Teen charged over Facebook post on UK soldiers killed in Afghanistan#

“Our” soldiers have no business being there in the first place, they do not deserve to die because of that; they just shouldn’t be fighting the war at all.

Being arrested for having an opinion is a joke, if he is not afforded the right to free speech then what rights are these soldiers even fighting for?

reply to post by Xadaz


The right not to get blown up on buses and trains going to their work I guess, after all there were Afghan terror training camps before we deployed there.

Originally posted by randomname
reply to post by Petest205

 

to be fair, osama is dead and you're still bombing the sh-t out of them.

It was never about OBL...

U.S. to File WTO Complaint Over China Rare-Earth Export Caps


Bounty of Rare Earths Discovered in Afghanistan

reply to post by randomname


To be fair, they're still harboring terrorists (Muslim extremists) that are bombing everyone in addition to all the other atrocities they commit against their own people.

Originally posted by ironsjack
reply to post by JailTales

 

No, his crime is not being brown. His crime is spouting comments which were bound to incite racial hatred and by looking at some of the comments, it did. As i explained before, if i was to make the same comments, but vice versa and it offended Afghans in the UK and people got wind of it, then I would be treated exactly the same. The fact he has gone and slandered dead soldiers and hoped for every soldier to burn in hell is more than enough to be considered that. The same way that those scumbags burnt the poppy not so long ago.

But how do his comments incite racial hatred, that's what I'm struggling with. I don't care whether it works both ways, it shouldn't.

He's wrong, and he's a prat, but it's not an incitement to racial hatred. If that's the case then lets try every white person who in the last week have hoped Kony and his merry men would die.

Race doesn't come into it

reply to post by JailTales


Cos, in the same was he is being ignorant labeling all soldiers scum, others idiots may label all muslims terrorist and then they get hurt. You get it yet?

We try to protect minorities in this country, including from idiots within their own communities. Don't you agree there had to be some action taken in this instance to avert a possible backlash? given the high level of public attention this has received.

reply to post by JailTales


Wow, that Kony comment shows how uneducated you are on the subject!

He is inciting racial hatred as he is making comments or sharing an opinion which in turn can cause an inflammatory response related to race. Obviously it caused an inflammatory reaction and racist comments were probably exchanged, which was all because of his comment. As i've stated before, if i made the same comment related to this subject vice versa and it was reported i would be treated the same way.

FYI the "muslims against crusades" group who burnt the giant poppy were also charged on the same offence. Both caused exactly the same response.

FWIW the troops shouldn't even be in Afghanistan. All these people are doing when voicing their "opinions" or "extremist opinions" which is the correct term, are creating racial hatred. What's wrong with saying "I don't agree with the military action in Afghanistan, I don't like the way civilians have been treated and i hope they get pulled out of there soon", rather than "i hope they all burn in hell?". You see what i'm saying?

Does the UK have a Bill of Rights or Constitution? Guess we shouldnt expect much from a nation which has a history deeply rooted in imperialism, conquest, gun confiscations and more surveillance cameras than any other nation on Earth.

reply to post by gladtobehere


Yes, it does have a Bill of Rights, funnily enough it's called the Bill of Rights. Oh yes, "gun confiscations".

More surveillance cameras than any other nation? Wrong. Chicago has more surveillance systems than London.

But if this is coming from the nation of the CIA, TSA and SOPA, well then it was a waste responding to your troll post wasn't it.

reply to post by Maponos


This is what I was saying before.

Should he have the right to say these things? Yes.

Should he have said these things on a public forum, knowing the possible implications of his actions? Probably not.

When the police receive a complaint from a member of the public, should they ignore it? No. They are paid to investigate and take action when the 'Evidential Sufficiency Test in any case' is met. As was in this case here.

I was trying to see how long I could go without responding to someone who said something stupid...Looks like not long. First of all, I don't care WHAT nationality you are, as a death is a death. If you wanted to get technical, the civilian deaths are WAY more of a travesty, for the simple fact that they didn't ask to be born into a war-torn region, with no possibility of escape.

Soldiers on the other hand, KNEW exactly what they were getting themselves into when they signed up. Why do you think I joined the Air Force? Because there were not that many airmen with boots on the ground, that's why. If I would have joined the army, like two of my brothers and my cousin did, then I wouldn't complain about being shot at, since that's what I would be getting paid for...Spreading "democracy".

The truth is that I can talk about the US and Britain however I want, because I am not Muslim, or do not have a Muslim-sounding name. I would hate the West just as much as they did had I been born into the oppression that the West and others have caused over there. If they want Sharia law, who are WE to say NO, you cannot do that?

Grow the # up. We should just LEAVE them ALONE. Like Mr. Crocker said about Brittany. We are NOT making friends, and the governments of the US, Britain, etc, all know that...But despite what they say, they are NOT there for peace. They are there for resources and future monies and profit. That is all. And that is all.

Originally posted by Morg234

Does the UK have a Bill of Rights or Constitution? Guess we shouldnt expect much from a nation which has a history deeply rooted in imperialism, conquest, gun confiscations and more surveillance cameras than any other nation on Earth.

reply to post by gladtobehere

 

Yes, it does have a Bill of Rights, funnily enough it's called the Bill of Rights. Oh yes, "gun confiscations".

More surveillance cameras than any other nation? Wrong. Chicago has more surveillance systems than London.

But if this is coming from the nation of the CIA, TSA and SOPA, well then it was a waste responding to your troll post wasn't it.

edit on 14/3/12 by Morg234 because: (no reason given)

Yeh but our bill or rights was scribbled on a bloody napkin compared the actuall bill of rights in the US
i think we are still using the magna carta as its basis and that didnt afford us much rights
under god and king !

Im sure I've read the bill of rights we have , on my epic crusade into the freeman movement , which is interesting in itself. - another thread

I would like to do the test also stu , but I think in on the side of caution we should employ a journalist to do it for us to highlight the potential pitfalls and failures in our laws and judical system.

what say you ?
that way we can not get directly involved

reply to post by JiggyPotamus


Wait, if they want sharia law that's OK? Seriously? It's ok for them to opress people who disagree with their religion by taxing them and executing them if they don't meet the requirements of their regulations? I'm not saying that our armed forces are doing the right thing by being over there, but Muslims don't enforce sharia law just on members of their own faith who accepted the consequences of their actions, they punish even those people who never agreed to adhere to sharia law in the first place.

By saying they should be able to enforce sharia law if they want to, you're saying it's fine for them to kill innocent people just because they don't agree with them on something as miniscule as a dress code.

reply to post by JiggyPotamus


But the Afghan Government want us there, we are no longer the invaders. We are not oppressing these people, we are providing assistance to them. Giving them an infrastructure and security.

I wonder, if you actually spoke to one of these village elders in a shura, you would see that they are happy that we are there and what we are providing for the families. Yes, they have certain gripes, but generally they are thankful for the assistance. We are not there to take on the insurgents, they are just an annoyance in the day to day lives of our servicemen and women.

And don't think you are better because you are not 'boots on the ground'. Generally, it is air ordnance that causes the most destruction and civilian death by military hands.

Here's an interesting point to consider.

Would they have arrested the kid if he didn't have a muslim sounding name?
Think about that.

Originally posted by ironsjack
He is inciting racial hatred as he is making comments or sharing an opinion which in turn can cause an inflammatory response related to race. Obviously it caused an inflammatory reaction and racist comments were probably exchanged, which was all because of his comment. As i've stated before, if i made the same comment related to this subject vice versa and it was reported i would be treated the same way.

There was nothing about race in his main comment. I have yet to seen any of his other comments, so I guess it's safe to assume we have not seen proof of any racism(yet), so it's hard to debate this subject without backing evidence.

search for the page "Azhar Ahmed scumbag!!"

Thank you OP
Im not being sarcastic either. You provided an excellent example of why this is all completely ludicrous.

If you followed the OP's recommendation then you ended up HERE .

A closer look

1. The 'About' section

Azhar Ahmed need to be killed for what he wrote on facebook the scum! people like this should not be in our county if their not going to support it! out with the scum!!!

So the main purpose of the page is calling for this guy's death... for posting something people don't agree with on Facebook.
With 2k+ Likes. Stay classy Facebook.

2. This LINK. (Another Facebook page calling for his arrest)

Vaz Ahmed from Birmingham needs to be arrested for calling for the deaths of british troops

Another page calling for another guy's arrest over his Facebook post.


3. This

I bet the cops are wishing they didn't have to protect this lowlife... at least let 1 army veteran go in and knock the hell out of him, people like this shouldn't live on the planet never mind reside in our country!

More calls for violence.

4. And this

.... but the memory will still be there in the minds of all that have liked this for the right cause, getting low life scum out of our country NO MATTER WHAT THE RACE!

In summary, we have a dude calling for the removal of 'low life scum' (aka people who do not agree with him) either by arrest, deportation, or murder.

Lets all show our support!

The hypocrisy behind all of this is disturbing.

Originally posted by sapien82
Yeh but our bill or rights was scribbled on a bloody napkin compared the actuall bill of rights in the US

Hardly! Ours was an actual Bill passed in Parliament, after the Declaration of Rights 1689. I believe the original manuscript is in the National Archives, but it wasn't on a napkin

Originally posted by sapien82
i think we are still using the magna carta as its basis and that didnt afford us much rights
under god and king !

The Magna Carta was primarily a document concerning limiting the Kings' powers more than actual rights, but it was the first step towards recognition of such. It did grant the nombility certain rights and eventually they cascaded down.

Originally posted by sapien82
Im sure I've read the bill of rights we have , on my epic crusade into the freeman movement , which is interesting in itself. - another thread

I can give you several links to peruse it if you like?

Originally posted by sapien82
I would like to do the test also stu , but I think in on the side of caution we should employ a journalist to do it for us to highlight the potential pitfalls and failures in our laws and judical system.

what say you ?
that way we can not get directly involved

Sounds like a plan matey, not sure how one could organise such a thing though, I don't know any Journo's

Originally posted by Maponos
reply to post by JailTales

 

Cos, in the same was he is being ignorant labeling all soldiers scum, others idiots may label all muslims terrorist and then they get hurt. You get it yet?

We try to protect minorities in this country, including from idiots within their own communities. Don't you agree there had to be some action taken in this instance to avert a possible backlash? given the high level of public attention this has received.

edit on 14-3-2012 by Maponos because: (no reason given)

No, I don't get it. Being a soldier is a profession, being a Muslim or being a race is not

Originally posted by ironsjack
Wow, that Kony comment shows how uneducated you are on the subject!

Great start, thanks.

He is inciting racial hatred as he is making comments or sharing an opinion which in turn can cause an inflammatory response related to race.

So saying something that could incite a response from racists is inciting racial hatred? That's bollocks. If that's the case I incite racial hatred every day.

It's paramount to saying "don't say that, it might make the racists say racist things", are you kidding me?

Obviously it caused an inflammatory reaction

You can't blame him for the fact there are racists in the world. He caused nothing. I disagree with the line of thinking being promoted. Even if he didn't mention soldiers and slammed the war, you could say he was inciting racial hatred based on the fact some racists might make racist comments when hearing such an opinion, couldn't you?

and racist comments were probably exchanged

If that's the case then I will retract my statement. As of right now I see no evidence for him making any race-related statements.

which was all because of his comment.

Is being in an interracial relationship an incitement to racial hatred? Because I bet if I went and announced I was in one on Stormfront I would be received with a chorus of disgusting racist abuse. Am I to blame for their racism?

As i've stated before, if i made the same comment related to this subject vice versa and it was reported i would be treated the same way.

You've said it, I'm not sure I believe it. If you said that Afghan soldiers are murderers and you hope they die, I really doubt that you'd be arrested.

FYI the "muslims against crusades" group who burnt the giant poppy were also charged on the same offence. Both caused exactly the same response.

But this is where I'm struggling, if you took a moment to read what I'm saying rather than getting on the offensive and calling me an idiot. I don't believe that anybody should be charged based on the reaction of others, they should be punished on what they do, nto what other people do in response.

The Muslims Against Crusades or w/e they're calling themselves are a despicable group who go out to offend, upset and bait people into response. I don't think this lad, however vulgar, was trying to incite anyone. He sounds like a teenager mad at the world having a whinge from his bedroom. Apples and oranges for me.

FWIW the troops shouldn't even be in Afghanistan. All these people are doing when voicing their "opinions" or "extremist opinions" which is the correct term, are creating racial hatred. What's wrong with saying "I don't agree with the military action in Afghanistan, I don't like the way civilians have been treated and i hope they get pulled out of there soon", rather than "i hope they all burn in hell?". You see what i'm saying?

There's nothing wrong with that, you're right, I agree with you. But where I disagree is I don't think they're creating anything, the people making racist comments as response were racist beforehand, you can bet your arse of it.

If he'd used racist language or made reference to white soldiers then I could see why you're of the position you are, but because he doesn't make mention of race I don't think it fair to punish him for the fact other people are racist.

My only argument is that I think it rubbish he's being charged with inciting racial hatred, because okay he's a vulgar moron, but I don't like the underlying tone which I think is that he's responsible for the fact other people are racists. I don't buy that. I read what he said, you read what he said, are either of us espousing racial hate? No. Because you can't incite racial hate, the best you can do is unearth or make closet racists take off their mask.

Nobody is reading his comments and saying "You know what, I just realised I don't like people of a brown complexion any more, I think i might go paki bashing tonight"

I think to some degree we can see the side of each others argument, but disagree on this idea of incitement. I'm responsible for my actions, always.

Wow. If there is any doubt that citizens of the UK have NO freedom of speech, here is the proof.

Make sure you make your point clearly and with good grammar, spelling and punctuation when you post to Facebook kids, or the UK thought crimes division will come knocking.