Charges of Racism for Chanting USA…In America!

Originally posted by FreedomKnight
reply to post by theubermensch

 

YES!! EVERYDAY WE CELEBRATE OUR FREEDOM BECAUSE OUR FOUNDING FATHERS AND THOUSANDS OF MEN DIED FOR OUR FREEDOM AND CONSTITUTION...IT'S CALL PRIDE ZOMBIE!

USA !! USA !! USA!!!

What does playing high school basketball have to do with the Founding Fathers or our Constitutional rights? Mindless chanting is not a substitute for actually being involved in the maintenance of your rights. Mindless chanting does not secure your right to vote in an open and fair election that does not have moneyed-interests in control. Playing basketball has nothing to do with freedom. They play basketball in China and they have mindless chants in North Korea.

Originally posted by theubermensch
I live in Australia ...

Then you, as a foreigner, have no clue as to what Americans do at sporting events.

When we go to Flyers games, at times the crowd will break out in chants of 'USA, USA' during the game. They do this when the Flyers are playing other American teams as well as Canadian teams. They do this even though the players are from many different places ... USA, Canada, Europe ...

Chanting 'USA USA' at a game .. ANY game ... happens in America.
And as I said ... 'USA' isn't a race.

This is so damn stupid ... it's NOT racist.

reply to post by thehoneycomb

Now me personally I have nothing against them, unless they are criminals. But if I walked down my own street I could not count the number of illegals on both hands

wow, I wasn't aware you could deduce citizenship from visual appearance alone. Thanks again ATS for being a wealth of invaluable knowledge.

Anyways, honestly guys, you can't be seriously trying to tell us you don't see that this chant was intended as a racist chant? Actually, it's quite obvious you don't see that, because from your own posts, some of you are clearly racist.

Being hispanic doesn't exclude you from being an american, Seabag got THAT part right. But come on, you have a predominately white team, and a predominately hispanic team. You all know EXACTLY what as intended with that chant, to play on the notion that because the other team is mostly hispanic, they aren't real americans. Don't deny this until you guys read your own posts ok, because you've said this crap yourselves, in your well practiced veiled way.

now maybe we do it differently in Cannuckistan, but at the end of a game between schools, we rarely chanted CANADA!! or even the name of the province. In fact, at a school sports event, you usually chant for the team, or school.

That is, unless you intend to spread racism, then you chant USA USA USA at a bunch of hispanic kids and make them feel GREAT to live in the land of the free.

They are coming there for the same reasons your ancestors ILLEGALLY SETTLED there.

I'm not justifying illegals, but this doesn't appear to be about that, you guys just learned the trick, say it's about illegals, and you can be as racist as you want.

Hell, apparently you can just LOOK at a dude and know he's not got a green card absolutely nothing racist about basing your judgements on someones race.....

I hope at least some of you are facepalmin, I am, for wasting my breath.

If the mostly Latino high school had won and begun chanting "Aztlan! Aztlan!", I wonder if the reaction would've been the same.

/TOA

Originally posted by phishyblankwaters
now maybe we do it differently in Cannuckistan,

And we hear from yet another foreigner who hasn't got a clue as to what we do in the USA. Look ... just because you guys don't go around saying 'CANADA, CANADA' at sporting events doesn't mean that in the USA we do the same. We are a different country with different ways of doing things.

'USA USA' happens at all sorts of events. Turn on a NASCAR race ... you'll hear it. Go to a Flyers game. You'll hear it. Or a Patriots game. Or a Phillies game. Heck ... at my daughters high school swim team finals all the teams did it, right after the National Anthem.

Originally posted by phishyblankwaters
reply to post by thehoneycomb

 

Now me personally I have nothing against them, unless they are criminals. But if I walked down my own street I could not count the number of illegals on both hands

wow, I wasn't aware you could deduce citizenship from visual appearance alone. Thanks again ATS for being a wealth of invaluable knowledge.

Anyways, honestly guys, you can't be seriously trying to tell us you don't see that this chant was intended as a racist chant? Actually, it's quite obvious you don't see that, because from your own posts, some of you are clearly racist.

Being hispanic doesn't exclude you from being an american, Seabag got THAT part right. But come on, you have a predominately white team, and a predominately hispanic team. You all know EXACTLY what as intended with that chant, to play on the notion that because the other team is mostly hispanic, they aren't real americans. Don't deny this until you guys read your own posts ok, because you've said this crap yourselves, in your well practiced veiled way.

now maybe we do it differently in Cannuckistan, but at the end of a game between schools, we rarely chanted CANADA!! or even the name of the province. In fact, at a school sports event, you usually chant for the team, or school.

That is, unless you intend to spread racism, then you chant USA USA USA at a bunch of hispanic kids and make them feel GREAT to live in the land of the free.

They are coming there for the same reasons your ancestors ILLEGALLY SETTLED there.

I'm not justifying illegals, but this doesn't appear to be about that, you guys just learned the trick, say it's about illegals, and you can be as racist as you want.

Hell, apparently you can just LOOK at a dude and know he's not got a green card absolutely nothing racist about basing your judgements on someones race.....

I hope at least some of you are facepalmin, I am, for wasting my breath.

edit on 8-3-2012 by phishyblankwaters because: (no reason given)

So not agreeing that this is a race issue somehow makes the person racist? Very interesting. Reminds me of how all the people that didn't want the seperate gay/lesbian forum were called names such as homophobic and small minded. You jump to conclusions too fast. You see all the other responses and if they aren't on the same page as you than instantly think they must be racist and in a veiled way feel like anyone not 'white' isn't really American.

Explanation: Ok to summarize ...

It APPEARS that the 1st racist transgretion was performed by the San Antonio Edison fans [lets leave the teams out of this... see below in my personal disclosure for why ok!] with the chanting of "Alamo Whites!"

This [if true ... it's the interwebz ok & it is all about AD REVENUE generation ] clearly has racist undertones [am I putting that too mildly ] !

And the response to it by the Alamo Heights teams fans [apparently including some students who were latino's ... but I can't verify that claim as yet ... any help to confirm or deny it would be appreciated please] was to pull a Homer Simpson and start chanting "USA! USA! USA!" which although highly patriotic can act as cover for illwill [am I putting that too mildly ] !

Now in my pained research of the source article and its comments section it came to my attention that this is not the 1st time that the articles reporter has made a beat up story to grab headlines by completely twisting the reality to suit his editors nefarious schemes!

Personal Disclosure: OH MY GOD I AM SO FREAKING MAD RIGHT NOW!



I don't have a child ... but the students playing on both teams were disrespected and exploited!

When you start eating your children alive ... its game over for your culture!

Originally posted by FreedomKnight
reply to post by getreadyalready

 

You're the reason racism still exist...I'm not sure of your race or nationality but this is the UNITED STATES OF AMERICA and our citizens are protected by the 1st Amendment...pick up the Constitution and read it! This event was NOT racist..this was two PUBLIC, AMERICAN TAX PAYER, FUNDED SCHOOLS and they have the right to cheer on their school and OUR country.

But what does cheering on your country have to do with a sporting event between two, as you put it, tax payer-funded school teams? The only purpose of starting that chant (whatever group of students did that) was to highlight the ethnic difference, as though if you weren't pasty white, you weren't a salient Gestalt example of an American.

I'll quote my father, who's parents were Italian immirgrants, "If you don't like what America stands for...GET OUT...we don't want you here".

I'll quote mine, "Tu sei pats"...you're crazy...there's nothing anti-American about calling out hate. The first Amendment does protect the students' speech. It also protects the speech of the principal and other district officials who choose to apologize.

Lemme give you an example. The word Mexican is not a racist term at face value, but you could use it that way with the right context. The word "gay" is not a hateful term, but when it's used derogatorily, it becomes that way.

Chanting USA! USA! USA! is not a hateful, bigoted thing to do at a competition between the US and Zimbabwe or whatever country. It is a hateful thing to do when two AMERICAN teams are playing each other and it is clear that the only salient difference between to the two teams is a "mainstream" ethnic background and a "fringe" ethnic background. It's about implication and intent...it's about context.

I'm sure almost everyone on ATS read this article about 3 students, and I believe 1 or 2 of them was hispanic, were suspended for wearing USA T-shirts on Cinco de Mayo, a Mexican holiday..NOT a USA holiday!! And then their lives were threatened!! THIS IS AMERICA..if you don't have pride in our STARS and STRIPES LEAVE!!

That's context too, but at the end of the day, those kids were ignorant as is. Cinco de Mayo is not a real holiday in Mexico. It's become a partying holiday here in the US and most Mexican-Americans know it more for that reason. People in Mexico celebrate Cinco de Mayo the way people in the US celebrate the anniversary of the Boston Massacre...what do you do on the anniversary of the Boston Massacre? Well that's what most Mexican's do on Cinco de mayo. That whole story was ridiculous, because a bunch of young men wanted to start some trouble by being provocative on a non-day. Stupid and totally context dependant.

Originally posted by FlyersFan

Originally posted by theubermensch
I live in Australia ...

Then you, as a foreigner, have no clue as to what Americans do at sporting events.

When we go to Flyers games, at times the crowd will break out in chants of 'USA, USA' during the game. They do this when the Flyers are playing other American teams as well as Canadian teams. They do this even though the players are from many different places ... USA, Canada, Europe ...

Chanting 'USA USA' at a game .. ANY game ... happens in America.
And as I said ... 'USA' isn't a race.

This is so damn stupid ... it's NOT racist.

edit on 3/8/2012 by FlyersFan because: (no reason given)

You saw the video. It was racist.

And if Flyers fans chant USA when they are not playing against a Canadian team then they are strange. Are they retarded or something?

And USA doesnt have to be a race to make what happened racist. It is racist because the other team were hispanic americans. It was a taunt and insult to imply that the hispanic students were not american. How many people have to point that out? As if it isnt crystal clear.

Originally posted by The Old American
If the mostly Latino high school had won and begun chanting "Aztlan! Aztlan!", I wonder if the reaction would've been the same.

/TOA

No, because almost no one knows what that means. Now maybe if they chanted "I didn't cross the border, the border crossed me" or some other slogan.

But if it had, i would hope it would have had the same denouncement, because we need to evaluate things on the same playing field. If they had shouted "Aztlan! Aztlan!" it would have been less splitting hairs, that's for sure.

Originally posted by TKDRL
reply to post by getreadyalready

 

So they were all illegals from mexico or something? Last time I checked, hispanics can be americans....

And the last time I checked, there were racist that will tell any hispanic, legal or not...mexican or not, to go back to where they came from.

Anyone who tries to deny that the intent of this chant wasn't racist is either lying to themselves or is truly clueless.

Originally posted by theubermensch
So you just break out in spontaneous USA USA USA chants that makes no sense in any way?

Originally posted by Esotericizm
What reason was their to start chanting USA, other then the crowd thinking the other team didn't fit into that image?

More foreigners who don't like the way of life in America or our national pride.
I bet ya'll just luv to step on America and scream if we say things about cultures in other countries.
But here in our country we chant 'USA USA' at sporting events ... and you don't give us the
common courtesy to allow for our culture.

tsk tsk and same on you.

Originally posted by nunya13
People dont just start chanting usa in high school football games when playing against an american team. .

YES Americans do. Like I said .. turn on a NASCAR race sometime ... or a Phillies game ...

Originally posted by Sphota
The only purpose of starting that chant (whatever group of students did that) was to highlight the ethnic difference, as though if you weren't pasty white, you weren't a salient Gestalt example of an American.

That's just plain wrong. 1 - You have no way of knowing that. 2 - The fact that 'USA USA' is chanted at games and sporting events all around the country says just the chances of you being correct are very slim.

Originally posted by FlyersFan

Originally posted by theubermensch
I live in Australia ...

Then you, as a foreigner, have no clue as to what Americans do at sporting events.

When we go to Flyers games, at times the crowd will break out in chants of 'USA, USA' during the game. They do this when the Flyers are playing other American teams as well as Canadian teams. They do this even though the players are from many different places ... USA, Canada, Europe ...

Chanting 'USA USA' at a game .. ANY game ... happens in America.
And as I said ... 'USA' isn't a race.

This is so damn stupid ... it's NOT racist.

edit on 3/8/2012 by FlyersFan because: (no reason given)

Hey FlyersFan watch it, us Philly illegal 'ferners gotta keep a lid on it!!

You are exactly right Americans are not a RACE!!
And agree with everybody else: What happened to the 1st Ammendment???

One other thing the name of the school the "offended" attended was THOMAS EDISON H.S. He's an American, right? Why are they not offended by the name of their school?
Maybe it will be changed now to Tomas El Edison H.S.

I give up on this PC Crap!

73's,
Tom

Originally posted by OutKast Searcher
Anyone who tries to deny that the intent of this chant wasn't racist is either lying to themselves or is truly clueless.

Anyone who tries to claim that the intent of this chant was racist, is playing the race card or is truly clueless. Seriously .. you guys have absolutely nothing to stand on. No proof of intent and you ignore the culture of America, that 'USA' is chanted at all sorts of sporting events all the time.

'USA is not a race'. 'USA" chants happen all the time.
You guys are really looking desperate with this one.

reply to post by FlyersFan


Right after the National Anthem?

What does that have to do with the end of the game?

If the US beats Finland in some Winter Olympic event, you would expect to hear "USA, USA, USA!". If two high school teams play each other and one wins (obviously), you would NOT expect to hear "USA, USA, USA!"

When I was in high school I don't recall this chanting.

I do wonder, however, why, as a society, we are so insecure with our tenuous democracy and constitutional rights that we feel the need to chant the name of our nation in unison...

...is it a form of coping mechanism? Kind of like you tell yourself you're not an alcoholic after your first six pack for the day on a Monday morning. Are we trying to tell ourselves we really are FREE, you know, distracting our consciousness from the obvious hypocrisy? ...as the alcoholic would say, "I go to work and get my bills paid...I can stop anytime". The American chants "USA, USA, USA!" and as if by magic we aren't a proto-fascist closing-society with less and less freedoms and more and more police state?

Originally posted by FlyersFan

Originally posted by theubermensch
So you just break out in spontaneous USA USA USA chants that makes no sense in any way?

Originally posted by Esotericizm
What reason was their to start chanting USA, other then the crowd thinking the other team didn't fit into that image?

More foreigners who don't like the way of life in America or our national pride.

I bet ya'll just luv to step on America and scream if we say things about cultures in other countries.
But here in our country we chant 'USA USA' at sporting events ... and you don't give us the
common courtesy to allow for our culture.

tsk tsk and same on you.

Originally posted by nunya13
People dont just start chanting usa in high school football games when playing against an american team. .

YES Americans do. Like I said .. turn on a NASCAR race sometime ... or a Phillies game ...

Originally posted by Sphota
The only purpose of starting that chant (whatever group of students did that) was to highlight the ethnic difference, as though if you weren't pasty white, you weren't a salient Gestalt example of an American.

That's just plain wrong. 1 - You have no way of knowing that. 2 - The fact that 'USA USA' is chanted at games and sporting events all around the country says just the chances of you being correct are very slim.

edit on 3/8/2012 by FlyersFan because: (no reason given)

So its national pride to taunt and insult hispanic americans? It was not some retarded confusing national pride. It was a white community in Texas being racist and you know it. If you want to chant USA for no reason at all then be my guest. Im sure you do it in the shower and while driving. But if it is used to imply that hispanics are not true Americans then its racist.

reply to post by FlyersFan


You're ignoring context. You're the clueless one.

The only distinguishing factor between the two teams was the majority ethnic background.

Cast that with the default notion in this country that a white person you see on the street must be American and you are usually shocked when you hear an accent when they open their mouth.

The inverse is true for non-White, where you are surprised to hear a normal, everyday American accent come out of their mouth.

I've had enough friendships with enough people of different backgrounds to know how they feel when they get asked questions like "Where are you from?"

My friend whose parents are Filipino (one of her grandfathers was actual a US serviceman stationed over there)...she lives in San Francisco and I've been with her when a person asked "Where are you from?" She'll say "San Francisco" and they clarify, "NO, like WHERE are you from?"

No one ever does that to me. No one ever does that to the mostly european-American team in this story.

But to Bill Gutierrez or Mary Benavidez on the "wrong" side of the tracks, who can't speak Spanish any more than I can speak Scots Gaelic are automatically assumed to NOT be from here.

DO YOU REALLY NOT GET THIS?


EDIT: Let me clarify, while I'll be the first person to SHOUT FROM THE ROOFTOPS that American is not a race, you are missing the point. As I just explained above, I, as a European-American (a person of Italian, Irish and French background) have never gotten asked on the street "WHERE ARE YOU FROM?"

However, I have a filipina friend and a Mexican-American friend who speaks worse Spanish than I do and they both have gotten asked that question.

So, are you so sure that the majority of people in this nation really get...I mean, really GET deep down, that if you are not "White" you can still be an American?

Then, with that notion in mind, reevaluate the context of this situation...gotta go make money, keep spending time debating this at your leisure.

reply to post by Nucleardiver

And anything and everything can be made out to be bigotry, racism, etc if someone wants to. Let me ask you this, was the opposing team from Mexico? If it was then an argument could be made that it was bigotry and racism. However the other team was from a nearby school or district so no, it will not work to try and twist the facts around. The other team was, for the most part American citizens regardless of their heritage.

I don't know why you are intentionally pretending to be ignorant over this. It's quite simple.

If the opposing team was from Mexico...a chant of "USA" would have been totally appropriate. It is very common for a crowd to chant "USA" when one team or competitor is from the USA and one is not. It happens all the time in the olympics, in boxing, in UFC, in soccer...any time you have an American team playing another national team. And that is 100% appropriate.

But this opposing team was also from the USA...so when the students from the winning team start chanting "USA"...what are they saying? You know what they are saying, I know it....everyone knows it. They are implying that the white team is the "USA" team...and that hispanic team is "something else". And chanting USA as a victory chant is implying that the "American" team has defeated the "non-American" team.

They did it soley to imply that the other team is somehow non-American.


But maybe you and others truly don't see the racism behind this...because that is one of the biggest issues with racism in America. People don't even recognize when they are being racist...because they see it as acceptable. Which is truly sad.

Originally posted by theubermensch
You saw the video. It was racist.

I saw the video. It was NOT racist.

And if Flyers fans chant USA when they are not playing against a Canadian team then they are strange. Are they retarded or something?

WOW .. you just showed your true colors.
So people who don't act and think like you are 'strange' and 'retarded' eh?
Lovely tolerance for other cultures and countries you have.

Listen up Aussie boy ... we understand that you are a foreigner and therefore don't 'get' things that go on here. However, it has been explained to you that here in the USA we do indeed chant 'USA USA' at all sorts of sporting events. In the USA, instead of chanting against the opposing team all the time, people chant 'USA USA" to show that underneath, we are all together. You can, of course, continue to ignore the facts ... but don't be surprised if no one takes your posts seriously.

Originally posted by OutKast Searcher

Originally posted by TKDRL
reply to post by getreadyalready

 

So they were all illegals from mexico or something? Last time I checked, hispanics can be americans....

And the last time I checked, there were racist that will tell any hispanic, legal or not...mexican or not, to go back to where they came from.

Anyone who tries to deny that the intent of this chant wasn't racist is either lying to themselves or is truly clueless.

...or looking at the circumstantial evidence and only being about to form an opinion since nothing the in the video says why they were chanting "U.S.A.".

Anyone who says it was definitely or was not definitely racism needs to check their ego at the door.

/TOA