The Suicide Bomber's Doctrine!

reply to post by Jameela


Jameela, do you not see the difference? Honestly?
Attacking Roman SOLDIERS, assassinating RULERS, etc?
Muslim terrorists do not distinguish, they aim to kill CIVILIANS.

reply to post by Gramlengo


Who was the soldier in Afghanistan killing if not civilians, what was this act if not a terrorist act?

American aim to kill anyone they can, they do not care women children innocent or not.

So, does this explain why Muslims murder so many other Muslims?

Link

What I notice on almost a daily basis is Muslims murder other Muslims and it has little to do with Occupiers.

The US will be out of Iraq soon, but the murdering will not stop.

The US will be out of Afghanistan soon, but the murdering will not stop.

Your creed sounded good but I think that it's empty and is more or less just a justification for Muslim violence since so much of the violence is not based on occupation or oppression but rather on factions of Islam competing with each other.

Originally posted by Jameela
reply to post by Gramlengo

 

Who was the soldier in Afghanistan killing if not civilians, what was this act if not a terrorist act?

American aim to kill anyone they can, they do not care women children innocent or not.

edit on 21-3-2012 by Jameela because: (no reason given)

You fail to address the issue, and try to avoid giving an honest answer to, or rebuttal, my claims by derailing the topic at hand. You sir, are a troll.

Back to the issue at hand, any form of civilian killing is terrorism, I'll give you that much, BUT there's a big difference between organized terrorism ala-Al Qaeda / Hamas / Muslim Brotherhood etc. etc.
That soldier obviously "lost it" and should be punished, so should his commanding officers and the people who are responsible for him being there (the Obama administration) be held accountable.
But you cannot, under any circumstance equate that unfortunate situation to the systematic killing of civilians by well-known and outspoken terror groups.

"American aim to kill anyone they can, they do not care women children innocent or not."
This claim shows your true colors, and probably "agenda" - Defame and defile the very existence of others than the ones YOU see fit.
That statement only draws you further from denying ignorance by spreading hate and backwards thinking.

reply to post by Wildbob77


Even this has to do with the west, the west trains, funds, and arms these wahabbi groups to do the 'dirty work' for them.

And when we fight against them like in Syria we are bombed, killed indiscriminately and lied about. www.abovetopsecret.com...

If you all stayed out of our countries and quit funding terrorism we would not see these things, because them we could fight against them and their ideology and overcome... eventually living in peace in our own lands.

reply to post by Gramlengo


read the link in the above post and then we can talk seriously about al qaeda and muslim brotherhood and such.

Originally posted by Wildbob77
So, does this explain why Muslims murder so many other Muslims?

Link

What I notice on almost a daily basis is Muslims murder other Muslims and it has little to do with Occupiers.

The US will be out of Iraq soon, but the murdering will not stop.

The US will be out of Afghanistan soon, but the murdering will not stop.

Your creed sounded good but I think that it's empty and is more or less just a justification for Muslim violence since so much of the violence is not based on occupation or oppression but rather on factions of Islam competing with each other.

Occupation is bad, I honestly believe that, and I live in Israel, and served in the IDF.
BUT, and that's a big but, Muslim extremists and extremist groups will use the "occupation" card to the death (pun intended).
These occupations are serving as an amazing platform for spreading hate-speech and propaganda.
Israeli occupation = The source of all evil in the region, forget the fact that these so called sympathetic countries (Egypt, Syria, Jordan) which call the Gazan's their "brothers" cringe at the idea of welcoming them to their country. Egypt REFUSED to sign a peace treaty with Israel on the grounds of them having to include Gaza as a part of Egypt, they were smart. Only after Israel accepted that Gaza remains in Israeli territory, the Egyptians agreed to sign said treaty.
As long as there is Gaza, Muslim extremists and extremist groups will always have someone to point a finger at, the second it will be resolved (either by a two-state solution, or other) all those so-called Gaza sympathizers will have no one to blame for their wrong doings, and something for you conspiracy lovers - This is the exact reason that the powers who fund Hamas, Fatah and all the rest of the groups in Gaza will NEVER allow them to create a REAL unified government and will NEVER allow them to reach an agreement with Israel.

reply to post by Jameela


There has not been peace in the Muslim land since the Suni #e split 1400 years ago.

THe fight back then was over who should lead the faithful after the death of Mohammad in 632.

The Sunnis thought that any faithful man could lead the faithful and the #es wanted Mohammads cousin.

So of course, this led to violence and the murder of the prophets cousin.

There has been violence ever since within Islam.

Originally posted by Jameela
This thread is dedicated to those to whom I wish for what I wish for myself, whose pain is my pain.



The Occupiers in countries such as Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya, Palestine etc. are stealing Muslim lands. Using the accusation, "Muslims are violent" as a reason to rape the nations and kill the people.

What Muslim lands have been "stolen"?

Originally posted by ImaMuslim
We will stay nonviolent till we get our chance, then we destroy them and find them in every hole.

There's a nice, non-violent Muslim for ya. They'll be non-violent "until they get their chance". Is what we are seeing now an example of Islamic "non-violence"? I reckon when they "get their chance" and get violent, then, it's gonna be a HELL of a show!

Those who were involved in killings will be slaughtered by the consequence of their own actions.

Do you mean like the ones slaughtered in the WTC? Those kinds of people who were "involved in the killings"?

It's not going to continue like this, they're not going to occupy forever. Soon there will come an army to rescue the Palestinians and that will be the indication.

Go ahead and gather your army up. I'll wait right here until you get back, and pop some popcorn while we wait for the show.

For now, the US is a nation which can not be destroyed unless Allah wills. You would need a miracle to destroy the US and Russia, China etc.

Allah's will has nothing to do with the US. Your god doesn't live here. Look towards the Ka'aba. That's where he lives.

Originally posted by Jameela

Apathy is not an excuse, ignorance not an excuse, there are none who are innocent. In western countries these policies are supported by the people, in Israel these policies are supported by the people. The people want us dead, they want the benefit of our resources and land and do not care what took place to get it, so long as they enjoy its prosperity and comfort.

Who is innocent? You do not see our women or children, our people who were not even fighting as innocent or deserving of life, why should they consider your life?

Bin Laden said much the same thing.

So be it. If that's the way you want it, that's the way it will be. You have spoken, and I can now live with that, with a clear conscience, knowing how you feel in the matter.. If none are innocent, then all are fair game - on your side as well. Then again, the suicide bombers have already made that point, even against your own.

If you prefer war to the death, we can accommodate. Makes no difference to me at all which side is extinct in the end. I would rather that myself and every living thing related to me die than live in submission.

I'm ready to die whenever you are.

Just go ahead and jump.

"Religion of peace" my ass.

Originally posted by Jameela

Its a loop that can not mean everyone rolls over and dies for your benefit!

Nor will we just roll over and die for yours.

Suicide bombing is wrong, but what causes it? What is the situation that created the suicide bomber?

Evil, or, more properly, submission to evil.

You cannot say it will only end if everyone in the world bows to your will, you have to be willing to let others live in their own freedom in their own land before this will ever stop!

The same notion works in the other direction, as well. we will not bow to your will. We will not submit.

If none of us are innocent, then of course you will not leave us alone until you have hounded the last one of us to the grave. Enjoy the hunt.

As much as you are able to, considering the consequences.

Originally posted by Jameela


So why does the American say it is ok to kill us?

Even if there were no West,No Israel,No Superpowers,No other religion,but Islam,Those following Islam would STILL kill each other.That is a fact.Why? Cause they kill each other EVERY day.Unless you can prove to me otherwise.

So,until you can come to cope with that fact,while pointing the finger at America,you will ALWAYS have three pointing back at you.


Peace.

reply to post by ZeroKnowledge


I agree with your post in general, except for your inclusion of the Taliban. There was no Taliban in Afghanistan during the Soviet war there. The Soviets left Afghanistan in February, 1989, and the Taliban did not exist until 1994.

Originally posted by Jameela

Admittedly, the issue of women's rights and education for girls was controversial, and fundamentalist mullahs conducted campaigns against this. It was these people and their converts, along with landlords, who migrated to Pakistan, as refugees.

They "migrated" to Pakistan not as refugees, but as fugitives from justice. that was because THEY were the ones who beheaded the Russians at the Embassy which opened the door and precipitated the Soviet invasion.

But there was a much more powerful opponent to the government -- that was the U.S., which objected to it because it was Marxist. The CIA, along with Pakistan and Saudi Arabia, almost immediately began to provide military aid and training to the Muslim extremists.

Incorrect. Simply being marxist was not reason enough. at the time, about a third of the entire world was marxist. If what you say were true, World War III would have happened at that time, since we would have been actively fighting marxists over a third of the entire planet. The real reason was because they asked for assistance against the Soviets, who invaded with modern weapons which the Afghan mujahideen had only old Enfields left over from the British (and in some cases only ancient jezails) to counter.

After the Soviets invaded, and the muj asked for aid, a few people got togehter and acquired Egyptian Maadi Kalashnikovs and a BUNCH of Chinese type-56 Kalashnikovs to send to the Afghan Resistance. We eventually gave them Stingers, too, in order to counter the Mi-24 HIND helicopter gunships that were wreaking havoc.

But at the end of December, 1979, Amin was overthrown by the remnants of Taraki supporters, and, under the leadership of Babrak Karmal (who had been in exile in the U.S.S.R.), they invited the U.S.S.R. to send in a contingent of troops to help ward off the well-armed mujahedeen invaders,many being foreign mercenaries.

As mentioned above, this time line is off. The mujahideen were anything BUT "well-armed" at the time of the Soviet invasion. The muj were not "invaders", they were native Afghans in the beginning, until mujahideen started pouring in from all over the Islamic world much later.

The muj did not pay their "volunteers", and all were required to be Muslims, so I'm at a loss as to why you think many were "mercenaries".

See, my religion teaches me to stand against oppression on the basis that it is wrong. I do not have to have the same politics or religion to stand with a people who are oppressed.

When was the last time you stood with a NON-ISLAMIC oppressed people?

Again, what he said was not religion based but based on a spirit of self defense against people who have been oppressing the Muslims for generations.

"Against people who have been oppressing Muslims for generations..." that sure sounds religion based to me.

The Americans had one attack on their soil and have been killing for 11 years in retaliation

You should meditate deeply upon that before attacking again.

reply to post by Gramlengo


Hamas is a Creation of Mossad globalresearch.ca...

Thanks to the Mossad, Israel's "Institute for Intelligence and Special Tasks", the Hamas was allowed to reinforce its presence in the occupied territories. Meanwhile, Arafat's Fatah Movement for National Liberation as well as the Palestinian Left were subjected to the most brutal form of repression and intimidation

Let us not forget that it was Israel, which in fact created Hamas. According to Zeev Sternell, historian at the Hebrew University of Jerusalem, "Israel thought that it was a smart ploy to push the Islamists against the Palestinian Liberation Organisation (PLO)".

reply to post by Elexio

Originally posted by Elexio
And exactly this thread and way of thinking is what keeps the circle go round and round.. It's been like this forever.. always pointing fingers at each other and fighting fire with fire.. *sigh* i get the feeling, the world will never break away from this infinite loop..

violence isn't a loop or cycle, that's just an evasion/justification
it's a pendulum swinging back and forth, somebody set it in motion, and it doesn't stop swinging until whoever set it in motion is destroyed. those who did not set it in motion originally do not have and never had any reason for employing violence in the 1st place, did they?

Originally posted by Elexio
And still it's wrong to kill another human being, no matter what!

2nd line..

yet you glorify the soldier and war with your avy there eh?
in self defense it is perfectly justified.
whether it is lawful or legal is irrelevant

Originally posted by ZeroKnowledge
reply to post by ImaMuslim

 

1-We will stay nonviolent till we get our chance, then we destroy them and find them in every hole. Those who were involved in killings will be slaughtered by the consequence of their own actions.

1-Another peacemaker. At least you do not hide that the real issue is destroying the Israel. All the other things are secondary.

2-Poor Palestinians. If not your approach ,they could have their own country in 1948. But your kind where crying about "destroying" and "slaughtering" and there was nothing. Then in 1967 the same logic ,then in 1973....

3-I am sure that you are ok with waiting to get your chance. Knife probably sharpened, too. But how about those opressed Palestinians, you are forcing them to wait without their state.
Like you care about something else then finding Jews under rocks according to some old text,though.

2-true, Hamas is a Creation of Mossad globalresearch.ca...
but you're good with that whatever it takes to get what you want,
hmmph!

1 and 3 ImaMuslim [not imam,, and that mistake exposes you much more than you could ever imagine] has offered you no violence, yet you attempt to belittle him.
in the fight game this is called posturing.

you see his non-offer of violence as weakness and think you can go for the jugular
one can tell by your posturing that YOUR knife is sharpened along with your gun

i understand, mindless, brutish thugs only understand and must be crushed by force, ZeroKnowledge indeed

reply to post by sonnny1

reply to post by Wildbob77

So, does this explain why Muslims murder so many other Muslims?

it's called divide and conquer, i'd explain , and show how old it's use is
but you'd never understand, because you don't really dare to :shk:

Originally posted by Gramlengo

Originally posted by Jameela
reply to post by Gramlengo

 

Who was the soldier in Afghanistan killing if not civilians, what was this act if not a terrorist act?

American aim to kill anyone they can, they do not care women children innocent or not.

edit on 21-3-2012 by Jameela because: (no reason given)

You fail to address the issue, and try to avoid giving an honest answer to, or rebuttal, my claims by derailing the topic at hand. You sir, are a troll.

Back to the issue at hand, any form of civilian killing is terrorism, I'll give you that much, BUT there's a big difference between organized terrorism ala-Al Qaeda / Hamas / Muslim Brotherhood etc. etc.
That soldier obviously "lost it" and should be punished, so should his commanding officers and the people who are responsible for him being there (the Obama administration) be held accountable.
But you cannot, under any circumstance equate that unfortunate situation to the systematic killing of civilians by well-known and outspoken terror groups.

"American aim to kill anyone they can, they do not care women children innocent or not."
This claim shows your true colors, and probably "agenda" - Defame and defile the very existence of others than the ones YOU see fit.
That statement only draws you further from denying ignorance by spreading hate and backwards thinking.

LL
you do realize that everything you posted in that quote above applies equally to you, if you really think about it...
oh wait
You fail to address the issue, and try to avoid giving an honest answer to, or rebuttal, [to] my claims by derailing the topic at hand.

You sir, are a troll.indeed.

... I live in Israel, and served in the IDF.

why am i not surprised?

another soldier, and smug about it

reply to post by Jameela

Apathy is not an excuse, ignorance not an excuse, there are none who are innocent. In western countries these policies are supported by the people, in Israel these policies are supported by the people. The people want us dead, they want the benefit of our resources and land and do not care what took place to get it, so long as they enjoy its prosperity and comfort.

there are none who are innocent

this is revenge talking, not justice.
i could tell you that babies are. but wont
judge not lest you be found guilty according to your own judgement.
that entire quote can be turned around to applie to you.


reply to post by Jameela

you there pay attention: you post links showing many of the filthy schemes and deceptions that have led to all the violence in the ME
yet in becoming a suicide bomber, all you really accomplish is the futherance of those selfsame schemes and deceptions, you've merely chosen the side that seems less loathsome to you and do it's bidding,thus becoming the pawn of that which you claim to oppose. you change nothing .
you want to protect using violence and murder. how many are you willing to slaughter so that your chosen few can live?

by all means if the use of violence/force is initiated against you and yours go right ahead and kill your attackers, by any means possible.
if foreign soldiers kick down your door and attack, tear their lives asunder, and show no mercy. i don't care who it is, they have no right to you and yours lives.

did you lose someone precious to you? was your family killed?
your survival is meant to be a memorial and testament to them.
blow yourself up and who will remember them then?

do not misunderstand me, by all means seek revenge, but remember the ancient saying: "the best revenge is living well"
i will repeat: your survival is meant to be a memorial and testament to those you are seeking justice for.

if you continue to subscribe to this [or any other] doctrine, you allow yourself to be a pawn of nefarious men on both sides. you've got the right basic attitude,
however,

a true warrior doesn't battle in the service of doctrines, isms, politics, or religion.
nor does a true warrior fight for money, power, and glory, [as the boys playing soldier do no matter how much they seek to deny it]
but in the service of life and liberty.

killing boys playing at soldier will really accomplish nothing in the end,

it's generals, heads of state, corporate leaders, economic hegemons, and those who hide their lust for power and violence behind religion you should be targetting.

reply to post by nenothtu


Don't you love the truth of the saying 'history is written by the victors"? It might be why your 'version' of history and mine differ. You seem to have written history, might want to ask people who were there though, Afghanis know, they lived through it.

as far as when was the last time I stood with non-muslim who were being oppressed? Well, every day is that answer.

www.abovetopsecret.com...
The Catholic and Christian clergy in Syria are begging Christians not to support the uprising, but no one is listening to their voice, because it does not serve the interest of the US and Israel.

Funny isn't it I am the one supporting the rights of Christians to be able to live in a country that grants them religious freedom while US and Israeli governments are working hard to get these freedoms taken away. This next is off my blog that I am not allowed to link to so I will quote this portion;


Syria has a secular government, and as such affords such things as religious freedom, something any American would agree is good, yet, Syrian opposition forces have categorically stated this will be the first thing removed from public policy when they obtain power;

“It is time to come back home and rule the Syrian Muslim people who live under the umbrella of the secular regime that supports and protects the principles of tolerance, and guarantees the freedom of thinking and embracing whatever belief the people choose. Such a freedom was the main reason that made the other non-Muslim sects of the Syrian people able to step forward and have a rank and a good contribution in the Syrian life, and also share the wealth with the Muslims on their own land. It is time for us to come back and force all the other non-Muslim sects to shrink and step back. These sects are the infidel Christians, the criminal Alawites and the infidel Druzes.” (The Truth about Syria)

The first question in anyone’s mind is why the American government is showing full support of this group, a party deemed terrorists to whom it is illegal under the Patriot Act to fund.

Strange indeed that you have seen Muslim stand for the rights of Christians and other religions that I do not belong to (as I am not Druze or Alawite or Christian), do not think to accuse me without proof.

reply to post by DerepentLEstranger



I stated this earlier in the thread, I am not supporting these acts, but I do understand fully the cause of the acts, this thread is about trying to explain the causes that lead to such a desperate mental state. My prayer was that in bringing the topic up and showing what leads to it and causes it, that it would effect a greater understanding between peoples.

You who live in the west do not understand what people in the middle eastern countries go through, what ordinary citizens deal with and the losses we have endured. We lost human rights in Iran when the west put the Shah in power, Saddam Hussain was no better and the west put him in power too, then killed hundreds of thousands to remove him. This story is repeated in almost every single country, the west eliminates elected governments (or at least governments the people wanted) and replaces them. The House of Saud is the most dictatorial and evil regime in all the middle east, and guess what? They are best friends with the west!

The most brutal regimes are either propped up by the west or placed into power by the west, and the people have grown weary of the west meddling to the extent we are nothing but slaves being killed at the whims of the west, controlled by western alliances and not allowed any measure of freedom or human dignity.

You all blame us for people like Osama Bin Laden yet he was CIA then conned people into following him while he was still CIA! Just look at the damage this has caused the arab peoples!

I do not approve suicide attacks, and I do not support them, but we can seek to understand their causes and end the cause, once the cause no longer exists then we can hope for peace in our world. It will take a long time to rebuild all the damage these last 100 years (or so) have wreaked, but it can be done.

Make sense?

Originally posted by DerepentLEstranger

reply to post by Elexio

 

Originally posted by Elexio
And exactly this thread and way of thinking is what keeps the circle go round and round.. It's been like this forever.. always pointing fingers at each other and fighting fire with fire.. *sigh* i get the feeling, the world will never break away from this infinite loop..

violence isn't a loop or cycle, that's just an evasion/justification
it's a pendulum swinging back and forth, somebody set it in motion, and it doesn't stop swinging until whoever set it in motion is destroyed. those who did not set it in motion originally do not have and never had any reason for employing violence in the 1st place, did they?

Never the less, there is always two sides to a conflict and if either don't break the cycle you will stay in it for sure.

Originally posted by Elexio
And still it's wrong to kill another human being, no matter what!

2nd line..

yet you glorify the soldier and war with your avy there eh?
in self defense it is perfectly justified.
whether it is lawful or legal is irrelevant

Even though i don't have to explain myself, i will because the avy looks contradictive (If thats the right word for it). My avy is tied to my profession and the reason for joining this profession is not to kill others even if the job description says it's a posibility. I have my reasons for it and they stay my own. TBH i'm not glorifying anything, to me it's a nice picture of a machine i had the luck of flying in combined with a link to something im connected to in some way.

It's human nature to go for self defence, absolutely right. And yes, the way i see life and the avy are a bad mix.. the world ain't perfect.. ;-)