Do Animals Have Rights, Does It Matter How We Kill And Eat Them?

reply to post by MountainLaurel


Supermarket meats are all from animals that had been treated with no respect. It's best to source poultry and beef from local sources. Even raise your own pig...

Farm raised pigs are among the most horribly treated. Same goes for chickens. Imagine if you are a chicken in a caged room with 30,000 other birds who all had to take a dump...Now imagine your legs getting burned alive from the ammonia/methane gases in the room.

Your daughter is pretty sharp. The only trick to being vegetarian is protein balancing. Sadly the government has subsizied the grain industry which in turn suppliments the brutal farm raised animal business.

Just watch the fosters farms chicken video. You'll see the chickens knee deep in manure burning alive...That's not what I'd call "always natural, always fresh"

I haven't read through all the replies yet but....

If animals have rights, what or who, protects them from predation?
If seals have rights, who prosecutes the whales, dolphins and sharks?
If dolphins have rights, who prosecutes the sharks and other animals that kill them?
If sharks have rights, who prosecutes the dolphin and such that eat them?
If octopus & squid have rights, who prosecutes the whales, dolphin, sharks ... ?
If people have rights, who prosecutes the animals that ... ?

It seems that WE are the only species that assigns value to life.

So, does that give us carte blanche to direct life on our planet?

We should not interfere with the "natural order" of things in so much as natural order is the result of natural predation, where predators consume prey. When prey is of short order, the predator moves on to other prey.

Evolution tells you that species will change, species will adapt, and those best poised to survive will continue. Animals will survive the Human onslaught, or they won't. The evidence for evolution will best be shown if Human's manage to survive the loss of their prey.

How's that for Darwinism at work?

Originally posted by DestroyDestroyDestroy

Originally posted by pierregustavetoutant
Life feeds on life. The morality/immorality of killing is a human invention. As far as Mother Nature is concerned, a dog is no better than a fern is no better than a cow is no better than a fungus is no better than a rock. It's just routine energy transfer.
1 thing I've never figured out is why vegetarians kill and mutilate those poor vegetables. Especially after all the evidence that plants feel pain. Murderous Heathens!

ETA: I support vegetarians because less demand for meat means better prices for me!

edit on 26-2-2012 by pierregustavetoutant because: see above

The difference between animals killing other animals for food and modern treatment of animals in slaughterhouses is what most vegetarians consider the breaking point. How cows and chickens are treated is absolutely disgusting; life can feed on life, but it does not have to completely disregard the life which it is feeding on.

Again. Completely made up morals by humans (who are simply glorified apes). Nature just plain don' give a fudge. Suffering is everywhere in nature. The vast majority of it not caused by humans. Even evil white people, for that matter. That's just us again, committing major acts of hubris.

I guarantee you. If tigers could have deer farms where the deers weren't treated that well before they were slaughtered, they'd be jim dandy with it.

Originally posted by pierregustavetoutant


Again. Completely made up morals by humans (who are simply glorified apes). Nature just plain don' give a fudge. Suffering is everywhere in nature. The vast majority of it not caused by humans. Even evil white people, for that matter. That's just us again, committing major acts of hubris.

I guarantee you. If tigers could have deer farms where the deers weren't treated that well before they were slaughtered, they'd be jim dandy with it.

edit on 27-2-2012 by pierregustavetoutant because: (no reason given)

Pretty much true. Nature can be beautiful, but its also ruthless and harsh - and many, many predators certainly do not kill humanly.

Originally posted by Frogs

Originally posted by pierregustavetoutant


Again. Completely made up morals by humans (who are simply glorified apes). Nature just plain don' give a fudge. Suffering is everywhere in nature. The vast majority of it not caused by humans. Even evil white people, for that matter. That's just us again, committing major acts of hubris.

I guarantee you. If tigers could have deer farms where the deers weren't treated that well before they were slaughtered, they'd be jim dandy with it.

edit on 27-2-2012 by pierregustavetoutant because: (no reason given)

Pretty much true. Nature can be beautiful, but its also ruthless and harsh - and many, many predators certainly do not kill humanly.

I completely get that point, however I think there is a distinction between an animal that goes about it's normal life in the wild prior to being mauled & killed by a lion, compared to an animal that spends it's life suffering before being killed by a human. Just saying....

reply to post by Golf66




Take only what you need, and respect what you take...

I'm a meat eater, and make no apologies for it...but to each his, or her, own.

Eating meat in this day and age is a choice. There are other options available to most people in developed countries to have a healthy diet that does not include meat.

However in the distant past, it was a necessity. Especially during the cold Winter months when most vegetation was either dormant or buried in snow. Humans depended on meat to survive.

Also early prehistoric man is believed to have developed his intelligence by eating a mixed diet that included protein from meat which helped in the development of larger brains. Which allowed us to develop tool making skills.

I think by now it has become somewhat part of our genetic code. We don't "need" to eat meat. But we subconsciously want it and prefer it over most other foods. It is one of the most energy compact foods available.

I don't think that animals we killed in the past or animals killed in the wild by other animals are killed more humanely or less painfully. Death is still death. Pain is still pain and fear is still fear.

Yes, some horrible treatment takes place in meat facilities. But the bad treatment is usually while the animals are still alive. Not they manner in which they are slaughtered.

Game hunters adopted the theory of a "clean kill" or humane kill. Trying to cause as little suffering as possible and utilize most parts of the animal. Meat factories also try to adopt these principles as much as possible. They use the parts of the animals that can not be sold for human consumption in dog food and other products.

I don't think I need to go into details about hot dogs or chicken nuggets. We all know most of them are made with the nasty bits and pieces of the carcass.

I think it does matter how we kill the animals and most importantly how we treat the animals while they are being raised. We should appreciate and give thanks to the animals. We are what we eat.

Time for some Carne Asada Tacos with fresh onions and cilantro anyone?

reply to post by ThirdRock69


What does that have to do with "animals' rights"?

I get what you're saying and cilantro, carne asada tacos sounds good... need some lime and avacado...
and a splash of tequila on the grill.

reply to post by abecedarian


Well the thread title is "Do Animals Have Rights, Does It Matter How We Kill And Eat Them?"

I was commenting mostly to the latter part of the OP's question.

As far as animal rights, I stated that they should be raised in a more humane way and we should use the best methods to prevent the animals from sufferening.

Time for some Carne Asada Tacos with fresh onions and cilantro anyone?

Inside joke

Of course, they are sentient being like us. To remove that factor of compassion is to remove humanity's conscience. Can't stress more to opt-out on buying factory farmed meat for those who choice to eat meat. Vegans and vegetarians alike, product research is in your favor as Monsanto has taken over soy.

Certain food are being banned here in California.

It is now illegal to eat or serve

Shark Fin soup & Foie Gras

CA food ban

Originally posted by ThirdRock69
reply to post by abecedarian

 

Well the thread title is "Do Animals Have Rights, Does It Matter How We Kill And Eat Them?"

I was commenting mostly to the latter part of the OP's question.

As far as animal rights, I stated that they should be raised in a more humane way and we should use the best methods to prevent the animals from sufferening.

Do the best you can but unless you can catch them and get them to willingly permit sedation, and then kill them, there's going to be some suffering.

Still, a little tequila and lime won't hurt the flavor.

reply to post by MountainLaurel


Yes they do.
Yes it does.

reply to post by ThirdRock69


Funny, think I know that joke!

Very interesting thread..I'm not a vegetarian and never will be but i do like a good salad with my steak..."Do animals have rights" my answer is no ..I would not eat my dogs or cats there my loved pets..I raise cattle for a living here on my farm and thats what there used for there meat goes to fine dining facilitys and some right into my home freezer..nothing better then a yummy steak on the grill..peace,sugarcookie1..P.S we onley shoot what were going to eat we dont do it for the thrill..

We both love animals here and this is a should watch short 3 min video.
Link below
www.liveleak.com...

Awwww, Wow, that may have been the Best Video I have ever seen. Thank-you for sharing it in this thread. I hope everyone will watch it !

Will make you smile, maybe even cry....very special.....

p.s. how do I post a ready to watch video?

My mom vegetarian, Dad suppose to be vegetarian(since his parents are) but dad friends who ate meat on regular basis, which made him like meat, which lead to my mom cooking meat for the family (she still did not eat) which influenced me to eat meat... but i wish i stayed vegetarian or ATLEAST stay with white meat(seafood, chicken, birds)...

reply to post by sugarcookie1


Thanks for your input, seems the cows on your farm are well taken care of, probably why "finer" resturants in your area appreciate the quality of meat. I'm guessing you don't use hormones on your cattle? What do you think about hormones being used in your industry? Any insights on what we should all be looking for when we buy meat?

Originally posted by MountainLaurel

We both love animals here and this is a should watch short 3 min video.
Link below
www.liveleak.com...

Awwww, Wow, that may have been the Best Video I have ever seen. Thank-you for sharing it in this thread. I hope everyone will watch it !

Will make you smile, maybe even cry....very special.....

p.s. how do I post a ready to watch video?

If the video is on the net just copy and paste the link that shows you the URL in your tool bar up top on your browser.
To copy and past just Highlight the link in your tool bar then hit Ctrl and your C key to copy it.
Then to drop it in this thread or wherever just hit Ctrl and your V key and that will drop it to the screen for you.


Hope that helps you out there, just practice on a post and see what happens, if it does not work edit or delete your post.


Regards, Iwinder

reply to post by MountainLaurel

p.s. how do I post a ready to watch video?

If the video is from youtube you copy the numbers after the = sign

On the page you create your post on, at the top, you will see a green bubble with blue writing in it that says (VID:YOUTUBE)

Click that and paste the video numbers into the pop up window

Example:
youtube.com/watch?v=xncooF66lCg&feature=related

This is the part you need to copy and paste

xncooF66lCg&feature=related

if the video number is short

Example:
youtube.com/watch?v=xncooF66lCg

You need to add the & symbol after the numbers

xncooF66lCg add the & symbol like this ..... xncooF66lCg&



This is for youtube videos only

You can also manually type the tags which are .. [ yvid ] xncooF66lCg& [ /yvid ] .... but no spaces

If the video is not from youtube or google you can only link us to the page