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Undercover Police Officer Posing as a Highschool Student.

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posted on Mar, 18 2012 @ 08:14 PM
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Originally posted by MrWendal
This has been going on for years. When I was 16 years old (many many moons ago) there was an undercover sting operation in a High School I attended in Kansas. It was a drug sting.

I was actually shocked when the arrest came down. These undercover officers got in good with the Students. Hung out with them. Drank with them. Did drugs with them. Even had sex with some of the female students at parties. Then one day, they came in and arrested everyone involved.


Mmmm...Drugs and sex with underage female?? students you say...Mmmm.

I think I should investigate that, cant have this going on, now if only i could...fit...into...my school uniform.....ahh at last.
Excellent, I look like a 40 something yo kid in a school uniform.......Now wheres all that sex and drugs action...I mean, point me in the direction of that illegal activity, my good man......




posted on Mar, 18 2012 @ 08:25 PM
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Does being young offer an excuse or a free pass to get away with a crime? The police were there, and some of the staff, if not the district knew about it. Be it that we want to admit it or not, the public school system is no longer safe, and is getting more and more dangerous. So the question is do we allow for the youth to commit crimes and break the law without any sort of consequences on their part?

Once, and those who are older can attest to, school was more structured, and many of the students, if they broke one of the rules, the punishments hurt, be it via spanking, to suspensions that were something that students were not wanting and tried to avoid. But those days are long gone, so what is the system to do? Teachers no longer hold the authority and are often forced to consult with lawyers before they can act, or even take disciplinary actions. We all know, as it has been a rule for as long as most of us can remember, that selling drugs is against the law, criminal and even a felony. So what is a district to do?



posted on Mar, 18 2012 @ 08:33 PM
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reply to post by sdcigarpig
 


Actually, yes kids should be able to get away with certian things. The fact that they are in school means that they don't already know everything they need to know. Let this be a learning experience rather than a criminal branding for life. Yes life. The days of this stuff disappearing off of records is long gone. A mistake in young adulthood can screw you for the rest of your life. Corporations will not hire anyone convicted of a crime at any age.



posted on Mar, 18 2012 @ 08:36 PM
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seems this is just an AI evening.

i'm going for a smoke.



posted on Mar, 18 2012 @ 08:42 PM
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If this happened at the rural high school I went to in 1973, the place would have been burned to the ground. That's how it was back then.



posted on Mar, 18 2012 @ 08:44 PM
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reply to post by sligtlyskeptical
 

So you are of the belief of not doing something?
What if it was your child who was say hooked on say cocain? Or who got shot, as a drug deal went sour, would you still have the same thought and belief that it should be just a learning experience, that there should be no consequence for breaking the law?

Is that not a dangerous precedent to set with the youth of the country?
This was not simple smoking in the bathroom or simple childhood stuff, but the kind of stuff that gets a person locked up for a long time, the students were selling narcotics to other students. Not weed, but heroine and cocain. And what do you think that the suppliers would have done if they did not get their money? Let by gones be bygones, or gone after those students peddling the drugs?

A bullet fired does not discriminate between an innocent victim and its target.



posted on Mar, 18 2012 @ 09:20 PM
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Originally posted by homeslice
21 jump street?


lol beat me to it

isn't there a movie coming out?
strange timing? ehh?

what i find odd is that OP being canadian
[where the original fox series and a lot of others were filmed and produced]
hasn't noticed/mentioned it



posted on Mar, 18 2012 @ 09:29 PM
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reply to post by boncho
 


no dude
i do not condone this kind of investigation/behavior

nor should anybody

if you or i were to pose as a high school minor and infiltrate a school ...
no reason would be accepted as a justification

why are the authorities always given a free pass on despicable and criminal behavior?
well, not speaking for myself, of course.

of course this is all relative to what you believe schools and their purpose should be



posted on Mar, 18 2012 @ 09:40 PM
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reply to post by DerepentLEstranger


[where the original fox series and a lot of others were filmed and produced] hasn't noticed/mentioned it

 


I didn't mention it because I was focusing on the fact that this is happening now, in our current social climate. I didn't really want to focus on the past media productions as this is something happening in real life.

Though, news of the story breaking and the current release of the remake movie seems ironic.



posted on Mar, 18 2012 @ 09:57 PM
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reply to post by boncho
 


Its not entrapment at all. Entrapment is where a person operating under color of law (law enforcement) persuades and individual to take an action / commit a crime they were otherwise not going to do.

An example of entrapment would be a police officer waking up a drunk guy sleeping in his car at the bar because he was to drunk to drive. The officer makes contact, realizes the intoxication and then tells the drunk he must leave property.

The moment the drunk starts the car / pulls out of the parking lot another officer makes a traffic stop and arrests the individual for DWI.

As far as school goes I support the action in the sense that it was more than just marijuana. The officer sent in did not create the drug ring nor did he recruit the students to join. Rather the students had set up the ring and did their own recruiting, and in this case managed to recruit an undercover cop. Generally speaking if the situation revolved around personal amounts of marijuana you would not see an operation like this.

The use of the undercover officer tells me the ring dealt in larger quantities of drugs (moving from personal to intent to distribute). The fact no school resource officer (if they have them) or local police with a drug dog were used to sniff / check / search lockers would suggest the group knew what they were doing.

Some other things to consider -
Chances are they were getting their drugs from an individual / entity with ties to drug cartels. I say this because of the drugs listed in the article as well as location of the school. There is a massive amount of violence in Mexico with the drug crackdown, and that violence is trickling across the border (im referring to the extreme violence).

If this group was moving larger than normal drug types / quantities, logic tells us that it is dangerous. If anyone in the group does something that pisses of their supplier its not out of the realm of possibility for a violent response by the supplier and as we have seen they don't really care if they cause collateral damage or not. That places the entire school in danger (more so again because of the types and quantities).

Also its not out of the realm of possibility for a person on drugs to go bonkers through an adverse reaction. The goal in this case was to protect the student body.

Students have an expectation of privacy and they are covered under law. However that privacy only goes so far before it transitions into In Loco Parentis.


Here is my question -
Why do people find the behavior of law enforcement in this incident problematic while at the same time ignoring the fact the students broke the law? The students made their own choices and in the end got caught. How is that law enforcements problem?



posted on Mar, 18 2012 @ 10:58 PM
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reply to post by boncho
 


I recall when I was in high school there was an undercover female cop posing as a student (she was 25 if I recall correctly..) her purpose was to infiltrate some drug ring.. it ended badly when she was fired for sleeping with a student.
I always thought the use of undercover cops, especially among kids at school was a blatant invasion of privacy and essentially entrapment.



posted on Mar, 18 2012 @ 11:44 PM
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Originally posted by g146541
Old news, as the police have been doing this FOREVER.
I see nothing wrong with it.....


That is the Stockholm Syndrome taking charge.

Pretending that this is somehow desirable or a good thing, is a coping mechanism.



posted on Mar, 19 2012 @ 12:07 AM
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reply to post by Xcathdra


Here is my question - Why do people find the behavior of law enforcement in this incident problematic while at the same time ignoring the fact the students broke the law? The students made their own choices and in the end got caught. How is that law enforcements problem?

 


As always XCat, you bring a challenging argument to the topic. Much appreciated.

The things you list are very real problems and of course, under the current laws must be dealt with. However, I do not feel the police should be involved in the schools in that manner.

In some of our local problem schools they have posted a uniform officer, and they are there to bridge gaps with the kids and be present to deter criminal behavior on site. While this is by no means the best answer either, I still see it as better than sending in officers for undercover operations.

Yes, the kids were heavily involved given what the article says, but I don't see where this could end if it became the norm.

Should the officer only target those kids?
Did they not hear of other crimes while they were there?
We're all the kids treated equally? (ie. Were some given free passes because they weren't part of the ring?)
How did the kids know to recruit the undercover? (Did he offer illegal services to the group?)

Where does it end? Should every school have one... Should all kids be pursued criminally?

The reason I point this last one out, is because in high school, a number of kids who walked a fine line with the law eventually went on to become great members of society, had they all been prosecuted for there missteps, there is no telling where they would have ended up.

Entrapment? If it was routine for officers to ask for illegal goods, and kids were willing to accommodate even if they had no intention prior, it seems like it would be a good definition. Regardless of how that is actually reflected by the law as it is.

School should be a place free from societies politics. It should be a place where kids can live without the worry of everything that is negative. Perhaps this effort was to rid the school of certain negative influences, but at the same time, politics is spreading into the schools.



And why the schools?

Where are the undercovers in the Catholic Church. There is evidence in some cases of priests being guilty of abhorrent acts, and the church sends them to new jurisdictions. They are a bloody organization guilty of covering up criminal behavior, so where are the undercover priests or parishioners?

Where are the undercovers in banks, hedge funds and on Wall Street? I bet there is a long list of crimes that could be found there.

Where are the undercovers in.....


The list could go on and on. But at the end of the day, some people walk away and some people get prosecuted. And why kids are a more important target than some of the real evils in this world is a tad confusing.



posted on Mar, 19 2012 @ 12:19 AM
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There were drugs in the school. The parents wanted something done to stop it. The school and police took action. I don't see the problem. Best lesson they can learn is that they run the risk of having to take responsibility for their actions.



posted on Mar, 19 2012 @ 12:21 AM
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Originally posted by torque
There were drugs in the school. The parents wanted something done to stop it. The school and police took action. I don't see the problem. Best lesson they can learn is that they run the risk of having to take responsibility for their actions.


I was from a family that moved a lot throughout my youth. Ended up at a lot of different schools, and in every one there were people doing illegal things. I think you would be hard pressed to find a school that this wasn't going on at (at least on some level).

So the question is, do you think it should be done in every school?



posted on Mar, 19 2012 @ 03:12 AM
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reply to post by boncho
 


Interesting points for sure, as well as a few flawed ones.

Things that must be taken into account (mind you the example I am giving is based on my states laws and not California) when working this type of investigation.

First off an investigation does not mean there is criminal activity. It merely suggest that something is not right and there is a potential for laws to be broken. The goal for law enforcement is to eliminate people as suspects while looking for the suspect.

When we get into the high school age we run into the problem of students falling under juvenile law while others are subject to adult laws (because of age). In my state if the student is 17 or older they are considered an adult and I am ok with Miranda and questioning them. If the person is under 17 I have absolutely no authority to question or arrest the minor (it falls under the jurisdiction of a juvenile officer). The other thing to take into account is the fact not all of the criminal behavior occurred on school grounds. Because of that you are going to need an officer to go undercover so they can be present at all locations / actions regardless of jurisdiction.

Generally speaking school resources officers are restricted to school grounds (again in general). Even then, at least in my area, they are responsible for all misdemeanor issues. Anything that is a felony must be turned over to the jurisdiction the school is in (City / County / Township / etc). My state is goofy as it allows school districts the ability to form their own school police / public safety. They do not answer to other law enforcement agencies as they are one.

The issue with that is politics and inside baseball. Schools don't like being in the news when it comes to drugs / fights / etc etc etc. By forming their own school resource police setup administration can exert control over the school resource officers.

I agree with part of that view to be honest. I certainly have no desire to see kids who made a stupid mistake get slammed to the extent where the criminal activity inhibits there future.

Lastly the officer that went undercover was working under essentially observe and report. Because of his involvement, which was extensive in this case, his reports would go to the PA for review and charges if applicable (again in general - California law, when it comes to who has arrest authority, is pretty large).

I will wager that the investigation is going to be torn apart by defense because of the age of the students involved (adult and juvenile) as well as the officers actions coming under an electron microscope to look for "entrapment" or illegal actions.

With that being said we need to take a look at our laws. The war on drugs is an absolute failure with no results that would justify its continuation. As a side note here the police do not send people to jail for drug possession, the PA does all that in conjunction with the judge / jury. Blaming law enforcement in this area makes no sense.

Parents need to take an active interest in the kids lives instead of using the schools to raise their children for them.

Coming back to the topic I am curious what the facts are. An 8 month undercover investigation is not norm when it comes to schools (not unheard of but very rare - at least to me). That to me implies the drug suppliers / contacts / distribution is most likely significant. At least significant enough to go down the road they did.

I would expect to see more arrests as this goes on...

Btw thanks for answering my questions...



posted on Mar, 19 2012 @ 10:02 AM
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Alright if this would have just been some kids selling grass I wou ld have said who cares, in my school roughly 80% of the students were smoking bud and nobody got hurt. Since they were selling coke though I have to say ya it was probably necessary for them to do this.



posted on Mar, 19 2012 @ 10:26 AM
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Originally posted by Nite_wing
We did this 30 years ago and it worked then too.


Since when is selling and using drugs in school "borderline" illegal?


Your existence is a waste of time.



posted on Mar, 19 2012 @ 12:44 PM
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Undercover "sting" operations in schools can't possibly be justified as anything "good" IMHO.

Kids brains aren't even fully delevoped till thier early 20's. Kids make mistakes and experiment with drugs, sex, and many other things they probably shouldn't, but do we want them arrested and given records?

Seems a huge waste of resources, and I would much rather see the police being used to Educate kids on the dangers of drug use in the schools, not busting them.

As other's have pointed out there is also the potential for abuses when you have adults "befriending" teenagers. The thought of a grown man/woman "hanging out" with any child of mine with the purpose of "betraying" thier secrets should they exist feels REALLY wrong to me.



posted on Mar, 19 2012 @ 12:55 PM
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reply to post by MountainLaurel
 


So its ok for teens to experiment with illegal activity and its not ok for police to enforce the law and protect kids who arent doing drugs?

At what point do we introduce personal accountability into the equation? An arrest does not make a criminal history. That comes when the PA files charges and only after the person is found guilty by judge or jury and has absolutely nothing to do with the Police.

Maybe parents should actually do their job and raise their children instead of expecting the school to do that? Complaining about law enforcement doing there job while ignoring the fact the kids broke the law makes no sense.



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