reply to post by BO XIAN
Well, with the statistics he charges through in the clip he notes what Farrel and others have long noted about male conditioning and the notion of a
"crisis in masculinity".
Homosocial work and relaxation environments for men are nothing new, and historically such socializing for men was deemed functional, and some
cultures still consider gender segregation as traditionally desirable. So why is this suddenly problematic for males? Are the women integrating more,
and who are the men they socializing with, if the men are so busy socializing at the local pub?
What culture is he talking about? In Muslim, Hindu and many African cultures mixing with unrelated women is frowned upon and considered a recipe for
He makes essentialist and deterministic comments on men's brains, when most feminists would regard such statements about women's brains as
Arguably "porn" for women is widely available, but because of its emotional content it is rarely recognized as "porn". So the Twilight series features
gratuitous topless hunks for teenage girls, but vice-verse it would be labelled "porn". One sexy Hollywood "romance" for women can make billions, but
So we don't see anything really being challenged about essentialist and deterministic theorizing on men.
Men are compared to women, rather than to previous generations of men, which creates the illusion of "a crisis" without taking into account the unique
problems thrust on the current generation of men, including reverse discrimination.
At least in SA race and gender intersect, as women of all races are candidates for affirmative action and greater resources at universities, while
white males face increasing exclusion.
Men are not a homogenous racial or class group, and even religious affiliation divides men in their responses to feminism, between the adaptable "new
man", and gender segregated ministries that prompt men to assume older forms of gender power.
The crisis seems more on how men and their problems have been marginalized in liberal and conservative discourses.
Men are more likely to face violence from other men (despite the focus on male violence on women) so it is not surprising many withdraw socially.
Thus we get the notion that men are withdrawing because they cannot adapt to "equality" without looking at the reasons.
It's probably fair to say that previously men were privileged over women (mediated by class and race), and while the playing fields are made equal for
women in Western society, men are expected to adapt to the role of the "new man", and to bear the old responsibilities without complaint.
The clip only gives us a snippet of the debate, so maybe some of these questions were raised elsewhere, but the feeling is that males are inherently
deficient, and that's unfair.
The context is very unclear. Is Zimbardo blaming the male brain inherently for the problems experienced by men, or are men seen as the victims of
If the latter is the case, then why not mention that men still overwhelmingly perform the most dangerous jobs, with great risks to their lives and
He could have made some really helpful statements on the problems and experiences of men.
In SA there's been a feminist discourse around prostitutes and their HIV risk around the mines, but there's little focus on the short life expectancy
and bleak outlook of the men who work there (even without HIV, their jobs cause lung diseases and fatal accidents).
So Zimbardo mixes up men as a classless group when it suits him (he mentions gangs and fraternities in one breath of homosocial behavior), but his
focus on Internet porn and college drop-outs does have a race and class implication, so it appears that he is once again implying his own prejudices.
However, I may read this differently from SA than somebody from the US or Canada.
His books and lectures are more complicated, but I'd like to see his statistics and their methodologies.Do men just drop out to watch porn and join
gangs? Why link such statistics? Maybe some must support a woman and kids, which is the still the social norm?
The communication problems of "young men" in regard to women's sexuality was already discussed by Farrel before the mass computer age, so that's not
As for male drop-outs for BA degrees - that's true by my experience, and it can become a very hostile environment for heterosexual men, particularly
in some fields where radical feminism and queer studies proliferate. That statistic may not work for all degrees however. Anything to do with previous
power, be it whites or males, can now be denigrated. If minority groups or women have lower statistics in educational success it is considered a
tragedy to be remedied. If it's any other group it's their own laziness and lack of social skills, so they should shut their gobs and stop
complaining. That's the notion I get, even if it may not be intended.
edit on 27-3-2012 by halfoldman because: (no reason given)