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Sin all you want and send the bills to Jesus.

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posted on Mar, 24 2012 @ 08:10 PM
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reply to post by sk0rpi0n
 



Huh, so you mean to tell me that accepting Jesus died for mankinds sin is a one time thing?


Not exactly, I'm saying Jesus' death was a completed work for the remission of our sins. He died for all of them.

"It is finished!"

Now, a person either comes to trust in Him and accepts the reconciliation made on our bahalf, or spends a lifetime rejecting that atonement.




posted on Mar, 24 2012 @ 08:13 PM
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Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by sk0rpi0n
 

Huh, so you mean to tell me that accepting Jesus died for mankinds sin is a one time thing?

If you look at NOTurTypical's signature, he has a link to a Mark Driscoll video, he being a Calvinist. Apparently the philosophy is you are predestined to be saved, you demonstrate a faith that you are saved, and then from that point forward, you have faith in that earlier demonstration of faith that you acted out, and then go on to live life normally, with no further concerns regarding your salvation. The trick is that it has to be "real saving faith" (according to this philosophy), otherwise you are only fooling yourself and will go to hell regardless of what you believe.


No, I didn't say that.



posted on Mar, 24 2012 @ 08:16 PM
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reply to post by babloyi
 



The problem here (in the 1st and/or 2nd group), NuT, is that actually doing good deeds isn't emphasised at all, it is just that you are saved, then good deeds is something that will happen.


It isn't a problem, that's exactly what Ephesians 2:8-10 says. We're not saved by our good works, we are saved to do good works for Him and His kingdom. Or in other words, we're saved for a purpose, not just to give us access to heaven.

Justification isn't the finish line, it's the starting gun.



posted on Mar, 24 2012 @ 08:22 PM
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reply to post by sk0rpi0n
 


John 3: 31-36

31 He who comes from above is above all; he who is of the earth is earthly and speaks of the earth. He who comes from heaven is above all. 32 And what He has seen and heard, that He testifies; and no one receives His testimony. 33 He who has received His testimony has certified that God is true. 34 For He whom God has sent speaks the words of God, for God does not give the Spirit by measure. 35 The Father loves the Son, and has given all things into His hand. 36 He who believes in the Son has everlasting life; and he who does not believe the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him.”


John 4:39-42

39 And many of the Samaritans of that city believed in Him because of the word of the woman who testified, “He told me all that I ever did.” 40 So when the Samaritans had come to Him, they urged Him to stay with them; and He stayed there two days. 41 And many more believed because of His own word.

42 Then they said to the woman, “Now we believe, not because of what you said, for we ourselves have heard Him and we know that this is indeed the Christ, the Savior of the world.”

Deny it all you want to, deny the Son of God, it does you no good.

1 John 2: 18-23

18 Little children, it is the last hour; and as you have heard that the Antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come, by which we know that it is the last hour. 19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us; but they went out that they might be made manifest, that none of them were of us.

20 But you have an anointing from the Holy One, and you know all things. 21 I have not written to you because you do not know the truth, but because you know it, and that no lie is of the truth.

22 Who is a liar but he who denies that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist who denies the Father and the Son. 23 Whoever denies the Son does not have the Father either; he who acknowledges the Son has the Father also

Thats all i have to say.
edit on 24-3-2012 by lonewolf19792000 because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 24 2012 @ 08:25 PM
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reply to post by sk0rpi0n
 



What happens to a "saved" christian who sins after accepting Jesus' sin sacrifice?


We repent and seek forgiveness. And it's not "accept' His sin sacrifice. We trust Him that He died for the remission of mankind's sins. All of them.

Everything in the OT types and foreshadows Christ. So at the Day of Atonement in the OT did the high priest place the sins of all of Israel on the goats, or just some of Israel's sins?




edit on 24-3-2012 by NOTurTypical because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 24 2012 @ 08:50 PM
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Originally posted by AshleyD
reply to post by sk0rpi0n
 


Two quick things (I don't want to get sucked into this):

1). That is one of the things I find beautiful about salvation. We believe in a God that gives it to us freely. We don't have impossible demands set upon us to acquire salvation. We don't have to engage in endless rituals for acceptance. It's a gift for the taking. That's a pretty neat.

2). In my 32 years, I've never come across a Christian who has said, 'I'm saved so I guess I'll go out and murder, rape, rob, and fornicate.' Not even atheists say 'Well there is no God so I guess I'll go rape some people now.' So why would a Christian?

It's not a free pass to sin. I would suspect anyone who used it as such doesn't truly love Jesus. Even Jesus said that if we love Him, we would obey Him.




Amen.

John 14:15-18

15 “If you love Me, keep My commandments. 16 And I will pray the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may abide with you forever— 17 the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees Him nor knows Him; but you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you. 18 I will not leave you orphans; I will come to you.

(Jesus is the original comforter)

It is automatic, he writes his words on our minds and hearts so we are wanting to keep his commandments.

Jeremiah 31: 33-34

But this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the Lord: I will put My law in their minds, and write it on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people. 34 No more shall every man teach his neighbor, and every man his brother, saying, ‘Know the Lord,’ for they all shall know Me, from the least of them to the greatest of them, says the Lord. For I will forgive their iniquity, and their sin I will remember no more.”

Hebrews 8: 7-12

7 For if that first covenant had been faultless, then no place would have been sought for a second. 8 Because finding fault with them, He says: “Behold, the days are coming, says the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah— 9 not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they did not continue in My covenant, and I disregarded them, says the Lord. 10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the Lord: I will put My laws in their mind and write them on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people. 11 None of them shall teach his neighbor, and none his brother, saying, ‘Know the Lord,’ for all shall know Me, from the least of them to the greatest of them. 12 For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their lawless deeds I will remember no more.”

That Second Covenant is Jesus.


edit on 24-3-2012 by lonewolf19792000 because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 24 2012 @ 10:21 PM
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reply to post by Lionhearte
 


It's your choice. It's not for me to "try" and convert you, because I can't, so I don't know why you bothered telling me. If you don't want anything to do with God, there's a place for you where you'll never have to deal with God again.

Ever.

Why is it when someone questions the validity of God some people put on a front where at the beginning of the conversation they are very nice but they always have to throw that last little barb in just for fun.

If I don't want anything to do with God, there's a place where I will never have to deal with God again.

Ever.

I think I will make that my signature now. Thanks for the hugs and then the bullet in the back of my head.


I was brought up in a pentacostal bacground, First Assembly of God, and all my uncles, aunts and cousins are preachers. I even have a niece over in Africa doing evangelical work. I became upset with religion because it appears to want only one true thing, money. It doesn't matter what denomination sometime during the service the hat is gonna be passed around. If you don't put money in the "hat" believe me, people are watching, you will be made to feel like the proverbial leper.

Ok so we have to pay the preacher and the evangelists right? Why. Didn't God say he would provide?
Then I began to hear the "prophets" speak and none of the so-called prophecies came true. My wife, who is a firm believer in God, became pregnant and she was prophesied over that she was going to have twins. This was done on several occasions. We had names picked out and everything. Even had the guy that does the "babygram" pictures tell us she was full of babies.
Time for birth and we had a beautiful baby girl. Where did the other one go?

I guess you would call these people false prophets. Why not just call them what they are, all of them, deceivers of false religion.

Anyway, you don't have to get up on your high-horse and tell me that I'm going to hell, I've been through hell here on earth and survived so don't think your little barb is going to cut me.



posted on Mar, 24 2012 @ 10:35 PM
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maybe some prison bars would change some minds?

it does have a high output percentage of doing just that!



posted on Mar, 24 2012 @ 10:37 PM
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reply to post by SisyphusRide
 





maybe some prison bars would change some minds? it does have a high output percentage of doing just that!


Are you advocating that non-believers in your God be placed in prison for not believing?



posted on Mar, 24 2012 @ 10:42 PM
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reply to post by mikelkhall
 


no I am making statements of fact only at this point.

I like the way you address directly and short btw... try not to load it.



posted on Mar, 24 2012 @ 10:44 PM
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Atheist are not above the law and I question their authority.



posted on Mar, 24 2012 @ 10:58 PM
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reply to post by SisyphusRide
 


That really was funny. I am slow at times.
I get it now.
2nd



posted on Mar, 25 2012 @ 12:38 AM
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reply to post by NOTurTypical
 



And it's not "accept' His sin sacrifice. We trust Him that He died for the remission of mankind's sins. All of them.


Fine, I can just as well rephrase my original statement to say everytime someone sins, all they need to do is "trust that Jesus died for the remission of mankinds sins".


We repent and seek forgiveness.

If you repent and seek forgiveness after "trusting Jesus died for your sins", why not repent and seek forgiveness in the beginning as the bible teaches you, instead of involving Jesus with YOUR sins.
(or however else you would rephrase that)



posted on Mar, 25 2012 @ 12:56 AM
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reply to post by Lionhearte
 




Yes, all one has to do is accept Christ - by showing faith. For we are saved by Grace, THROUGH faith.


You are still making that YES/NO choice to accept Christ.
If you say "YES", you are saved. If you say "NO", you are condemned.

So technically, one can plan to sin till they are satisfied, and then show faith, like you said and accept Christ died for mankinds sins...




Exactly. This is what we call "backsliding to the Cross". Jesus died for your sins ONCE and FOR ALL. He sacrificed his life, just like they used to do in ancient times with sheep - the only difference is, the sheep only covered your sins for a day. Jesus covers them for life.

If you stop and ask for forgiveness again, you're basically asking Jesus to get back on the cross because his death wasn't enough. He needs to do it again.


So a christian can sin (lets say, he has a particular weakness) and all he needs to do is remind himself that Jesus died for his sins once and for all?
Its implied he wouldn't even need to show repentance or feel guilty, because that would mean he'd be sending Jesus back to the cross.

Wow. Its basically "sin all you want, Jesus already paid the bills".



posted on Mar, 25 2012 @ 01:02 AM
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reply to post by AshleyD
 



2). In my 32 years, I've never come across a Christian who has said, 'I'm saved so I guess I'll go out and murder, rape, rob, and fornicate.'


I'm not saying christians would do that.
But if christians just need to accept Jesus paid the price for mankinds sins once and for all, it removes the need for repentance and asking for forgiveness.



posted on Mar, 25 2012 @ 04:17 AM
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Originally posted by sk0rpi0n
reply to post by Lionhearte
 

You are still making that YES/NO choice to accept Christ.
If you say "YES", you are saved. If you say "NO", you are condemned.

So technically, one can plan to sin till they are satisfied, and then show faith, like you said and accept Christ died for mankinds sins...

I should have said "having" faith. "Showing" faith is pointless. First thing that comes to mind when someone "shows" faith is by praying, and Matthew 6:6 states - But when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your Father, who is unseen. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you.

So, no. That was a mistake on my part.



So a christian can sin (lets say, he has a particular weakness) and all he needs to do is remind himself that Jesus died for his sins once and for all?
Its implied he wouldn't even need to show repentance or feel guilty, because that would mean he'd be sending Jesus back to the cross.

Wow. Its basically "sin all you want, Jesus already paid the bills".

Lol, It's so simple yet you still don't get it!
John 8:43 - Why do you not understand what I say? It is because you cannot bear to hear my word!

I've told you already that you cannot fool God. That example you gave? It's the exact OPPOSITE of what I said. So you are putting words into my mouth, since you want to get the answer you are looking for - what I said is that we are saved by grace, through faith.

What you are saying, in that example, is that grace is PERMISSION to sin! I mean, really?

Let's put it this way..
Let's say someone stole.. a pencil. They're as guilty as Hitler.
Let's say someone lied. They're as murderous as Stalin.

Getting the picture yet?
Sin a billion times, or sin once; it doesn't matter. If you truly BELIEVED in Christ, because of your CONVICTION, and were actually BAPTIZED with ANGUISH, then yes; you are forgiven; ONCE. AND. FOR. ALL.

I really can't put it anymore simply. Please try to understand.
edit on 25-3-2012 by Lionhearte because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 25 2012 @ 05:52 AM
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reply to post by Lionhearte
 



Let's put it this way..
Let's say someone stole.. a pencil. They're as guilty as Hitler.
Let's say someone lied. They're as murderous as Stalin.


Yet, if Hitler or Stalin accepted Jesus died for their sins, they would have been saved.
But, if the guys who stole pencils or lied stopped short of accepting that Jesus died for their sins, they would burn in hell for eternity, even if they were otherwise the type who fed the hungry or gave water to the thirsty?

Do you even realize how absurd this is?



posted on Mar, 25 2012 @ 06:29 AM
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Originally posted by sk0rpi0n
reply to post by Lionhearte
 



Let's put it this way..
Let's say someone stole.. a pencil. They're as guilty as Hitler.
Let's say someone lied. They're as murderous as Stalin.


Yet, if Hitler or Stalin accepted Jesus died for their sins, they would have been saved.
But, if the guys who stole pencils or lied stopped short of accepting that Jesus died for their sins, they would burn in hell for eternity, even if they were otherwise the type who fed the hungry or gave water to the thirsty?

Do you even realize how absurd this is?


You still don't get it.

In your analogy, it would be the same as if Hitler fed the hungry, or if Stalin gave water to the thirsty. Yet you want them to go to Heaven? Why?

In the eyes of God, a single sin brings upon the penalty of death. You commit one sin, you broke the ENTIRE. LAW. How does that not make sense?

Absurd? No, it's not. Tell you what. You go find the richest, wealthiest, most expensive home in the entire world - go up to the front door, knock, and when the owner answers the door, tell them you're moving in, "because you're a nice guy", and see what they do. They'll laugh at you and tell you to get the F out.

Yet you think someone can stand in front of God and say "Let me into Heaven, I'm a good guy!"?

LOL. No.

The only way you can enter Heaven, or that rich home, is if you were apart of that family.. The only way to be apart of that family, is to accept Christ. Then you'll be welcomed into Heaven with open arms.
edit on 25-3-2012 by Lionhearte because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 25 2012 @ 06:38 AM
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reply to post by Lionhearte
 



Yet you think someone can stand in front of God and say "Let me into Heaven, I'm a good guy!"?


No. I said in the OP that God knows the heart and mind of a person and saves them basis His understanding of the person, regardless of his belief system.



posted on Mar, 25 2012 @ 07:48 AM
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reply to post by sk0rpi0n
 



Fine, I can just as well rephrase my original statement to say everytime someone sins, all they need to do is "trust that Jesus died for the remission of mankinds sins".


I think you're misunderstanding what I'm saying, let me try another way:

Q: "NuT, how many of your sins were yet future when Christ hung on the cross?"

ME: "All of them were."

We still seek to be forgiven when we sin, we're not trying to restore salvation, but to restore fellowship with Him. Or again, do we trust that His work at Calvary was a completed work, with Him getting the glory alone? Or are we trusting that He did His part, but we have to do ours? Or again, do we think what was begun in the Spirit of God must now be maintained (kept) in our flesh by our works?



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