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Let's Talk about David Wilcock's 2012 Claims

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posted on Feb, 28 2012 @ 02:56 PM
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You have evidence that suggests Wilcock actually believes his stories?
reply to post by stereologist
 


His own words. Do you have evidence he doesn't believe his stories?? I didn't think so. You cannot ask me for something that you yourself cannot give.



You have evidence of this? Actually, you do not. People that point out Wilcock is a fraud are stating the obvious. It is not hate or love or any other emotion. It is simply stating a fact.


You have evidence he is a fraud? Just because you say it does not make it so. Sorry. You say its no emotion yet you are showing plenty of emotion when you speak about him and how you speak to me. Why are you so emotional?




Your link to Violetta never mentions the Oort cloud. There is no evidence for anything massive happening out there.


It was not meant to mention the Oort Cloud. It was meant to introduce you to him. You are lucky I put a link to him after I mentioned him. In regards to the Oort Cloud...surely you can use google. Here ya go..just in case you can't google the Oort Cloud in the search bar. en.wikipedia.org...

There is plenty of evidence what is going on out there. Seek and you will find. Otherwise you will not see any evidence cause ya aint looking for it.



The claim about "There is new and unknown type of plasma energy seeping through into our Solar System" is also unsubstantiated and not mentioned in the article you linked.


If you didn't get it and didn't read it...that is on you. I can't read and understand material for you too. Maybe this will keep you busy and maybe you can find/see/read substantiated material here. space.mit.edu...



There are no new blood types. There are no new DNA types.


Really? inewp.com...
www.planetchange.tv...
www.rense.com...
www.thedailybeast.com...
www.genetichealth.com...
www.nature.com...

Just like the Earth, we change. Everything changes. Change is constant. Its a law.



This is like Wilcock. You make a statement. You post a reference and the two are not connected. That is what Wilcock does.


Because YOU do not see a connection does not mean there isn't one. I could tell you the sky isn't blue and you would argue because you do not understand color.




posted on Feb, 28 2012 @ 03:00 PM
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Lighterside is on-point. All this new age/awakening/consciousness/transition horse# is nothing but an escape clause for crystal-packing hippies with an aversion to the real world and all its trials and tribulations.

If you prefer to meditate and herbalise and wear tie-dye ad nauseaum, then have at it. I'm going to do my job, feed my family, and deal with real life in a way that actually has an impact. We'll all be compost 1000 generations removed before any super-duper transition/awakening occurs.



posted on Feb, 28 2012 @ 03:25 PM
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reply to post by MamaJ
 



If I was not busy defending myself and schooling you and stereo about your tudes then I would obviously have more time and WANT to tell you all I THINK is going on. I know enough about people to know that no matter what I produce..you still wont get it. You wont get it because you don't want to. You are scared. That is why you don't like David Wilcocks message. You don't understand it so you hate on the ideas presented by him and other new age thinkers because you fear what you do not know.


Some people pretend to want to provide sources. All that is ever produced is a list of excuses.

All I have asked for is evidence for claims. The reason I ask is that I do not believe they are correct. This becomes your chance to provide information about your position. Your failure to produce anything to substantiate your claims is only your problem. Excuses based on your predictions about responses from other just reinforce the fact that no evidence has been provided. Assigning emotions to issues triggers the baloney detector in many people. It is simply another excuse. Claiming fear of not knowing is just another bad excuse.


Wilcocks believes we are in a transition and so do I.

You don't know what he believes. Neither do I. Only Wilcock knows what he believes.

Does he provide any evidence for this claim of his? No.



posted on Feb, 28 2012 @ 03:25 PM
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Well it may be if we actually get a shift then. But, I''m enjoying reading his latest book, Source Field Investigations, which is really good. Now of course, its long and we're listening to the auditory with the hardcover on the way, and three of us, so it'll take some time to get to conclusions and ideas about ascension and what is coming.

However, the science part, with the studies and pineal, along with the things the mystery school have put out in plain sight, ie the pinecone at the vatican, the lions and the sarcophagus that resembles the one in the kings chamber of the great pyramid, and then going into to depth on some interesting points of the pineal in statues and finally the mountains, from Assyria to Greece. Orphalus to Baetyl stones in Rome, which all represent the Axis Mundi, which is also about third eye. In fact, the Baetyl leads to Bethel, then Bethlehem and Christ.


So, in the 33 degree masons you have a correspondence to the 33 vertabraes in the spine or the rising of the energies/kundalini, to awaken the pituatary, Isis, and therefore affect Ra, the pineal which opens to become the Eye of Horus.

And all of this pertains to the US Great Seal.

Of course they are assuming that, some magical way, if they don't do the heart chakras, and throat one of shining your light and speaking for the poor and equality and using your talents to serve, that they can still open the eye of Horus. They think this is all it takes to Grow their souls to become gods, or basically accomplish the ben ben/phoenix bird's transformation, and leave us all in the dust to be used by the dark ones.

But alas, thats not how it really works, it actually takes growign your consciousness, loving more, helping more, seeking more, becoming more good and raising your frequency more.

Its a wonderful, highly informative book, which explains why there is a huge smear campaign going on presently regarding him.

I highly recommend it.

To me, it doesnt matter when upgrade happens, it may be for the entire planet this time, it feels like that, many feel that inside in their souls. So thats what I believe.

But even in this book, not necessarily his portion. The one who wrote the screenplay for Carl Sagan's Contact (Jim V. Hart) and Graham Hancock. (prologue and introduction)

One of the 3 said, that as of 2012, this time of awakening and change, and transmutation, this could be a process that goes on 100 years.

No one really knows.

But TPTWB (I had to through a wanna be into that word) think something is going on.
edit on 28-2-2012 by Unity_99 because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 28 2012 @ 03:31 PM
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reply to post by MamaJ
 

Yes, I feel so schooled on my "tude"


I wanted to thank you for backing up the thoughts and opinions I posted here in that reply.


Originally posted by MamaJ
If I was not busy defending myself and schooling you and stereo about your tudes then I would obviously have more time and WANT to tell you all I THINK is going on. I know enough about people to know that no matter what I produce..you still wont get it. You wont get it because you don't want to. You are scared.
That is why you don't like David Wilcocks message. You don't understand it so you hate on the ideas presented by him and other new age thinkers because you fear what you do not know.


Unfortunately, you're just talking in circles at this point. We get it, we are meanies and don't deserve your contributions. However, we never asked you what you THINK, we're not here to discuss you, that's a pretty arrogant assumption. You tell us all that we keep assuming this and assuming that, do you read what you type? I believe you are in fact trolling (possibly without even realizing it).

We don't understand Wilcocks message huh? Do we just not have the aptitude to comprehend? Is it because we've closed our minds to the possibilities? OR, are we in fact smart enough to understand what is being said, and smart enough not to buy in to his rhetoric... nah that couldn't be it.

The stubbornness you exhibit, here is exactly why Wilcock gets to stay in business. People like yourself are committing to the ideals of a 2012 change so much that you seem to be closing your mind to the possibilities of that it might just be another year - to the point that you are unwilling to trade information as to avoid any argument that might defeat the ideals you share with Wilcock, and that is no assumption. And luckily for Wilcock, this type of refusal to think plays right into his pocket book.

You (along with Jaws) claim the refusal to share information that back up these claims is connected to a fear that we will just tear the information apart, and not give it a fair assessment, that cowardice. If you believe in 50% of Wilcocks ideas, then represent them with your head held high (without all the arrogance please).

If anything, I see one contribution that you've made, and it's an important one. I think you have clearly demonstrated to us all why/how Wilcock is able to continue making money even after being wrong time after time, so thank you for that.



posted on Feb, 28 2012 @ 03:34 PM
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Its not about being right for predictions, its about being on the right side. Love and Equality! And seeking within and waking up and if people really did this, and started their own source field investigations in groups, ie Remote Viewing, meditation, envisioning good things, the control grid would crumple.



posted on Feb, 28 2012 @ 03:35 PM
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Some people pretend to want to provide sources. All that is ever produced is a list of excuses. All I have asked for is evidence for claims. The reason I ask is that I do not believe they are correct. This becomes your chance to provide information about your position. Your failure to produce anything to substantiate your claims is only your problem. Excuses based on your predictions about responses from other just reinforce the fact that no evidence has been provided. Assigning emotions to issues triggers the baloney detector in many people. It is simply another excuse. Claiming fear of not knowing is just another bad excuse.
reply to post by stereologist
 


I provided links and you are still crying.
You are full of excuses as to why you wont read links and I am stating facts not excuses there is a difference. You want me to provided a link that shows you the difference. I can't help your emotions.



You don't know what he believes. Neither do I. Only Wilcock knows what he believes. Does he provide any evidence for this claim of his? No.


If you do not know what he believes then ok. I do. How? Because I do not assume I read and watch what he says. There is another difference. You cannot speak to what I know and what I don't know. You can only speak on behalf of you.

What he provides evidence for is for you to discover as the same goes for me.

I am only defending him because you continue to hate on him.
I don't even buy into what he says. I only go off FACTS that can be backed up as absolute. In this world...there are very few FACTS. Have you noticed this FACT?



posted on Feb, 28 2012 @ 03:40 PM
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reply to post by MamaJ
 



His own words. Do you have evidence he doesn't believe his stories?? I didn't think so. You cannot ask me for something that you yourself cannot give.

My point is that no one knows what he believes. What he espouses is not necessarily what he believes.


You have evidence he is a fraud?

I have posted several examples in this and other threads. Go read.


Why are you so emotional?

Another failure on your part. You are the only one assigning emotions.


It was not meant to mention the Oort Cloud. It was meant to introduce you to him. You are lucky I put a link to him after I mentioned him.

I know of Violetta. Again nothing you have posted shows any large disturbance in the Oort Cloud.


There is plenty of evidence what is going on out there. Seek and you will find. Otherwise you will not see any evidence cause ya aint looking for it.

If you knew even a smidgeon about the Oort Cloud then you'd know that this is a false claim.


If you didn't get it and didn't read it...that is on you. I can't read and understand material for you too.

Had you read the article you'd realize that the material in question was no where near the solar system.

Here is your link go read it and learn where interstellar material is.
archaeologynewsnetwork.blogspot.com...

Your link to the Cooper article does not support any of the claims you have made.

As for the blood types. These are not new blood types. They are further differentiations of known blood types. As article 1 states it has been known that there were transfusion problems. The reason is now known. The ability to differentiate more blood types is due to the advancement of biochemistry.


Just like the Earth, we change. Everything changes. Change is constant. Its a law.

Humans are not forming new blood types. Existing blood types are being identified. Their existence has been inferred from known data.



posted on Feb, 28 2012 @ 03:47 PM
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reply to post by Unity_99
 


These weird tales about symbols in plain sight makes me laugh hysterically. It is so funny. Reminds me of Abbot and Costello skit where they show that 13 times 7 is 28. The funnier part is that the Abbot and Costello skit makes more sense.

The problem with the Wilcock book is that the author is not truthful. He references work but does not report it correctly. That's like claiming that new blood types have appeared even though the reason for the search was old evidence that these must exist.

I wouldn't use Hancock as a positive. He's the person that made up the pole shift claims even though it is well established that nothing like that has ever happened in the history of the Earth and certainly not in the last 200My.



posted on Feb, 28 2012 @ 03:49 PM
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reply to post by MamaJ
 


You realize that the links your are providing about new blood types are not about "new" blood types right? Just recently discovered blood types, kind of a big difference.

The links you provide about a new kind of DNA are either links that discuss DNA mutation, which has nothing to do with a new type of DNA, it's just DNA, it mutates, always has, always will. The 2 links that actually speak of "new" DNA come from 2 sources. One being a bachelor of fine arts with no doctorate or real scientific background and happens to already be a new age guru. The other arrested for fraud.

ETA
 

To be honest, I was expecting something more from someone proclaiming to have years and years of research on the matter. I guess you and I have a difference in opinion on the meaning of "credible"

edit on 28-2-2012 by Lighterside because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 28 2012 @ 03:52 PM
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reply to post by Unity_99
 



Its not about being right for predictions, its about being on the right side. Love and Equality! And seeking within and waking up and if people really did this, and started their own source field investigations in groups, ie Remote Viewing, meditation, envisioning good things, the control grid would crumple.

I disagree wholeheartedly.

There was a man named Lysenko that wanted biological sciences to follow what was right. He promoted the idea that science should reflect the Soviet ideal. He ruined biological research for decades. The work was a fraud.
en.wikipedia.org...

Follow the data regardless of the emotional trappings you try to assign to them.



posted on Feb, 28 2012 @ 03:58 PM
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off-topic post removed to prevent thread-drift


 



posted on Feb, 28 2012 @ 04:00 PM
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off-topic post removed to prevent thread-drift


 



posted on Feb, 28 2012 @ 04:12 PM
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Now you are telling lies. I read the links and there is nothing in there supporting your claims. Had there actually been something in those link supporting your claims you would have shown that, but instead you choose to lie.
reply to post by stereologist
 


Lies? Lies? Oh now I am PISSED! You say you read the links. How? You have not had time to read all of that. I call BS and who is lying? You do not care to read anything I present ... I know your kind.


Neither you or lighterside have had time to read those links. Those links are petty and I will be # if I give you anything of substance as far as links from NASA, ESA, or any other organization I mentioned in the very beginning.

I wanted to see what you knew.

Obviously DNA changes all the time.
BUT...you stated it doesn't. You said there were no new blood types either...and they have been discovered so they are NEWly discovered. I aint dumb.

Please do not reply to me as I wont reply to you if you want to press me for more links feel free to email me.



posted on Feb, 28 2012 @ 04:15 PM
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reply to post by MamaJ
 


The only ones of those links that seem to be talking about the type of stuff you're referring to are the one with Melchizedek and the one with Fox. In neither of these cases do the interviewee actually cite any sources for their claims. They merely say these studies exist without actually giving us an author or anything of the sort. It doesn't help that Melchizedek has been caught in lies in the past and his entire livelihood is dependent on selling books related to 2012, while Fox was arrested and indicted for fraud. These aren't exactly credible sources and they provide no way to verify their own claims.



posted on Feb, 28 2012 @ 04:27 PM
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I don't believe that David Wilcock is a "fraud", he is simply mistaken regarding 2012. And I do not agree that information that benefits the whole of mankind should be charged for, it should be free. It seems to me that his business model is also his way of life, he truly believes what he preaches and thus, in my mind he is still a force of good in the universe.. every bit of light helps in this as of yet dark world.

Otherwise he has some very interesting articles which might be "on the money", like these:
divinecosmos.com...
divinecosmos.com...
divinecosmos.com...
divinecosmos.com...

2012 is not the end of the world. Is a shift in global consciousness. It is the end of the age of Pisces and the beginning of the age of Aquarius. It is the end of the world as we know it. It is the point of turning from being more darkness in the world into there being more light in the world. It is our one chance to set things right. It is you, me and everyone becoming aware of the global elite control of the system.

We will not magically ascend 2012, we have a long ways to go before even truly being in control of our own lives. We will have to work for shifting our reality into one we truly prefer. But we might have to conquer our fear of the unknown to do it.

To know what really is happening regarding the NWO and the financial crisis, which is very important today, I would look to Foster Gamble and the movie Thrive, which I think presents it quite good and is a good place to start off with if nothing else. There are others perhaps even more knowledgable on the subject but they are people like David Icke and Alex Jones that quite frankly believe one conspiracy too many, others are conseited, closed minded or even quite frankly "rude" like i find Peter Joseph. After a year of research I arrived at most of the same conclusions that Thrive presents.

Personally I would seek truth regarding us, 2012, the nature of your universe among parallells universes and just about anything else with Bashar channeled through "Paul Anka". He seems to always have very insightful answers without having to think about the questions. The reason I started listening to Bashar is that he amazingly placed Atlantis where I theorised it would most likely be based on my own reasearch. Though I a couple of weeks ago never expected me to write something like this, I believe him to be the real deal.
edit on 28-2-2012 by anno141 because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 28 2012 @ 04:38 PM
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Originally posted by MamaJ
You have been mean, demanding, assuming, arrogant, and just plain twisting what I say or what I don't say.

I believe I've been quite civil, as do the moderators apparently. I have been left to assume when left with your unwillingness to comply to simple requests. Arrogant? I'm sorry, but I have yet to deny sharing information with you based on the principle that you are not on my level, I cannot say the same for you.


Originally posted by MamaJ
You are just so smart. I agree. Because of the way you present his ideas as crazy you obviously do not understand him nor his message. Its ok though I don't understand a lot either. None of us are in the KNOW of all things... only possibilities.

Technically yes, with an IQ of 162, but that's neither here nor there, but I'm glad we agree on one thing. (oh hey! you're right that IS arrogant! =D). So by understanding something, then calling that idea false, I suddenly do not understand it? If I told you 2+2 does not equal 5, does that mean I don't understand simple addition? But I do believe you when you say you don't understand a lot of it, and maybe that's the key difference between someone like yourself who believes in this rhetoric, and someone like me who knows better.


Originally posted by MamaJ
If David is banking then good for him.

See, I can't support someone making money off of blatantly lying to people, my consciousnesses won't allow it.


Originally posted by MamaJ
I have traded information. Have you not read it yet? I even asked you to email me. Ha! How nice am I? But you never emailed. Or did you?

Actually I have, I've even replied about some of it prior to your post. As for emailing you, sorry, no way in hell you're getting my email address, but I assume you mean U2U, and no I haven't, you can stay here on a public board, keep it civil, and share with the rest of the class if you choose to share more information with me. I'd love to see more, hopefully something we can both agree on as a credible source.


Originally posted by MamaJ
You keep referring to his pocket book.Why? Who cares?

I do. It is wrong to profit off abusing the ignorance of others. But that's just me.


Originally posted by MamaJ
I am not in fear you will tear anything apart...I already KNOW you would. I am just smart like that. I wouldn't want to share a link now cause I am too stubborn but I did...but...you haven't read anything. Oh well. I already wrote out what I thought about David and let me ask...WHY IN THE WORLD does it matter what I THINK about David anymore than I have already stated?

A: I did point out some credibility issues in some of what you've provided, I guess that constitutes "tearing it apart". B: I have been reading your posts and the material you've posted, no need to assume otherwise. C: It doesn't matter what you think about David. If I wasn't clear before, let me be clear agai... er now. We never asked what you think, we asked you to cite what you claim to know that's all. We would love more information to move the topic of DW and his 2012 claims along a path of irrefutable evidence and fact. Help us out.


Originally posted by MamaJ
Well, take that contribution and feel lucky. Today is your lucky day my respected foe! I cannot even believe you sent that to me nor can I believe the juvenile email I found in my inbox. Its been a joke being a part of this thread with you....really an immature JOKE. I feel as though I am in high school again.

.... sigh. Well at least one of us can stay civil. And to be clear, I've sent you ZERO emails, no need to go spreading complete fabrications such as calling out stereo as being "emotional" and me as "juvenile via email". Kind of steeping to a new low there.

 

Sorry for the long post, was a lot to be rebutted.

ETA (side note)
 

I don't think anyone has the right or ability to deny others from the conversation on a public forum. If you don't wanna participate and interact with the community, find your power button on your internet enabled device. That's about the best advice I can give.

edit on 28-2-2012 by Lighterside because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 28 2012 @ 04:46 PM
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Originally posted by Xcalibur254
reply to post by MamaJ
 

The only ones of those links that seem to be talking about the type of stuff you're referring to are the one with Melchizedek and the one with Fox. In neither of these cases do the interviewee actually cite any sources for their claims. They merely say these studies exist without actually giving us an author or anything of the sort. It doesn't help that Melchizedek has been caught in lies in the past and his entire livelihood is dependent on selling books related to 2012, while Fox was arrested and indicted for fraud. These aren't exactly credible sources and they provide no way to verify their own claims.

If you want to message me and begin talking back and forth about what I have concluded I will be more than happy to do so. This thread is not appropriate nor do I want to be a giver right now. I am upset with the dialogue that has transpired here and I am upset by a very juvenile message that was sent to me that has now been forwarded to the staff.
I am fully aware of the fraud and I am fully aware that DNA changes all the time as I am fully aware that the new blood types are newly found.

I do not jump on David Wilcocks band wagon nor do I think he is spot on but I do think he shares some of what other new ager's think and subscribe to. I do not know what I think really that is why I began studying so hard about the upcoming "shift" and whether or not I (me) "believe" any of it. What parts do I believe, if any is what I searched for.

I now happen to "believe" there is a possibility that a shift can indeed occur. IF it did occur then is it natural, would everyone have a "shift" of awareness and what would the implications be, if any. This is what I wanted to find out....for myself and for my family. I owe nothing to anyone else. I definitely do not want to feel as though I am pressured to spill everything I think I may be onto. Why? I became scared for a minute (while researching) for myself and for my loved ones. I don't wish that surreal feeling on anyone.

Sometimes what you feel is more important than what you see. I am not a one to jump on a band wagon and follow just anyone. I have a mind of my own if you cannot tell.


I feel sorry for David and so I defend him. I defend a lot of people that are the under dog. He may not be the most credible dude but he may have some truth to his words. Before one discounts his message I think it would be better to research his claims as I have done. Even though I do not think he is correct with his assumptions I do believe he is right in some respect. I like metaphysics and I get into reading about the brain and consciousness. Energy and the different types fascinates me so I connect with him on some level just as I do most people.

I am even wondering if the will to end this error of war and hate will manifest because I believe the human consciousness together is that powerful.

2012 is not a year that I think all hell will break loose nor do I think the world will end. I don't know. How can I say when and if that could or would ever happen. I am not God.
I just don't know nor do I have any predictions. I do think this year and maybe the next 100 or 10000 years may be a different kind of life as we know it for Earth.

If you think about it.... what laws do we know are fact within the Universe? We know one for sure. Cause and Effect. Change is constant. As we travel through the Universe we will encounter alien materials of all kinds. We will have to maintain not only our Magnetosphere but the Heliosphere, Ionosphere and so on and so on. The Planets in the Solar System work together, unlike humans. The work together to provide or dismantle.
From www.nasa.gov...

This link is actually a bookmarked link.
I just read it today again but forgot to bookmark it.


So far, much of the evidence for the bubbles comes from the Voyager energetic particle and flow measurements. Proof can also be obtained from the Voyager magnetic field observations and some of this data is also very suggestive. However, because the magnetic field is so weak, the data takes much longer to analyze with the appropriate care. Thus, unraveling the magnetic signatures of bubbles in the Voyager data is ongoing. "We'll probably discover which is correct as the Voyagers proceed deeper into the froth and learn more about its organization," says Opher. "This is just the beginning, and I predict more surprises ahead."

We are just now studying the Bubbles at the edge of the Suns Heliosphere. The data is suggestive as he says but he adds the data needs more time to be analyzed and so the study is ongoing. This frothy substance was quite a surprise. Scientists are studying in depth the new and improved space we are in and or may begin to push through



posted on Feb, 28 2012 @ 05:02 PM
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Originally posted by MamaJ
As we travel through the Universe we will encounter alien materials of all kinds. We will have to maintain not only our Magnetosphere but the Heliosphere, Ionosphere and so on and so on. The Planets in the Solar System work together, unlike humans. The work together to provide or dismantle.
From www.nasa.gov...

This link is actually a bookmarked link.
I just read it today again but forgot to bookmark it.

...

We are just now studying the Bubbles at the edge of the Suns Heliosphere. The data is suggestive as he says but he adds the data needs more time to be analyzed and so the study is ongoing. This frothy substance was quite a surprise. Scientists are studying in depth the new and improved space we are in and or may begin to push through

See, now that some good credible material. Though I personally don't think these new discoveries have anything to do with the "new age" outlook on the universe. As far as I know, "new age" gurus have always been pointing to new sciences and discoveries as a means to add credibility to their claims. However as we learn more, much of that connection gets ruled out. Thanks for sharing the link though.

But wait a second...


Originally posted by MamaJ
... I will be # if I give you anything of substance as far as links from NASA, ESA, or any other organization I mentioned in the very beginning.

LOL
just throwing that out there cause I thought it was funny.


ETA
 
Oh and hey, you're more than welcome to forward this alleged message I supposedly sent you my way too.

edit on 28-2-2012 by Lighterside because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 28 2012 @ 05:04 PM
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Personally I would seek truth regarding us, 2012, the nature of your universe among parallells universes and just about anything else with Bashar channeled through "Paul Anka". He seems to always have very insightful answers without having to think about the questions. The reason I started listening to Bashar is that he amazingly placed Atlantis where I theorised it would most likely be based on my own reasearch. Though I a couple of weeks ago never expected me to write something like this, I believe him to be the real deal.
reply to post by anno141
 


I totally agree. I just don't think anyone has it pin pointed therefore I don't buy into any of the hype about the world ending in 2012. I am more interested in working on me, my family, and studying the Universe and what it entails and that in itself keeps me real busy.

Who is Paul Anka or Bashar? I am not sure I have read anything that relates to either.


What does he say that makes you think he is the real deal?



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