'Honour' violence is acceptable, say one in five young British Asians

reply to post by ollncasino

Obviously, this is an attempt to vilify the current enemy of choice: the Muslims.

However, violence towards women in both the US and UK is hardly limited to the Muslims.

But this wont make the headlines because it hurts the propaganda rather than support it.

In the U.S.:

In 2005, 1,181 women were murdered by an intimate partner.1 That's an average of three women every day. Of all the women murdered in the U.S., about one-third were killed by an intimate partner.

According to the National Center for Injury Prevention and Control, women experience about 4.8 million intimate partner-related physical assaults and rapes every year.

According to the National Crime Victimization Survey, which includes crimes that were not reported to the police, 232,960 women in the U.S. were raped or sexually assaulted in 2006. That's more than 600 women every day.

www.now.org...

In the U.K and Wales.:

On average, two women in England and Wales are killed every week by a current or former male partner.

One incident of domestic violence is reported to the police every minute.

There were 48,801 incidents of domestic abuse recorded in 2006-07 in Scotland.

One in five women in Northern Ireland has experienced domestic violence.

www.endviolenceagainstwomen.org.uk...

I often wonder if it would be as acceptable if there was a death penalty for murder.

so? Hasn't west been waging genocide on hundreds of millions and billions for centuries?

reply to post by mkgandhas


Uhhh no actually.

So would I be able to kill any radical Muslim I want for the honor of all the Americans dead....sounds good to me.

reply to post by ollncasino


Political correctness is something that I oppose, even though I consider myself left-leaning. I believe that the same standards should be applied to everyone. I expect the same high ethical standards of non-Europeans that I expect of Europeans. I am tired of Hollywood and the cultural elites promoting "tolerance" at the expense of certain moral standards that should apply to everyone. One of those standards should be womens' rights.

All religious fascism should be opposed. I am also in favor of a total ban on all immigration from anywhere (including Europe) in the name of saving the environment from human encroachment. It is not racism, although I might be accused of that. It is the same reason I believe that birth control should be readily available and part of any health plan. If we become as populous as India and China, our environment will be destroyed completely. The trend toward a few billionaires running everything will increase even further, as it has already increased since we became a nation of ever more people. We will also have to accommodate barbarism in the name of tolerance, just like Europe and Israel are being forced to by politically correct enablers.

How is it that families of twenty kids can provide each child with love? That does not sound possible to me. I think that the Mountain Lion, the Wolf, the Bear and, if it exists, the Sasquatch ought to have some consideration here. Immigration and a high birth rate, promoted by a number of religions in the name of filling the pews, are nothing but trouble anywhere. Sex is good, and so is procreation. Celibacy is not the answer. Birth control is.

I am not a Malthusian because Malthus believed in the idea of a HIGH birthrate leading to a culling. The world's elites have promoted a high birth rate, and then turn around and say that we should have only 500,000,000 people around. This essentially means that they choose who lives and who dies. Personally, I believe that human choice and womens' empowerment are the answer. The world has been too tolerant of the abuse of women. Malthusianism would simply add to that abuse.

Originally posted by gladtobehere
Obviously, this is an attempt to vilify the current enemy of choice: the Muslims.

However, violence towards women in both the US and UK is hardly limited to the Muslims.

So you object to the BBC making a documentary about Muslim honour killings on the grounds that it's an "attempt to vilify Muslims"?

Surely the problem is the honour killings themselves, not the fact that the BBC has shone a light on them?

Europe tackles 'honour killings'

European police are meeting in The Hague to look at ways of tackling the rising phenomenon of "honour killings".

In England and Wales police are reinvestigating more than 100 murders they suspect could be honour killings.

Police say some of the murders were carried out by contract killers hired by the families.

Should the police also be prevented from investigating 'honour killings' on the grounds that they are "attempt to vilify the current enemy of choice: the Muslims."?

I think you would prefer that.

Okay then, looking at it another way, approximately four out of five young British erm,..."Asians" do NOT condone honor violence. Well then, there has been some good in having them leave behind their old culture and embracing new ideals then. Good, now continue to uphold and defend laws protecting all people from assault, persecution and murder, and somehow convince the majority to bring the scary minority into the new millennium. Why are we ignoring a majority number of modern thinking enlightened Muslims because of a bad fifth? There are ignorant vile abusive subcultures of every kind everywhere. I'm sure we've all seen signs of that at some point.

Originally posted by SheeplFlavoredAgain
Okay then, looking at it another way, approximately four out of five young British erm,..."Asians" do NOT condone honor violence.

And that clearly is a good thing.

Originally posted by SheeplFlavoredAgain
Why are we ignoring a majority number of modern thinking enlightened Muslims because of a bad fifth?

Becuase the 4/5s aren't the ones causing a problem?

Originally posted by ollncasino

The newspaper report uses the word 'Asian'. While in the USA this has a wider meaning, in the UK it is now a code word for 'Muslim', particularily Pakistani Muslims.

To identify honour killings with Muslims is apparently to be avoided even though they carry out 96% of honour killings in Europe.

www.meforum.org...

Luckily only 6% of those questioned felt that an honour killing was justified. That is still a large number of young people in real terms however.

I do not think that you really understand what you are talking about. Izzat is a belief in the reciprocation of deeds, whether they be good or bad, and it is rooted in a society that is different from the west. It is the same as the idea of honor in Japan or in old English tales, like Beowulf, in that you are supposed to avenge the ones that have been wrongfully harmed. Furthermore, the notion of Honor as a way to describe this method, it is so vague as to encompass a range of various crimes like you mention, which I feel is taking Izzat out of context. Just because someone believes in something that you do not, whether it be religious, or an idea of honor, I don't feel like it is right to judge. Luckily.

Originally posted by buckeye13

I do not think that you really understand what you are talking about.

Izzat is a belief in the reciprocation of deeds, whether they be good or bad, and it is rooted in a society that is different from the west.

This Wikipedia page would suggest that the BBC are entirely correct in their use of Izzat in relation to honour killings.

Izzat (Hindi-Urdu: इज़्ज़त or عزت) refers to the concept of honor prevalent in the culture of North India and Pakistan. It applies universally across religions (Hindu, Muslim and Sikh), communities and genders.

Maintaining the reputation of oneself and one's family (especially women) is part of the concept of izzat, as is the obligatory taking of revenge when one's izzat has been violated.

Although the concept of izzat has been viewed as curtailing the freedom of women, it is also a strongly egalitarian concept that cuts across social hierarchy and enforces "equality in giving, but also equality in vengeance

en.wikipedia.org...

Originally posted by buckeye13
Just because someone believes in something that you do not, whether it be religious, or an idea of honor, I don't feel like it is right to judge. Luckily.

On the contrary, when Muslims choose to live in the West but carry out violence and murders in pursuit of their 'honour' then I have every right to judge.

'Honor killings' in USA raise concerns

Muslim immigrant men have been accused of six "honor killings" in the United States in the past two years, prompting concerns that the Muslim community and police need to do more to stop such crimes.

"There is broad support and acceptance of this idea in Islam, and we're going to see it more and more in the United States," says Robert Spencer, who has trained FBI and military authorities on Islam and founded Jihad Watch, which monitors radical Islam.

USA Today

reply to post by ollncasino


I didn't even know Britain had five Asians in it.

reply to post by Jameela


What a joke - he started a false religion, resurrecting the moon god as Allah - he was a mass murderer and a pedophile. To say he was 'pure' is vile.

reply to post by Jameela


Again you spout nonsense - no Christian commits honor killings. It is 100% opposed to the Christian faith. just because someone claims to be Christian does not make it so.

reply to post by Jameela


Islam deserves to be hated. it is the most dangerous religion in our time and is built upon hatred, lies and dishonesty. A vile notion from a vile so-called 'prophet.'

reply to post by Jameela


HA! Muslims dedicate their entire lives to getting rid of Christians. It's what the hell-spawned religion is all about. You must be either very foolish or very evil. Even your 'holy' book says its OK to lie to non-believers, so how can we even consider anything you say? Liars, murderous, pedophile prophet - something to be really proud of!

Originally posted by mkgandhas
so? Hasn't west been waging genocide on hundreds of millions and billions for centuries? thing is that the biggest barbarians are the most noisy ones about 'human rights' in zones where massive natural resources exist.

That's a logical fallacy, therefore not a valid argumentative point. Fail. Despite that, it also has absolutely nothing to do with the OP. Murder is not justification for murder to begin with, so even if your argument was relative, which it is not, it would make no difference.

I have read about what they do to their daughters in "Asian" places like this, and there is absolutely no honor in it. There is NEVER any honor in inflicting pain and suffering on another human being. There just isn't, and that is a fact that cannot be disputed.

What these barbarians are referring to as "honor" is nothing more than an excuse for them to punish anyone they feel has wronged them, as well as to take revenge on others. There is no honor in beating your wife because she doesn't want to have sex with you, or beating your daughter because she was raped, against her will of course.

A woman wants out of a marriage because her husband beats her and treats her like garbage, but if she attempts this, she gets "punished" so that the man can preserve his "honor"...These are just a few examples, but other acts of violence occur for minor reasons that still attract more violence. I am all for letting a country rule itself via its own system, but I advocated this mainly because I thought that your average person had common sense, as well as a common sense of morality.

Apparently I was incorrect, and anyone who would hurt another person to fulfill their own selfish needs is sick, and it is even worse when they say that they are doing it for a noble and honorable reason. That is the most stupid thing I have ever heard in my entire life, and I've heard some stupid things. These "Asians", since apparently it is politically incorrect to say the truth, Muslims, are so backward that they really do need civilization.

Despite the fact that I am against the way the West spreads "democracy", I really wish they would spread it, nice and thick, on every single one of the morons who advocate hurting other people for their "honor". It would be laughable if it wasn't so sick and twisted.

Originally posted by aardvark888
What a joke - he started a false religion, resurrecting the moon god as Allah - he was a mass murderer and a pedophile. To say he was 'pure' is vile.

I have to agree with you on that.

In the space of a single decade

Muhammad
• fought eight major battles,
• led eighteen raids,
• planned another thirty-eight military operations where others were in command but operating under his orders and strategic direction.

HistoryNet

Muhammad, for a man who started the religion of 'peace' was rather violent.

He was a slaver who sold POWs into slavery and also possessed slaves (including one which appears to have shared his bed). He encouraged his men to rape captive women.

He wasn't beyond political assassination or executing POWs either.

Raiding of caravan trains and killing the guards was a run of the mill occurance and rather lucrative.

All in all, the Koran, Hadiths and the first biography about him (by a devout Muslim) don't paint a picture of a man of peace at all. The portray him as a blood thirsty warlord.

"I was ordered to fight all men until they say 'There is no god but Allah."

Prophet Muhammad's farewell address, March 632

yalepress.yale.edu...

To be fair though, there is nothing in the Koran that justifies honour killings. It is a cultural practice carried out by Muslims.

reply to post by ollncasino


Strangely enough, if a muslim kills for honor of god or family, it is ok and acceptable.

If the victim turns the tables on the honor killer or simply survives, they are a cold blodded butcher or heathen and more often than not, executed by the religious police for simply living through the ordeal.

Same with rape victims. The young girls raped are mostly put to death for being sluts.

I think Lady Liberty Should Close the Book she is Holding on Immigrants

Muslims that are Unable to Handle Westernization

have their Ass Deported ..

and A Evaluation of the Mental State of Response of Honor & Mercy Killing

What i dont get like other ATS members on this Thread

Why the Hell do they come to America if they cant Handle Westernization

as Jim Morrison said the West is the Best

Make Sure a eastern Muslim doesn't listen to the Lyrics of The END by the Doors

especially when they Dont want to Westernize

to much Freedom , Revenge & """"" Pleasure"""" in that Song !
for a EASTERN Muslim to Understand

Ride the Snake ...

Can you picture what will be So limitless and free...

Freedom of and From Religion to do what you want to do

Lost in a Roman...wilderness of pain
And all the children are insane
All the children are insane Waiting for the summer rain, yeah

Eastern Muslim LOst in a Different World and see's the HORROR of the West
what their Mother & Father told them about of western civilization
Much like being in a Roman Colosseum Event

The west is the best Get here, and we'll do the rest

then Realizing hey I want his Modernization American Life Style Culture
and have fun like the Rest!

And he came to a door...
and he looked inside Father, yes son, I want to kill you
Mother...I want to..

Rebelling of no way Out .. Brainwashed of the Middle Eastern Society cant let go
Stuck on the Lifestyle , Or To Break Out of the Religious Mold ...
a Rebirth Resurrection from Old Tradition or their Value their Morals the Religion & Culture

The Ending of it All a Renew of Life .... WAKE UP !!!


Well this is How i See it in this Vision Im Getting from the Song & this Thread

A Jim Morrison Moment

The doors - The end [live in Toronto - 1967 - Part 1]

Originally posted by ollncasino

The vast majority of honour killings are carried out by Muslims killing other Muslims.

The Word Izzat. How many Languages do you speak or understand? Outside your Western world the Term Izzat is commonly used with high regard in India, Sri Lanka, Bangladesh, Pakistan, The Rest of the Middle East, Its version of Honor. Mainly used by Women, The word Izzat is hard to describe since English itself is quite a small and in adequate language including the westerners like yourself too small minded and always jumping 'lets blame the muzzis' bandwagon while you ignore your Zionist leaders. Many of these countries have at least 20 different words to describe water. there are variants of this word in Mongolia and other Asian countries such as Vietnam, etc, Countries like Italy and Spain also have certain code of Honor and respect that is quite similar to the Izzat term. You will see a big difference in people from these countries to the general westerner.

Honor Killings are very common in India as well, a Hindu country. You see outside the western world, most people find your culture, your people and your way of life too bigoted, small minded, materialistic, shallow and generally inferior. Money or Technology Alone doesn't make you the better person. Its Culture that puts our value in us. For example, we dont raise our women to grow up to be whores or to go around sleeping with every guy that she comes across. Its the Term Izzat, honor of oneself and their family that is something more understood and powered by women then most men in the Asian continent eg, india. As For Honor Killings, I Dont Condone them in general, however I can understand when it happens in some cases and I wont disapprove of it either.

I hate to be rude but to be honest I dont think its something a Westerner or a Australian would understand with their few hundred year old culture. I have lived in australia for a short time, terrible behaved people next to the kiwis. Just consider this, We the people outside the western world, find your culture inferior and wish not to be any part of it, neither do we want our children to be brainwashed into your biased way of thinking by your zionist media. And as honor killings being "carried out by Muslims killing other Muslims" Who do you expect the Muslims to kill?? Should they go kill other people now like the media keeps portraying? I am sure America does a great job of being the global terrorist.


By the way I also wanted to add, I dont Support sharia law however the honor killings is not just a Muslim Thing entirely, Its something that has been around for a long time before Islam came into progress, specially across the Asian Region, Read more on it. Goes on a lot out side the western world, I am sure even in Latin america and Mexico? As for japan, Ever heard of sepeku?