300,000 oppose gay marriage in biggest petition since election

reply to post by ollncasino


wow i am very pleased to see a decent response from someone i dont agree.

i just dont think the idea of marriage is as special as people, mostly religious people, want to believe it to be.

do you know more people who have been married once and are still happy together, or do you know more people who have been divorced and even on a second marriage?


its just a word really.

maybe straight people should be forced into civil unions for 20 years until they can prove they are worthy of the title of being married.

Originally posted by OrchusGhule

I am not convinced that this is as big a problem as you think it is. I know that in the states where gay marriage has been legalized, churches are not forced to marry anyone.

This expert on British law disagrees with you. It's a problem.

Neil Addison, a specialist in discrimination law, told the Mail: "Once same-sex marriage has been legalised then the partners to such a marriage are entitled to exactly the same rights as partners in a heterosexual marriage.

"This means that if same-sex marriage is legalised in the UK it will be illegal for the Government to prevent such marriages happening in religious premises."

The Telegraph

Originally posted by OrchusGhule
Gays go where they are welcomed to be married, and there are churches who are perfectly willing to marry gays in the eyes of God.

And other gays go where they can sue someone and make a tidy profit. Gays are only human after all.

– A Christian photographer was forced by the New Mexico Civil Rights Commission to pay $6,637 in attorney’s costs after she refused to photograph a gay couple’s commitment ceremony.

– A psychologist in Georgia was fired after she declined for religious reasons to counsel a lesbian about her relationship.

– Christian fertility doctors in California who refused to artificially inseminate a lesbian patient were barred by the state Supreme Court from invoking their religious beliefs in refusing treatment.

– A Christian student group was not recognized at a University of California law school because it denies membership to anyone practicing sex outside of traditional marriage.

Washington Post

Atheists also get married and legally call themselves "married", so saying that it is a religious institution is just bollocks. Essentially the term "marriage" is a social meme, and the meme adapts to the society that is using it.

Socially we understand that "marriage" is a union of two loving people. By "not allowing" gays to use a socially accepted term under the letter of the law, and forcing them to only use another term for the same set of rights is a form of discrimination.

Further, using the argument that "the traditional meaning of marriage is of a man and woman under the eyes of god" is also bollocks because words change their meanings over time. For instance, the traditional meaning of "gay" was "happy" not homosexual or lesbian.

Marriage has had many different interpretations at various points in time and in different cultures.It's absurd that a group of people are trying to control the meaning and use of a word, and since the gay community is being discriminated against, of course they should be pushing for equality.

Cheers

I'm all for gay marriage as long as both chicks are hot

I've been married twice and had one divorce

so as long as gay marriage also means gay divorce and gay alimony
I'm cool with it.

reply to post by southbeach


that is my point also
be what u want to be
but dont expect me to be

Originally posted by Freeborn
reply to post by ollncasino

 

Do you agree that the words mother, father, husband & wife should be replaced in official/legal documents by parent 1, parent 2, spouse 1 and spouse 2?

So what?

Are we really getting wound up over legal terminology?

You are right that there is no public groundswell in support of this.
I explained why in my very first post in this thread.
It's the sort of subject that those who oppose it are very passionate about it, generally because their opposition is based on some outdated bigotry or religious conviction.
The vast majority really couldn't give a toss and find it so irrelevant that they hardly go out of their way to even comment on it.

They aren't wanting something different to the rest of us.
It wouldn't hurt anyone in any way whatsoever.
I really don't see the problem at all.

This is more about people wanting to impose their morals and standards on people than anything else.

That's it.....I'm out of this thread.

yes, and in this case it's the gay marriage activists that are attempting to force their morality on those that define morality in other ways.
This isn't marriage activists forcing gays to call marriage a marriage.
The opposite is true.
You obviously got confused by whom the aggressor is in this case.

Originally posted by puzzlesphere
Further, using the argument that "the traditional meaning of marriage is of a man and woman under the eyes of god" is also bollocks because words change their meanings over time

But the meaning of the word 'marriage' hasn't changed. It still means a union between a man and women.

It's the gay lobby who are attempting to force a change on the rest of us by legislation.

reply to post by ollncasino


what are the divorce rates for straight couples in the uk?

in america the rates are so laughable that i see no sanctity in marriage .

reply to post by ollncasino


I think some of you are looking for something to be homophobic against, this hate you let inside you, will do you NO good. It will only turn YOUR body against YOU, you become ignorant , you lose sight of the much bigger problems, You become closed off , you will LOSE friends too. Those on here who are opposed to gay marriages, why are you?, is it because you've spent too long listening to KKK/gay bashing, ignorant, WRONG, VILE, HATEFUL rhetoric coming from a right wing "party" who cares NOTHING for YOU, it only sees you as a PAWN & a $ sign NOTHING more, you are being lead and you follow blindly without asking any questions. This is beginning to look alot like the witch/ earth healers hunt down of salem's past. Looking to blame someone for something that is genetic, thats ignorant, WRONG, absurd, and I will NOT associate or help anyone backing the gay bashing, I refuse and I used to think some of you were pretty good people. Guess I was wrong about some of you all along. I have gay & lesbian FRIENDS & FAMILY, I think some of you have forgotten what HONOR, RESPECT & EMPATHY means, I'll go as far as to say to those of you standing against gay marriage are SCARED COWARDS, I stand against YOU and there are more who feel the same way I do. Oh by the way it's on, want some come get some!.

reply to post by Freeborn


I think it's sad that such an obvious statement has to be made, but homosexuality is not normal. It is an aberration. It goes against nature. It does not fit with the biological mechanisms of man and woman. The genitalia of man and woman dictate that a man is meant to couple with a woman - only.

Homosexuals cannot reproduce so they have to, by any means possible increase their numbers. They are an unhappy lot and therefore are continually trying to seek approval from society. The very idea of gay marriage will further break down society, as has feminism and the advent of loose sexual morals and easy divorce has over the past decades.

The onslaught of the gay agenda in schools, trying to corrupt very young children is also a disgrace that needs to be fought against. This is the problem - they don't just keep it to themselves. They want to encourage others into this 'death-style.' And this is exactly what it is, the facts can't be denied - homosexuals die younger!

It is a fact that there are many people who have homosexual desires, but because of their consciences they have chosen to live a heterosexual lifestyle. They deny those lusts because they know they are not right.

If you can't see that homosexuality is a dysfunction then there is little hope for you and if the general polulace as a whole embraces this harmful way of life, there is little hope for society as well.

Originally posted by MisticRebel
Those on here who are opposed to gay marriages, why are you?, is it because you've spent too long listening to KKK/gay bashing, ignorant, WRONG, VILE, HATEFUL rhetoric coming from a right wing "party" who cares NOTHING for YOU, it only sees you as a PAWN & a $ sign NOTHING more, you are being lead and you follow blindly without asking any questions.

You are hardly likely to convince someone to support gay marriage with an attitude like that.

Originally posted by MisticRebel
This is beginning to look alot like the witch/ earth healers hunt down of salem's past. Looking to blame someone for something that is genetic, thats ignorant, WRONG, absurd, and I will NOT associate or help anyone backing the gay bashing, I refuse and I used to think some of you were pretty good people.

What gay bashing?

This is about whether the gay movement has the right to change the menaing of the word marriage to include gay civil unions.

Originally posted by MisticRebel
Guess I was wrong about some of you all along. I have gay & lesbian FRIENDS & FAMILY, I think some of you have forgotten what HONOR, RESPECT & EMPATHY means, I'll go as far as to say to those of you standing against gay marriage are SCARED COWARDS

People who oppose gay marriage are SCARED COWARDS?

Originally posted by MisticRebel
I stand against YOU and there are more who feel the same way I do. Oh by the way it's on, want some come get some!.

Sorry, I thought you were serious right up to the end. I understand you are just having a laugh.

reply to post by ollncasino


Again, I'm calling you gay bashers OUT, I'm here standing against YOU , and there are more standing AGAINST YOU. You think its ok to call gay, lesbian, bisexual, transgender second class people, you think you got the right to hate them, you think you have the right to tell them how they have to live, then you really are ignorant, LOST, NOT holy, COWARDLY, NO honor, NO guts. Some of you have forgotten what democracy means, you'vealso strayed far from the right path. NO you aren't on the right path , your mind is clouded those of you backing the NAZI right wing "party" which its not a party, its the epidomy of the SS & the KKK put together, you really want to support another genocidal group?. Cause those of you who stand with the right wing, that is where YOU are headed. It will come to drawing lines in the sand, and I know where I stand & it sure isn't with ignorant, closed minded, hypocritical nazi wannabes. you sure you want to FALL with the right wing?

reply to post by aardvark888

Anti homosexuality ....anti feminism.....
I take it your pro sharia law???

Click here for more information.

This is annoying. I agree homosexuals should have the right to be together and enjoy the same rights as a marriage (benefits and legal stuff and such) but marriage is a between a man and a woman.

reply to post by aardvark888


Normal!??!! whose to say what normal is? what is your criteria?

if one institution is attempting to define normal for all, well, isn't that where fascism, xenophobia, totalitarianism etc. etc. all come from. when we define what normal is for all, we take the first step on a slippery slope to reservations, concentration camps, reeducation camps, inquisitions and so on.

as well, homosexuality is found quite often in nature: en.wikipedia.org...

lastly, using your argument that sex is solely for procreative purposes, i sure do hope you have never been involved in any form of fellatio, cunalingus, or any other form of frisky time.... cause that would be unnatural according to your definition.

listen... i respect that homosexuality makes you uncomfortable. i respect that it is not 'normal' for you... but it is perfectly normal for a great deal of other folk. who is anyone to condemn them if they are celebrating and loving the life they have been given?


PS mods... hopefully the technical terms for those particular acts of intimacy i stated above won't get this post nixed. i'm trying to illustrate the point that sexual expression comes in a great many forms, other than solely coitus for reproductions sake. thanks!

... but the meaning of "marriage" has changed.

Atheists legally call themselves married, so in that sense the term no longer means "in the eyes of god", technically by today's current understanding of the word it means "in the eye of the law", so the meaning has changed, at least legally.

I don't call a gay couple "civilly unioned"; that just sounds silly and cumbersome. I will call any officially unioned couple married regardless of their sex (or species for that matter) because that's the socially understandable term for it. To not allow it to be official is pigheaded and discriminatory.

You understand what is meant by "gay marriage", so the meme has already shifted, there are just a bunch of people who haven't accepted it yet.

Originally posted by kaylaluv

Originally posted by OrchusGhule
The funny thing being that the original technical definition of marriage WAS a legal union between a man and a woman, and did not include same sex relationships.

Believe or not, there have been same-sex marriages in the history of the world. So, heterosexuals don't "own" the rights to marriage.

www.randomhistory.com...

Speaking from a strictly non-religious standpoint, I think its absolutely disgusting and can not fathom what would be going through a man's mind when...well, you get the idea. I don't care what they do, but at the same time, I don't want to be called a hate monger, a bigot, or a homophobe when I make it clear that I find homosexuality to be disgusting.

Technically speaking, the definition of homophobe is one who has feelings of aversion and contempt for homosexuals. I think finding something to be disgusting is considered aversion and contempt. So, technically, you ARE a homophobe. Just embrace it, if that's what you are - and quit trying to deny it.

en.wikipedia.org...

Do you find it an insult to be called a homophobe? Does it make you feel bad about yourself? Shouldn't you just "get it over it", the way you say gays should just "get over it"?

I've been with my "wife" for 10 years, and while I call her my wife, we are not married and never will be, because we don't need the government or the legal system to tell us we are together.

Good for you. Some people want to be married within the legal system. Who are you to tell them they can't?

I, for one, don't think we should start changing definitions of words to fit a certain group's interpretation of those words. If we did that with everything, language just would not work properly.

This, I find to be the most hilarious argument. Nobody will know what the word marriage means if gays get married? Seriously? Marriage is when 2 people decide to "partner up", hopefully for life. Sometimes there will be children, sometimes not. Sometimes people partner up for love, sometimes they partner up for money, or political gain, or property gain. None of that will change when gays get married. The definition has not changed.
A parent is still a parent; a mother is still a mother; a father is still a father. It's not confusing.

Wow, just wow. I expected you to twist my words, but I did not expect you to twist them that much and then attempt to put words in my mouth and make a number of assumptions about me. I'm going to respond briefly because this is just one of those things I don't care too much about, so I'd rather not waste much time on it.

I am going to explain in simple English for you. Look up the definition of phobia. Then look up the definition of homophobia. Homophobia is the fear of homosexuals. I am not afraid of homosexuals. I think some of their sexual acts are disgusting on a physical level, like licking a bathroom floor is disgusting. I do not hate homosexuals, nor do I interact with homosexuals differently than I do with heterosexuals. Therefore, I am not a homophobe as you insist. I merely do not understand why they insist on changing the definition of a word to fit their value system. That's all. Civil unions come with the same legal clap trap as marriage does, so again, why is this such a constant issue?

It just seems to me that much of this is not geared toward gaining homosexuals more rights, but instead to deny others the right to hold a negative or neutral opinion about homosexuality.

reply to post by MisticRebel


That was one of the most hateful rehetoric I think I have ever read on ats directed at a group, couched in more ignorance than I have read in such a small and factless post to date.
Lets start by the genetics statement.
It's PROVEN that there is no scince to back that statement up.
It's based on one researcher that others call a scientist whose work was discredited. But the question is "why do people still make the statement using it to support their ideologies"?
There is NO GAY GENE. It simply has never been identified.
Your post is simply hate filled.

reply to post by mythos


Animals throughout nature are found eating feces.
That's natural for the animal kingdom.
Humans are above that.....for the most part...hehe, these type of threads make me wonder.