegans and vegetarians is this. Will you open this new advancement with open arms? And what do you expect will be the result of the vegan and vegetarian lifestyle when the availability of lab-grown meat becomes ever increasing?

As for the meat eaters here, will this new substance be just as appetizing to you as before? and will you be as open to this new concept as well?

I will.
edit on 25/3/12 by Ghost147 because: (no reason given)




posted on Mar, 25 2012 @ 11:02 PM
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Most vegetarians I know just can't stand the taste and texture of meat. I can vouch for that. For reasons I can not fathom, the past week I've become vegetarian without meaning to. It started with a steak dinner the prior week, I just found the taste and texture unpleasant even though it was a good steak and no different from every other steak I've enjoyed all my life. The same thing happened with my reaction to some chicken in some soup. I ended up avoiding all meat for about three days. I'm to the point now where I can tolerate fish and some chicken, but I don't enjoy the chicken like I used to. My attempt to eat spaghetti with meat sauce was a flop, too. I have no moral or philosophical opposition to eating hormone free, antibiotic free, humanely treated animals. I just have somehow joined the ranks of vegetarians who find meat rather gross. I don't know what triggered this or how long this might last. I started on some new over the counter allergy medication a couple of weeks ago, so that might have something to do with it.



posted on Mar, 25 2012 @ 11:10 PM
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As long as the synthetic bacon tastes as good as real bacon then im sold



posted on Mar, 25 2012 @ 11:11 PM
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Sorry but I won't eat GMO plants I certainly will not eat lab grown meats with who knows what in them and companies like Monsanto trying to re-engineer what nature took millions of years to perfect. I prefer to know whats in my meat and not trust it to mega corps who are only in it for the money.

Organic grass fed beef and free range chicken along with deer and elk etc. will always be on the menu. Vegetarianism/veganism is fine for a temporary cleansing and transition to organic eating but as a life style it has it's drawbacks and is very easy to lack enough nutrients and proteins if one is no vigilant and also does not eat organic...


edit on 25-3-2012 by hawkiye because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 25 2012 @ 11:19 PM
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Ok, so if everybody in the world started to eat veggies, we would need the land that the animals graze on for growing our foods. That's ok. Now those animals still need to be fed, or are we just going to kill them all and stick a few into zoos. We are giving these cows and animals a chance to experience life. We could be like India with cows walking the streets and eating the garbage. Nah, I don't want to step in a cow pasty full of plastic. We will need to neuter and spay any animals found in nature. Kill off any that interfere with our gardens. there will not be hunters to manage the herds anymore and no need to worry about the fish since we don't eat them. No conservation of any animal on the planet other than us will be needed. And if the grasshoppers decide to go locust, we won't have animals to back up our food supply while the plants grow back. Where do I sign up to become one of these people who think we are doing things wrong.
edit on 25-3-2012 by rickymouse because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 25 2012 @ 11:22 PM
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Eat what you like, why all the fighting....It is obvious from all these veggie vs. meat threads everyone has their own idea of what is good food. Why does everyone argue over it all the time.



posted on Mar, 26 2012 @ 12:03 AM
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reply to post by rickymouse
 

A cow is a domesticated animal that we created and way over produced. They're bad for the environment and they're unnatural. If artificially grown meat catches on, all the cows should be killed. They wouldn't be missing any "existential freedom" or anything like that. Personifying animals doesn't really make sense.

And I'm pretty sure this artificially grown meat and indoor farming would solve any food crises created by mutated grasshoppers that eat our plants (?).

edit on 26-3-2012 by UnivoxSuperfuzz because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 26 2012 @ 12:05 AM
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reply to post by Ghost147
 


I still prefer eating the real thing.

If your idea really catches on, all this technology will do is increase the number of people in the general population who will get on my nerves when they insist I should eat like they do.






edit on 26-3-2012 by loam because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 26 2012 @ 12:06 AM
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reply to post by hawkiye
 


These aren't living things and there's no reason to give them hormones or antibiotics. They're simply grown until they're the right size in a sterile environment. It would actually be safer than any naturally made meat available. Ever. That's a fact.

And as for a response to the OP, I'm a vegetarian I'd totally switch over for fake meat. No reason not to.
edit on 26-3-2012 by UnivoxSuperfuzz because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 26 2012 @ 12:17 AM
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Originally posted by ANOMALY502
Eat what you like, why all the fighting....It is obvious from all these veggie vs. meat threads everyone has their own idea of what is good food. Why does everyone argue over it all the time.


Amen to this. I 100% Agree.

If you enjoy steak, bacon, wings, then by all means, freaking eat it!


As for me, I never liked meat, even as a child I was forced to eat meat by my parents, I couldn't leave the table unless I finished my plate. I wanted to puke eating meat. It just never tasted good to me, and even to this day eating some heavier meats gives me stomach issues.

I'll eat fish, shrimp, chicken, and white turkey meat and the occasional burger here and there. I don't (and can't according to definition) consider myself a vegetarian but I'm on the border of being one. It's all a preference of taste in my opinion.

If you enjoy it, then nobody is stopping you from eating your steak, venison etc. If you prefer to go the vegan route, then go for it. I'm not judging you for being 100% vegan or for being a meat eater.

We're all human and we're in this for the experience.




posted on Mar, 26 2012 @ 12:20 AM
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It's the texture, the taste, the feeling. the fact that you know that you were eating something that was once alive. it personally disgusts me. that's just my opinion. no matter what. even eating "fake" meat grosses me out. I don't miss meat at all.



posted on Mar, 26 2012 @ 12:23 AM
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Originally posted by UnivoxSuperfuzz
reply to post by rickymouse
 

A cow is a domesticated animal that we created and way over produced. They're bad for the environment and they're unnatural. If artificially grown meat catches on, all the cows should be killed. They wouldn't be missing any "existential freedom" or anything like that. Personifying animals doesn't really make sense.

And I'm pretty sure this artificially grown meat and indoor farming would solve any food crises created by mutated grasshoppers that eat our plants (?).

edit on 26-3-2012 by UnivoxSuperfuzz because: (no reason given)


So your saying i should just shoot my livelihood? What about the Dairy industry? should we shoot all the Dairy cattle if the nation switches from consuming Dairy products to Soy based products?

The world would sure be darker place if the Bovine Species were to be annihilated because they serve no purpose anymore. Also a serious waste of a life. Personally i raise cattle because i enjoy them, no for Profits.

There are many of us who Live for cattle, Show cattle, etc. A world without them would have lost something great. You can't have Horses without cattle and vice versa. Not all cattle in the world are Commercially raised. Many live wonderful natural lives as they would in nature.

Similar things could be said about the human race sadly.

That statement is Downright Absurd and narrowminded.
edit on 26-3-2012 by Pegasus2000 because: Added content



posted on Mar, 26 2012 @ 12:37 AM
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The real difficulty with vegetarian - specifically 'vegan' diets is meeting both the caloric and nutritional needs of the human body. Plants have incomplete amino acids to complete animal proteins, forcing anyone who wants to avoid animal proteins to consume a very wide range of plant material. It's not easy to sustain, nor is it cheap (or all that practical outside of families/individuals with considerable income).

And that doesn't begin to touch a lot of the more discrete nutrients.

Humans developed the ability to eat meats because of the practicality. Animals provide complete proteins and their fats provide a considerable array of nutrients packed with energy.

Presuming the "dawn" of our species was solidified in the trailing years of the last Ice Age - this makes a lot of sense from an evolutionary standpoint.

The same logic defines it, even now. Strict vegetarian diets are very difficult to sustain in a healthy manner. Props to those who do it (it's not a bad thing - the amount of research, preparation, and gathering to be done for it is impressive in and of itself); but I would hope that if they are ever faced with a survival situation, they can resolve to survive.



posted on Mar, 26 2012 @ 12:44 AM
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Originally posted by UnivoxSuperfuzz
reply to post by hawkiye
 


These aren't living things and there's no reason to give them hormones or antibiotics. They're simply grown until they're the right size in a sterile environment. It would actually be safer than any naturally made meat available. Ever. That's a fact.

And as for a response to the OP, I'm a vegetarian I'd totally switch over for fake meat. No reason not to.
edit on 26-3-2012 by UnivoxSuperfuzz because: (no reason given)


Safer and fact my ass yeah right just like GMO's are better for you and anything the FDA approves is safe and healthy... Sigh! It's amazing the level of stupidity displayed by some...



posted on Mar, 26 2012 @ 01:02 AM
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reply to post by hawkiye
 


There is no credible study that demonstrates GMOs to pose a statistically significant risk of causing any problems.

That said - you eat what you want to. Just like you get to buy what electronics you want to. I will go over and look at your organic garden and complement you on the work you've done, just as I'd go and look at your Apple-Pod-Desk and congratulate you for doing something you are happy with.

Start trying to tell me why I'm dumb for not doing the same, and I'll point out every flaw in your 'organic' garden and the health risks you are accepting by using the methods you are; just like I would show you how useless and broken every apple product is once you get past its sleek veneer.

Life is full of choices. No choice you ever take is free of risks or errors.



posted on Mar, 26 2012 @ 01:05 AM
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I went vegetarian after I saw my brother slice his arm open and it looked like damn raw lamb chops in there......

Dead serious... Same #... I had been eating my brothers arm for 19 years!!

As for lab grown meats, that is disgusting. That just means people are sooo addicted to meat that if they can't have the real thing, they'll take the fake.. Like cheap vodka...
edit on 26-3-2012 by My.mind.is.mine because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 26 2012 @ 04:27 AM
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I will put a line in this dirt, and stand one side of it on this issue. If you are going to eat meat, make sure it has been farmed by a person whose understanding of animal husbandry is generationally imbued, and second to none. Do not make farmers take another hit to thier strapped pockets at this time in history, and ensure thier livelihoods for all time.

If a man cannot make a living doing the most natural of work, feeding people with wholesome produce, then we must all accept that on the day that farming becomes utterly financialy impossible, all of us will be doomed. I was watching a wildlife show last night at a friends house, which featured some old documentary footage filmed in the eighties, about chimps. These happy little critters share ninety percent of our genetic make up, and as a result share familiar physical and dietary habits. A chimp troop, will rip a colobus monkey into pieces, and consume it raw.

My attitude is this. Our digestive system is built to accomodate meat.It has been doing so for more tens of thousands of years, than recorded history can say, and more years than archeology has yet discovered. Displacing ourselves further from our origins has made us as a species weak. We use guns to defend ourselves, rather than the strength of our sword arms, and the power of our shield arms. We use machines to do the work that our forefathers did. We use computers to do our thinking, and even families sitting one room away from one another will now sometimes phone one another to stay in contact, rather than relying on the intimate understanding that used to be shared between those of like blood, a deeper type of interfamilial communion than can even be thought about by the latest generation of materialists.

I see this pathetic turn of events, this fake meat, as no more than another bar on the cage that is being dropped around all wholesome things, all traditional things, and all that makes our species worth a damn. Soon we will not be allowed to eat real meat, because some simpering tit will decide that its not morally correct to do so. These fools will doom us to slavery to the chemists and biologists who have created these fake meats, the monopoly is ready to roll. The people who would like to see this happen are traitors against the entire human race, and are contributing to our downfall.



posted on Mar, 26 2012 @ 04:56 AM
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Originally posted by Aim64C
reply to post by hawkiye
 


There is no credible study that demonstrates GMOs to pose a statistically significant risk of causing any problems.

That said - you eat what you want to. Just like you get to buy what electronics you want to. I will go over and look at your organic garden and complement you on the work you've done, just as I'd go and look at your Apple-Pod-Desk and congratulate you for doing something you are happy with.

Start trying to tell me why I'm dumb for not doing the same, and I'll point out every flaw in your 'organic' garden and the health risks you are accepting by using the methods you are; just like I would show you how useless and broken every apple product is once you get past its sleek veneer.

Life is full of choices. No choice you ever take is free of risks or errors.


Wow maybe you should try some research first before you embarrass yourself further www.abovetopsecret.com...

Stupid is as stupid does. Oh and please do show us the risks and dangers of organic gardening... Sigh!



posted on Mar, 26 2012 @ 05:53 AM
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Spare me the ####### bacon bits and drug-tortured animal flesh.

If I want meat I'll kill it myself.



posted on Mar, 26 2012 @ 08:19 AM
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reply to post by hawkiye
 


Wow, thanks for insulting me with literally no basis. I explained myself logically. There would be no reason to genetically modify or add hormones or pesticides to artificially grown, controlled meat. Just because you don't understand biology doesn't make me an idiot.



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