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Infant's death at Maimonides Hospital linked to circumcision

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posted on Mar, 4 2012 @ 06:10 PM
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Infant's death at Maimonides Hospital linked to circumcision


www.nydailynews.com

A two-week old boy died at a Brooklyn hospital in September after contracting herpes through a religious circumcision ritual that ignited controversy in 2005 after another infant died, the Daily News has learned.

The unidentified infant died Sept. 28, 2011, at Maimonides Hospital, according to a spokeswoman for the city Medical Examiner, who confirmed the death after a News inquiry.

The cause of death was listed as “disseminated herpes simplex virus Type 1, complicating ritual circumcision with oral suction.”

City officials declined to comment Friday.
(visit the link for the full news article)


Related News Links:
www.circumstitions.com
www.jta.org
edit on 4-3-2012 by el1jah because: (no reason given)




posted on Mar, 4 2012 @ 06:10 PM
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I cant tell if I am more sad or outraged - This is not the first, and unfortunately won't be the last death related to this barbaric tradition. I dont need to go over my opinion on the subject of circumcision, what I think is important is analysing the act of mutilation on an innocent child. If an adult wants to change their gender, pierce their nipples, tattoo their testes, I could not care less. But when we allow our traditions to put a child in potential danger... something is seriously wrong.



www.nydailynews.com
(visit the link for the full news article)

Here is a link to a thread from 2005 related to the death in 2004- Rabbi gave herpes to babies in NYC
edit on 4-3-2012 by el1jah because: (no reason given)


Here is a chart from one of the sources- look at the ratio.



And here is an up to date list - source


edit on 4-3-2012 by el1jah because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 4 2012 @ 06:19 PM
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The cause of death was listed as “disseminated herpes simplex virus Type 1, complicating ritual circumcision with oral suction.”


WTF is oral suction?????

Are they saying this kid got herpes directly from a person and not unsanitary instruments?

Sorry but the link isnt working for me and I cant read the article but right now I have a picture in my head of some pervy Rabbi going round felating babys then cutting a piece off to keep as a souvenir



posted on Mar, 4 2012 @ 06:23 PM
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Herpes? Oral suctions?? HUH??!

People REALLY need to think twice before having their child worked-on by anyone of religious affiliation...

Talk about child abuse.



posted on Mar, 4 2012 @ 06:25 PM
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reply to post by IkNOwSTuff
 


I just checked all the sources they work for me.

This is a quote from the Jewish news source

The controversy was sparked when an infant died from herpes after undergoing metzitzah b’peh. The infant’s twin also was infected with herpes. Another child circumcised the previous year by the same mohel also had contracted herpes. The mohel in question disputed the notion that he had caused the herpes infections.


So in this case it seems like they were using unsanitary tools since they both got the disease. But its not just herpes, general infection, bleeding to death, urine blockage (causing infection) the list of possible complications is long.

Can anyone clarify what credentials one must have to perform a circumcision. I hope the Rabbi is medically trained or a doctor actually performs the cut.

EDIT: The person who performs the circumcision is called a Mohel- source

Many mohelim are doctors or rabbis (and some are both) or cantors. However, all are required to receive appropriate training both from the religious and medical fields.


edit on 4-3-2012 by el1jah because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 4 2012 @ 06:33 PM
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Originally posted by IkNOwSTuff



The cause of death was listed as “disseminated herpes simplex virus Type 1, complicating ritual circumcision with oral suction.”


WTF is oral suction?????

Are they saying this kid got herpes directly from a person and not unsanitary instruments?

Sorry but the link isnt working for me and I cant read the article but right now I have a picture in my head of some pervy Rabbi going round felating babys then cutting a piece off to keep as a souvenir


I was about to ask the same question even though i did read those links. WTF


News of the death comes more than half a decade after a public controversy broke out in New York City over the practice among haredi Orthodox Jews of metzitzah b’peh, which traditionally involves a mohel orally suctioning blood from a circumcision wound.


First, what/who is a mohel?
Second, what do they mean by suctioning blood from wound? I mean, i think i know what it means but i cannot believe there are people out there doing it in the name of religion.

And last question, do they circumcise all little boys in America ? Is that 'the normal' thing to do?

This story is so wrong on so many levels, unbelievable



posted on Mar, 4 2012 @ 06:39 PM
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reply to post by Exitt
 


A Mohel- wiki

And no not everyone in America is circumsized, its just sold to parents that its healthier and cleaner and all that good stuff. I live in Canada, many of the people I know have been cut. My mom told me when I was born they were told the same bit about it being healthy and there being a lower chance of infection yatta yatta. She said she thought it was a good idea but my dad said they are ridiculous to think the body was not made perfect as it is. So i still got my trunk

edit on 4-3-2012 by el1jah because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 4 2012 @ 06:55 PM
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reply to post by el1jah
 


Tnx for the wiki, unfortunately i have now learned there are men who basically perform oral insert whatever word makes you more comfortable on baby boys in some kind of religious ritual with the approval of baby's parents



and btw. your dad is cool, i also wouldn't let anyone touch my son (or daughter, but that's another topic)



posted on Mar, 4 2012 @ 06:56 PM
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I don't know but it sounds like this guy is practicing his suction on more than infants.

So he basically sucks the blood off of a baby's penis?!? Why would you even apply for that job?



posted on Mar, 4 2012 @ 06:56 PM
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reply to post by el1jah
 

Wow... I'd heard about this ritual. Very disturbing.
So, GOD says, "Cut the foreskin and suck the blood off with your mouth?". Really?! I seriously doubt it.



posted on Mar, 4 2012 @ 07:34 PM
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Originally posted by wrkn4livn
reply to post by el1jah
 

Wow... I'd heard about this ritual. Very disturbing.
So, GOD says, "Cut the foreskin and suck the blood off with your mouth?". Really?! I seriously doubt it.



Where did I say they use their mouth? I think by orally they mean with a tool of some.....oh god I really hope they dont.... AHHH



posted on Mar, 4 2012 @ 07:35 PM
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reply to post by Exitt
 


My dad is pretty darn cool- Straight headed. He's also very religious but he believes in aliens and ufo- cooky.



posted on Mar, 4 2012 @ 07:43 PM
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Well this is terrifying. My friend sends me information about this all the time, but I never saw one where anything was contracted! Terrible. It is wrong when it's done to women and just as wrong for men. If someone chooses to do it of their own free will when they are grown, then fine, but parents who force this on their children should educate themselves quick. Watch what actually happens during the surgery and you won't think twice about why this is wrong.


Because of the age of the children when it's done, they are usually fully awake. Obviously no general anesthetic. In many countries they will just have someone hold the child down while it's done, so the movement from the child flailing about can be really dangerous. Not to mention what the 'doctors' have to do to perform the surgeries. If you ask me, it's definitely a sex crime.
edit on 3/4/2012 by SpaceJ because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 4 2012 @ 07:49 PM
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reply to post by SpaceJ
 


I dont know it I would call it a sex crime, but it is definately criminal, and wreckless. I was reading about an infant in london who died from shock, basically there is a risk of death from 'shock' when there is a lot of bleeding (which is not exactly common, but common enough) Basically they lose so much blood their body goes into shock and just dies.... I cant find a source.

I dunno in my mind its like I started a religion, that cuts the tip of the tongue of a child, sure there is a risk, but hey they can still talk and its for the greater good of tradition. . . . insanity!



posted on Mar, 4 2012 @ 08:08 PM
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I would call it a sex crime the nydaily link says that he removes the blood from the wound with his mouth it is NOT the tools giving them herpes it is his saliva. This is disgusting and barbaric. I was circumcised in a hospital and it is very common in america and not dangerous if properly performed.



posted on Mar, 4 2012 @ 08:17 PM
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reply to post by el1jah
 


I say sex crime for how they must be touched in order to perform the surgery.

In order to perform the surgery they have to repeatedly stimulate the children with their hands in order to be able to make a clean cut. So imagine being cut there and being in extreme pain, and some doctor is using their hands on you to make you stay stimulated throughout. So they cut a little part, use their hands for a while, cut again, hands again, so on until it's finished. Messsssssed up.

***To clarify, I only know they do this on older children. Not sure about infants. But this^ is common practice in a lot of countries that are much more lax about this, I've seen it with my eyes and wish I could erase it from memory, believe me.
edit on 3/4/2012 by SpaceJ because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 4 2012 @ 08:49 PM
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reply to post by el1jah
 


The words oral suction, means using the mouth to suck. Yeah sounds pretty wrong on many levels to me. Mutilate, then someone sucks on their blood.
edit on Sun, 04 Mar 2012 20:52:00 -0600 by TKDRL because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 4 2012 @ 09:12 PM
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I've seen some youtube videos describing this act. I believe the Jews do it as part of their religious tradition. In the US circumcision without any Rabbi using his mouth was common back in the 1960's. Today if the youtube video I watched is correct, it is no longer routinely done on most male infants and is not reinbursed by insurance. Most males are left intact the way God intended them to be in my opinion. I heard in Africa circumcision has made a comeback as a way to prevent aids but I heard those studies were flawed and there is no medical agency in the world that I know of that says the procedure is medically necessarily as a routine operation.

I also heard the procedure (without anyone doing the Rabbi sucking thing) was routinely started in the US (as far as the US is concerned) back in the 1800's by the Puritans because they thought self stimulation was bad so they starting cutting off skin with over 40,000 nerve endings. Then big business took over profiting from it. I heard with female circumcision only skin with 20 some thousand nerve endings gets cut off and that practice was banned long ago in the US. Basically as someone put it, it's like routinely cutting off an infants eyelid because of tradition. If someone started a new tradition like that now, there would be a tremendous outcry about it but people defend old traditions.
my two cents.



posted on Mar, 4 2012 @ 09:27 PM
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I thought Jews were forbidden to eat blood. Where in the Torah does it say to use this procedure to circumcise babies?



posted on Mar, 4 2012 @ 09:53 PM
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reply to post by lostinspace
 


From what I've seen visiting these sites, there is nothing written about the specifics of the procedure, so they have developed their own methods.

sorry I cant wrap my mind around their deciding to do this orally.... seriously anyone able to clear this up - Im not willing to accept this is common practice.
edit on 4-3-2012 by el1jah because: (no reason given)



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