Apology to the members of ATS (including member John Lear)

I know I will regret this, but here goes.... SkepticOverlord you seem to be apologizing for making some kind of mistake, there seems to be no mistake here. I think your apology should be exclusively for the way in which you attacked JL.

Originally posted by SkepticOverlord


You are presenting them as truth. You are engaging in what appears to be an organized deception of the members of this website community. We do not take kindly to that.

A post is a kind of presentation is it not? Well, at the end of JL's post was this:

Originally posted by johnlear

And finally, remember that my statements are opinion of what I believe to be true. They are not knowingly false or intended to mislead the membership of ATS.

[edit on 19-9-2004 by Regulator]

Originally posted by SkepticOverlord
There has been a great deal of discussion about this thread, Q&A With John Lear, especially what transpired on page11. I and the senior staff want to express our apologies for a bumbled handling of this event on ATS.

We bumbled it. Plain and simple.

1- We should have confirmed our satisfaction with his identity before making this thread "seem" like it was a sanctioned ATS interview.
2- We should have expressed our doubts about his ideas more clearly, more sooner, and in a less confrontational tone.
3- We should have communicated the need to be careful of big-quotes and one-line responses sooner (though we would have offered leniency upon confirmed identity).
4- We should have taken a more leadership role in controlling the participation of a potential guest speaker (not from a debunking or content standpoint, but in helping him to better deal with the volume of questions and efficient responses).

You should know we realize it turned bad, and we recognize that it did so, and are sincerely sorry that it occurred the way it did.


A few senior staff members have some direct and first-hand experience with the subject matter. Unfortunately, due to busy schedules, we were not able to be active in confirming Mr. Lear's identity, helping manage the thread flow, helping Mr. Lear cope with his participation, and participating in questions in a timely way as the thread first began. With such a potentially important figure to the UFO/ET community, we should have either made the time, or postponed his involvement until we could devote the time.


Our goal has been, and always will be the relentless search for the truth, no matter what form it takes. While you may disagree with what we say, or the way we say it, I hope that the mere fact that this situation has not been "brushed under the carpet" shows our sincerity in that search.


From this, we have learned, and In the future things will be different...

Senior staff will moderate the flow, not the subject matter of guest speakers. This is what should have happened, and this is what will happen. If a senior ATS staff member has prior "issues" with a given guest speaker, they will participate in the guest discussion as a regular member.


We've learned from this, and have taken policy steps to ensure that any future events with a guest speaker will be different. There are several ways we can assist a guest speaker's participation, and the appropriate methods should be established before the thread begins.


Thank you. The admin and super-mods of ATS.



(typo edit)

[edit on 20-9-2004 by SkepticOverlord]

Accepted, and respected.

SkepticOverlord-I sincerely appreciate your apology and it is humbly accepted. I, too, made some mistakes and hopefully we both learned so we can press on with patience and understanding in the quest for knowledge. It takes a very large man to post what you did and I express my appreciation to you and the senior staff.

John Lear

I am hugely impressed by your humility SO. Whether or not it was necessary is entirely irrelevant, the fact that you unequivocally humbled yourself when you yourself felt you were wrong is an amazing and admirable trait.


EDIT- Kudos to John Lear as well. It was SO's feedback request that brought this thread to my attention and probably many others. All's well that ends well. The only thing about you that I have fully made up my mind about is that you are fascinating.

[edit on 19-9-2004 by deevee]

Very nice apology SO. I think we all can learn from this experience. I know I have and I will try and watch my tongue...err...attitude in the future. Nice to see John Lear respond too. Kudos to both of you.

You two should kiss and make up now,,,



Hahahah!




[edit on 19-9-2004 by Seth76]

John you are showing a lot of class by accepting this apology and vowing to �press on with patience and understanding in the quest for knowledge�. I appreciate you and the research you have accumulated over the years and I look forward to hearing about more of your theories. After all we are all here for the same thing.

Originally posted by kinglizard
This is exactly why I stay here at ATS. The administration and super-moderators of this site made some mistakes and rather than sweeping them under the carpet they asked the members of this board their feelings on what happened and how they felt things were handled. They took in responses and are now taking action to ensure that we don�t repeat these mistakes in the future. What more can you ask.

Well done SkepticOverlord! You�ve shown enormous class in your actions.

I fully agree....Well done, SO!

Originally posted by johnlear
SkepticOverlord-I sincerely appreciate your apology and it is humbly accepted. I, too, made some mistakes and hopefully we both learned so we can press on with patience and understanding in the quest for knowledge. It takes a very large man to post what you did and I express my appreciation to you and the senior staff.

John Lear

Now, John.... On the matter of your assertions...

Welcome aboard.

Originally posted by johnlear
SkepticOverlord-I sincerely appreciate your apology and it is humbly accepted. I, too, made some mistakes and hopefully we both learned so we can press on with patience and understanding in the quest for knowledge. It takes a very large man to post what you did and I express my appreciation to you and the senior staff.

John Lear

John good to see you're back. Looking forward to reading your thoughts.

John,

I am glad you have been able to post those moon photos and other things from a URL, instead of from the ATS members file system. I still have not figured out why your image did not go through, but perhaps ATS help guys could explain whatever the hitch was just for your information. I had no doubts about you, because I have read your authorship before, and each person has an idiograph, a way of speaking, so I was entirely comfortable. An imitator could not have fooled me, even by quoting you verbatim. The transitions would not have been the same.

Let me say also thanks for being you, and making me and others comfortable, while expressing your sometimes speculative concepts. Further elaboration for our understanding surely is a "leap of faith," while filling in the gaps for commensurate proofs or at least a greater level of certainty as the narrative proceeds. I am hopeful that you might continue say another brand new Q&A, once you confer with the ATS guys if necessary and everyone feels comfortable with whatever you would want to proceed.

Before this administrative dialogue happened I wanted to find what you might have to say about more friendly cultures in the universe, whether most that have to deal with us are highly advanced technologically but moral and philosophical insectoids. Are there balanced civilizations in the universe that might have commensurate political science, a tremendous gap that our planet is now experiencing? It would be a terrible universe if most civilizations were simply greedly self serving utilitarians, rather than philosophers with all that high technology.

Thanks,

SkipShipman

Comment: Thanks to our ATS administrators for where we are right now, quite hopefully reconciled for the future on how to flow a bit better on personal situations with a greater level of grace. As a good friend once told me, "you gotta be gentle on people." In other words if people are confrontational , "a soft answer turns away wrath." While that alone may not accomplish miracles every time, it is a good start.

[edit on 19-9-2004 by SkipShipman]

I didn't even know we had such a UFO-celebrity amongst us! This is the first news of this other thread that I've heard of...

As the rest have said, good job SO...I think it's only natural to question things though, but it's always good to know I'm amongst people who actually care and think about what they say and can equally express when they're in doubt of prior convictions...Of course SO quite often is the only one who gets the credit - and while it is most definantly due, I salute the rest of the ATS staff on maintaing an awesome forum environment that cannot be matched elsewhere

This is one of the things I like about this board - it is run with class -- don't know many mods or list owners who would make a public apology like this. And John it shows something about you also that you are back and accepting the apology. Kudos to all involved.

jm

Do ya feel the love???

I'm all tingly inside, lol.

I definitely feel better now that everyone made nice.

Rokgodes

I don't see the need for an apology, really.

Fiction is fiction, opinion is just that, and if you state a fact, back it up.

Otherwise, you're wasting valuable reading time that could be devoted to valid conspiracy and truth-seeking.

It's ok, Skeptic. I still

Well done... I had a feeling it would come to this, on following that thread, and I'm glad to see it borne out... It was a bit over the top, but it takes a big man to admit that...as well as a big man to accept the apology. Well done all....

Now that is what I am talking about

This is what make a good forum a GREAT forum.
Skeptic Overlord I commend your action's

Now on to finding the real truth!

And as said by (Eric Cartman) "I WAS NOT ANAL PROBED" lol

J/k

Yes, as everyone has said, it takes a big man to apologise.

But I am extremely disappointed after doing a great deal of reading on John Lear last week and over the weekend, that I have lost the opportunity to ask some questions.

I did not want to dive-in in ignorance.

I have to admit I was surprised to see SO behave in the manner that he did, given that John Lear re-iterated on numerous occasions that these were theories and opinions. And as always each member is more than capable of using Google if they want to find out more regarding John Lear or any other questionable subject, if they should so choose.

I accept the apology, but remain extremely disappointed.

I'm always too late....

Hey John if your're still reading this....I know... you know this fellow


And as a fellow Pahrumpian I'm saying hello from 'The Kingdom of Nye' what a pleasure,,,, it is to have you on here.

Art took this picture of the Monsoons.......



S.O. your forgiven as long, as John has forgiven you.