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Exclusive! First hand Witness: Trayvon Martin attacked Zimmerman Zimmerman Innocent Smoking Gun

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posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 11:11 PM
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Originally posted by spacedog1973

Originally posted by rom12345
reply to post by spacedog1973
 


Technically unless he is indicted there will be no defense needed.



Well, i think without a charge, this will go on and on. Zimmerman will always be seen as guilty without having his chance to present his evidence in a court of law for everyone to see.


So you do understand the injustice occurring here.


edit on 1-4-2012 by rom12345 because: (no reason given)




posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 11:43 PM
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Originally posted by rom12345
So you do understand the injustice occurring here.



Injustice?

A kid died because of Zimmerman's Vigilante actions.



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 11:48 PM
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Originally posted by spacedog1973

Originally posted by rom12345
reply to post by spacedog1973
 


Technically unless he is indicted there will be no defense needed.



Well, i think without a charge, this will go on and on. Zimmerman will always be seen as guilty without having his chance to present his evidence in a court of law for everyone to see.


His chance? People want to hang him
public opinion has already found him guilty
have made it so spun and bull crapped out
that justice will not be served in this.
With any jury now being tainted especially
locally, how can anyone call it justice
when the man will not even be able
to get a FAIR TRIAL.
The state decided not to file charges
no ones fault but theres now that this is
out of control. A modern day lynching
against zimmerman will not bring treyvon
back and IF zimmerman is really innocent
he will be sitting in a cage because of a mob rule
public opinion.. THATS BS



posted on Apr, 2 2012 @ 12:10 AM
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reply to post by popsmayhem
 


Then maybe you should be on the side that says "Zimmerman should be tried" Because until he is, well, he will continue to be tried in the court of public opinion.



posted on Apr, 2 2012 @ 12:31 AM
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reply to post by TsukiLunar
 


Once again, it is required that based on evidence he is 1st indicted before a determination that he should be tried can be made.

It is not up to popular opinion to make any decisions here, and the belief that it is, constitutes a failure to treat this fairly. Public conjecture reveals a lust for sensationalism and can have no part in justice.



posted on Apr, 2 2012 @ 12:43 AM
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Originally posted by conspiracy nut
reply to post by rebellender
 


trayvon would look like anyone of our sons from behind wearing a hood. god forbid your son is wearing a hood and walking in the rain and some overzealous neighborhood watch guy thinks he is up to no good. i'm sure if it did happen and lets say your son was not shot and killed and lived to tell you about the confrontation, your fatherly instincts would kick in and you would go confront the jerk that thought your kid was up to no good for WWH "walking while hooded".

I am White, if I or my White son was murdered it wouldn't make the local news.
I am a Veteran. If I was murdered, the President would not speak on my behalf PERIOD



posted on Apr, 2 2012 @ 12:49 AM
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reply to post by Annee
 


What turned me is the fact that the kid got away from Zimmerman and had more than enough time to get to the house. He was practically shot in his front yard (not literally, but he was less than a football field from the door). Why did he not go to his house, which was within sight, when he got away? He had his chance to get away, but he refused it.

Zimmerman had stopped a theft, had multiple robberies, burglaries, and a shooting in his neighborhood. We can't fault him for trying to do something good. He didn't know the kids age. When the kid decided not to go to safety and hang around to jump Zimmerman (showing he wasn't afraid) then we can't blame Zimmerman for defending, as far as he knew, his life. It sucks, but it appears he did just that. You guys keep saying it's a minor, etc, etc, how was Zimmerman to know that? Does it matter anyway, 17 year olds kill people all the time (a few days ago a 12 year old kid in detroit shot a 23 year old woman he was trying to rob).

People are calling it racially motivated, there is no evidence (if you really break down the audio he is most likely saying "punks.") of that. People are saying Zimmerman should be arrested. They don't and shouldn't arrest someone until they know a crime was committed. They don't take you to jail and then investigate to see if their was a crime. They investigate then if there was a crime they bring you in on charges. No charges, no arrest (I know you know that, it's more for other posters).

We can't trial by media this guy, we have already ruined his chance at a fair trial if he is brought in on charges the public forced on him in ignorant outrage. We need to be a real and fair society.



posted on Apr, 2 2012 @ 12:51 AM
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reply to post by TsukiLunar
 


Tried for what? There is no evidence he committed a crime.
They have to investigate before they can arrest you. You don't sit in jail until they come up with charges.
See my above post.



posted on Apr, 2 2012 @ 12:55 AM
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Originally posted by pizzanazi75
reply to post by conspiracy nut
 


just like he just told me he was insulted because I said he wouldn't make a good lawyer then he turns around and calls you loony......the logic of some people.


Fact is there are no facts. It doesn't take a self professed Hot Shot see right through your arguments or see that when you have now argument to make with an issue you go right for the poster.
again I call Fishing out of the back of a boat by pulling bait through the water.

Like a teacher without students, No Class!!



posted on Apr, 2 2012 @ 01:01 AM
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Originally posted by rebellender

Originally posted by conspiracy nut
reply to post by rebellender
 


trayvon would look like anyone of our sons from behind wearing a hood. god forbid your son is wearing a hood and walking in the rain and some overzealous neighborhood watch guy thinks he is up to no good. i'm sure if it did happen and lets say your son was not shot and killed and lived to tell you about the confrontation, your fatherly instincts would kick in and you would go confront the jerk that thought your kid was up to no good for WWH "walking while hooded".

I am White, if I or my White son was murdered it wouldn't make the local news.
I am a Veteran. If I was murdered, the President would not speak on my behalf PERIOD


maybe maybe not but would you be mad that some overzealous wannabe cop followed your son?



posted on Apr, 2 2012 @ 01:20 AM
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Originally posted by conspiracy nut

Originally posted by rebellender

Originally posted by conspiracy nut
reply to post by rebellender
 


trayvon would look like anyone of our sons from behind wearing a hood. god forbid your son is wearing a hood and walking in the rain and some overzealous neighborhood watch guy thinks he is up to no good. i'm sure if it did happen and lets say your son was not shot and killed and lived to tell you about the confrontation, your fatherly instincts would kick in and you would go confront the jerk that thought your kid was up to no good for WWH "walking while hooded".

I am White, if I or my White son was murdered it wouldn't make the local news.
I am a Veteran. If I was murdered, the President would not speak on my behalf PERIOD


maybe maybe not but would you be mad that some overzealous wannabe cop followed your son?


talk to me when you have a son mostly grown and are qualified to make the comment that you wouldnt make if you did have a son that was mostly grown



posted on Apr, 2 2012 @ 01:36 AM
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Originally posted by GogoVicMorrow
reply to post by Annee
 


What turned me is the fact that the kid got away from Zimmerman and had more than enough time to get to the house.


A scared kid full of Adrenaline.

Plus you have no real facts to back up what you just said. All you have is speculation from what you've heard in the media. The media on this is "pick and choose" what you want to believe - - because it keeps changing.

As I previously stated. I was followed once when I was a teenager. I hid in the bushes just a couple houses away from my house. Why didn't I run home? Because the porch light was on. Because I didn't know if the door was locked. Because I didn't know if I could get there - be seen clearly in the light - - and still get my key in the lock to open the door before I was grabbed or attacked. Do you honestly believe you think clearly in a situation like this?

That person - the one following me - - gave up and left. I stayed where I was for a while before I slowly crawled out and felt safe to go home.

So easy to say - - - "why didn't he run home". You weren't there. You were not experiencing what he was experiencing. He told his girlfriend someone was following him and he was scared.

One Fact that is Real - - Zimmerman created the situation for this to happen. That is FACT.






edit on 2-4-2012 by Annee because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 2 2012 @ 01:42 AM
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reply to post by Annee
 


I do though. I have looked at a time line.
It isn't speculation. I know what the distance (about 70 yards) was from where he disappeared from Zimmerman's sight and where the house he was staying at was. We can all guess how long it would take a teenage football player to make a 70 yard run (likely less than a minute) and he had several minutes.

There is a marked time when Zimmerman said he lost sight of the kid when the kid started running, and a marked time when the gunshot went off. The distance the kid had to make he could have made several times over in that time. Zimmerman was out of sight. Martin waited.

I promise I didn't just say it to support Zimmerman because I want to support him. I have been on both sides of this, but the evidence has been changing my opinion. Even if Zimmerman created the situation, that doesn't matter. That doesn't make him guilty. If the kid jumped him and he defended himself trying to leave that really really doesn't matter. Yeah it's a shame the kid died, but you can't be like, well he created the situation he should have laid down his life and let the kid kill him (whether or not that would have happened doesn't matter, what matters is if Zimmerman thought he was going to die).

I have been beat by a group of thugs for no reason before, when I got the chance I booked it and never looked back until I found other people. If he was afraid he would have run for the door and if he couldn't get in kept moving. What if you are wrong and he hid and waited and jumped and really did beat Zimmerman. You would still think Zimmerman was wrong for defending himself.

You could be completely wrong about this, I am basing my opinion on my own analysis, your opinion is the one that is based entirely on the media. I am asking you to put aside the ages for a second because they really really aren't relevant. If they were switched the same arguments could have been made. Or if they were the same age. Zimmerman didn't know the kid was 17. There was real crime in this neighborhood. There had been a shooting. This guy doesn't know what he was dealing with, he was just trying to help make his neighborhood safer. Fact.
edit on 2-4-2012 by GogoVicMorrow because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 2 2012 @ 01:52 AM
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Originally posted by GogoVicMorrow
reply to post by Annee
 


I do though. I have looked at a time line.
It isn't speculation. I know what the distance (about 70 yards) was from where he disappeared from Zimmerman's sight and where the house he was staying at was. We can all guess how long it would take a teenage football player to make a 70 yard run (likely less than a minute) and he had several minutes.


Black and White on paper.

Tell me what its like to be in a boxing match with a heavy weight - - - from your black and white paper.



posted on Apr, 2 2012 @ 02:03 AM
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reply to post by Annee
 


You are willing to condemn Zimmerman based on black and white just the same.
What is it like to have a 6 foot tall guy you are concerned about, jump you from the shadows? What if you are trying to keep your neighborhood safe?

It sucks, he was wrong about the kid that night, but if he thought he was defending himself we can't blame him. The people out to get this guy (I suspect you would be involved in this group) are the same people that speak out against the prison system packing the prisons full of people who aren't really a threat to society and are a victim of circumstances for ridiculously long sentences.

Not only was he likely defending himself, and there is no reason yet to press charges (which is why he isn't locked up), but he isn't someone who is a real threat. He is not a cold blooded killer criminal. You guys have ruined his chance at a fair trial and want to throw him into a system that you oppose entirely. See what the media turns people into? Turns people against their own beliefs based on nothing.



posted on Apr, 2 2012 @ 03:33 AM
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reply to post by GogoVicMorrow
 





(if you really break down the audio he is most likely saying "punks.")


i found this interesting...

jneilschulman.rationalreview.com... mmerman-really-said/




As Rich Lowry notes, the word “It’s” is in both versions, and the phrase, “It’s f***ing coons” is therefore a nonsensical interpretation.” The racist interpretation suggesting a hate crime is therefore not present on the record





What George Zimmerman said in rainy 63 degree February weather in Sanford Florida was,
“It’s f-ing cold.”

edit on 2-4-2012 by truthseeker808 because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 2 2012 @ 03:50 AM
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reply to post by truthseeker808
 


Also a possibility. Though I never heard "it's." I really believe it was punks, if you look up the video on youtube where it is compared to punks and coons you can hear. The problem is the phone is away from his face and key parts drop out so it gives it a weird effect.

My question, if it was "it's f'n cold" would be, what was the temperature in Sanford Florida on Feb 26th?

I searched. if THIS info is correct, I don't think he would be saying "f'n cold," but I really don't think he said that anyway.

It says the minimum temp was 52 and the max was 69, If I have everything correct there. Someone might wanna double check.
edit on 2-4-2012 by GogoVicMorrow because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 2 2012 @ 04:30 AM
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Originally posted by hawkiye



I notice you didn't answer any of the questions I posed? We are all speculating at this point about the evidence that has been presented. You are just as guilty as anyone else. That is what we do when cases like this come up. You don't seem to know what is true evidence and what is just speculation. I have looked at all of the evidence presented and decided I can see probable cause that he should have be arrested and tried.

Try answering my questions instead of trying to derail the real conversation.

reply to post by pizzanazi75
 



Your questions are irrelevant because they are speculation. I have not speculated I posted the known facts of the case and they point to an obvious conclusion. Please feel free to review my post on the facts of the case and point out any specific speculation or quit wasting our time.


Its irrelevant to ask how you can't see blood on zimmerman after supposedly shooting some in the chest on top of him.
The question I have posed are not speculation, your answers to them may be, but the questions themselves are not. You have no deductive reasoning skills.



posted on Apr, 2 2012 @ 04:36 AM
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Originally posted by GogoVicMorrow
reply to post by pizzanazi75
 


See.. there you go again. No, your argument is wrong. Cops do do that, but sometimes they don't. That is just the way things are. Are you accusing cops of always following protocol all the time every time?

It is up to them. There are people from police families and with personal experience in THIS thread that have already covered this. It is just fact that cops don't always wear them. Especially after the guy is cleaned of blood.
This is really a piss poor argument. First you accuse the cops of a huge conspiracy, but now they won't even break a protocol wearing gloves.

Again, you are dead wrong.
They aren't at the scene, and in they don't actually touch him much (if at all) in the video. I guess you think they put on the gloves at the scene and then wore the bloody gloves while driving, all the way to the station? Yeah, the probably did wear gloves at first, but just because they aren't in the video means nothing.

Try again.

Also, I am not basing my claims on the video, I am basing them on the police, and witness reports. I am simply explaining that the video does show some spots that appear to be damage when you guys are saying there are none. It just can't be accurately determined from the video. Man.. I am getting tired of arguing against the same non existent evidence over and over again. When something substantial appears, then I will reevaluate my opinion on whether or not it was justified. As it stands now though, it was justified.
edit on 1-4-2012 by GogoVicMorrow because: (no reason given)


Your saying cops routinely touch people with blood on them without gloves on? You must not live in 2012.

that video shows no spots of anything on him and if you think you can shoot someone that is on top of you in the chest and not get significant amounts of that person blood on you are just flat out ignorant.
As it stands now it was minimum manslaughter.



posted on Apr, 2 2012 @ 04:40 AM
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Originally posted by popsmayhem

Originally posted by Deranged74
Anyways let me ask you this question..

IF it is indeed found out it was Trayvons voice calling out for help will your opinion change?


People already have changed there opinion.
The ones that did change were not the zimmerman folks
it was the treyvon folks who leaned one way
then when more evidence came out and learnt
what we know now weighed the evidence and
came to the only rational explantion
that we have right now, as it stands
there is not enough evidence to charge zimmerman
with murder.. that was the point of this thread,
zimmerman did not commit murder he is innocent of murder.
IF it came out that it was not zimmermans voice
and he was lying i think it will for sure hurt his credibility
with me and other posters, but it is going to take more
then a 50.50 chance with voice analyze. hell we got
a 50.50 guess and with the eye witnesses it
is a possible 100% zimmerman.... i am sticking
with the witnesses for now.
now can you accept that zimmerman is innocent of murder?
edit on 1-4-2012 by popsmayhem because: (no reason given)


You really should quit talking about the voice analysis. You lack of understand of how it works is amazing. You look really foolish when you keep bringing up this 50/50 argument.

NO SAMPLE OF TREYVON IS NEEDED TO RULE OUT ZIMMERMAN !!!!!!!!



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