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Exclusive! First hand Witness: Trayvon Martin attacked Zimmerman Zimmerman Innocent Smoking Gun

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posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 09:33 PM
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reply to post by Annee
 


The facts seem pretty clear, yet inconclusive.
Witness testimony are not facts, yet the testimony so far does not warrant an indictment.




posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 09:34 PM
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reply to post by spacedog1973
 


So if on the spur of the moment Trayvon was intent on killing him and Zimmerman was intent on saving his life??
I don't get the point you are trying to make.

I think you both mean premeditation. If it was premeditated, which is highly unlikely but has been implied here, then he probably wouldn't have called 9-11. People usually don't change a mission to the store to a mission to commit their first murder at the drop of a hat though.



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 09:36 PM
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Originally posted by spacedog1973

There is no polite way to explain what has happened. There is no polite way to explain the reflexive defensive rationalizations by the right-wing media and their right-wing fans. This was a racist killing with a racist cover-up and the right wing's reaction has been virulently and viciously racist. To understand the depth of the right wing's racist depravity, all it takes is to consider the very different reaction to this horror had the races of the victim and his killer been reversed.


I agree with this entirely.


With all due respect, the pulling of the race card here is what will compromise justice from being done.



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 09:37 PM
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reply to post by Annee
 


If anything it should be manslaughter. At first I thought he should be going up for manslaughter for sure. Now I am doubting it, and since the media has turned 70 + percent of people completely against GZ I am definitely against it, because he can't be guaranteed a fair trial.



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 09:39 PM
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reply to post by Deranged74
 


Precisely. 73 percent of people.. it means nothing when they don't know the facts. You can find large percentage of ignorant people against anything. What makes these people's opinion worth anything? This is just proof that this man can't get a fair trial.



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 09:42 PM
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Originally posted by rom12345

Originally posted by spacedog1973

There is no polite way to explain what has happened. There is no polite way to explain the reflexive defensive rationalizations by the right-wing media and their right-wing fans. This was a racist killing with a racist cover-up and the right wing's reaction has been virulently and viciously racist. To understand the depth of the right wing's racist depravity, all it takes is to consider the very different reaction to this horror had the races of the victim and his killer been reversed.


I agree with this entirely.


With all due respect, the pulling of the race card here is what will compromise justice from being done.


Its not pulling the race card' when it is justified. One of the most racist things at the moment, is pretending racism doesn't exist and 'blaming the messenger'. Its cowardice not to face reality.

The argument is very clear; if the victim and perpetrators races were reversed, we'd be seeing something completely different. Anyone who denies that is running from the truth.



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 09:44 PM
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Originally posted by rom12345
reply to post by Annee
 


The facts seem pretty clear, yet inconclusive.
Witness testimony are not facts, yet the testimony so far does not warrant an indictment.


I'll leave it up to the lawyers.

This reminds me too much of coverups from the 40s/50s.



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 09:47 PM
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TReyvon folks dont want manslaughter charges
THEY WANT HIS HEAD..

All the witnesses line up with zimmerman story
atleast the ones that were their and SAW it not the hearsay
ones. Here is what we got 3 eyewitnesses all line up with zimmerman.
Maybe this is why he was not charged?

Witness accounts

An eyewitness to the confrontation just prior to the shooting stated that Martin was on top of Zimmerman and punching him, while Zimmerman was yelling for help. This witness, who identified himself as "John", stated to Fox News Orlando that "the guy on the bottom, who had a red sweater on, was yelling to me, 'Help! Help!' and I told him to stop, and I was calling 911. He went on to say that when he got upstairs and looked down, Martin was lying in the grass, and the witness believed Martin to be dead.[73][74] Martin’s mother said she recognized the shouting for help was from her son. Zimmerman says he was the one calling out.[75]

A 13-year old boy walking his dog saw a man on the ground shortly before the shooting and identified him as wearing red.[76][77][78] .[79][80]

On March 30, 2012, a new eyewitness said that it was dark and he saw two men on the ground fighting, then heard the shooting, and saw Zimmerman walk away with no blood on him.[85] Police records confirm only a single shot was fired.[86]

,
Treyvon folks don't want to hear the truth
or see evidence or listen to the witnesses, they want ZIMMERMANS HEAD
so it is senseless even replying to the trolls.
So if I am ignoring anyone in this thread let it be known
your a troll



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 09:47 PM
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reply to post by spacedog1973
 


How is a Latino guy killing a Black guy some how and evil rightwing plot.
Obviously there is racism, but the only racism I see here, is the black community blaming white people for this incident.


edit on 1-4-2012 by rom12345 because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 09:47 PM
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reply to post by GogoVicMorrow
 


What facts do you guys keep saying that points to him being so innocent? You are getting your facts from the media just like we are. Except you see him as innocent we do not.

If you are not getting your facts from the media tell me who do you know in law enforcement in Fla or in either of the familys that are giving you these facts that make Zimmerman absolutely innocent?

Tell me what knowledge you are aware of that I have not seen. Point it to me. Ive seen and heard it all and I think their is probable cause to arrest him.

Cause all the facts i have seen leads to probable cause. .No video, photos or medical records of injurys, the voice sounds like a kid regardless of analysis, charges wanting to be bought up by lead investigator who said he did not believe Zimmermans story etc etc

All the facts I see point me to him being guilty of something.

How are we seeing completely different facts?
edit on 1-4-2012 by Deranged74 because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 09:50 PM
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reply to post by Deranged74
 


No one needs to prove innocence.
The burden of proof lies on the accuser.

Your sentiment clearly sums up what is going on here.
edit on 1-4-2012 by rom12345 because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 09:53 PM
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Originally posted by rom12345
reply to post by spacedog1973
 


How is a Latino guy killing a Black guy some how and evil rightwing plot.
Obviously there is racism, but the only racism I see here, is the black community blaming white people for this incident.


edit on 1-4-2012 by rom12345 because: (no reason given)


The definition of racism doesn't fit your description. I suggest you read up on the definition.

Also, you fail to even understand the point that was made by the post. He didn't describe it as a 'right wing plot', but stated that the defense of Zimmerman comes from the right wing. Which generally is true.

And the fact that you see 'obvious racism' but see it only from 'the black community' which is a stupid broad brush comment, put you firmly in the camp of the Zimmerman defenders. You just lack the courage to explain why with almost every post you make in defense of Zimmerman, you find a reason to criticise the 'black community' as you refer to it, ignoring the FACT that people who question Zimmerman's actions come from all sections of society.



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 09:53 PM
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Originally posted by popsmayhem
TReyvon folks dont want manslaughter charges
THEY WANT HIS HEAD..

All the witnesses line up with zimmerman story
atleast the ones that were their and SAW it not the hearsay
ones. Here is what we got 3 eyewitnesses all line up with zimmerman.
Maybe this is why he was not charged?

Witness accounts

An eyewitness to the confrontation just prior to the shooting stated that Martin was on top of Zimmerman and punching him, while Zimmerman was yelling for help. This witness, who identified himself as "John", stated to Fox News Orlando that "the guy on the bottom, who had a red sweater on, was yelling to me, 'Help! Help!' and I told him to stop, and I was calling 911. He went on to say that when he got upstairs and looked down, Martin was lying in the grass, and the witness believed Martin to be dead.[73][74] Martin’s mother said she recognized the shouting for help was from her son. Zimmerman says he was the one calling out.[75]

A 13-year old boy walking his dog saw a man on the ground shortly before the shooting and identified him as wearing red.[76][77][78] .[79][80]

On March 30, 2012, a new eyewitness said that it was dark and he saw two men on the ground fighting, then heard the shooting, and saw Zimmerman walk away with no blood on him.[85] Police records confirm only a single shot was fired.[86]

,
Treyvon folks don't want to hear the truth
or see evidence or listen to the witnesses, they want ZIMMERMANS HEAD
so it is senseless even replying to the trolls.
So if I am ignoring anyone in this thread let it be known
your a troll


None of this means in the slightest Zimmerman is innocent. NO
ONE HAS SEEN WHO STARTED IT.!!!



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 09:56 PM
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reply to post by rom12345
 


We have a man shot who was unarmed, it should be Zimmermans duty to prove it was self defense!!! The person he shot can not prove Zimmerman was not justified. So Zim needs to prove he was. He is the one who shot and killed a unarmed teenager, therefore that person has no voice.

If someone steps on my lawn outside now and i go shoot them i need to justify to cops why i felt i needed to shoot them.
edit on 1-4-2012 by Deranged74 because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 09:59 PM
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Originally posted by Deranged74
reply to post by rom12345
 


We have a man shot who was unarmed, it should be Zimmermans duty to prove it was self defense!!! The person he shot can not prove Zimmerman was not justified. So Zim needs to prove he was. He is the one who shot and killed a unarmed teenager, therefore that person has no voice.

If someone steps on my lawn outside now and i got shoot them i need to justify to cops why i felt i needed to shoot them.
edit on 1-4-2012 by Deranged74 because: (no reason given)


Thats correct. The burden of proof is not on the victim in self defence cases.



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 09:59 PM
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reply to post by rom12345
 


Actually, if I understand correctly, generally when a person kills someone, they are arrested and charged with whatever is appropriate and then depending on evidence they are either released on their own recognizance, bail is set or bail is denied and a trial date set, where they then have their chance to prove self defense etc...



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 10:00 PM
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Originally posted by Deranged74

Originally posted by popsmayhem
TReyvon folks dont want manslaughter charges
THEY WANT HIS HEAD..

All the witnesses line up with zimmerman story
atleast the ones that were their and SAW it not the hearsay
ones. Here is what we got 3 eyewitnesses all line up with zimmerman.
Maybe this is why he was not charged?

Witness accounts

An eyewitness to the confrontation just prior to the shooting stated that Martin was on top of Zimmerman and punching him, while Zimmerman was yelling for help. This witness, who identified himself as "John", stated to Fox News Orlando that "the guy on the bottom, who had a red sweater on, was yelling to me, 'Help! Help!' and I told him to stop, and I was calling 911. He went on to say that when he got upstairs and looked down, Martin was lying in the grass, and the witness believed Martin to be dead.[73][74] Martin’s mother said she recognized the shouting for help was from her son. Zimmerman says he was the one calling out.[75]

A 13-year old boy walking his dog saw a man on the ground shortly before the shooting and identified him as wearing red.[76][77][78] .[79][80]

On March 30, 2012, a new eyewitness said that it was dark and he saw two men on the ground fighting, then heard the shooting, and saw Zimmerman walk away with no blood on him.[85] Police records confirm only a single shot was fired.[86]

,
Treyvon folks don't want to hear the truth
or see evidence or listen to the witnesses, they want ZIMMERMANS HEAD
so it is senseless even replying to the trolls.
So if I am ignoring anyone in this thread let it be known
your a troll


None of this means in the slightest Zimmerman is innocent. NO
ONE HAS SEEN WHO STARTED IT.!!!


The witnesses blow all the theories out of the water
EXCEPT who started it. I think treyvon did because zimmerman
had a gun he was not going to fist fight anyone think about it people.



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 10:00 PM
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reply to post by spacedog1973
 


My position is that this has nothing to do with racism, yet the hype is all about racism.
I do criticize the 'black community' for making it about race.
My criticism however is not racist in it's intent.



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 10:02 PM
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reply to post by rom12345
 


people keep saying black people are blaming white people, it is starting to sound a little paranoid. quit making this a racial issue! i dont care if trayvon was green and zimmerman was orange, what went down was terrible and a full investigation will hopefully bring justice for trayvon. with all the evidence used to prove zimmermans guilt or innocence.

i dont feel trayvon was followed because of his race i believe he was followed because of his perceived "thuggishness". its a damn shame that someone could be profiled as a criminal because of the way they dress.

this means photos of the crime scene, photos of zimmermans life threatening injuries, i'm sure their are those pics right i mean that would seem to be very helpful evidence that zimmermans life was in danger. the bloody clothes, grass stained jacket, all the typical evidence of a crime scene investigation. medical evidence, did zimmerman suffer a concussion from having his head bashed into the ground, stitches? how big and deep were the gashes, bruising...i mean if zimmerman is innocent all these facts will work in his favor wont they?



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 10:04 PM
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Originally posted by Deranged74
reply to post by rom12345
 


We have a man shot who was unarmed, it should be Zimmermans duty to prove it was self defense!!! The person he shot can not prove Zimmerman was not justified. So Zim needs to prove he was. He is the one who shot and killed a unarmed teenager, therefore that person has no voice.

If someone steps on my lawn outside now and i go shoot them i need to justify to cops why i felt i needed to shoot them.


I concede to this point as matter of justice.




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