HC's Ancient Aliens MINDBLOWING episode "The NASA Connection".

originally posted by: PlanetXisHERE

originally posted by: ZetaRediculian
a reply to: TrueMessiah

Sorry but you can't help but to wonder about the motives and intentions of some members

True. there seems to be a handful of users here trying to start a "truth movement" or some kind of UFO cult. How's recruitment going?

On the one hand you have people here, following the scientific method,

IF you're going to follow the scientific method than without further data beyond his claims Mitchell's statements are off the table.

originally posted by: PlanetXisHERE

Or would you rather wait for proof, that the government/MSM is possibly covering up, at which time it will be too late?

A mainstream media cover-up?

You mean like the Hearst Corporation and Disney–ABC who run UFO programs like Ancient Aliens all the time? That mainstream media?

originally posted by: TrueMessiah
Dan Morris is a retired Air Force career Master Sergeant who was involved in the extraterrestrial projects for many years.

You have any links to anything about him that's not from the Disclosure Project? Doesn't seem to be much of a footprint.

If you research Ufology for any length of time you discover there's a half century of former military and intelligence people or people claiming to be former military and intelligence making all sorts of extraordinary claims that can never be confirmed.

There is also speculation and reports about "inside sources" who have deliberately made things up.

originally posted by: TrueMessiah
a reply to: neoholographic

And Edgar isn't the only astronaut who has come forward announced an alien presence.
- Dr. Brian O'leary, Former NASA astronaut and Princeton Physics Professor

Sweet, imaginative guy, dropped out of astronaut training -- and AFAIK never claimed he learned anything about UFOs at NASA.

"In my opinion I think they were worried that it would panic the public so they started telling lies about it.
And then I think they had to tell another lie to cover their first lie, now they don't know how to get out of it. Now it's going to be so embarrassing to admit that all these administrations have told so many untruths, it would be embarrassing getting out of it. There are a number of extraterrestrial vehicles out there cruising around."
- Gordon Cooper, Former NASA Astronaut, Aeronautical Engineer and test pilot. One of the seven original Astronauts in Project Mercury, the first manned space program of the United States

There are a lot of bogus Cooper quotations buzzing around, so I'd prefer a checkable reference rather than 'some guy on the Internet SAID he said this'. Can you help?

originally posted by: JimOberg

originally posted by: neoholographic
a reply to: AdmireTheDistance

.....
If some guy named Willie said the same thing as Edgar Mitchell, the first thing you're going to ask is."Who is Willie?" That's just common sense because you're looking for credibility. You don't have to look for credibility when Edgar Mitchell says it.

You can also calibrate Mitchell's standards by examining other paranormal stories he finds credible -- like his own ESP experiment. Anybody ever read his report from Apollo-14?

Are we missing a trick in calibrating Mitchell's judgment by examining a list of other paranormal topics he has stated he found credible, that might NOT be?

And I was serious about asking about assessments of the credibility of his claim for successful 'space ESP' on Apollo-14. Has anybody read and assessed his formal report on that experiment?

originally posted by: TrueMessiah

Seems you were pretty low on the totem pole there. There's this kind of clearance, like what Dan Morris (NRO operative, also apart of the disclosure project) had :

Testimony of Master Sergeant Dan Morris, USAF (Retired)/ NRO Operative---I had a clearance 38 levels above top secret, which is cosmic top-secret -it is the top of all of those clearances. It is for UFOs, and aliens, etc. No president has had that level, has ever been cleared for that level. Eisenhower was the closest.

www.bibliotecapleyades.net...

I'd bet serious money this guy's resume isn't remotely close to matching anything he's claiming.

He had a higher security clearance than Eisenhower?

originally posted by: DelMarvel

originally posted by: TrueMessiah
Dan Morris is a retired Air Force career Master Sergeant who was involved in the extraterrestrial projects for many years.

You have any links to anything about him that's not from the Disclosure Project? Doesn't seem to be much of a footprint.

If you research Ufology for any length of time you discover there's a half century of former military and intelligence people or people claiming to be former military and intelligence making all sorts of extraordinary claims that can never be confirmed.

There is also speculation and reports about "inside sources" who have deliberately made things up.

Couple of things here:
1. The burden of proof is on you to invalidate his status. I presented a link with credentials, if you oppose those credentials, then you have to produce evidence that his status and/or story is fabricated.

2. It works the other way too. There are disinfo campaigns that attempt to discredit genuine officials and researchers by putting out bogus stories and even erasing records. There's a coverup involved, remember?

originally posted by: JimOberg
Sweet, imaginative guy, dropped out of astronaut training -- and AFAIK never claimed he learned anything about UFOs at NASA.

If you had a problem with what he said you may want to take that up with all the other people who attested to what he said. Don't shoot the messenger.

There are a lot of bogus Cooper quotations buzzing around, so I'd prefer a checkable reference rather than 'some guy on the Internet SAID he said this'. Can you help?

Straight from the horse's mouth, 6:40 mark:

originally posted by: TrueMessiah.....


Couple of things here:
1. The burden of proof is on you to invalidate his status. I presented a link with credentials, if you oppose those credentials, then you have to produce evidence that his status and/or story is fabricated.

Uh, no. Just because somebody posts something on the Internet, doesn't by itself establish any presumption of authenticity.

a reply to: TrueMessiah Thanks, I'll check it later tonight. I appreciate your constructive response. Perhaps I got too cynical after the spread of the bogus Mercury-9 UFO fable and the counterfeit "Ferrando tape".

Oh, this is an old thread. Anyone who thinks the "staff of Ancient Aliens take things to a new level" needs their head examined.

Ancient Aliens completely reverses scientific principle. The assume a conclusion (that everything is Aliens) and then make up facts completely or distort facts in order to support their conclusions.

Most of the suppositions presented on Ancient Aliens have long been debunked or long challenged. These are NOT widely accepted facts, by any stretch of the imagination.

originally posted by: TrueMessiah

Couple of things here:
1. The burden of proof is on you to invalidate his status. I presented a link with credentials, if you oppose those credentials, then you have to produce evidence that his status and/or story is fabricated.

Whoa! Hold on a minute! You posted ONE link from the Disclosure Project that claims this guy was a Sergeant with a "Cosmic top secret" clearance 38 levels above top secret who knew about NSA death squads knocking off UFO witnesses and the burden of proof is on me to invalidate that?

From what research I've done today I would say the burden of proof is on you to demonstrate this character even existed. The one and only sighting of this guy seems to be 2001. If someone with this alleged resume dropped off the charts like that I'd say the most likely explanation is because it was discovered he was a fraud.

EDIT: This appears to be a full transcript of his Project Disclosure testimony. Read this and tell me if you still stand by him as a credible source: rune.galactic.to...

originally posted by: DelMarvel


Whoa! Hold on a minute! You posted ONE link from the Disclosure Project that claims this guy was a Sergeant with a "Cosmic top secret" clearance 38 levels above top secret who knew about NSA death squads knocking off UFO witnesses and the burden of proof is on me to invalidate that?

All I need is one link. I believe him, you don't. Now INVALIDATE IT.

From what research I've done today I would say the burden of proof is on you to demonstrate this character even existed. The one and only sighting of this guy seems to be 2001. If someone with this alleged resume dropped off the charts like that I'd say the most likely explanation is because it was discovered he was a fraud.

He existed alright. Who do you think was at the hearing giving testimony? He was discovered a fraud huh? Sorry but speculation won't win you any points here.

EDIT: This appears to be a full transcript of his Project Disclosure testimony. Read this and tell me if you still stand by him as a credible source: rune.galactic.to...

Umm... that's the same exact transcript from my link word for word. It's already been read and if I didn't find any of it credible, I wouldn't have posted it. lol

originally posted by: JimOberg


Uh, no. Just because somebody posts something on the Internet, doesn't by itself establish any presumption of authenticity.

It's his own testimony, not "something somebody posted". You guys are killing me right now....killing as in making me lol to death.

originally posted by: TrueMessiah

originally posted by: DelMarvel


Whoa! Hold on a minute! You posted ONE link from the Disclosure Project that claims this guy was a Sergeant with a "Cosmic top secret" clearance 38 levels above top secret who knew about NSA death squads knocking off UFO witnesses and the burden of proof is on me to invalidate that?

All I need is one link. I believe him, you don't. Now INVALIDATE IT.

Well, would you look at this:

Testimony of Master Sergeant Dan Morris, USAF (Retired)/ NRO Operative

September 2000

Dan Morris is a retired Air Force career Master Sergeant who was involved in the extraterrestrial projects for many years. After leaving the Air Force, he was recruited into the super-secret National Reconnaissance Organization, or NRO, during which time he worked specifically on extraterrestrial-connected operations. He had a cosmic top-secret clearance (38 levels above top secret) which, he states, no U.S. president, to his knowledge, has ever held.

Compare that to this:

Dan Salter and others
Dan Salter is a retired Air Force career man, E9, master sergeant, who was involved in the extraterrestrial issue for many many many years.

He later, after leaving the Air Force, was recruited into the super secret National Reconnaissance Organization, or NRO. During which time, he worked specifically on extraterrestrial matters and the retrieval of extraterrestrial vehicles and the management of this subject. he had a ’cosmic’ top secret clearance.

Top secret cosmic compartmentalization, which he states, no U.S. president, to his knowledge, has ever held.

Second quote is from info provided by Greer: link

Greer is the source of this man's "credentials," and Salter's as well (assuming they are not the same huckster.)

Harte

originally posted by: JimOberg
a reply to: TrueMessiah Thanks, I'll check it later tonight. I appreciate your constructive response. Perhaps I got too cynical after the spread of the bogus Mercury-9 UFO fable and the counterfeit "Ferrando tape".

Found it, believe it, appreciate it. Nicely done, he did say it.

Do you want to discuss why his Edwards landing story is at variance with every other witness account and all documentation, or is that too far off topic?

a reply to: Harte

Very interesting. Here's a video which starts with "Daniel Salter" repeating lines word for word from the earlier posted transcript attributed to "Dan Morris."

Here's another video attributed to "Daniel Salter" with an elaboration of the same Roswell story from the "Dan Morris" transcript. Same story, same resume.

I'm not a hundred percent sure it's the same man in both videos. What do others think?

It does get back to my original question about whether "Dan Morris" ever even existed.

It certainly should raise red flags about the credibility of this story assuming one found it remotely plausible to begin with.



EDIT: Here's another video labelled "Daniel M. Salter" where the subject is repeating a story from the "Dan Morris" transcript almost word for word.

www.dailymotion.com...

a reply to: DelMarvel

So, I got to the bottom of this.

His name is actually Daniel Morris Salter.

For some reason the Disclosure Project never bothered to clear this up which raises some issues about their attention to detail.

I found a synopsis of his book and some commentary from Stan Friedman on the UFO UpDates mailing list from 2004:

One item on the internet said Salter "Taught courses on
electromagnetic anti-gravitational propulsion systems as a
Professor Emeritus at Mountain View College." MVC is a 2 year
college. I can't find anybody there who knows anything about him
though he was on a list of possible teachers. I can't imagine
such a course being taught there.

Furthermore it is hard to believe that he lists "the Development
of Conscious Contact Citizenry Department (DCCCD) with the
United States Military". Mountain View College is part of the
Dallas County Community College District (DCCCD). Coincidence?

Stan

ufoupdateslist.com...

originally posted by: TrueMessiah
All I need is one link. I believe him, you don't. Now INVALIDATE IT.

All right. I established above that who we are talking about is actually Daniel Morris Salter. Here's his obituary from the Taos News:

www.taosnews.com...


Reads in part:

Daniel M. Salter, born 9/7/1928 passed on September 12, 2007 in Colorado Springs, Co...... He moved to Taos, NM in 1990 after retiring from Mountain View College, Dallas, Texas, after serving as Head of Pilot Technology for 22 years. Prior to that he served 21 years in the United States Air Force in the field of electronics and radar. He was a Korean War veteran. While living in Taos, he was an avid lecturer regarding his UFO studies

He moved to Taos in 1990 AFTER retiring from Mountain View College where he had been for 22 years. That puts him at Mountain View College at least by 1968 the year he says the NRO came into existence and he went to work for it. He was in the Air Force for 21 years before that which takes us back at least to 1947 when he would have been around 19. The dates don't match up and there is no window for the 38 levels of top secret shenanigans at the NRO he claims.

originally posted by: JimOberg

originally posted by: JimOberg

a reply to: TrueMessiah Thanks, I'll check it later tonight. I appreciate your constructive response. Perhaps I got too cynical after the spread of the bogus Mercury-9 UFO fable and the counterfeit "Ferrando tape".

Do you want to discuss why his Edwards landing story is at variance with every other witness account and all documentation, or is that too far off topic?

Now that we've agreed on what Cooper actually said, how about we confront the crux of the issue -- is what he SAID accurate?

Regarding the 1957 'Edwards landing', three separate investigators checked into it and all three reached the conclusion Cooper's story about being there in charge and seeing film of a UFO landing is total bunk.

One investigator was me, but you wouldn't believe me.

The other two were leading, highly respected pro-UFO investigators, James McDonald and Brad Sparks.

James McDonald investigated the Edwards story for his testimony to Congress in 1968, and found no landing gear, no landing, and no Cooper. His prepared testimony is here
www.ufoevidence.org...
and the report is “Case 41” on page 44. McDonald refers to interviewing “a third person who states that he inspected the prints in company with the two Askania operators and darkroom personnel” and some writers have interpreted this to be Cooper in disguise – but cameraman Bittick [who was at that review] is clear he didn’t even know Cooper was on base, and in 1967-8 there was no chance McDonald was ever going to be allowed to interview a Mercury astronaut about some pre-NASA UFO story.


UFO investigator Brad Sparks interviewed witnesses and demolished Cooper’s claimed connection with the Edwards case. NICAP report, 2009: www.nicap.org...

In light of that research, how do you insist that Cooper's version is the one we should accept over the coherent, consistent accounts of every other witness, document, and investigator?

originally posted by: Harte

originally posted by: TrueMessiah

originally posted by: DelMarvel


Whoa! Hold on a minute! You posted ONE link from the Disclosure Project that claims this guy was a Sergeant with a "Cosmic top secret" clearance 38 levels above top secret who knew about NSA death squads knocking off UFO witnesses and the burden of proof is on me to invalidate that?

All I need is one link. I believe him, you don't. Now INVALIDATE IT.

Well, would you look at this:

Testimony of Master Sergeant Dan Morris, USAF (Retired)/ NRO Operative

September 2000

Dan Morris is a retired Air Force career Master Sergeant who was involved in the extraterrestrial projects for many years. After leaving the Air Force, he was recruited into the super-secret National Reconnaissance Organization, or NRO, during which time he worked specifically on extraterrestrial-connected operations. He had a cosmic top-secret clearance (38 levels above top secret) which, he states, no U.S. president, to his knowledge, has ever held.

Compare that to this:

Dan Salter and others
Dan Salter is a retired Air Force career man, E9, master sergeant, who was involved in the extraterrestrial issue for many many many years.

He later, after leaving the Air Force, was recruited into the super secret National Reconnaissance Organization, or NRO. During which time, he worked specifically on extraterrestrial matters and the retrieval of extraterrestrial vehicles and the management of this subject. he had a ’cosmic’ top secret clearance.

Top secret cosmic compartmentalization, which he states, no U.S. president, to his knowledge, has ever held.

Second quote is from info provided by Greer: link

Greer is the source of this man's "credentials," and Salter's as well (assuming they are not the same huckster.)

Harte

E-9 is not "Master Sergeant" in the USAF.