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Pulling the PTSD card

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posted on Mar, 16 2012 @ 06:36 PM
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Originally posted by rebellender
reply to post by ILikeStars
 

my apologies I am old and was a little busy with another in your era of service mos....sorry its a tight group I think you would understand


Apology accepted. Sure, I can understand calling someone out if there is doubt. It's the nature of the beast that is ATS. You were a firefighter in the USAF, brother. That is certainly worth more cool points than making some error concerning Air Force Specialty Codes. And if the change happened after your time (and before mine), how the hell is one expected to know they would overhaul all 400+ codes after they got out? Leave it to the military to move all the afsc's around back in 93.

On the bright side we both learned new things today. This has made my day productive. Thank you ATS.




posted on Mar, 16 2012 @ 07:08 PM
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Is it just me
Or has someone gone very quiet, yes got a thread in top replies
But quite possibly lost some credibility
But I hope has atleast learnt something



posted on Mar, 16 2012 @ 07:24 PM
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reply to post by Neocrusader
 



Is it just me
Or has someone gone very quiet, yes got a thread in top replies
But quite possibly lost some credibility
But I hope has atleast learnt something


Good observation but I can assure that’s not the case.

He’s likely creating a few new threads on US military atrocities and the awesome economy of Iran!


My fingers are warmed up and I’ll be ready to respond to those threads too!

Semper Fi



posted on Mar, 16 2012 @ 07:26 PM
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Originally posted by beezzer
reply to post by rebellender
 
In his defense, I held 3 different AFSC's in the Air Force and a different MOS in the Army.

To tell you how confusing it was, I once made a label with that OD duct tape that said "Squadron Punk Ass Bitch" on my office as a joke.
At that same time, my Col. was walking by.

He stopped.
He looked.

He nodded.

And kept walking.



that was a funny one for sure.
All serviceman share a kind of comradery. And then you run into one that has done the same thing its a little tighter a click say Fireman. I called out an afsc and this guy didnt know what I was talking about. Times and things change and there you go.
So in 1979 I was a 57150 and in 1995 I had some real fun and was an mos 11b. While he was at McDill I was at Eskan Village and PSAB. Its all good and it doesnt mean we will be singing in the shower or holding hands.


Back on topic, There is more to this story. To Include comments by our Fine
President of service men and women in country and home.
Again I say it is very convenient that this (op) happened at exactly the time Obama needed an exit strategy from Afghanistan
edit on 16-3-2012 by rebellender because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 16 2012 @ 07:50 PM
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reply to post by rebellender
 


I'm thinking the pentagon, pysops professionals, and "spin doctors" could definately use this as a PR asset in extracting troops from Afghanistan.

Truth is we are being lied to. That's my take. Look at the whole Pat Tillman incident. The government knew he was killed by friendly fire but since he was famous for his enlistment after 9-11 he was a public relations concern also.

If the government has proven they will lie about the death of one individual, surely they would lie about the death of numerous individuals if it would help them reach their objectives. Why should I believe otherwise?

These are some of my thoughts on this particular issue.



posted on Mar, 16 2012 @ 08:03 PM
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reply to post by THE_PROFESSIONAL
 


Seriously? I have seen the effects of PTSD. Its involuntary. Guys will be talking to you and then stop talking and just stare at you. They will stand in one spot for several minutes blanked out. They will go into convulsions. Their eyes will twitch in a weird way. They break out in sweats. They start hyperventilating.

It's all random. I only ever saw the effects of PTSD outside of combat. When we were just relaxing.

PTSD is very real. Most soldiers who have seen combat have it. It's just how bad is it affecting you?

Its like gum disease. Everyone has some form of gum disease. It's just how long can you keep it at bay.
-----

I have it myself. Its instant emotions that physically exhaust you , but i am cleared. My IED encounter. The emotions are instant and literary physically over take you. Very hard to explain , the pain hits you physically as well.

However , im still cleared for duty. I am in the IRR at the moment due to an injury and attending college. I have one more semester to go it seems. I was hoping this was my last one , but it might not be.

After college , i will be put back into active duty.
-----

Being on alert every single day of your life and being able to trust no one leaves an imprint on your mind man. You dont understand it obviously because you havent been there. Isnt a thing you can do about it except time.
edit on 16-3-2012 by milkyway12 because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 16 2012 @ 08:25 PM
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The human mind is complex. We each handle different scenarios differently. I was thrown to the floor and had a knee in my back and gun to my head for 3 minutes in 2001. Eleven years later and I still suffer. 3 MEASELY MINUTES. I do not want to know what it is like to be in a foreign land, always under threat. This soldier needs to be given treatment, not prison or death. I hate war, as would any sane human, but our leaders keep doing what they do, and We the People allow them to do so. So if we take a few steps back and look at the whole picture, we can see we are to blame. Not TPTB. Not this or any soldier. Not any other country. Blood is on all our hands and I cannot understand how others do not see the big picture the way I do. Everyone wants to pass the buck and refuse responsibility. Imagine if this was your father, brother or childhood friend, would you guys be screaming for blood or trying to get him the mental help he needs. And deserves. We are all capable of losing it and going on a killing spree.


 
Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com
 



posted on Mar, 16 2012 @ 08:40 PM
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Reply to post by popsmayhem
 


They support the man not his actions. Everything is not so cut and dry as you always seem to be in your posts. What happened was horrible, but the military does not treat its warriors the way an honorable military should. The US craps on the vets, that's common knowledge, and now we are seeing what is being done to them while still active. Some are strong like Rambo while others are unable to handle the reality of war, yet both should be considered heroes. I do not say just slap him on the wrist, but he does not deserve to be slapped in the face either. Unless any of you are practicing Judges, maybe you haters should let the courts decide what's best. We should do what we can to let Obama and the next POTUS know we are sick of this crap, and put an end to this nonsense.


 
Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com
 



posted on Mar, 16 2012 @ 08:52 PM
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reply to post by THE_PROFESSIONAL
 


your a lier you havent scene anything you just post as much hate filled BS as you can in an attempt to cause trouble .GOLFCLAP for you , not wasting anymore time enjoy talking out your ass and condemning a man who needs and needed help ..Your a real man !!!



posted on Mar, 16 2012 @ 09:27 PM
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reply to post by THE_PROFESSIONAL
 


You know what I think? I think this guy was drunk out of his mind. Completely loaded. And sometimes when that happens, actually often when it happens, people go into what is called a "black out." The news accounts say this soldier had been drinking with his buddies. Who knows how much he drank or what he was drinking?

A few years ago a guy in my city went into a black out, walked across the street, and slit the throats of two women who just happened to be in his path. The next day, he didn't remember the crime or any of the details whatsoever. He was in shock. He was described by people who knew him as a gentle, good person, but even when good people get so loaded they black out, they are capable of horrendous crimes.

Excessive alcohol consumption makes people do wicked, crazy, scary stuff in black outs. The key thing to me was the report that the soldier was in shock. It could be that he didn't even remember doing what he did. The crazy thing about black outs is that people, in that state, can still be highly functional. Drunks have described going into black outs and waking up in entirely different countries! Somehow they are able to buy tickets, board planes, etc., but have absolutely no recollection of how they got to their destination.

I just have a gut feeling that's what happened in this case. And sure, I don't know for certain how much he drank or if he suffered a blackout. Heck, we don't know for certain if drinking was involved (the news accounts may be wrong). But that's the first thing I thought when I read that this decorated soldier had "snapped" after drinking.

As an aside, apparently some of the villagers have stated there was more than one man involved in the killings.



posted on Mar, 16 2012 @ 09:42 PM
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Never mind.


edit on 2012/3/16 by nenothtu because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 16 2012 @ 09:43 PM
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I think we should quit taking pot shots. Of course it was terrible. I hate to see his guy not get a fair trial, to be used to set an example and/or appease Afghans, military God's or politicians. Whatever happened to the idea of "walk a mile in my shoes''?

Read a little about the man:


On Saturday, the day before the shooting spree, Browne said, the soldier saw his friend's leg blown off. Browne said his client's family provided him with that information, which has not been verified.

The other soldier's "leg was blown off, and my client was standing next to him," he said.


Read more: www.foxnews.com...


Can you say "snapped"?



posted on Mar, 16 2012 @ 09:56 PM
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Originally posted by ILikeStars

This one was taken in 06 I think, at Joint Base Balad, Iraq (and sometimes I use it with this caption for rebuttals to people being rude):




I can assure that is balad. I was there in 2006 and in those same little white trailers. I was in the 777 C-130 squadron there. Though I didn't have the tighty whities....



posted on Mar, 16 2012 @ 09:57 PM
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reply to post by Thaxter
 


I want to see news reports that show they have any of booze in a modern combat theater in an Arab country.
edit on 16-3-2012 by rebellender because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 16 2012 @ 09:58 PM
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PTSD is not a disorder --- it's a trauma, an injury.

It is misleading because the 'D" stands for disorder. PTSS (Syndrome) would be more accurate.

PTSD and socio-pathology are two very different diagnoses.

Many adults who were abused as children, witnessed crimes or people who have suffered serious traumas have PTSS/PTSD and would never, ever harm anyone, including their own children. They have empathy and compassion along with a moral compass.

Maybe he was a sociopath/psychopath. They have no remorse and zero empathy. They are 'without conscience' and 'without empathy'. But, most people with PTSD have empathy, compassion and feel remorse and they have a sense of right vs wrong, unless there is an underlying socio-pathology.

People with PTSD have empathy and remorse ... unless they are a sociopath/psychopath with PTSD.



posted on Mar, 16 2012 @ 10:53 PM
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PTSD- wikipedia



Posttraumatic stress disorder
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
(Redirected from Posttraumatic stress syndrome)
Jump to: navigation, search
Posttraumatic stress disorder
Classification and external resources

No quieren (They do not want to)
#9 from aquatint series Los Desastres de la Guerra (The disasters of war – 1810–1820)
Francisco Goya (1746–1828)
ICD-10 F43.1
ICD-9 309.81
DiseasesDB 33846
MedlinePlus 000925
eMedicine med/1900
MeSH D013313

Posttraumatic stress disorder[note 1] (PTSD) is a severe anxiety disorder that can develop after exposure to any event that results in psychological trauma.[1][2][3] This event may involve the threat of death to oneself or to someone else, or to one's own or someone else's physical, sexual, or psychological integrity,[1] overwhelming the individual's ability to cope. As an effect of psychological trauma, PTSD is less frequent and more enduring than the more commonly seen acute stress response. Diagnostic symptoms for PTSD include re-experiencing the original trauma(s) through flashbacks or nightmares, avoidance of stimuli associated with the trauma, and increased arousal—such as difficulty falling or staying asleep, anger, and hypervigilance. Formal diagnostic criteria (both DSM-IV-TR and ICD-10) require that the symptoms last more than one month and cause significant impairment in social, occupational, or other important areas of functioning.[1]



put simply-
brain not work right...

chemical levels in brain mean that the lights are on but no one is home

the machine is off.... and not working properly

you cant even use the drinking against him, because with a diagnosis of PTSD... the drinking is usually how the undiagnosed deal with the symptoms....



posted on Mar, 16 2012 @ 10:54 PM
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This is a set up, end of story.

How many troops do we have in Afghanistan?? How many troops do we have to fight a REAL War with Iran right now?? This could be a smart move from the Military to get the troops out of there to start fighting in Iran. There battle tested in the harshest part of the Middle East.

Just a Theory. Its a set up either way. There is never a lone gunmen.



posted on Mar, 16 2012 @ 11:02 PM
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reply to post by hoochymama
 

As I said an example,now possibly there are more elements involved.Does this scream PSYOP to anyone?



posted on Mar, 16 2012 @ 11:05 PM
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Originally posted by cavtrooper7
reply to post by hoochymama
 

As I said an example,now possibly there are more elements involved.Does this scream PSYOP to anyone?

hell yes,
this guy's story has all the conspiracy of an Oliver Stone movie.....so far
Plus, this is ATS, I am allowed to speculate manchurian candidate, CIA Op, give returning soldiers 2 black eyes, this has all kinds of vibes coming off of it....

or

a guy went nuts and shot up 16 people

its ATS I like my scenario better
edit on 16-3-2012 by rebellender because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 16 2012 @ 11:11 PM
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Originally posted by SGTSECRET

Are you a soldier: Yes
Have you served in combat: Yes
Have you been shot at: Yes
Have you witnessed someone bleeding out begging for help: Yes

What this soldier did was not some PTSD episode, it was a planned out event. He didn't just wake up one night and snap, he had to plan to get off base alone(if thats what happend), and he had a plan for what would take place when he arrived in the village.


PTSD does not impair the ability to plan. Some times, it provides the impetus FOR the plan. It can give you a skewed view of the world, causing faulty reasoning for a plan, but it doesn't prevent you from planning. You may see events differently than other people (colored by the traumatic stresses that caused the PTSD reaction to begin with) that will cause you to react differently. Sometimes a trigger can provide an irrational "snap", and other times it's a long, slow, steady grind on your nerves that will also provide an irrational response that may be weeks in the planning - but no less irrational for all that.




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