Is there a Heaven And Hell ? or the worlds greastest lie?

reply to post by miniatus


Your not understanding what I'm saying sorry, Satan does a lot of his work through the elite, so they are the ones doing the actual handiwork of trying to discredit Christianity. They did that by creating every other religion out there, Buddhism, Mormon, everything. They even have a new one recently, chrislam. They're working overtime to do this. Your right, man did mess with the texts. But hell is real nonetheless. Hell wasn't created by man.

I think your problems lie deeper than on a spiritual level.
Hate is a very strong word and I discourage using it. Look into yourself... I believe you do not hate them, but not on their save wave length.
I do not believe their is anything in our lives to lose it for any cause except for family, even military.

reply to post by WatcherMan


Nope... heaven and hell are metaphors for psychological states.

Most stories are metaphors for the human condition. If people take ANY part of the bible litteraly then theyve been infected with the stupid virus.

reply to post by Wertdagf


stupid virus.

I have to clean my keyboard now. I spewed my drink on it.

In the old testament the word that has been mistranslated into our current definition of hell, actually meant nothing more than "Grave" .. The Jewish people ( Jesus was a Jew.. just saying ) have no belief in a hell, nor did they in the time of Jesus.. Jesus himself had no concept of hell, nor did his followers.. The Jewish faith has no concept of eternal punishent / damnation because they view God as a forgiving God... they believe, and it's part of the old Testament.. that you will be punished in the afterlife.. but that's about it.. there is no eternal damnation, or lake of fire.. there is no Hell ..

Why is this important? .. because those same texts are the basis for the Christian bible.. MEN added onto a mistranslation of a word..expanded greatly this incorrect concept and made it into a thing it never was.

Originally posted by mikelkhall
reply to post by WatcherMan

 

I'm interested to know why you think that God makes man do bad things to each other? I'm not tryin to bash you or anything, just interested. Satan is the one that does this, not God. (respectfully disagreeing) but people blame God.

I understand that you are not bashing and I have no problem with someone questioning my belief or unbelief.

You do realize that it was God that told Abram to sacrifice his own son Issac right? You do realize that it was God that told Moses to kill his own people right?

Exodus 32:26-28 26 Then Moses stood in the gate of the camp, and said, Who is on the Lord’s side? let him come unto me. And all the sons of Levi gathered themselves together unto him. 27 And he said unto them, Thus saith the Lord God of Israel, Put every man his sword by his side, and go in and out from gate to gate throughout the camp, and slay every man his brother, and every man his companion, and every man his neighbour. 28 And the children of Levi did according to the word of Moses: and there fell of the people that day about three thousand men.

Is it your contention now to say that this was not God but Satan that did this?

Ok, this is my last post on this thread cuz it sucks to see that people don't believe in God, and humans can't save people from Hell, only God can, Christians can only do so much.

But to answer your question, you are 100% percent correct. God did tell abraham to sacrifice his son. But you took it out of context unfortunately. He did that to test his faith. See, another thing about God is he sometimes allows satan to let bad things happen in your life so that God can use it to test your faith in Him, but he will never let satan kill you, or let him do such bad things without giving you a way out of it. Abraham didn't end up killing his son, because when God saw that abraham was actually going to do it, he stopped abraham. That allowed abraham and God to trust each other more. And moses wasn't told to kill his own people. He saved from pharoah, you know, the Red sea miracle etc, ten plagues, etc.

not greatest lie:

most transparent population control

=

old useless superstitions which the information age should have released ALL sentient beings from.
















IMHO

Originally posted by WatcherMan
reply to post by miniatus

 

Your not understanding what I'm saying sorry, Satan does a lot of his work through the elite, so they are the ones doing the actual handiwork of trying to discredit Christianity. They did that by creating every other religion out there, Buddhism, Mormon, everything. They even have a new one recently, chrislam. They're working overtime to do this. Your right, man did mess with the texts. But hell is real nonetheless. Hell wasn't created by man.

MANY religions on this planet pre-date Christianity or even the old testament so that to me is kind of a silly thing to say.. Since those other religions are older than your own, you could very well argue that Satan invented Christianity for the purpose you describe..

I still STRONGLY suggest you do some actual research into biblical history.. I have.. I was an ordained, practicing minister long before I was no longer religious .. while I am not religious anymore, I'm still very much a bible scholar in my own right because it's deeply interesting to me... but it's quite frustrating when people don't understand their own religions history, especially the history of the text they worship from.

reply to post by miniatus


And threw in a garbage dump at the edge of the city called Gehenna, that was continually burning, as a real-live place of eternal damnation.

reply to post by Starchild23

controlling the masses through the lies and deceit they have called God, Jesus, Muhammad, How many lives could have been saved if we only knew the absolute truth.

Originally posted by WatcherMan
Your right, man did mess with the texts. But hell is real nonetheless. Hell wasn't created by man.

And again this makes no sense to me.. Hell was never mentioned in the original holy texts, hell is not believed in by the very religion Jesus was a part of.. Hell is not believed in by them to this day.. Hell was written in by man.. yet you still say hell is very real and not man made, while acknowledging man fiddled with the texts.

The fact of the matter is, and I think you just spelled it out .. you want to believe it so much because you were raised on that idea that you can't let it go.. it's burned into you at the core.. despite it never existing in the texts your bible was based on..

That shows you that the authors who expanded that myth, really did exactly what they set out to do .. at least in your case..

For the reasons I spelled out above.. I firmly believe that if you popped into the time of Jesus, walked up to him and asked him about Hell he would not understand what you were talking about.. this concept just wasn't real

And moses wasn't told to kill his own people. He saved from pharoah, you know, the Red sea miracle etc, ten plagues, etc.

Moses wasn't told to kill his own people? What bible are you reading from?

Exodus 32:26-28
26 Then Moses stood in the gate of the camp, and said, Who is on the Lord’s side? let him come unto me. And all the sons of Levi gathered themselves together unto him.
27 And he said unto them, Thus saith the Lord God of Israel, Put every man his sword by his side, and go in and out from gate to gate throughout the camp, and slay every man his brother, and every man his companion, and every man his neighbour.
28 And the children of Levi did according to the word of Moses: and there fell of the people that day about three thousand men.

This was Moses and his brother had just forged a bull out of gold for the people to worship cause Moses was gone to long talking with God. When Moses got back he was really pissed off.

This was done in the name of the God he was just talking to. So now you are going to say that Moses was wrong and he was wrong for killing all those other ...ites out there also cause God didn't order it? It was done in the name of God and evidently this god liked it cause he supposedly kept taking care of these murders while they were running around blind in the wilderness.

Originally posted by miniatus

Originally posted by WatcherMan
reply to post by miniatus

 

Your not understanding what I'm saying sorry.... but it's quite frustrating when people don't understand their own religions history, especially the history of the text they worship from.

They don't understand the text because nobody can understand the disjointed gibberish, most people have a religious sentiment (feeling) they then use the words of their religion to conform with their own personal interpretation of religion if they are so minded.

To be clear: I believe religion is for weak minded individuals too scared to catch the fact that we are all biological entities with a limited shelf life. The ultimate arrogance is to believe you are going to live forever, the hilarious aspect is using an irrational belief in somebody else's purpoted belief structure (read population control) to cure your night fears!

Originally posted by miniatus
For the reasons I spelled out above.. I firmly believe that if you popped into the time of Jesus, walked up to him and asked him about Hell he would not understand what you were talking about.. this concept just wasn't real

*************ISNT*************** REAL

reply to post by WatcherMan
If our so called god wants to test our faith by murder how is that a god you can worship. its a travesty that our world is surrounded by religions that will sacrifice morality in the name of god

For those interested in research and figuring it out own your own.. research the Tanakh which is the ORIGINAL texts that were later translated into the Christian old testament ( with many errors mind you ) and then was the foundation for modern bibles..

There's no hell in the source material .. so, there's no hell.

Originally posted by spacedonk

Originally posted by miniatus
For the reasons I spelled out above.. I firmly believe that if you popped into the time of Jesus, walked up to him and asked him about Hell he would not understand what you were talking about.. this concept just wasn't real

*************ISNT*************** REAL

I'm iffy on the existence of Jesus, I believe he did exist as a man .. there's some archeological evidence I find compelling.. but I think he was just that, a man .. I believe there is a LOT of myth surrounding him .. including his date of birth, location of birth and most details of his life.. I think ultimately we know very little about the real life of Jesus.. but yes I have to confess .. other than some compelling finds, there's no direct evidence he existed that is definitive. That, however isn't the topic at hand

reply to post by WatcherMan


How can I trust you, tell me have you ever been to heaven or hell, has life gifted you given you knowledge of a great unforgiving god that basically left me an orphan. Tell me why Religion destroyed my family tell me why.

Originally posted by WatcherMan

Originally posted by mikelkhall
reply to post by WatcherMan

 

I'm interested to know why you think that God makes man do bad things to each other? I'm not tryin to bash you or anything, just interested. Satan is the one that does this, not God. (respectfully disagreeing) but people blame God.

I understand that you are not bashing and I have no problem with someone questioning my belief or unbelief.

You do realize that it was God that told Abram to sacrifice his own son Issac right? You do realize that it was God that told Moses to kill his own people right?

Exodus 32:26-28 26 Then Moses stood in the gate of the camp, and said, Who is on the Lord’s side? let him come unto me. And all the sons of Levi gathered themselves together unto him. 27 And he said unto them, Thus saith the Lord God of Israel, Put every man his sword by his side, and go in and out from gate to gate throughout the camp, and slay every man his brother, and every man his companion, and every man his neighbour. 28 And the children of Levi did according to the word of Moses: and there fell of the people that day about three thousand men.

Is it your contention now to say that this was not God but Satan that did this?

Ok, this is my last post on this thread cuz it sucks to see that people don't believe in God, and humans can't save people from Hell, only God can, Christians can only do so much.

But to answer your question, you are 100% percent correct. God did tell abraham to sacrifice his son. But you took it out of context unfortunately. He did that to test his faith. See, another thing about God is he sometimes allows satan to let bad things happen in your life so that God can use it to test your faith in Him, but he will never let satan kill you, or let him do such bad things without giving you a way out of it. Abraham didn't end up killing his son, because when God saw that abraham was actually going to do it, he stopped abraham. That allowed abraham and God to trust each other more. And moses wasn't told to kill his own people. He saved from pharoah, you know, the Red sea miracle etc, ten plagues, etc.

edit on 6-3-2012 by WatcherMan because: (no reason given)

***********HEADDESK******HEADDESK****HEADDESK*********

Thank you Leigh Butler for this turn of utter frustration cos OMG this just makes me want to headdesk.

So if some alien wanted me to test my utter blind faith to him by sacrificing one of my sons I shoul?!?

Screw you, screw him and both your crazy arguments