Hospice ...Is this murder legal?

I have seen some of the worse cases as Iv gotten older.Doctors told an older friend his mother would get better care in hospice..what he didn't know she would be dead in a week from the morphine.She had no pain,no cancer,just old.she didn't talk a lot but would if you talked first and it was just a yes ,no and that about it.she was in her 90's.My friend came to me and told me they took her from nursing home to hospice,and I ask why and she had just been from the hospital (nurses)thinking she had pneumonia.No pneumona!Dehydrated.... so some sick doctor told her son she would get better care there(hospice)....I could comment a lot more but I think you know where I am going.What is your thought?My friend went to see his mother 5 days out of a week and spent several hours a day there.At one time they told him that he spent too much time at the nursing home ,this man loved his mother like no other, I know and he is a Christian man.

reply to post by Highergrounds


The old people need to go. It is a sad fact of life, but it is necessary for our survival. The younger generations will be worse off having to take care of all the old people as well as themselves, paying taxes through their nose to pensions and sick-care etc. This is especially true at these economic times we live in right now, and with the 1940-born people "baby boomers" all getting their pensions right about now, it will break the backbone of the economy keeping all these old non-productive people alive. This young doctor probably knew this and wanted to get rid of this old lady so he recommended she was sent to the "morphine house" to die peacefully.

Eat that.

reply to post by Highergrounds


Dear Highergrounds,

I am very sorry for your friends loss. Hospice is where you go when there is nothing more that can be done for you. Hospice can be at home or in a facility. My father passed away in home hospice and my family and I took care of him and a nurse visited regularly. I knew and my father knew that they would not give him any life saving measures. He knew he was going to die and didn't want to do it in the hospital. My father never used the morphine that he was given and didn't want to, he just died because his organs failed as the result of chemo therapy.

reply to post by Highergrounds


My uncle recently died in a hospice. After a 12 year battle with cancer, he finally went. He had 5 different chemo sessions, which all failed. The hospice, pumped him full of painkillers, and at least he went happy and pain free.

If it wasn't for my "christian family" messing with him him last week, he probably would have went happier. He drift to sleep, and these retards would slap him until he woke up, for their own selfish BS reasons. They wanted to talk to him etc.... WTF, if you are a believer in heaven and christ, you will see the guy again, let him be comfortable.

The whole hospice thing, for him was a godsend. In his own words. He had enough of fighting, and was ready to go. The hospice made it as comfortable as possible.

Odd that the doctor would recommend the patient to hospice if they were only old.. and very odd hospice would even take the patient in that situation.. that makes no sense to me.

Hospice is for the terminally ill .. those people who are expected to pass on in a short time, it's there to keep them comfortable and as pain free as possible in their final days...

Hospice is a type of care and a philosophy of care that focuses on the palliation of a terminally ill patient's symptoms.

I'm not trying to be insensitive I'm just saying that hospice is just a place for people who are terminal to keep them comfortable until they pass on naturally.. it's not a place where they kill anyone..

My father died in hospice care, as did my grandmother and in each case I was there on a daily basis.. they were taken care of exceptionally well .. Hospice will turn down a patient who's not terminally ill because they aren't a retirement community.. is there possibly more that you might not know?

If I'm ever terminally ill and the time comes when I'm in pain and I know my time is near, I really hope I'm placed in hospice.. it was a comfortable, peaceful environment.

Originally posted by NeoVain
reply to post by Highergrounds

 

The old people need to go. It is a sad fact of life, but it is necessary for our survival. The younger generations will be worse off having to take care of all the old people as well as themselves, paying taxes through their nose to pensions and sick-care etc. This is especially true at these economic times we live in right now, and with the 1940-born people "baby boomers" all getting their pensions right about now, it will break the backbone of the economy keeping all these old non-productive people alive. This young doctor probably knew this and wanted to get rid of this old lady so he recommended she was sent to the "morphine house" to die peacefully.

Eat that.

Your parents should have used some form of birth control to prevent your pain you are having and will experience because of us older folks that have paid for your upbringing in this country (or even someother one than the US). Your "solution" is typical of the self-consumed younger generation that for the most part, were pampered too much by their parents and grandparents. Why don't you joint the army and go fight a war for your kids?

reply to post by Aliensun


Sounds like you are a typical old fart, and wish your situations in life be inflicted on the younger people

Originally posted by Highergrounds
I have seen some of the worse cases as Iv gotten older.Doctors told an older friend his mother would get better care in hospice..what he didn't know she would be dead in a week from the morphine.She had no pain,no cancer,just old.she didn't talk a lot but would if you talked first and it was just a yes ,no and that about it.she was in her 90's.My friend came to me and told me they took her from nursing home to hospice,and I ask why and she had just been from the hospital (nurses)thinking she had pneumonia.No pneumona!Dehydrated.... so some sick doctor told her son she would get better care there(hospice)....I could comment a lot more but I think you know where I am going.What is your thought?My friend went to see his mother 5 days out of a week and spent several hours a day there.At one time they told him that he spent too much time at the nursing home ,this man loved his mother like no other, I know and he is a Christian man.

If you're old and you get a 'thumbs down' from the typical allopathic establishment. and especailly if you lack resources (read $$$) in the case of cancer; watch out for 'certain' *hospice* organizations, some sadly believe they are the judge and jury over who lives and who dies, I had a relative deprived of food and water in order to make them die quicker (murder) and so doped up on morphine patches that they couldn't eat or drink (the hospice' nurse's said it was actually *better* to rush death, I called the police but they wouldn't do a thing' even when the person almost stopped breathing from the forced UNWILLING drugging.... watch out... some of these groups (I don't faullt honest caregivers) are very Eugenics minded, and if you look back though history one might be amazed at just who has pushed 'hospice' and their thought on 'hastening' death.

reply to post by Tecumte


The reason food is not given when someone is close to dying is because when the body is dying the digestive system can no longer digest food. Hospice runs lab tests that checks a specific enzyme (I can't remember what it is) and when it reaches below a certain level, they recommend to the family that no more food be given. Food in the digestive system at this point would just come back up and then the patient runs the risk of aspiration. So, keeping in mind that hospice care is to help make the patient as comfortable as possible for the inevitable, it is in the best interest of the patient to no longer give them food. They aren't hungry and the smell of food is nauseating to them. Fluids are usually given as long as kidney function is still evident. But when kidney failure is occurring, even IV's are discontinued. So while it may seem cruel or cold that the basics of food and water are being withheld from a loved one, from the hospice and medical perspective, they are being allowed to die with as least amount of stress to them as possible and with as much dignity as possible.

Also, morphine is given to keep them as comfortable as possible. Pain, sometimes severe pain, is felt as each body system stops working (example, pleurisy is excruciating pain). The goal of hospice is to help the patient first and foremost, die with as much comfort as possible. This may be hard for some family members to accept, but the most loving act you can do for someone in this situation is to let them go.

Hospice does not only consider terminally ill cancer clients, they will also care for those with end stage illnesses ie dementia, heart failure, dissecting AAA etc.

I am not sure why this lady went into hospice, if she required morphine then she must have been in pain.

reply to post by DonaldD


Morphine is also administered to keep them in a semi coma if the pain is severe enough.

I would think that it should be described to her son what ''better care'' in there words mean.Her son honestly didn't have a clue that she was sent there to be put to death until I told him that hospice was for cancer .I know now it eases people out and I think that should be left to family.It just saddens me to see her only son lost without her to spend time with even though she was bed ridden.He was always going to see her and now she is gone with some help.I think she would still be alive if she would of been sent back to the nursing home.

reply to post by justsaying
There was no pain that I know of or she never complained about anything.She did have dementia and I don't know a lot about that.

reply to post by DonaldD
There was no pain and she had dementia.

My grandmother had hospice just last year. For her she was up one week and was shutting down completely the next...not due to the hospice its just how quick ''uncomfortable'' when into total shutdown. Their job is not to prolong anything, just make the inevitable more comfortable. When it's just a ''matter of time'' it can seem like it's ''not as bad as the DR says'' one day and ''so hard to be awake'' by the time hospice gets set up. The inevitable downturn looks like it showed up with them, but most likely just the timing. I assure you (from personal experience) the pain of the natural shut down makes a min. of pain feel like days of pain on its own. The morphine isn't good for anyone long term but no one is ever put on hospice unless long term effects aren't an issue....Sorry for your friend I assure him/her that pain they saw in their loved ones eyes wasn't caused by the drugs...in fact they were most likely the only thing that felt like it was almost relief (just enough to be able to sleep through it really)

If it is shaving off any time I promise it's not time they would want. Most people haven't seen natural shutdown in process and it's common to lash out about the person not being taken care of right...rather that person is on hospice or not....I've seen both in the past year and even without the drugs it still looks the exact same way, only my grandmother seemed to be able to sleep more than the gentlemen without hospice I knew.

Originally posted by Highergrounds
reply to post by justsaying

 

There was no pain that I know of or she never complained about anything.She did have dementia and I don't know a lot about that.

If she had no pain then you need to be angry with the DR who prescribed it or the chapter of hospice pushing drugs that weren't needed. Also just because she didn't complain doesn't mean there wasn't pain. The older generation wasn't a bunch of complainers like we have today. My Gma got into so much pain she lost speech. As quick as it happens she may not have been able to convey how bad it was by the time she was willing to take help. I would investigate as to who and why specifically decided it was time for the morphine, I would be angry too if it were needlessly pushed but don't assume it was pushed for no reason either.

reply to post by Highergrounds


You are not the first person that I have heard this from. My mother's dear friend was always bright, active and quite talkative. She was diagnosis with cancer. She had a couple chemo sessions and according to my mother, her and her husband, they were told that she would be able to stay at home with more services, if she went on hospice care.

Her husband said that she rarely complained of pain and the he always gave her medication whenever she so much as grimaced, but she was still very awake, happy and social. That is until hospice came in. He said that once hospice came in the nurse took over giving his wife her medications and that they kept her zonked. He said that after four days of this he told the nurse that morning that he did not want her to give his wife any more medication unless he told her to give it to her. He said that this was about 8 o'clock in the morning. He said that his wife died around 2 o'clock the same day and he is convinced that the hospice nurse killed her with excess medication.

I don't know anymore then what he and my mother have said to me, but they both believe that her time was cut short by hospice. So you are not the only person that believes that this sometimes happens.

To anyone who has had a family member in hospice and you feel they were mistreated, the patient's records must be released to the person who had the legal decision making for the patient appointed to them. If there is a question of impropriety, have those records examined by a third party to see if the appropriate care was given. I don't mean a lawyer, cause they act only in self interest, but a nurse or doctor who will be impartial to the situation. Just an FYI.

reply to post by NightSkyeB4Dawn


Yes, It's true I have PERSONALLy experienced it. SOME hospice workers will commit HOMICIDE they will INTENTIONALLY hasten the death of someone THEY feel needs to die quicker, and the family will often be shocked at just how crass and crude that their Angel of Death mentality is.

To all of the apologists defending these acts of HOMICIDE and 'the old people need to go' no problem, you'll be old one day and maybe you will have the karmic fortune of having you or yours 'snuffed' when they could have had a few more weeks, months or even years,

We are all dieing some at just different rates, for some hospice worker to drug a person so much that they can't eat or drink is murder, IF it's---- WITHOUT--- their permission (except in the most EXTREME cases) call it what you like, but I've seen it, it's INTENTIONAL killing and I hope these killers doing it are brought up on homocide charges.

Originally posted by NeoVain
reply to post by Highergrounds

 

The old people need to go. It is a sad fact of life, but it is necessary for our survival. The younger generations will be worse off having to take care of all the old people as well as themselves, paying taxes through their nose to pensions and sick-care etc. This is especially true at these economic times we live in right now, and with the 1940-born people "baby boomers" all getting their pensions right about now, it will break the backbone of the economy keeping all these old non-productive people alive. This young doctor probably knew this and wanted to get rid of this old lady so he recommended she was sent to the "morphine house" to die peacefully.

Eat that.

Old people need to be treat with dignity and respect - sad fact of life they are not by such as you judging from your callous comments.
Eat that indeed