300,000 oppose gay marriage in biggest petition since election

Originally posted by Helmkat
Oh and by the way, its not that Gay Marriage isn't a Human right, its that Marriage itself is not a Human right.

Source?

Originally posted by Freeborn
Seriously, how is gays wishing to have the right to marriage advancing their rights at the expense of other groups.

See my post above where Christians have been sued for refusing to offer services to gays.

Do you agree that the words mother, father, husband & wife should be replaced in official/legal documents by parent 1, parent 2, spouse 1 and spouse 2?

Again, not a theoretical argument. That is what happened in Canada.

reply to post by ollncasino

Do you agree that the words mother, father, husband & wife should be replaced in official/legal documents by parent 1, parent 2, spouse 1 and spouse 2?

So what?

Are we really getting wound up over legal terminology?

You are right that there is no public groundswell in support of this.
I explained why in my very first post in this thread.
It's the sort of subject that those who oppose it are very passionate about it, generally because their opposition is based on some outdated bigotry or religious conviction.
The vast majority really couldn't give a toss and find it so irrelevant that they hardly go out of their way to even comment on it.

They aren't wanting something different to the rest of us.
It wouldn't hurt anyone in any way whatsoever.
I really don't see the problem at all.

This is more about people wanting to impose their morals and standards on people than anything else.

That's it.....I'm out of this thread.

Originally posted by Freeborn
So what?

Are we really getting wound up over legal terminology?

There certainly is no ground swell of support for replacing the words mother, father, husband & wife in official/legal documents with parent 1, parent 2, spouse 1 and spouse 2.

But that is what happened in Canada when gay marriage was legalised.

Why? The words mother, father, husband & wife no longer worked when the members of a 'marriage' were two men.

Originally posted by ollncasino

Originally posted by imjustcurious242
Just because canadians did something stupid doesn't mean rest have to follow that. Just because u can;t figure out how to write a document doesn't mean u can take someones basic human right.Anyways point taken.

But how can we deal with the problem of legal documents that currently say 'mother', 'father', 'husband' and 'wife' if the two parties to a marriage are of the same sex?

The Canadians introduced parent 1, parent 2, spouse 1 and spouse 2 onto official/legal documents for that reason.

I'm wouldn't be happy being referred to as parent 1 or spouse 1 on a legal or official document, but that is what we are talking about if gays are allowed to get 'married'.

First of all, I am a heterosexual mother and wife, and I wouldn't have a problem being referred to as parent 1 or spouse 1.

I will say that I have seen some documents here in America where there are a couple of spaces for "Parent/Guardian", and then next to each name, there is a space for "Relationship". Under Relationship, you could put whatever you want, i.e., Mother, Father, Aunt, Grandmother, etc. So, you could possibly have two names listed under Parent/Guardian, and both names could have "Father" listed under Relationship. Seems like a generic way of handling it without hurting anybody's "feelers".

Originally posted by ollncasino


The Washington Post recently printed an article citing several examples in the United States of just how gay marriage and gay rights in general are stepping on the rights of Christians all across the country.

– A Christian photographer was forced by the New Mexico Civil Rights Commission to pay $6,637 in attorney’s costs after she refused to photograph a gay couple’s commitment ceremony.

– A psychologist in Georgia was fired after she declined for religious reasons to counsel a lesbian about her relationship.

– Christian fertility doctors in California who refused to artificially inseminate a lesbian patient were barred by the state Supreme Court from invoking their religious beliefs in refusing treatment.

– A Christian student group was not recognized at a University of California law school because it denies membership to anyone practicing sex outside of traditional marriage.

The Washington Post

Substitute the word "Black" each time you see the word "gay" or "lesbian". Discrimination is an ugly thing, and unfortunately many people use the Bible to justify their prejudices. The KKK claims to use the Bible to justify the superiority of the Aryan race.

The funny thing being that the original technical definition of marriage WAS a legal union between a man and a woman, and did not include same sex relationships. This entire fiasco has been about the definition of a word, not whether homosexual couples can be together or not. While I do not oppose same sex relationships, I don't really understand why they are not satisfied with civil unions, instead of creating such an issue of it and insisting that the definition of marriage be changed. If you compare dictionaries from 30 years ago to those of more recent years, you will see what I mean.

It always seems to me that homosexuals are extremely focused on making sure everyone knows they are in fact homosexual, and many of them make it a point to rub it in the faces of people who may not be entirely comfortable with homosexuality. Speaking from a strictly non-religious standpoint, I think its absolutely disgusting and can not fathom what would be going through a man's mind when...well, you get the idea. I don't care what they do, but at the same time, I don't want to be called a hate monger, a bigot, or a homophobe when I make it clear that I find homosexuality to be disgusting. You can barely say anything negative about homosexuality these days without being called a Nazi or an underevolved ignorant pig, and I don't think its fair. If you are going to do those things with your....things....you need to understand that if you flaunt it and insist on changing the definition of words so everyone knows what you are doing, there will be people out there who will turn up their noses in disgust. Just get used to it and get over it. Its their right to have an opinion, and just because homosexuals don't like that opinion and think everyone should be accepting of their behavior does not mean that opinion makes one a homophobe. I can understand not wanting to be discriminated against, but that's not what this is about. Its about taking over a heterosexual practice with the intent of making it your own and, in many cases it seems, to wave in the face of heterosexuals while saying "nanananabooboo I'm gay and you're a dirty homophobe."

Which brings me to ask, why is it so important that you are married anyway? Its just a legal technicality and a civil union carries the same legal guidelines, so what's the rub? Why do you feel it necessary to take a practice that is heterosexual by definition, change the meaning of the word and force your way into a long standing institution?

I've been with my "wife" for 10 years, and while I call her my wife, we are not married and never will be, because we don't need the government or the legal system to tell us we are together.

I, for one, don't think we should start changing definitions of words to fit a certain group's interpretation of those words. If we did that with everything, language just would not work properly.

Originally posted by kaylaluv
Substitute the word "Black" each time you see the word "gay" or "lesbian". Discrimination is an ugly thing, and unfortunately many people use the Bible to justify their prejudices. The KKK claims to use the Bible to justify the superiority of the Aryan race

You certainly appear pro-gay and anti-Christian.

I am still not convinced that Christians should be forced by law to marry gays. That is exactly what is going to happen if gays are allowed to get married.

Neil Addison, a specialist in discrimination law, told the Mail: "Once same-sex marriage has been legalised then the partners to such a marriage are entitled to exactly the same rights as partners in a heterosexual marriage.

"This means that if same-sex marriage is legalised in the UK it will be illegal for the Government to prevent such marriages happening in religious premises."

The Telegraph

Originally posted by OrchusGhule
Which brings me to ask, why is it so important that you are married anyway?

Its just a legal technicality and a civil union carries the same legal guidelines, so what's the rub?

Why do you feel it necessary to take a practice that is heterosexual by definition, change the meaning of the word and force your way into a long standing institution?

Because it is all about gays demanding that the hetrosexual majority give them moral and legal support for their lifestyle choice.

They already have equal rights with a civil union.

Originally posted by sealing
reply to post by ollncasino

 

Obviously 300,000 ignorant witch hunters have been reincarnated.

Why does anyone care? How do same sex couples being married effect
any of these petitioners? The petitioners certainly have an effect on gay couples.

This will be seen in the future as absurd as separate bathrooms for non-whites.
Those against this need to get on the right side of history and humanity.

What a load of crap you have just stated
this/my country was founded on many things recently and in the past.
dont spout about history for i will twist it
this is just simple thinking
oooohhh we have to be nice to the gays..wtf
if this mentality continues expect test tube babies to be the norm in so many years
ffs all of you
your being played of against each other
if your gay want to be gay so be it
but dont expect us straight peeps to take it
its not the norm nor ever will be

Originally posted by OrchusGhule
The funny thing being that the original technical definition of marriage WAS a legal union between a man and a woman, and did not include same sex relationships.

Believe or not, there have been same-sex marriages in the history of the world. So, heterosexuals don't "own" the rights to marriage.

www.randomhistory.com...

Speaking from a strictly non-religious standpoint, I think its absolutely disgusting and can not fathom what would be going through a man's mind when...well, you get the idea. I don't care what they do, but at the same time, I don't want to be called a hate monger, a bigot, or a homophobe when I make it clear that I find homosexuality to be disgusting.

Technically speaking, the definition of homophobe is one who has feelings of aversion and contempt for homosexuals. I think finding something to be disgusting is considered aversion and contempt. So, technically, you ARE a homophobe. Just embrace it, if that's what you are - and quit trying to deny it.

en.wikipedia.org...

Do you find it an insult to be called a homophobe? Does it make you feel bad about yourself? Shouldn't you just "get it over it", the way you say gays should just "get over it"?

I've been with my "wife" for 10 years, and while I call her my wife, we are not married and never will be, because we don't need the government or the legal system to tell us we are together.

Good for you. Some people want to be married within the legal system. Who are you to tell them they can't?

I, for one, don't think we should start changing definitions of words to fit a certain group's interpretation of those words. If we did that with everything, language just would not work properly.

This, I find to be the most hilarious argument. Nobody will know what the word marriage means if gays get married? Seriously? Marriage is when 2 people decide to "partner up", hopefully for life. Sometimes there will be children, sometimes not. Sometimes people partner up for love, sometimes they partner up for money, or political gain, or property gain. None of that will change when gays get married. The definition has not changed.
A parent is still a parent; a mother is still a mother; a father is still a father. It's not confusing.

Originally posted by ollncasino

Originally posted by kaylaluv
Substitute the word "Black" each time you see the word "gay" or "lesbian". Discrimination is an ugly thing, and unfortunately many people use the Bible to justify their prejudices. The KKK claims to use the Bible to justify the superiority of the Aryan race

You certainly appear pro-gay and anti-Christian.

I am pro-civil rights. I advocate civil rights for all minorities - gays, blacks, Hispanics, women, etc. I'm not anti-Christian at all. I know many Christians who truly follow the teachings of Christ, and who love and tolerate all - including gays.

I am still not convinced that Christians should be forced by law to marry gays. That is exactly what is going to happen if gays are allowed to get married.

I am not convinced that this is as big a problem as you think it is. I know that in the states where gay marriage has been legalized, churches are not forced to marry anyone. Gays go where they are welcomed to be married, and there are churches who are perfectly willing to marry gays in the eyes of God.

reply to post by ollncasino


i know straight people who have been married 3, even 5 different times.

and what would gay marriage do to the sanctity of straight marriage?

i wish people would just learn to keep their religion to themselves, that is what drives the anti gay crowd.

btw im not gay , im just anti hate.

Originally posted by kaylaluv

Originally posted by ollncasino

Originally posted by kaylaluv
Substitute the word "Black" each time you see the word "gay" or "lesbian". Discrimination is an ugly thing, and unfortunately many people use the Bible to justify their prejudices. The KKK claims to use the Bible to justify the superiority of the Aryan race

You certainly appear pro-gay and anti-Christian.

I am pro-civil rights. I advocate civil rights for all minorities - gays, blacks, Hispanics, women, etc. I'm not anti-Christian at all. I know many Christians who truly follow the teachings of Christ, and who love and tolerate all - including gays.

I am still not convinced that Christians should be forced by law to marry gays. That is exactly what is going to happen if gays are allowed to get married.

I am not convinced that this is as big a problem as you think it is. I know that in the states where gay marriage has been legalized, churches are not forced to marry anyone. Gays go where they are welcomed to be married, and there are churches who are perfectly willing to marry gays in the eyes of God.

i live in iowa and you know how often gay marriage affects my life or anyones around me? not a single bit.
how many churches have been FORCED to marry gay people? zero

maybe if you would just come out of the closet you would b happier op.

Click here for more information.

Originally posted by elitegamer23

Originally posted by kaylaluv

Originally posted by ollncasino

Originally posted by kaylaluv
Substitute the word "Black" each time you see the word "gay" or "lesbian". Discrimination is an ugly thing, and unfortunately many people use the Bible to justify their prejudices. The KKK claims to use the Bible to justify the superiority of the Aryan race

You certainly appear pro-gay and anti-Christian.

I am pro-civil rights. I advocate civil rights for all minorities - gays, blacks, Hispanics, women, etc. I'm not anti-Christian at all. I know many Christians who truly follow the teachings of Christ, and who love and tolerate all - including gays.

I am still not convinced that Christians should be forced by law to marry gays. That is exactly what is going to happen if gays are allowed to get married.

I am not convinced that this is as big a problem as you think it is. I know that in the states where gay marriage has been legalized, churches are not forced to marry anyone. Gays go where they are welcomed to be married, and there are churches who are perfectly willing to marry gays in the eyes of God.

i live in iowa and you know how often gay marriage affects my life or anyones around me? not a single bit.
how many churches have been FORCED to marry gay people? zero

maybe if you would just come out of the closet you would b happier op.

edit on 25-3-2012 by elitegamer23 because: (no reason given)

edit on 25-3-2012 by elitegamer23 because: bad grammar

do you live in britain...no
so how do you know what the heck your talking about

Originally posted by elitegamer23
i wish people would just learn to keep their religion to themselves, that is what drives the anti gay crowd.

I'm not religious.

Originally posted by elitegamer23
btw im not gay , im just anti hate.

So am I. Gay should not be hated. They have as much right to exist as anyone else does.

Whether they have the right to demand that the meaning of the word 'marriage' should be changed to accomodate their demands is however another question.

Originally posted by elitegamer23
maybe if you would just come out of the closet you would b happier op.

Why would there be any issue about coming out of the closet?

Being gay is no big deal.

But that doesn't give the gay movement the right to force the meaning of the word marriage to be changed from its tradtional hetrosexual union meaning.

Good luck to the gays and their civil unions.

Good luck to the hetrosexuals and their marriages.

Originally posted by kaylaluv

Originally posted by ollncasino


The Washington Post recently printed an article citing several examples in the United States of just how gay marriage and gay rights in general are stepping on the rights of Christians all across the country.

– A Christian photographer was forced by the New Mexico Civil Rights Commission to pay $6,637 in attorney’s costs after she refused to photograph a gay couple’s commitment ceremony.

– A psychologist in Georgia was fired after she declined for religious reasons to counsel a lesbian about her relationship.

– Christian fertility doctors in California who refused to artificially inseminate a lesbian patient were barred by the state Supreme Court from invoking their religious beliefs in refusing treatment.

– A Christian student group was not recognized at a University of California law school because it denies membership to anyone practicing sex outside of traditional marriage.

The Washington Post

Substitute the word "Black" each time you see the word "gay" or "lesbian". Discrimination is an ugly thing, and unfortunately many people use the Bible to justify their prejudices. The KKK claims to use the Bible to justify the superiority of the Aryan race.

edit on 25-3-2012 by kaylaluv because: (no reason given)

this is sooooo illogical its a shame.
All I have to do is counter using your same backwards logic, or illogic as this is.
sample: just replace gay with the word pedophile, or just replace the word gay with beastiality, or "insert anything to do with sexual preferences"

Your logic is illogical for this discussion. If it isn't illogical then you have to accept my examples as they deal with sexual preferences and yours compares skin color to bedroom activities.
You simply have no arg in this direction and you bring it up in every gay thread.

Who really cares?It's not my buisness what someone wants to do with their lives.The only issues I have with arguments over gay marriage are when Christian fundamentalists bring their caveman mentality to the table and preach about it's against Gods law.All laws are man made.No law however rightful it seems to some can be the word of God.Live and live.