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I am slightly confused. Looking for Info

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posted on Feb, 28 2012 @ 02:22 PM
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reply to post by Thisbseth
 


thank you...i believe the proof is in the eyes of the beholders. those who believe they are bunk have their proof; while those whom believe they are a reality believe believe in their proof as well. i just hope this thread can bring an extensive list of sources on both sides of the argument for those whom wish to research all of the information on this topic we can




posted on Feb, 28 2012 @ 02:23 PM
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Originally posted by Uncinus
If there's no difference between chemtrails and contrails, then what's there to believe in?


Well, for instance what do you think this depiction is...contrail or chemtail?

"Chemtrails"....or Con trails?



Image taken from about 4:20 into the video.

www.youtube.com...

Oh, wait! You just said there is no difference.



posted on Feb, 28 2012 @ 02:24 PM
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reply to post by ThirdRock69
 


oh for sure. i do also have video thought of upwards from 18-35 lines in a checkerboard pattern across the entire sky, for multiple days lol



posted on Feb, 28 2012 @ 02:28 PM
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reply to post by Aloysius the Gaul
 





the lack of evidence for them requires no fantasy either.


There is no lack of evidence. The thousands of of documents and videos are all evidence.

There is only a lack of 100% undeniable, irrefutable proof.



posted on Feb, 28 2012 @ 02:29 PM
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reply to post by Aloysius the Gaul
 


id have to respectfully disagree. however, if you truly believed in your example, i would support your theory and help provide insight and help you expand and elaborate on your idea. not shut it down. if you limit the possibilities in reality, then you limit the abilities of the mind. i believe i heard before that a scientific mind was an inquisitive mind. to me that meant, ask questions and question the norm. do not single tract my mind to a limited capacity for academic acceptance, but ever expand and seek new realities. who am i though right lol



posted on Feb, 28 2012 @ 02:32 PM
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reply to post by burntheships
 


loll, good post. thanks for the video



posted on Feb, 28 2012 @ 02:35 PM
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Originally posted by Uncinus
If there's no difference between chemtrails and contrails, then what's there to believe in?


There is a difference. Normal contrails are not intentionally made and they do not persist and spread in the same way that chemtrails do.

The belief (or more accurately put) the theory is that the method in which chemtrails are made by either injecting a substance into the hot exhaust coming from the jet engines or that an additive in mixed into the fuel system at a certain location in flight.



posted on Feb, 28 2012 @ 02:38 PM
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Originally posted by ThirdRock69
There is a difference. Normal contrails are not intentionally made and they do not persist and spread in the same way that chemtrails do.


OK - I can buy that.

So what is the difference?



posted on Feb, 28 2012 @ 02:39 PM
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Your very welcome.


Originally posted by JAsay1LOVE
i just hope this thread can bring an extensive list of sources on both sides of the argument for those whom wish to research all of the information on this topic we can


I found it helpful in disucssions to understand the "terms" that are commonly used
by the professionals in the industry. This is helpful in many ways; in discussion
and also for research.

Just for starters....
The professional term for "chemtrails" is Solar Radiation Management - SRM for short.

Solar Radiation Management is a term commonly used by Governments worldwide
describing essentially "chemtrails". SRM is the process of adding sulfate aerosols to
the atmosphere, or other particulate matter as a means of a "sun shade".

Under the broader term of Geoengineering....

The video I posted is an example of just that, Govenments using sulfate aerosols
under the guise of SRM....for the good of humanity.

Edward Teller is often referred to as the mastermind behind the particulate matter
that can be used for SRM....his research papers can be found here:

www.geoengineeringwatch.org...

Further mentions of Tellers research here:
www.etcgroup.org...

And the concept of the Space Shade can be found here, on Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org...


edit on 28-2-2012 by burntheships because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 28 2012 @ 02:50 PM
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Originally posted by burntheships
Your very welcome.


Originally posted by JAsay1LOVE
i just hope this thread can bring an extensive list of sources on both sides of the argument for those whom wish to research all of the information on this topic we can


I found it helpful in disucssions to understand the "terms" that are commonly used
by the professionals in the industry. This is helpful in many ways; in discussion
and also for research.

Just for starters....
The professional term for "chemtrails" is Solar Radiation Management - SRM for short.


No it isn't - see below


Solar Radiation Management is a term commonly used by Governments worldwide
describing essentially "chemtrails". SRM is the process of adding sulfate aerosols to
the atmosphere, or other particulate matter as a means of a "sun shade".


The process of adding sulphates or something else to the atmosphere to block solar radiation is ONE possible method of SRM - but it is not the only one proposed.

Others include "cool roofs", grasslands management, space mirrors, fertilising the ocean to increase cloud albedo, using aluminised hydrogen filled balloon reflectors, forestry, and others.

Wiki page on SRM


edit on 28-2-2012 by Aloysius the Gaul because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 28 2012 @ 02:50 PM
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reply to post by JAsay1LOVE
 


after reading through this thread, I am not quite sure what your definition of a chemtrail is.

Believe it or not, there are as many different ideas of what they are as there are believers.



posted on Feb, 28 2012 @ 03:01 PM
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Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul

The process of adding sulphates or something else to the atmosphere to block solar radiation is ONE possible method of SRM - but it is not the only one proposed.


Oh, Gaul, silly :shk: dont think I dont know that. There are very many methods of SRM.....yes of course.
You know you have seen my lengthy threads on the matter. You know, like the last one
on Bill Gates, and his financing of the SRM schemes.

You know, one of the methods is adding sulfate to the fuel of aircraft, in addition to other particulate
matter, like nano aluminum particles, with barium.

But here, we can see the research papers on adding the sulfates to the fuel.



Efficient formation of stratospheric aerosol for climate engineering by emission
of condensible vapor from aircraft

Jeffrey R. Pierce
Department of Physics and Atmospheric Science, Dalhousie University, Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada
www.agu.org...



posted on Feb, 28 2012 @ 03:06 PM
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reply to post by network dude
 


good call, i should clarify...what i mean by the term "chemtrail"-

a trail left from a plane, through deliberate dumping, or through the exhaust, that consists of toxic chemicals. toxic in terms of detrimental to the health and well being of all types of life on Earth, specifically plant and animal life. i have no fancy to whether the chemicals are distributed for humanitarian purposes or depopulation nwo theories. when i see fat lines that stretch from east horizon to west and last for several hours, and only eventually dissipate out into hazy clouds and cover the sky- that is a "chemtrail" in my mind



posted on Feb, 28 2012 @ 03:08 PM
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Originally posted by burntheships

Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul

The process of adding sulphates or something else to the atmosphere to block solar radiation is ONE possible method of SRM - but it is not the only one proposed.


Oh, Gaul, silly :shk: dont think I dont know that. There are very many methods of SRM.....yes of course.
You know you have seen my lengthy threads on the matter. You know, like the last one
on Bill Gates, and his financing of the SRM schemes.

You know, one of the methods is adding sulfate to the fuel of aircraft, in addition to other particulate
matter, like nano aluminum particles, with barium.

But here, we can see the research papers on adding the sulfates to the fuel.



Efficient formation of stratospheric aerosol for climate engineering by emission
of condensible vapor from aircraft

Jeffrey R. Pierce
Department of Physics and Atmospheric Science, Dalhousie University, Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada
www.agu.org...


he knew what you meant, i have only briefly read a very small amount on SRMs and even I knew there where multiple methods lol. but just because one can take 7 different roads home from work, doesnt mean 1 is any less realistic than the others



posted on Feb, 28 2012 @ 03:16 PM
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reply to post by JAsay1LOVE
 


Yes, exactly.


And its shown that delivery by aircraft is very cost effective in SRM and aerosol
delivery. For example here, this talking head gal Jane C.S. Long...from Lawrence Livermore labs
estimates that to cool the entire planet, it would only be about a billion dollars.

What a real value deal.
"The Ships have been designed"..... "A Fleet of airplanes the size of SW Airlines."



www.youtube.com...
edit on 28-2-2012 by burntheships because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 28 2012 @ 03:20 PM
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Originally posted by burntheships
reply to post by JAsay1LOVE
 


Yes, exactly.


And its shown that delivery by aircraft is very cost effective in SRM and aerosol
delivery. For example here, this talking head gal Jane C.S. Long...from Lawrence Livermore labs
estimates that to cool the entire planet, it would only be about a billion dollars.

What a real value deal.
The Ships have been designed"..... "A Fleet of airplanes the size of SW Airlines."


Are you suggesting that someone has actually been doing this for the last ten years? Because every scientist I've ever heard talking about geoengineering is talking about doing it in the future, at least a decade in the future, usually more.
edit on 28-2-2012 by Uncinus because: removed vid



posted on Feb, 28 2012 @ 03:27 PM
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Originally posted by burntheships

Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul

The process of adding sulphates or something else to the atmosphere to block solar radiation is ONE possible method of SRM - but it is not the only one proposed.


Oh, Gaul, silly :shk: dont think I dont know that. There are very many methods of SRM.....yes of course.


So why get huffy about me pointing it out?



You know, one of the methods is adding sulfate to the fuel of aircraft, in addition to other particulate
matter, like nano aluminum particles, with barium.


I know of nothing suggesting adding particuilate matter to fuel of aircraft at all.

And AFAIK adding sulfur to fuel is a suggestion - not something that is actually happening yet. It would be easy to establish that it is happening of course - just go get a sample of fuel and measure the sulfur content - there is no need to suggest that it is happening when you could so easily prove it.


But here, we can see the research papers on adding the sulfates to the fuel.



Efficient formation of stratospheric aerosol for climate engineering by emission
of condensible vapor from aircraft

Jeffrey R. Pierce
Department of Physics and Atmospheric Science, Dalhousie University, Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada
www.agu.org...[


Yep - there's lots of evidence of research - well done.
edit on 28-2-2012 by Aloysius the Gaul because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 28 2012 @ 03:29 PM
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reply to post by Uncinus
 


Am I suggesting that? I dont see anything I have posted that says that, do you?

:shk:

However, thats not to say that it hasnt been going on for ten years. I dont know,
you dont have any proof that it hasnt do you? And I dont have any "proof' that it has.

What I have posted are scientists advocating "chemtrailing" or SRM as its professional
term is used by the Governments, and inventions of methods of SRM delivery.

Take for instance this company out of Nevada. Desert Research Institute.
They have a method of Modification of Cirrus clouds to reduce global warming

I dont know, would that be "chemtrails" or Con trails?

edit on 28-2-2012 by burntheships because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 28 2012 @ 03:31 PM
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reply to post by JAsay1LOVE
 


Thanks for the clarification. So in understanding your definition, (please correct me if I am wrong) you believe that persistent contrails aren't real, they are actually chemtrails?

And just for the record, I don't like the government, but I also don't believe in chemtrails to the extent of ATS believers.



posted on Feb, 28 2012 @ 03:33 PM
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Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul
there is no need to suggest that it is happening when you could so easily prove it.



Gaul, please dont tell me what I can and cant say here. I see that this is a forum
on Geoengineering, and I am well aware that I can suggest it could be happening.

You could prove its not happening as well, please feel free to test the fuel,
as you have suggested. I would think since you thought of it, you might want to do it.





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