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Math Philosophy-- Why does 1/∞ not equal 0, and for that matter, what is ∞?

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posted on Mar, 20 2012 @ 11:16 PM
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Originally posted by PhysicsAdept
reply to post by OccamAssassin
 


Well there are so many variables, and with something like a fluid there are less I would assume. I mean I know a big topic in engineering is wind because though we have wind-powerable sources and turbines that can move depending on from where the wind id hitting but we have no real exact equation for wind. We cannot predict wind yet to a tee enough for wind energy to be t peak efficiency. I mean, wind is more than just a concept but we can assume there is some equation for wind. It has been around since man has been around, and yet there still exists no quantifiable evidence of a uniform equation...

As far as I know anyway. Just interesting to ponder. We know it exists and we even use it to our advantage--yet no equation. I figured infinity is (more or less) in the same boat.


There are less variables than you would think.

Most of our issues regarding predicting the weather are due to insufficient data.

Even with modern systems (satellites, balloons, etc) we still have major limitations on how much data we can collect. Take into account of the fact that we have only been collecting weather data for little over 200 years(I know of records dating back 1000 years plus, but they are vague at best and usually only referenced due to a cataclysmic event).

I come from the maritime industry and know first hand how much weather predictions have improved over the last 30 odd years. Back then daily forecasts were sketchy at best. These days, I can get a 30 day forecast and be pretty confident that it will remain relatively accurate for the duration.

The system is far from perfect, but it is getting better all the time.




posted on Mar, 20 2012 @ 11:25 PM
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Originally posted by OccamAssassin
reply to post by circlemaker
 


Care to enlighten us with a proof involving infinity?


Go ahead and read my replies throughout this thread. I've said quite a bit already and don't care to repeat myself.



posted on Mar, 20 2012 @ 11:25 PM
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reply to post by OccamAssassin
 


Just pointing out an observation.


Staying with the philosophical aspect... can be prove such thing as love? Yet infinity cannot exist as anything but a concept? Love may only be a concept but it sure can affect many people, and feels very real I might add. Yet, there are chemicals and we can make predictions on how these hormones interact with our psychology, yet still it is a mere concept.



posted on Mar, 20 2012 @ 11:28 PM
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reply to post by circlemaker
 


That is how I feel hahaha, or especially felt 2 pages ago


Well, it is interesting to consider certain things. Where would we exist mathematically without infinity? Limits are a great example, though I am sure there are more. We apply infinity there soo much, even as a number in many cases, and yet without them... we would know very little mathematically compared to today



posted on Mar, 21 2012 @ 12:12 AM
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Originally posted by circlemaker

Originally posted by OccamAssassin
reply to post by circlemaker
 


Care to enlighten us with a proof involving infinity?


Go ahead and read my replies throughout this thread. I've said quite a bit already and don't care to repeat myself.


You haven't really stated much.

You have posted a few pictures so far but haven't commented on how your theory works despite being asked several times to do so.

To you I would suggest putting all of your ideas onto paper. Get a suitcase with a lock, put all of your theories into it and lock it. Forget all of your theories and go and study algebra and calculus for 12 months. Then, after 12 months, unlock your case and apply the knowledge learned to explaining your theories.

You sound like you may have some good ideas, but you do not have the ability to describe your work. This is a problem faced by many who have a great idea but lack the terms to express it.

There are quit a few fundamental terms in advanced maths (proof, limit, integrate, etc) that hold different mathematical definitions than one would normally expect.

If you think that studying mathematics is a waste of time because your already smarter than the rest of us, then start a thread so we can all get a clear representation of your theory. That way, we can judge for ourselves if there is any weight to your theory or not.



posted on Mar, 21 2012 @ 12:25 AM
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Originally posted by PhysicsAdept
reply to post by OccamAssassin
 


Just pointing out an observation.


Staying with the philosophical aspect... can be prove such thing as love? Yet infinity cannot exist as anything but a concept? Love may only be a concept but it sure can affect many people, and feels very real I might add. Yet, there are chemicals and we can make predictions on how these hormones interact with our psychology, yet still it is a mere concept.


There is a pretty solid argument for the chemical love scenario.....

An old security dog handling trick is to have a pair of gloves soaked in the urine(I know its gross) of a bitch on heat. No matter how wild or out of control a male dog is, they will not attack a handler wearing the gloves.

To Add

If anyone is thinking about using the above information to commit a crime, be warned that security dogs are usually left in male female pairs for exactly that reason. As soon as the female starts to rip into you....the male will join in.

Consider yourselves warned

edit on 21/3/2012 by OccamAssassin because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 21 2012 @ 01:13 AM
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reply to post by PhysicsAdept
 


As i said you can have infinity only in a process. You cannot have an infinite amount of items whether its atoms or oranges. If you take an infinite amount of oranges for example then the entire universe would be filled with them no space between. Same with atoms they cannot be an infinite amount of atoms because again they be no such thing as space. So please try to see infinity as processes that basically repeats itself over and over again.



posted on Mar, 21 2012 @ 01:44 AM
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Originally posted by PhysicsAdept
reply to post by circlemaker
 


That is how I feel hahaha, or especially felt 2 pages ago


Well, it is interesting to consider certain things. Where would we exist mathematically without infinity? Limits are a great example, though I am sure there are more. We apply infinity there soo much, even as a number in many cases, and yet without them... we would know very little mathematically compared to today



It's rather disappointing and very sad to see that not one single person in this whole thread
seems to have any understanding whatsoever about the nature of infinity and eternity.

the reason could well be that these two inseparable companions, just by their very existence, invoke
considerable fear, dread and anxiety to the vast majority of mankind who dare just for a split second
to think or contemplate about them.

Of course, both infinity and eternity are obviously absolute realities, but the reason they (generally
speaking), are considered only "concepts", is simply because they cannot yet be comprehended by
the human mind. And it is for that reason again, they have been considerably reduced to appear as
mere concepts bound between two limitations; and continue to be so falsely and callously abused.

The Truth of the matter naturally is, that both infinity and eternity are completely limitless. They are
both entirely without beginning and both entirely without end. They are endless.
Cosmos has always existed, always, throughout infinity, and will continue to exist always in futures,
eternally still to come.

One day humankind will advance, progress and mature to such an extent that they slowly will come
to realize that the "concept of time", or the "rhythm of time", has nothing to do with True Reality, but
belongs exclusively to the realm of "the absolute relative". In this regard, the only thing we can
confidentially consider to fall under True Reality, is the term 'the sequence of events'!

Times will come when humankind no longer reckon in days, weeks and years, but simply reckon just
in "time periods"! and when that time comes, humankind will be more than used to, and conversant
with all talks of infinity and eternity - in the Right manner and with the respect these 'True realities'
truly deserve.

Cheers











edit on 21-3-2012 by djeminy because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 21 2012 @ 01:55 AM
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Originally posted by PhysicsAdept
reply to post by longjohnbritches
 


Could you explain? I do not quite get where you are getting at...



I aquired the formula (equation) from an old Indian hermit.
It was a cold nite in the Himalayas north winds of 90 to 100 mph
The Shaman was close to death, I held his hand for comfort.
He squeesed with love and said into my ear, Grasshopper
"Which came first? The chicken or the egg.?



posted on Mar, 21 2012 @ 03:06 AM
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Originally posted by longjohnbritches

Originally posted by PhysicsAdept
reply to post by longjohnbritches
 


Could you explain? I do not quite get where you are getting at...



I aquired the formula (equation) from an old Indian hermit.
It was a cold nite in the Himalayas north winds of 90 to 100 mph
The Shaman was close to death, I held his hand for comfort.
He squeesed with love and said into my ear, Grasshopper
"Which came first? The chicken or the egg.?


Within the seed exist already the image of the potentially fully grown object.

This 'image' was first and foremost created by the 'Thought' representing the
feminine aspect. "Thought" is the primary abstract female concept: intuitive,
formative and creative.
In order for the initial 'image' to become manifest, Thought unites with the 'Will'
representing the masculine aspect. "Will" is the primary abstract male concept:
Fructifying, productive and dominant.
The Will stands above Thought as the highest concentration of the Light - the
supreme, fructifying and life-giving energy.

As long as the thought of creating or of acting is only thought, it has only the
potential for life, it is coming to life. But the moment the Will begins to fructify,
Thought unites with Will and changes from a state of becoming to a state
of being, it becomes concrete. However the Will is nothing so long as
it does not have Thought as a constant basis for its activity.

So as not to bore you with further info, the answer is simply that: The Thought
came first, then the 'image' next, and the rest is history.

(The Love part was really nice though)!

Cheers



posted on Mar, 21 2012 @ 07:18 AM
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reply to post by OccamAssassin
 


Well, you and I both know of love's existence, but what actual proof does that merit? If I said that yes, infinity does exist because we have such thing as zero, to a point that makes sense.

Yet there still exists no equation for love, and also no mathematical proof (that I am aware of). Does love not exist?

I see where you are going with it though, and it was a prudent example



posted on Mar, 21 2012 @ 11:01 AM
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Originally posted by OccamAssassin
You have posted a few pictures so far but haven't commented on how your theory works despite being asked several times to do so.

Wrong. I've described my work not only using words but by using measurable and reproducible geometry. Not only that, it's naturally emergent geometry based on the sine wave, square roots, circles, and yes even algebra.



To you I would suggest putting all of your ideas onto paper. Get a suitcase with a lock, put all of your theories into it and lock it. Forget all of your theories and go and study algebra and calculus for 12 months. Then, after 12 months, unlock your case and apply the knowledge learned to explaining your theories.

You know what? I've love to go to college and learn about all the math of those who came before. I would have loved to have had even the kind of elementary education that people like you take for granted. I had to teach myself math because I had no teacher. This produced interesting results and sometimes I get terminology or syntax wrong, but my geometry is undeniable. The past couple years I've been trying to understand how everyone else does math and integrate my understanding with theirs, but instead of being helped I'm just told to "go to school". Salt in the wound baby.

Unfortunately college isn't free where I live. When I make discoveries in mathematics I put them on my website for free so that everyone else in the world can have access to them. Yet I can not afford to go to college and no one has offered to teach me. I can barely afford to feed myself in this economy. It's a painful irony that I've had to endure while I toil in obscurity.



You sound like you may have some good ideas, but you do not have the ability to describe your work. This is a problem faced by many who have a great idea but lack the terms to express it.

Sometimes concepts are redefined or refined. I've explained many times how I'm treating infinity. It's the upper limit, the farthest possible distance from 0. I sometimes call it the infini-point (self-coined term). This stuff is really simple and people are making it out to be some sort of holy grail that forever eludes us. I resent that humanity is so self-defeating in this regard.



posted on Mar, 21 2012 @ 11:43 AM
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reply to post by djeminy
 


I hear ya dj ,
Where there is a will there is a way with feminity. an infinite one
You DAWG you, thanks for the reply



posted on Mar, 21 2012 @ 01:27 PM
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If you're going to be reasonable and talk about things that really do exist, then we can get to a point where your calculation may actually be logical.

There is no thing as 0,1 apple lol. You've come to a dead end and attempting to solve something which only exists in your brain is only going to mess you up or teach you otherwise.



posted on Mar, 21 2012 @ 02:15 PM
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Originally posted by ImaMuslim
If you're going to be reasonable and talk about things that really do exist, then we can get to a point where your calculation may actually be logical.

There is no thing as 0,1 apple lol. You've come to a dead end and attempting to solve something which only exists in your brain is only going to mess you up or teach you otherwise.


Hi ima
How so?
Think about it. The theory of relitivity was invented by a guy looting a host of ideas from others,
The new Mr. E could be putting the ideas of these very pages together to establish some new (mathmatical equation) as crude as that science is.
Is a dead end half full or half empty?
cheers



posted on Mar, 21 2012 @ 08:51 PM
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Originally posted by circlemaker
For whatever it's worth, some modern programming languages treat 1/0 as infinity and 1/infinity as 0. You can try it yourself using a simple _javascript alert. The official explanation says this isn't really the case, and yet the functionality is there at the same time.


I think this would be to avoid errors screwing up the program? I use a similar bit of code in Excel when I am calculating % etc at work. (If Demonator = 0 then "NA") because if I don't weasel out the areas where there is no data, the hole thing falls down!



posted on Mar, 21 2012 @ 09:26 PM
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reply to post by UKLionheart
 


Well the programmers would have designed it in mind of the most logical answer IMO. I know my calculator replaces undefined with infinity quite often. I just think about it, How many times does zero go into 1? ∞ is the only logical answer that pops into my mind--it being a number or not, it makes sense.



posted on Mar, 21 2012 @ 09:29 PM
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Originally posted by longjohnbritches
reply to post by djeminy
 


I hear ya dj ,
Where there is a will there is a way with feminity. an infinite one
You DAWG you, thanks for the reply


Hi ljb,

my inexhaustible boundless curiosity demands to know what
DAWG stand for?

We 'Vikings' still have a lot to learn from the languages of other
tribes!

Many thanks in return -


Cheers



posted on Mar, 21 2012 @ 11:00 PM
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At OP
Just wondering if you took the time to watch the doco (page 4 this thread) and if it helped answer any of your questions, or (most likely) probably hurt your head heaps more! I know it made my head spin just trying to get my mind around it!



posted on Mar, 21 2012 @ 11:45 PM
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reply to post by djeminy
 


DAWG is basically slang for dog, started as a meme like this.


but this thread needs one more along these lines.




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