The 99% Spring... Get ready for it... The previous antics were just a test for the big call

reply to post by woodwardjnr


I really hope that's sarcasm.
lol

reply to post by Kali74


Just curious...as the only one in this thread that is part of "occupy"...is this 99% Spring part of OWS?

To me...this looks like the hijacking that OWS was fearing all along.

I think on the surface so far...I am actually in support of this "99% Spring"...it's still early and not much information...but this looks like a Democrat re-election campaign.

UAW, MoveOn, SEIU, Greenpeace, United Steel Workers...etc. This is the liberal movement's base...this may turn out to be a real movement to push realistic ideas and help elect democrats.


I'm just a bit surprised that you seem to be in support of it, because you seemed very opposed to any type of involvement of groups like this with Occupy.

reply to post by Wrabbit2000


But those 330+ million are hardly individual people. I think we should be optimistic that at least some people are voicing their concern rather than sitting behind screens and blogging about their outrage. Any action is better than no action.

If we allow the evil and corruption to run rampant, we will be left with only ourselves to blame. And so with heads down we'll be left to ask ourselves, "how did we let this happen?"

I'm glad at least some people people are expressing their outrage, even though I don't agree with all of their actions and think most of them are really ignorant of actual issues, let alone actual solutions.

reply to post by jibeho

Tell the story of our economy: how we got here, who’s responsible, what a different future could look like, and what we can do about it

Who wants to bet it's gonna be : the republicans did it! Bush is responsible! Different future : Rainbows pooping unicorns! What we can do about it : march peacefully around and play drums all day and do camping in the city! Yeah that'll change things! Also reelect Obama!

Learn the history of non-violent direct action, and
Get into action on our own campaigns to win change.

Non violent direct action doesn't work against tyrants unless you have a deterrent behind it.

Know how NATO defeated the Soviet Union without nuclear war and stopped them for invading countries all over? Not by peacefully protesting at the UN... but by doing hard diplomacy with nukes backing behind it.

The banksters, just like the Soviet Union back then, needs to FEAR the people. To keep them in line they need to know that if they cross anyone, they'll go to prison. Until that is achieved, forget it.

Stay within the law : don't get destroyed.
Screw us over : get destroyed.

Right now it's :
Stay within the law : alrighty.
Screw us over : alrighty + massive profits + nobody goes to jail.

Non violent direct action is POSSIBLE if you have a credible OR ELSE option.

reply to post by Vitchilo


Well in a violence scenario the issue of funding comes into play; the rich can afford to hire bodyguards, mercenaries, even private armies in some cases. The public can take their guns and fight, but most would rather not risk life and death and live below less-than-desirable means.

reply to post by DestroyDestroyDestroy


If it comes to violence, a lot of people will fight for free.

The rich will flee. The economy will collapse and the banksters will win. Cops will get killed, civilians will get killed ... for what... for nothing.

Violence is BS. What should happen is a military force of patriots invade Washington DC and Wall Street and arrest all the criminals in suits. Problem solved, millions of lives saved.

Then new elections.

I wish a few good generals would do that.

I don't see how this will change anything. Do they really think creating traffic jams or sleeping in the park is going to effect how things are done?

reply to post by jibeho



So OWS just wants to be in Chicago so they can get their heads bashed in too?
IF nonviolent confrontation and non-compliance is off the list then there is only one option left and it's not voting either.
I understand the cynicism but that's a mighty broad brush your waving.

reply to post by OutKast Searcher


I never said whether I supported it or didn't. I just don't understand what the OP and now others as well are going on about. Previous antics (what antics?) test for big call (huh?).

Originally posted by DestroyDestroyDestroy
reply to post by Vitchilo

 

Well in a violence scenario the issue of funding comes into play; the rich can afford to hire bodyguards, mercenaries, even private armies in some cases. The public can take their guns and fight, but most would rather not risk life and death and live below less-than-desirable means.

True, I worry about my niece who works at a $14.00 a hour job in downtown Chicago hotel. People are taking about violence during the May NATO/G8 meeting. The rich/elites won't have to worry. They will have plenty of protection. It's someone like her who has to worry.

reply to post by Kali74


Ok, but is this something that OWS is behind or not? And you personally...is this something you support or not?

The people in this thread are saying these things because they are "scared" of this...this is the organization of the unorganized OWS. They know if they can organize the passion and focus it on electing democrats that their beloved republicans have no chance this election.

They are trying to link it to violence...when the website specifically talks about non-violence. And I bet these workshops are going to be voter drives and how to bring about change by voting in who aligns with their cause.

It's the hijacking that I said would take place...and it looks like it will happen...which is a good thing in my opinion. These people have the funds to take over the loose message OWS has put out there...hopefully it will work and they can take control of OWS's failure to bring about any concrete change.

reply to post by woodwardjnr


wow,

I hope that you are in a foreign country trolling so as to F up my country or are kidding....

reply to post by jibeho
I spent last summer on a number of Occupy threads.
Argued, debated, ranted, and fought with a number of "Occupy" supporters.

Their message was consistant though. More government oversight. More government regulation.

More government.

T'is why I can't support them no matter how many fluffy baby kittens they throw at me.

Originally posted by DestroyDestroyDestroy
reply to post by Wrabbit2000

 

But those 330+ million are hardly individual people. I think we should be optimistic that at least some people are voicing their concern rather than sitting behind screens and blogging about their outrage. Any action is better than no action.

If we allow the evil and corruption to run rampant, we will be left with only ourselves to blame. And so with heads down we'll be left to ask ourselves, "how did we let this happen?"

I'm glad at least some people people are expressing their outrage, even though I don't agree with all of their actions and think most of them are really ignorant of actual issues, let alone actual solutions.

edit on 27-2-2012 by DestroyDestroyDestroy because: (no reason given)

edit on 27-2-2012 by DestroyDestroyDestroy because: typos

Oh I agree entirely with the need to do something to effectively change the nation we see around us. It's why I was a part of an Occupy camp back when I believed they still stood for something and weren't lock, stock and barrel owned by the Unions and Democratic National Party. Unfortunately that is no longer the case and to say Occupy is partisan, among other things, it like saying the Pope is Catholic.

In my view though, it's that whole "Doing something is better than doing nothing" approach that turned Occupy from a promising movement into a menace to the society they claim to commit these crimes in the name of.

Doing EFFECTIVE things and LOGICAL things is far better than doing nothing. However, I'd note that ALF and ELF also "Do Something" when they burn down new construction homes or spike trees or fire bomb Humvee lots. That is doing something, the same as Occupy throwing water balloons full of human Urine a few days ago in Denver. Yeah.. doing SOMETHING isn't always better than doing nothing.

Occupy COULD have taken some middle ground...looked for ways to work with the right *HALF* of the nation and accomplished something. Instead, they've withdrawn deeper into the right/left paradigm and in doing so, probably doomed every last one of us by killing that last best hope we all had as Americans. Now...We'll have to wait until after everything has collapsed to start fresh.

reply to post by OutKast Searcher


Just for clarifying purposes...

No I don't think this has much to do with Occupy, most of Occupy is 100% awake from the nightmare of our 2 parties, including myself. I don't know that this movement wouldn't be able to share space comfortably with Occupy but that's just a guess on my part. I can't see the Occupy movement endorsing democrats.

reply to post by beezzer


Really? It shouldn't be too hard to dig up a few posts showing such then.

reply to post by Wrabbit2000


Second time I'm asking you to clarify, I want you to show me what you are talking about. What makes you think Occupy is owned by the democratic party? You also to allude to being marxists and leninists now...what indicates this?

reply to post by jibeho


Maybe, just maybe...they found the KGC gold caches....joking....
Chaos brings change, and any change, is better than what we have going now....IMHO

reply to post by Kali74

I'll tell you what... I'm due in class in about 20 minutes. I'm back out and home by about 9pm central. I'll reply with all the sourcing and data you could ask for when I get back tonight. I'm looking forward to it.

It's kind of surprising you'd ask, as you are at least as informed of the day to day good and bad of Occupy across the Globe as I am...but for the record and messages....I'll put sources and specifics together for what has come from Jan. 1 to present,. No need going back to the hundreds of documented criminal offenses committed across the nation within camp or by Occupy outside of them prior to the 1st of the year right? Well just go with what has come since.

Now I respect you, as a person and individual. I hope the fact I've gone from supporter...to live-in member....to skeptical...to ouright enemy of Occupy in it's current form, doesn't make us enemies in general. The whole problem as I see it now is polarization. The CORE problem with Occupy is how it's come to advance and feed off that polarization, not work to help erase it. Exploiting that seems to be just another tactic in the tool box.I hope it doesn't have to extend to every individual like those of us here.

See ya tonight on that info though.

Declaration of the Occupation of New York City

As we gather together in solidarity to express a feeling of mass injustice, we must not lose sight of what brought us together. We write so that all people who feel wronged by the corporate forces of the world can know that we are your allies.

As one people, united, we acknowledge the reality: that the future of the human race requires the cooperation of its members; that our system must protect our rights, and upon corruption of that system, it is up to the individuals to protect their own rights, and those of their neighbors; that a democratic government derives its just power from the people, but corporations do not seek consent to extract wealth from the people and the Earth; and that no true democracy is attainable when the process is determined by economic power. We come to you at a time when corporations, which place profit over people, self-interest over justice, and oppression over equality, run our governments. We have peaceably assembled here, as is our right, to let these facts be known.

They have taken our houses through an illegal foreclosure process, despite not having the original mortgage.

They have taken bailouts from taxpayers with impunity, and continue to give Executives exorbitant bonuses.

They have perpetuated inequality and discrimination in the workplace based on age, the color of one’s skin, sex, gender identity and sexual orientation.

They have poisoned the food supply through negligence, and undermined the farming system through monopolization.

They have profited off of the torture, confinement, and cruel treatment of countless nonhuman animals, and actively hide these practices.

They have continuously sought to strip employees of the right to negotiate for better pay and safer working conditions.

They have held students hostage with tens of thousands of dollars of debt on education, which is itself a human right.

They have consistently outsourced labor and used that outsourcing as leverage to cut workers’ healthcare and pay.

They have influenced the courts to achieve the same rights as people, with none of the culpability or responsibility.

They have spent millions of dollars on legal teams that look for ways to get them out of contracts in regards to health insurance.

They have sold our privacy as a commodity.

They have used the military and police force to prevent freedom of the press.

They have deliberately declined to recall faulty products endangering lives in pursuit of profit.

They determine economic policy, despite the catastrophic failures their policies have produced and continue to produce.

They have donated large sums of money to politicians supposed to be regulating them.

They continue to block alternate forms of energy to keep us dependent on oil.

They continue to block generic forms of medicine that could save people’s lives in order to protect investments that have already turned a substantive profit.

They have purposely covered up oil spills, accidents, faulty bookkeeping, and inactive ingredients in pursuit of profit.

They purposefully keep people misinformed and fearful through their control of the media.

They have accepted private contracts to murder prisoners even when presented with serious doubts about their guilt.

They have perpetuated colonialism at home and abroad.

They have participated in the torture and murder of innocent civilians overseas.

They continue to create weapons of mass destruction in order to receive government contracts.*

To the people of the world,

We, the New York City General Assembly occupying Wall Street in Liberty Square, urge you to assert your power.

Exercise your right to peaceably assemble; occupy public space; create a process to address the problems we face, and generate solutions accessible to everyone.

To all communities that take action and form groups in the spirit of direct democracy, we offer support, documentation, and all of the resources at our disposal.

www.selectsmart.com...,859709


Anyone is welcome to read it. Like I've stated MANY times, we can all agree that there are problems.

It's the solutions that differentiate us.

reply to post by beezzer


And as I have said a million times that was released by a group within OWS, which OWS itself makes that seperation clear even though they remain in the "same space". I actually wrote a thread about this group the other day. At any rate what specifically about that list gets you all huffy?