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Intelligence Breeds Evil, Choice Tempers It

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posted on Feb, 26 2012 @ 03:56 PM
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reply to post by Starchild23
 


No arguement here


S&F




posted on Feb, 26 2012 @ 04:11 PM
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Originally posted by Starchild23
reply to post by Tecumte
 



As to comment on the OP, I tend to personally view 'choice' and possibly 'free will' as yet another set of descriptions, certainly not operating equally by any means in all individuals at all times. "Choice' Imo happens on a scale when one has removed certain obstacles preventing one from actively 'choosing'.


Choice and free will go hand in hand, in my opinion. Free will provides the choice, and the choice is due to free will. The definition of choice, however, is not the question here, as most people have a pretty accurate understanding of the word.

Either you choose to, or you choose not to. It's not a difficult concept...a blessing, considering the rest of the thread.



I view 'choice' as a description of a perception of scale, certainly not equal in all individuals at all times, clearly one with a metaphorical *gun to the head* has less 'choice' *in reality* than one without, Imho.

We can deny this and say everyone has equal 'free will' but I think upon closer examination when we look at many people afflicted with all sorts of ailments we see many simply do not have the same *capacity* to choose, and in some extreme cases it is near zero. Clearly to my way of thinking it is indeed a scale.

Perhaps at best,more accurately we might say people really have largely varying degrees of so called 'free will'.



posted on Feb, 26 2012 @ 05:31 PM
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reply to post by prisoneronashipoffools
 


"Now the serpent was more subtle than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made.

And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden?

And the woman said unto the serpent, We may eat of the fruit of the trees of the garden:

But of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God hath said, Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die.

And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:

For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods,

knowing good and evil."



posted on Feb, 26 2012 @ 05:49 PM
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reply to post by prisoneronashipoffools
 


exactly, this op is evil in being against itself for free superior pretenses upon all and everything powers

evil is in fact what objectively always kill the truth, so never mention it existing

and evil inherently is free one in absolute terms by its own fact of being nothing to all

that is how in concept evil is one, wether u reach it from killing all and the concept of else or u reach it by insisting on being subjectively only enjoying all possible that support u to b one

what is truly free is the right out of objective absolute realisations, it is all to intelligence of facts

wether free right out of objective absolute positive realisations or free right out of objective absolute superior realisations bc truth is positive superiority freedom always

truth is first before any relative facts to, truth is all to absolute values of infinite existence rights

evil is stupid so it is obvious that it is not the source of what it looks doing, when u r one u cant do anything and surely never could invent anything as an object

evil is revealed clearly stupid from where it means objective reality it cant but mean itself pretenses reasons

while anyone can at least recognize that others are doing the same so objective is from else too, while in truth all freedom is much more present realisations then one free right realisations, what evil cant handle existing
from what it cant mean his free will but from concept of one freedom for it

and that is why evil in practics is against freedom too even his discovering how to be free liars in lies as the best way to be free evil from killing all freedom in concept of even meaning to kill freedom truth so truth for fake freed pretenses

when truth is positive superiority freedom then what is not positive truly is always in negative inferiority, the inverse equation and that is evil it cant b relative when it is direct reason is truth existence which it doesnt belong to

that is why ones are always from negating objective existence while pretending proving inferiority of others

the insistence to advocate the concept of one as existence justification is ridiculously to evil powers

from where could anyone recognize another one existence, life? love sense waoo, everyone must be related intimately to recognize each others? oh really and no matter of course how disgusting vison it looks nor the knowledge that truth say the opposite in all terms and realities of facts constantly



posted on Feb, 26 2012 @ 06:18 PM
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Originally posted by ImaFungi
reply to post by prisoneronashipoffools
 


"Now the serpent was more subtle than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made.

And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden?

And the woman said unto the serpent, We may eat of the fruit of the trees of the garden:

But of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God hath said, Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die.

And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:

For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods,

knowing good and evil."


AS mankind evolved it was known sooner later he would reach a point where he *must* 'eat of the tree' and reach a point where he would be able to see "above" the 'programmed' animal nature, it was 'god's' intention after all, the 'will of god' wasn't it?

I think if we can see the "garden of Eden" story in it's proper (Imo) and full allegorcial light we can more fully come to understand the road we're on. At least that's how it comes across to me.

edit on 26-2-2012 by Tecumte because: corrected quote



posted on Feb, 26 2012 @ 06:19 PM
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the logics in meaning to use worse ends for betterment wills pretenses is evil

it means opposition to truth in negating objective existence being always through, there is evil so absolute negative inferiority powers only from being untrue freedom
so what mean to use worse facts to allegate smthg to do is more evil then worse reasons that are also of truth superiority

evil in objective intelligence term, is what contradict fully itself realisation which prove that its self freedom is untrue

when u mean worse for better future, then u can do what is opposed to ur fact existence, no need to go further in means of doing, any and all is in right abstractions and truth very obviously clear



posted on Feb, 26 2012 @ 06:31 PM
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reply to post by Tecumte
 


Yes and I have my personal interpretations, i think its a pretty awesome piece of writing..... as much good there is in the world,,, look at how much bad there is.... amplifications of evil far greater then can exist in a simpler animal world..... with intelligence comes responsibility, which I guess is the implementing the intelligence into a path of wisdom and goodness,,,, fear, the loss of hope, the lack of giving a snip, with minute intelligence or a great amount, can never amount to the goodness produced by those using their will power of heart and mind for goodness sake....... goodness has to be knowingly created,,,,, it has to be maintained,,
edit on 26-2-2012 by ImaFungi because: (no reason given)



what i mean by fear/loss of hope leading to acts of evil,,,, and what i mean by acts of evil not amounting to good........ is that what we like we call good,,,,,, and what destroys, or interferes with what we like is evil........... its hard for good and evil to not be subjective,,,, and this is what the eden story is talking about the mess of contemplation and understanding sorting out reality in emotional and behavioral terms,,,, ordering it, and making it fair, inherent in the system of earthly life is destruction for creation,,,, recycle,,,, and life doesn't complain, it makes do, it does what it does and plays until it loses,,,,,, humans are attempting to make this wild arena,,,, a reflection of their inner potential, a heaven if you will, were there is no evil, and our identities and loved ones a are long lasting,,,etc..... so its hard for good and evil to not be subjective because this world of humans is every man for himself, living at different times,,,,,,,, if my family and i are starving,,,,, how is it not good for me to rob a store for food,,,,, this is bad for a store owner,,,,,,,, if i am a lion and my family is starving how is it not good for me to eat some gazelle....... the only way to make good and evil objective for humanity which is what the law and civil society attempts to do ( very cartoonishly and half sassed) but for every human member of the current world to be a part of the good family,,,, everyone secure,,,,, no need to cheat, or steal,,,, no need to destroy, no need to fear,,,, no hope to lose,,,,, and what gives people hope and meaning, and a reason to willingly do good,,,,, is acceptance, love,, knowledge.....
edit on 26-2-2012 by ImaFungi because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 26 2012 @ 07:04 PM
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reply to post by Starchild23
 

My definition of evil (subject to change) is that it's the result of separation and confusion. The separation stems from finiteness and conservation of energy. The confusion stems from separation. Essentially, people are stupid things just like a mouse or a bush or a bug with varying amounts of success at staying alive. When they're stressed by unspecified limits, this stupid-ness reaches a breaking point and hell spills out.

To have perfect goodness you need perfect clarity, thus no limits on knowledge. Limits on knowledge come from every direction, all of them originate from conservation of energy and finiteness. Finiteness is implied (if not wholly) by conservation of energy because conservation of energy, conceptually, is the idea that you can only fit (x) marbles in a jar. This restriction is the defining characteristic of finiteness.

This idea might be flawed or absolutely wrong. But I feel like a bloodhound on a trail.

Someone on this forum said something that was interesting to me. He asked what if the universe was finite and the god species of this universe grew bored. Lets argue that this god species has already discovered all of the physics and conditions of this universe and has inhabited every fold and fabric of time and space. There's nothing new for this god species to learn. So they became desperate and embittered. As a result of all this, they decided to take on the form of lower lifeforms and forget their knowledge, for a time. They would jump from lower lifeform to lower lifeform, enjoying life again, as they would no longer be bored or cursed with universal knowledge. Now, what gets me thinking is that maybe this is what our universe is. Maybe we will never know a world with close to perfect goodness simply because that would be, in fact, too boring. It might seem insane to us to turn down the offer of maximum goodness. But...

Maybe when we die we will rediscover heightened goodness, grow bored and then come back...

...to this hell. Because we got bored. It's a never ending cycle. Maybe we're addicted to imperfection.

NOTE: To have perfect goodness you need perfect clarity - you cannot have perfect clarity unless you're one step above the universe as a whole and can view all its parts and objectively plot their course. There is really only levels of clarity or levels of goodness. I am not sure perfect goodness is possible even if you have infinite knowledge. My knowledge of math and these ideas in this post are very much in their infancy.
edit on 26-2-2012 by jonnywhite because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 26 2012 @ 07:16 PM
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How many things generally speaking do we know of considered 'evil' that are not at least in part associated with some type of 'pain'.?

How many things do we know of considered 'good' do we know that are not associated with at least in some part 'pleasure'?

I maintain that at the basis and in the beginning this was the root of mankind's learnig to awaken form "eden' and starting to define (devine) 'good' from 'evil, pleasure from pain.



posted on Feb, 26 2012 @ 07:27 PM
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reply to post by Tecumte
 


true..... but an over indulgence ( hedonism) of pleasure can lead to pain.... there is a balance,,,,, im sure heroin is pleasurable/maybe......... I think our morals stem from life being good,,,,,, we are born,,,,, we are turned on,,,, death is turning off,,,, so to continue living is good,,, and with a lot of people we must be good to each other so they can continue living as well.... what is bad or evil is what contradicts life,, what attempts to destruct it or corrupt it ,,,,, and so with this knowledge of good and evil we attempt to grow,, progress towards greater levels of understanding this place we find our self existing in and of.... learning more and more about what we are capable of, and what we want to be capable of.....



posted on Feb, 26 2012 @ 08:16 PM
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Originally posted by ImaFungi
reply to post by Tecumte
 


true..... but an over indulgence ( hedonism) of pleasure can lead to pain.... there is a balance,,,,, im sure heroin is pleasurable/maybe......... I think our morals stem from life being good,,,,,, we are born,,,,, we are turned on,,,, death is turning off,,,, so to continue living is good,,, and with a lot of people we must be good to each other so they can continue living as well.... what is bad or evil is what contradicts life,, what attempts to destruct it or corrupt it ,,,,, and so with this knowledge of good and evil we attempt to grow,, progress towards greater levels of understanding this place we find our self existing in and of.... learning more and more about what we are capable of, and what we want to be capable of.....


Sure, hedonism and only focusing on the pleasure (lack of pain) of the self doesn't do much for humanity at large (maybe, necessarily), but focusing on the larger pleasure (lack of pain) in society seems to be regarded as a virtue.



posted on Feb, 26 2012 @ 08:42 PM
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Your equation falls apart when there is no Evil.


You equate everything based on this Matrix, which is a Closed System Construct, thus, n0thing can be based on this Construct, since n0thing herein can be believed. All Sources must come from without in order to counter the biasedness of this Construct, that, or expect your conclusions to be tainted, such as your conclusions usually are.


Ribbit



posted on Feb, 27 2012 @ 08:34 AM
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reply to post by Starchild23
 


It's not intelligence that breeds evil. The belief that competitive advantage is life's ultimate achievement is what breeds evil.

The most extreme expression of competition is to literally destroy a competitor. To kill him/her/it. Even better if that competitor can also be destroyed retroactively by demonizing, dehumanizing, humiliating him/her into an it either before or after physically destroying him/her. This is the essence of evil. The US engages is pure raw evil all over the world, and is better at demonizing, dehumanizing and humiliating its targeted enemies than any empire has ever been. True evil is too slick to be exposed for what it is, and maybe this is why you seem to have a problem with intelligence. Maybe it's the intelligent expression of evil that scares you so much? Brute, ignorant evil (like the KKK and the nasty stuff that goes on in the bad sections of cities like Calcutta is just as evil as the brilliant, creative stuff that pours out of marketing firms hired by the political parties during every election cycle, and yet it's all focused on one entity's survival over the opposing entity, and the expression of competition that is required to achieve that survival.

As human beings, we swim like fish through a literal ocean of pure evil, and we pass that evil through our fishy little gills for survival in the same way that fish extract oxygen from water with theirs. Every now and then, one of us will take a leap into the sky above the surface of our evil ocean and the feel of the sun on our scales will be like nothing we ever experienced before. And after we drop back into our sea of competitive evil, we never forget what it felt like to not feel the presence and pressure of evil against our bodies for that quick moment. And some of us jump up and into the sun again and again as a result.

But none of us can actually survive outside of the life-giving environment that we exist within. Small bits of evil feed us, clothe us, help us protect ourselves and our loved ones, drive us to shelter ourselves, and even inspire us to compete with others with our ideas and beliefs, with the conviction that we are doing good by battling for our views to be heard and embraced by others. But really, it's about winning against the effort of someone else who's trying to compete with us. Just evil battling evil, even if it's not the spectacular, extreme level of evil that we clearly have a fascination for as a species.
edit on 2/27/2012 by NorEaster because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 27 2012 @ 08:53 AM
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Originally posted by ButtUglyToad
Your equation falls apart when there is no Evil.


You equate everything based on this Matrix, which is a Closed System Construct, thus, n0thing can be based on this Construct, since n0thing herein can be believed. All Sources must come from without in order to counter the biasedness of this Construct, that, or expect your conclusions to be tainted, such as your conclusions usually are.


Ribbit


Don't know if you were responding to me, or even exactly what you we're trying to say, sorry.

But god/good/pleasure vs devil/evil/pain holds up enough times as a 'general' (though not absolute) formula to be of some value IMo in an aid to understanding many of mankinds thought processes and interpretations especially to the realm of religion, IMho but not limited to it.
edit on 27-2-2012 by Tecumte because: change text for clarity



posted on Feb, 27 2012 @ 09:35 AM
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reply to post by Starchild23
 


Intelligence, as in the capacity to acquire, process and utilize available information is hardly "evil". The attitude that intelligence or wisdom, the later being less an element of "smarts" but more the way one uses the available information they have REGARDLESS of how "bright" someone is. In one regard you have raw smarts and combined with an "energy efficient" use of said information. Intelligence is hence both data that is known to a person, and the plasticity of its potential use in novel ways (creativity) and the ability to access vast amounts of data.

You have unbelievable talent in many Savants often with the extreme ability for certain types of memory and ability to access it. Or you have tremendous capacity to visualize an object for example, and translate that into fantastic sculpture, though the later is seen less often then the former. We don't know the mechanism of differentiation between the two, but have seen rather surprising areas of the brain " light up"when people who are Savants using PET scans and fMRI's. If you take "just smart people"who are not Savants the areas of the brain that are used and the flexibility of both volume and bi-hemisphere communication are no different then anyone else. There's just more of it, as in signal density or volume if you will.

For me, wisdom is the ethical and practical use of what you have, the ethical being perhaps more applicable. We often use the term wise to apply in the same way we use the word "experience" That can come with age or the level of varied and/or difficult events in ones life. But I know people who are wise in that they are experienced, and yet may not be the most ethical people you would want to meet.

To me, intelligence has nothing to do with character or ethics, so to arbitrarily call intelligence evil won't cut it with me. Perhaps it's because very smart people who are also a son-of-a-bitch just get our attention. I think the correct word for them would be diabolical.



posted on Feb, 27 2012 @ 09:44 AM
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reply to post by NorEaster
 


"The most extreme expression of competition is to literally destroy a competitor. To kill him/her/it. "


do you think this nature of absorbing other packages of life for ones own continuation is an amplification of earlier activities/.......... in the way that,,, if life evolved from a soup of chemical reactions,,,, certain chemicals and molecules had to attach to others, and take energy from others to build itself,,, even the idea of conformity and mind control getting a mass amount of people to believe you, in turn making them think like you and act like you ( power /control) is a way of taking over "energies",,,



posted on Feb, 27 2012 @ 09:53 AM
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The universe is intelligent, ants are intelligent, but humans have 'intellect'.
It is the 'intellect' that is dangerous because it works on the basis of time. It plans and schemes, it is manipulative, it 'thinks' it can get something better later. The 'intellect', the human mind, does not respond to what is presently happening, it reacts to what it 'thinks' is happening or might happen, or what happened last time. It uses now as a stepping stone to something better, it doesn't see now as it is, it sees it how it should be or could be.
Humans are the only speices that does this because only humans believe in time and death.


edit on 27-2-2012 by Itisnowagain because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 27 2012 @ 03:24 PM
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everyone dont seem to recognize evil for what everyone think that all is intelligent and nothing else

absolute truth freedom has a reason in void, infinite values rights beyond all superiority existing always

so freedom sense is related originally to infinite values rights while the more reality exist as positive value absolutely the more free sense is individually existing and the more absolute free awareness of it all is present

so it is not about intelligence but all about conscious facts through knowledge of all objective positive reasons that will always confirm evil fact

intelligence is all to objective relations justifications so what include its freedom since all is about it and from, then always in truth so intelligence is always positive constancy reasons in objective ways and terms

but knowledge about the existence of what is beyond absolute truth as the reason of positive freedom constant sense is free from infinite values so can be its opposite, while knowing become nothing to intelligence at all and all to one subjective freedom that is inherently not right, since free sense from knowledge effect and not from objective freedom constant facts

evil free sense love the possible opportunity of acting powerful individual one from knowing that freedom reason is beyond all truth so never related to objective realisations and facts,
then evil free sense is positive sense in meaning to take advantage of the situation so to act above objective truth subjectively and fancy on possible effects on all from above as truth do but more

that is why the first thing that evil freedom do when meaning anyother is to point it as inferior thing relative to existence or reality seeking its way inn, so subjectively proving that noone no free sense can be of infinite values beyond truth is winning the base of its wills

that is why the answer or reply to evil is always exclusively by puting it down as never existing right and never freedom right and never will get anywhere of lies, acting knowing clearly the liar evil know he is

the mystery is never about evil freedom presence that is normal fact but the mystery is all about how objective existence became of evil rules

evil freedom is all subjective it knows how it cant even conceive truth as else existing, evil what u call intelligence which is not has nothing at all to do with truth intelligence in realizing objective free constancies

how did it become called intelligent from its powers over objects realities which seem the reason that impress everyone about evil livings which is never my case

so evil rules are clear even in scripture of god powers over all as nothing but possession of free will rights

first, pointing an absolute inferior ground as absolute thing right to possess
second, confirm its absolute inferiority from its weak reactions till it assert loosing its own freedom rights in accepting being ruled totally as a thing
third, act over as absolute possession so worse can be done to or whatever living will as nothing at all to it and all to evil freedom
fourth, from that powerful still stand over absolute thing, start to risk attacks on things done by truth realizations
fifth, dream about infinite life of that in the knowledge that there will always b truth and infinite values existence relative facts, that no way one can compete with or destroy totally, but dream about a subjective way to be happy in inventing how u r really more powerful then truth effects and above truth in ways that convince evil freedom absolutely

god strength is the invention of mercy calling it love while meaning it as fake infinite value that could justify its absolute powers on all freedom rights, while he knows that he cant b the only freedom above absolute freedom truth rights, but mean his fancy as if it is

satan strength in knowing that it can never b the absolute force on all existence rights while he keep imagining it as if it is, is the invention of hate to else existence rights to mean being existing through positive powers of willing things, that is how wherever global war exist is where satan possession is absolutely alive

as i show it this has nothing to do with intelligence nor truth ways of realizing always positive facts and existence realities constancies

the mystery still remain how do they reached with such cheap pretense of intelligence to b so powerful in means and objects possessions moves in songs and positive lies

my guess is what i mean to reveal that necessarily they are manipulated from out

poor us the innocents rights ones but this is another issue while it is all what existence is for



posted on Feb, 28 2012 @ 07:00 PM
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Originally posted by Tecumte

Originally posted by ButtUglyToad
Your equation falls apart when there is no Evil.


You equate everything based on this Matrix, which is a Closed System Construct, thus, n0thing can be based on this Construct, since n0thing herein can be believed. All Sources must come from without in order to counter the biasedness of this Construct, that, or expect your conclusions to be tainted, such as your conclusions usually are.


Ribbit


Don't know if you were responding to me, or even exactly what you we're trying to say, sorry.

But god/good/pleasure vs devil/evil/pain holds up enough times as a 'general' (though not absolute) formula to be of some value IMo in an aid to understanding many of mankinds thought processes and interpretations especially to the realm of religion, IMho but not limited to it.



What eYe was saying is you can't believe your senses, because they are what deceives your mind into believing this Construct to be what you think it is.


Ribbit



posted on Feb, 28 2012 @ 07:07 PM
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Originally posted by Itisnowagain
The universe is intelligent, ants are intelligent, but humans have 'intellect'.
It is the 'intellect' that is dangerous because it works on the basis of time. It plans and schemes, it is manipulative, it 'thinks' it can get something better later. The 'intellect', the human mind, does not respond to what is presently happening, it reacts to what it 'thinks' is happening or might happen, or what happened last time. It uses now as a stepping stone to something better, it doesn't see now as it is, it sees it how it should be or could be.

Humans are the only speices that does this because only humans believe in time and death.



What if Now isn't real? What if you are just playing a part in a computer like generated holographic werld, to make you think you exist as you are and everything is how it is, to get you to buy into this thing called Life?

eYe laid in my tent last night, with my tooth acting up again, asking: "If this isn't real, why make me suffer?"

Guess what the answer was?


Ribbit


Ps: eYe wish eYe could disconnect from the protocols of pain.
eYe know it's possible but eYe don't know how to dew it . . . yet.




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