This is How the Ancients Moved, Cut and Engraved Great Blocks with Such Precision. No Aliens, sorry.

Originally posted by SystemFailure1994
reply to post by signalfire

 

... Mainstream historians have so-far failed to explain how many of these structures were constructed, and the most widely accepted theories (like the rolling of the pyramid's stones along tree-trunks and up ramps) have been picked so full of holes and yet are still wrongly being taught as proven fact.

but where's the ancient tech then? i too dont believe in the copper chisels, ropes and tree trunks theory but so far we have nothing.

it was a shame that the library in Alexandria burnt to ashes, i'm sure all the ancient secrets were stored there.

reply to post by Picollo30


Well that's the big question, we seem to good at disproving theories but not so skilled at replacing them with plausible ones of our own.

I'm really not sure how much could have really survived from such ancient times though, mabye the odd arrow head or the tip of a spear, but any kind of advanced machinery is not going to last in any kind of identifiable form from the date of the construction of the pyramids for example. Paper will rot away, metal will decay, and the minds of men will be lost to time; leaving us with nothing to do but work from what little remains and speculate.

I'm not suggesting the ancients had any such advanced machinery, at least not in our modern interpretation of it. It seems to make more sense that they simply had a greater understanding of weights, levers, pulleys, acoustics, heat, forces etc., and could utilise them in ways the average person today wouldn't begin to understand. Perhaps most of them didn't understand eiither, and much like today the workers were directed by a minority of enlightened foremen.

It has been put forward elsewhere that the ancient Egyptians had a limited understanding and some use of electricity, for instance in lighting the deep interior of structures like the pyramids when there would be little oxygen for flames. This may or may not be true, and the potential of objects like the Baghdad batteries has been questionned, but it certainly seems, for the moment, more plausible than simply saying 'aliens did it'.

The sound levitation that you mentioned earlier (and I had heard of it before) would not require any specific technology as such, and would leave behind no trace of its use, if it is indeed possible. I know using sound vibrations to levitate objects is possible as it has been done in labs before now, but would individuals have been able to recreate this thousands of years ago? We don't know. I have heard the claims of the Tibetan monks directing their chanting through various instruments to levitate huge weights, but have no way of knowing if this is true.

It seems reasonable to suggest that great insight into our true past has been covered up; discoveries quashed before the can be made public, but once again this is only speculation. Mabye someday soon someone will dig up something truly amazing, and mainstream historians will be forced to rewrite their works, or mabye we'll just have to keep waiting a little while longer. Who knows?

reply to post by SystemFailure1994


I think that's one of the most interesting things about this whole subject- their technology. In Sitchin's books they talk about MEs and Tablets of Destiny as some kind of computer/smartphones and it was weird the first time I heard mention of a iTablet computer thing. Maybe these aliens have a lot of toys but don't litter? Probably some kind of universal code of ethics.

I haven't read all 30+ pages, but I have read many so my apologies if I'm just repeating what's been said.
The issue of aliens existing and having visited earth in the past or present is a separate issue from how ancients moved, lifted and cut rocks. Both of these conundrums can exist independently from one another and I think we sell ourselves short when we jump to the alien conclusion.
It's probable that they exist, just as we exist. Given sufficient time to evolve and develop it's plausible they would enter space and explore other worlds... Earth being one of them, just as we have entered space and are in the very beginning stages of exploring other planets and moons. If our current progress isn't upended by our own undoing or some catastrophic event it is inevitable humans will develop technology seemingly impossible, completely unexpected and yet unimagined by us today... Again, just as we have created technologies completely unimagined and unexpected by our ancestors.
So, it's plausible if not probable that aliens are out there and have been visiting Earth. Having said that we obviously can't say for certain otherwise no debate would exist. There is also no real reason to believe IMHO that they have given us some advanced technology to help us move the most primitive material up, down, forward and back. If anything they would have taught us about advanced materials that are much easier and more practical to work with than rock. For all the ancients technology and building techniques, they are still using rock. They might not be living in caves, but they are still living in buildings made of the same stuff caves are made of.
I want to believe they have been here and are up there keeping an eye on us. I'm addicted to all things alien and have consumed just about everything I can find on the subject. And yet, like I said above, I think we sell ourselves short when we begin the debate with "aliens". The alien argument for ancient technologies I think should still be the last assumption. By no stretch have we fully exhausted more terrestrial explanations.

I'd like to add though, that none of this is to say we should end the speculation or stop looking for alien influence in the ancient world...just that we should do it with objectivity and with the understanding that it being the most extraordinary of explanations will require the most extraordinary and irrefutable evidence to ever be considered seriously.

reply to post by Shadow Herder


It is quite possible that ancient aliens more advanced than us now used advanced methods of sonic levitation and drilling in order to accomplish these feats. As far as Puma Punku is concerned with Ancient Aliens, the flood is what destroyed it based on the dimensional shifts of the Mayan calendar.

According to various sources there was a local or global deluge and that before that man had prospered before that time. During and after the flood many people died and were displaced. Most of the survivors had no survival skills much like the majority of humans today living in their cities and societies.

In the past existed small civilizations that had mastered stone masonry and methods that were unique to them. These people built these structures. The same level of intelligence that built caral, Gobekli Tepe, Giza. There is no need to say outer-space aliens built them.

I find it more fascinating that ancient man flourished and achieved the pinnacle of stone work much like we have mastered synthetics. They had appeared to have disappeared lending credence to a global or local devastation written and spoken in the bible and north and south american indian lore.

Originally posted by SonofLeod
As far as Puma Punku is concerned with Ancient Aliens, the flood is what destroyed it based on the dimensional shifts of the Mayan calendar.

Not likely, since the site only dates to the Common Era (A.D.)

Harte

reply to post by Harte


To add to what Harte said the Inca were building building right up to the arrival of the Spanish and for some of them beyond that period of time.

The last Mayan city was conquered by the Spanish is 1697

No disasters wiped out the ancient Egyptian sites, except for their own internal wars and civil strife

The Minoans WERE hit with a disaster and were able to carry on afterwards for some centuries

reply to post by bottleslingguy


Even then there would have been something left behind, they could not have come and gone without leaving any trace of the use of their advanced technology, if that is they used any. If we are going to go with the ancient alien theory then a couple of things need to be addressed.

Firstly, if these are flesh and blood beings that we are talking about then the technology they must have possessed to be capable of travelling the immense distances of outer space would still be truly impossible for us to fathom today, let alone thousands of years ago. Would they have used physical devices brought with them on their journey to Earth or simply have passed on advice and basic techniques to those humans that they encountered? To me the latter is more likely as the structures we are talking about are simply not good enough for a space-faring race to have made them themselves.

Secondly, how would any extraterrestrials have communicated with humanity? Telepathy mabye? In my eyes the mainstream alien astronaut theorists (if there are such a thing!) lose credibility when they suggest the aliens could have simply descended from the skies, handed over their technology to humanity, helped us knock-out a few pyramids and then leave. Doesn't make more sense that we salvaged small scraps of understanding from the extraterrestrials as they did whatever it was they were doing on Earth, and managed to make a few poor imitations of what they were capable of (such as levitation of stone).

Even then we are making some pretty big assumptions, but it is an interesting subject to explore. A lot of the AA theory assertions depend on some long-term ET intervention in humanity, actively changing us psysically and ruling over us for thousands of years. Would we have not found more evidence of this by now? Who knows?

Originally posted by bottleslingguy
I think that's one of the most interesting things about this whole subject- their technology. In Sitchin's books they talk about MEs and Tablets of Destiny as some kind of computer/smartphones and it was weird the first time I heard mention of a iTablet computer thing. Maybe these aliens have a lot of toys but don't litter? Probably some kind of universal code of ethics.

I imagine they would have taken everything back with them because they wouldn't want to leave anything behind that could fall into the wrong hands (i.e. human hands lol) Think about that for a moment. Would you leave a loaded firearm on a table and leave a toddler in the room with it? I imagine they wouldn't have wanted us playing with their technology for obvious reasons. We've done enough damage with OUR OWN technology. Imagine the calamity we would have caused with their advanced technology!

Aliens would not have come to Earth and used something like stone for construction. I love stone as a construction material but it would be my last choice if colonizing a new world. Aliens would have used their ability to harness technology and made light-weight concrete. If we ever establish a lunar base, we would bring our shelter with us (biodomes, pods, etc.), but eventually we might fashion a concrete from the lunar soil and whatever water can be recovered from it, to protect our imported living modules.

If you look at how the ancients were using stone, I think you can see how that usage evolved over time. The initial uses of stone lacked sophistication - stacked blocks. (mastabas, pyramids, tombs, etc.) Lintels with very short spans (hypostyle halls/hypostyle temples). Or corbeled spans as in the GP's grand gallery.

If aliens were behind this construction, they would have already known that stone is great in compression but terrible in tension, and that to use it effectively to span a distance you would need to use it in an arch (where the stone is kept in compression), rather than using it as a lintel, such as at the Hypostyle Hall in Luxor - where the forest of columns is needed because the lintel blocks can only span a short distance.

I think the earliest uses of stone by humans are proof enough that aliens were NOT behind it, as we can see humans reasoning out (with much experimentation and trial-and-error) how to use stone effectively.

As it is;
The ancient Egyptians never developed the arch.
The ancient Minoans never developed the arch.
The Greeks - incredible masons and architects - never developed the arch.

It wasn't until the Romans that we really developed the sophistication of the arch, and about that time the Romans had also realized that bricks were just as good as stone and far more efficient to use than massive blocks. They ALSO developed concrete, an even better technology which they put to good use in the Pantheon, creating an awe-inspiring domed span (with no columns and minimal material).

Even the more recent cultures in Mesoamerica never developed the arch. a strange omission if Aliens were behind it all.

reply to post by Blackmarketeer


Exactly Blackmarketeer

The other problem for the 'Alien' solution is that these aliens would have had to stay around, unnoticed, for thousands of years if all fringe claims were to be recognized. As noted above the Inca were building structures up to the arrival of the Spanish and beyond.

Besides arches there were roofs, the high tech Incan roof was wooden beams covered with thatch!

One small correction, a few examples of domes and primative arches were made in Mesopotamian area in particular the discoveries of seal impressions in the ancient Chogha Mish, 6800 to 3000 BC, located in Iran, show the use of dome structures in mud-brick and adobe buildings. Other examples have been excavated at a Mesopotamian site of the Halaf 6100 to 5400 BC and Ubaid 5300 to 4000 BC cultures

One way to look at what aliens might do is what Westerners did when they encounter less advanced peoples

Fortifications
Sanitation
Sports (the British were notorious for building race courses, polo fields and cricket fields everywhere
Mines
Courts
etc

Of course who know what aliens might do!

if builders and architects can't replicate these feats I don't know that ancient societies would have any better skills that those of today. Something or someone had to intervene in order to produce such amazing tolerances and size.

Originally posted by lme7898354
if builders and architects can't replicate these feats I don't know that ancient societies would have any better skills that those of today. Something or someone had to intervene in order to produce such amazing tolerances and size.

Unfortunately that is just a myth. The building built with the best known 'precision and tolerances' was the Parthenon, and nobodies claimed it was built by aliens - AFAIK

What feats are you referring to?

Remember I can claim that aliens built the fleets that fought at Jutland or the Glorious First of June - no nation on earth could now build those with out a massive outlay of time an money and still couldn't match the 'ancients' in running those machines and technology.

Were they built and run with alien or 'advance human' intervention?

Awesome thread! I don't know how I missed it!

I was watching this video when something came to mind.



These structures were found at Giza. To me these were used to levitate the massive blocks. I don't know how to explain but after watching the video I linked and others on levitation and magnetism it makes sense. I know many think it's nuts but it makes more sense than slaves using ropes to move these blocks.


I don't think aliens built any of the ancient structures. Our ancestors were definitely smarter and possessed knowledge that we do not have...well I believe some have it but keep it secret from the masses.

The series "Ancient Knowledge" on Youtube is amazing. So far he has 4 parts and is working on part 5.

I will now go thru the 20+ pages of this thread to see what other juicy links and vids are provided

S&F!

reply to post by mblahnikluver


Hey Mblah...
Basically bookmarking for future referance.....I have some input but, not the time....atm...

Just a bit of the theory I'm on, is one pulley"pivot point"......at the top.... and two blocks on either side, one on each end of the rope, I'll dig the ole link out with the guy that does the balancing act block moving..theory..
Same principle....much bigger, mechanics.......but still simple and managable.
So in short if we had one block ground level,and one at the top,"have 3-5 guys" counter balance..."raise" all that's left is simple counter balance fulcrum, hence also is what I think made the illusion of the 8 sides of the Giza .....wear.....BBL good to see you still active blah..


Only thing stumping me ATM is the fossil artifacts in broken blocks don't match dates....sedimentary...almost had to be poured much like concrete......but I do realize there is a quarry...and many were cut, but I tend to think of the cut stones as the outer shell....but whom knows....at this point...
Peace yall

good theory :-) sound is definately a powerful device, has there been any experiments to see if they can move blocks the equivalent size of ones found in egyptian pyramids with sound...?

I don't know why History channel makes it sound like aliens did it. Everybody who thinks History channel is right needs to find the research out themselves. People of easter island must of used some of these techniques as described. There was a study done a long time ago that noted in easter island they used the almost identical astronomy signs like the those of India. Sanskrit must of some influence over the tools and projects of the island. Myths also talk about how the red haired people were their and had elongated ears who once ruled over there until they got overthrown by Polynesians.

source
www.new.dli.ernet.in/rawdataupload/upload/.../20005b60_122.pdf

Looking at photos of some of these ancient sites (especially the ones in South America), I can't help but feel that these structures were constructed out of fear. Why use such massive stone blocks with no gaps or mortar in between, while making them earthquack proof?! Perhaps, the great flood took many generations to finally engulf the entire earth after the last ice age, and the remaining inhabitants had no choice but to build way up on top of mountains for survival. They also used massive blocks so that the rising waters and accompanying earthquacks would not penetrate or push these blocks inward killing the population inside. It seems to me that earth had a thriving civilization during or before the last ice age, but had to endure some horrible conditions for many centuries after the ice melted. Eventually, the survivors were able to leave these protective areas, but without the knowledge of how they were actually built by their ancestors.

I tend to believe that humans have a tendancy to develop and perfect something out of necessity. We strove hard and put our brains, effort and money into reaching the moon, and we accomplished this task. Our computer technology keeps increasing at a geometric pace because we are putting the time, effort and resources into developing this technology further. Therefore, I don't think it's that hard to believe that humans were able to build these massive stone structures at some point within our past. However, the first question that needs to be asked is "why" were these structures built with such enormous stones, instead of "how". For instance, if these semi-advanced ancients (meaning no cars or computer technology) were faced with such catastrophe that completely destroyed their cities along the shores, their next inclination would have been to rebuild away from areas with rising waters. However, if these new dwellings were also destroyed via massive earthquakes and floods, then their next step would've been to build either underground or way up on top of mountains. Not only that, but since their less than adequate construction was destroyed many times before, they had no choice but to use massive blocks with no mortar to eliminate seepage, water pressure against the walls, and earthquakes. I don't want to sound crazy here, but also perhaps against some sort of technology that we call magic today.

Perhaps as time went by and the less sophisticated population began to reinhabit the earth, some of these cultures came out of their hiding places and helped earth re-establish again. With remnants of past knowledge still in their back pockets, their wisdom was important in helping some of the post flood ancient civilizations get a head start. Perhaps some even thought of themselves as gods among the primitive people that inhabited the earth.

Originally posted by skybolt

Looking at photos of some of these ancient sites (especially the ones in South America), I can't help but feel that these structures were constructed out of fear. Why use such massive stone blocks with no gaps or mortar in between, while making them earthquack proof?! Perhaps, the great flood took many generations to finally engulf the entire earth after the last ice age, and the remaining inhabitants had no choice but to build way up on top of mountains for survival. They also used massive blocks so that the rising waters and accompanying earthquacks would not penetrate or push these blocks inward killing the population inside.....snip

Well no evidence of a biblical style great flood. I think the best theory to explain why people used large stones instead of small ones early in stone working history was one of work. It was easier for them to move a large stone than to cut it into smaller pieces - and lacking a good binding mortar/concrete keeping the stones large solved the problem of structural integrity. The ancients didn't build cities along the shore line, they tended to build them alongside the banks of rivers where the water could be used for agriculture. Hunter-gathers did go to the shore to gather shellfood and other fish but that was seasonal. Smaller villages tended to be inland but near fresh water, fuel and food resources.