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Rick Santorum To Single Mothers: Government Paternity Tests Or No Welfare

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posted on Mar, 9 2012 @ 12:55 PM
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reply to post by OutKast Searcher
 


They'll get the government out of your lives...unless you are a women...and then the government is in your pants monitoring your vagina.

By God if this response didn't make it worth the posting then I don't know what did! ROTFL!

Watch out - here comes a POINT OF VIEW: It amazes me some of the same people (here) in this thread that post religiously AGAINST government trampling 'rights of privacy' are falling all over themselves to condom err, I mean, condemn women who are...less than monogamous.

Wow is all I can say.

peace




posted on Mar, 9 2012 @ 12:55 PM
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reply to post by LErickson
 


Another reason? Are you speaking of love????
A woman in love would not have the confusion of twenty candidates I think.
And as for my kids, no dna test was needed as they turned out real good looking kids!

Even if they weren't mine I'd be proud to say, "yep, them's my gene pool"!



posted on Mar, 9 2012 @ 12:59 PM
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Originally posted by youdidntseeme

Originally posted by Annee

The child did not choose to be born.

The child's sperm donor is just as responsible for this child as the mother.

AGAIN - - always the woman's fault.



I agree here.
If a father is the applicant for the benefits, he should be required to supply the mother's name also.


Oh yeah! But the birth mother can not hide who she is.

The birth mother is not protected by the constitution - - - so she can hide being the parent. DNA testing is voluntary. If the sperm donor refuses testing - - - she has no recourse.


there are father's who have sole custody of their children as well.


One of my best friends in high school back in the 60s was raised by her father. Her and her 5 brothers and sisters. He was of Syrian descent. One of the girls was blonde and blue eyed. Didn't matter to him - - she was his daughter.

But statistically - - - majority is the mother.



posted on Mar, 9 2012 @ 01:02 PM
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reply to post by g146541
 


Plus if Mommy is selling that many admission tickets to the underpants park, maybe there should be some monitors there.

Though that really made me laugh I have to ask you Why?

What about the men going for the ride?

If I choose to open my 'pleasure park' to anyone and everyone - that's my right, like it or not. (You know, the whole 'it's my body' argument)...

If children are the byproduct of my...lust(?) , what difference is there between ME and the sperm donor? Can't get a babe without the one or the other.

AND - Facts are it's NO ONE'S BUSINESS but Mommy and Daddy's.

If the Gubberment can't figure out a better way to help those truly in need and without kowtowing to those who are abusing the system then they need to do what they're paid for and figure it out. That is unless their job description has recently changed to actively continually and abusively trampling personal privacy.

peace


edit on 9-3-2012 by silo13 because:




posted on Mar, 9 2012 @ 01:03 PM
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Originally posted by g146541
reply to post by Annee
 


YES!!!
If the woman cannot remember which of the pittsburgh steelers is the father or cannot narrow it down to 3 people or god forbid, know the ONE person it could be.
Then yes, it would be the womans fault.
And if the woman has an idea of who it is and does not come forward with a name, then yes, that would be the womans fault as well.
Is this so hard to comprehend?


The sperm donor created the child - - - just as much as the mother.

Let's count how many places he stuck his "Hoo Hoo" in a "Woo Woo" - without a raincoat.

edit on 9-3-2012 by Annee because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 9 2012 @ 01:03 PM
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I think that the fathers should be financially responsible.

It's time for people to take responsibility for their lives.

If you can't afford children, don't have them. If you have children, then pay for their upkeep.

It's pretty simple.



posted on Mar, 9 2012 @ 01:05 PM
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Originally posted by g146541
reply to post by Annee
 


YES!!!
If the woman cannot remember which of the pittsburgh steelers is the father or cannot narrow it down to 3 people or god forbid, know the ONE person it could be.
Then yes, it would be the womans fault.
And if the woman has an idea of who it is and does not come forward with a name, then yes, that would be the womans fault as well.
Is this so hard to comprehend?


I've seen women bring in Ledger books, and give dozens of names, dates, locations, and have all the tests come up negative. I've seen women just give locations and number of participants, but with no knowledge of any names. I think the most I ever saw was about 50 good names, and good contact info, but they all came up negative!

Now you gotta think, A woman can narrow it down to a 28 day period when she must have become pregnant. So 50 unique names is a LOT of names in 28 days or less!

I could tell far more shocking stories than that, but it would teeter on privacy issuess, however there are GREAT public venues to read the most outrageous child support stories ever leaked!

Man ordered to pay child support after Oral Sex---ex-girlfriend saved sperm and later inseminated herself!

Top 10 Craziest Child Support Stories, including 2 fake children!

Funny Child Support Claims


2. I am unsure as to the identity of the father of my child as I was being sick out of a window when taken unexpectedly from behind. I can provide you with a list of names of men that I think were at the party if this helps.



I don’t know the identity of the father of my daughter. He drives a BMW that now has a hole made by my stiletto in one of the door panels. Perhaps you can contact BMW service stations in this area and see if he’s had it replaced.



I cannot tell you the name of child A’s dad as he informs me that to do so would blow his cover and that would have cataclysmic implications for the British economy. I am torn between doing right by you and right by the country. Please advise.


edit on 9-3-2012 by getreadyalready because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 9 2012 @ 01:05 PM
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Originally posted by g146541
reply to post by LErickson
 


Ok I will type slow for your benefit.
If Mommy does not know which of the men is her babydaddy



Originally posted by g146541
reply to post by Annee
 


YES!!!
If the woman cannot remember which of the pittsburgh steelers is the father or


Interesting choice of words. What exactly are you trying to say?



posted on Mar, 9 2012 @ 01:06 PM
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reply to post by sarra1833
 


Is it just me or am I the only one who had 'The Scarlet Letter' pop into my mind on reading this?

Hi Sarra! SO GLAD you made it through that bad weather you were having!

And yes, that is exactly what I was thinking - 'The Scarlet Letter'... Wow...

peace



posted on Mar, 9 2012 @ 01:10 PM
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First it was drug tests.

Now it is paterity tests.

It looks like it will be easier to go to colledge and be a snob, than to get on welfare.

With all the negative attention being put toward women of late, I wont be very surprised when they get tired of it and go on strike.

Then the country will really be up the creek.

I can see it now:

NO HEALTH CARE-- NO WORK !

NO CONTRICEPTIVES -- NO SEX !
edit on 9-3-2012 by hdutton because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 9 2012 @ 01:11 PM
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Originally posted by FissionSurplus
Naming the father has been the law in California since the late 1990s.


And?

The sperm donor is protected by the constitution. DNA testing is voluntary.

As of yet - - it can not be forced.

The sperm donor is within his legal rights to refuse DNA testing for paternity.

Where is the woman's right? Where is the child's right?
edit on 9-3-2012 by Annee because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 9 2012 @ 01:12 PM
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reply to post by silo13
 



What about the MEN! My gawd what a chauvinistic pig!



Also Silo, the men ARE required to give up the name of the mother if the men file for cash assistance, medicare or medicaid, although it is usually much, much more apparent due to the mother having to be present at the birth and always being listed on the birth certificate.

For the record, the statistics are getting much closer to fifty-fifty when it comes to who pays child support and who receives child support. Some of the largest payments I have seen have been mothers paying out to fathers. And, in fact, the dead-beat mothers are everyone's least favorite to deal with. For whatever reason, they are just caustic and vile when they don't have custody and have to pay.

Also, there are often times where custody is shared 50/50, but one party still has to pay child support. In fact, I know a father with full custody, the mother only got the children every other weekend, but their income disparity was so great that the father still had to pay the mother child support, just because she had to maintain a room at her residence for the children during her weekends. He paid her, for her to have visitation!
edit on 9-3-2012 by getreadyalready because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 9 2012 @ 01:17 PM
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reply to post by Annee
 


The sperm donor is protected by the constitution. DNA testing is voluntary.
As of yet - - it can not be forced.
The sperm donor is within his legal rights to refuse DNA testing for paternity.
Where is the woman's right?

*Stands up on my computer chair and applauds!*

There are no women's rights in this case. If a woman is pregnant and wants to terminate the pregnancy she now has to view an ultrasound of the...fetus...before her procedure - or take up a knitting needle. Even if she has a 'spontaneous abortion' (these days) she can be tried for murder...

If she has a child - she MUST finger-the-father, or go without.

And on and on and on.

When will men stop hating women?

When?

And when will the rest stop voting for them?

peace



posted on Mar, 9 2012 @ 01:19 PM
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reply to post by silo13
 


Why???
Because the man is not the one who will be carrying this child around for the next 10 months.
This new growth will irreversably change the womans life forever, the same is not always true for the male component.



posted on Mar, 9 2012 @ 01:19 PM
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reply to post by Annee
 



And?

The sperm donor is protected by the constitution. DNA testing is voluntary.

As of yet - - it can not be forced.

The sperm donor is within his legal rights to refuse DNA testing for paternity.

Where is the woman's right? Where is the child's right?


That is not true.

The potential fathers absolutely must submit to the DNA testing, or they will go to jail until they comply. And, this means even if they were not in the same state or country at the time of the conception! I've seen military men be forced to submit even though they were on assignment for months surrounding the conception date.

Worse yet, if a military man is married to a cheating wife, and she gets pregnant and gives birth and lists him as the father, then legally he is the father. The DNA test is worthless, his alibi is worthless, because legally he is the father.

Now suppose the man proves he can't possibly be the father, and also proves who the real father is, and he is lucky enough to get the case in front of a Judge. The Judge's motivation is to provide for a child, so the Judge looks at a good provider and legal father, vs. a dead-beat gigolo that knocked up a strange woman, and the Judge will ALWAYS err on the side of keeping the non-biological father as the provider for the child, and he has every right to do so according to state laws.



posted on Mar, 9 2012 @ 01:20 PM
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reply to post by getreadyalready
 


For the record, the statistics are getting much closer to fifty-fifty when it comes to who pays child support and who receives child support. Some of the largest payments I have seen have been mothers paying out to fathers. And, in fact, the dead-beat mothers are everyone's least favorite to deal with. For whatever reason, they are just caustic and vile when they don't have custody and have to pay.

Thank you for the information. It sounds like a great topic for a thread. If you start one please let me know I'd like to see where you got your facts and read up on them (no I don't doubt you I'm only curious) and you're right - 'dead beat' women get the best end of the financial stick. That being said I still don't agree with any government agency requiring 'proof' of parentage to give aid to a mother/father and child. Government does NOT belong in peoples bedrooms.

peace

EDIT TO ADD:

I read (the below) only after I posted the above:


The potential fathers absolutely must submit to the DNA testing, or they will go to jail until they comply. And, this means even if they were not in the same state or country at the time of the conception! I've seen military men be forced to submit even though they were on assignment for months surrounding the conception date.

Worse yet, if a military man is married to a cheating wife, and she gets pregnant and gives birth and lists him as the father, then legally he is the father. The DNA test is worthless, his alibi is worthless, because legally he is the father.

Absolutely needs a thread.
I hope you tackle that one, I can't.
Do it! And please let me know. This info your posting just floors me!

More peace,
gracie
edit on 9-3-2012 by silo13 because: see above



posted on Mar, 9 2012 @ 01:22 PM
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reply to post by Annee
 


Like I explained above, the woman will be the one carrying the child.
The "sperm donor" has some advantages in pregnancy as well as the Mother.
The Father cannot stop an abortion, the female component has ABSOLUTE control over that.
It is a give and take.



posted on Mar, 9 2012 @ 01:23 PM
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Originally posted by silo13

When will men stop hating women?



Oh I dont hate you!


Because you love my avatar!

But as a side note to this thread.

I applaud ATS and its members today for being able to have this discussion, fairly civilly, today nearly 20 years after the comments made by Santorum.

The issue existed then, albeit in a different context when in regards to welfare as this was before the reform act of 1996, and the issue exists today.

I a proud t be an ATS member today!



posted on Mar, 9 2012 @ 01:24 PM
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I'm just grabbing random sources that are easy to grab. As far as I know the laws are uniform across all 50 states, because all 50 states submit to the Title IV requirements of the Federal Mandate.

Here is some information on legal vs. biological fathers, and on forced genetic testing...



What if all the individuals who need to submit to genetic testing are not cooperating with the child support office? The Washington County Attorney's Office works with the child support office and may bring a court action asking a Judge to order all the necessary individuals to submit to genetic testing. When a Judge signs a court order for genetic testing, the mother, father and child must submit to testing.

Failure to cooperate with court ordered genetic testing may result in a warrant being issued for the arrest of the person(s) who fail to cooperate.




What is the difference between a legal father and a biological father? Every child has a biological father. The biological father is the man with whom a child's mother becomes pregnant. The legal father is the man the law recognizes as the father of the child. The legal father may or may not be the biological father.

When a woman is married and becomes pregnant, it is presumed that her husband is the legal father of the child and paternity is established without the parents having to take any legal action. When an unmarried woman has a child, an official action is needed to establish the legal father of the child. This is called the establishing of paternity.

How is paternity established? When a child is born to an unmarried mother, paternity can be established if:

• both parents agree that the man is the biological father and want him to be the legal father and they sign a Recognition of Parentage
• either or both parents ask the court to enter a court order finding that the man is the legal father of the child, or
• the parents marry after the child is born. Both parents sign an affidavit and file it with the Office of the State Registrar. (Paternity is then established if no other documents filed earlier name another man as the child's legal father.)


Source
edit on 9-3-2012 by getreadyalready because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 9 2012 @ 01:25 PM
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Originally posted by getreadyalready
Now you gotta think, A woman can narrow it down to a 28 day period when she must have become pregnant. So 50 unique names is a LOT of names in 28 days or less!



Women are going to list who they want to be the father first.

They may also intentionally not list the real father because they don't want that person in their life.

It should be about the child.

Personally I support modern style self-contained orphanages (similar to a boarding school) - - - that each city be responsible for their own - - and have as many as needed (not just one).

Culture (and generational poverty is a culture) - - is the hardest thing in the world to change. Only removing a child from this culture - - putting them in modern style self-contained orphanages would create the change they need.

Parents can go into "step" work camps. Lots of desert out there. They can live in "Tent Cities" and be given options to work themselves out and get their children back if that is what they want.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

First we need mandatory DNA testing for paternity.

And we need male birth control pills. Which have been deemed not cost effective - - - because men don't want to take them and/or the responsibility.






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