Libertarians are not Republicans!

It appears that many people are thinking these days that libertarians are republicans, when this is far from the case.

Below I will outline key reasons why libertarians are not republicans and are just aligning with the republican party because they do not have enough momentum or financial backing to penetrate the two party system which they despise so much!

Republicans Believe

Economy

Republicans emphasize the role of free markets and individual achievement as the primary factors behind economic prosperity. To this end, they favor laissez-faire economics, fiscal conservatism, and the promotion of personal responsibility over welfare programs.

Health Care

The party opposes a government-run single-payer health care system, believing such a system constitutes socialized medicine, and is in favor of a personal or employer-based system of insurance, supplemented by Medicare for the elderly and Medicaid, which covers approximately 40% of the poor.

Personal Responsibilities

Republicans support the ideals of the constitution the very same document that allowed this great nation to get out from under British rule. As well as the Boston Tea Party. With a free market and less government regulation Republicans believe that you should be allowed to do anything you want especially when it comes to religious beliefs as long as you follow the current laws. They want government to remain small but enforce the laws already in place. They frequently target corrupt judges within the system.

Environment

According to the platform, "economic prosperity and environmental protection must advance together, environmental regulations should be based on science, the government’s role should be to provide market-based incentives to develop the technologies to meet environmental standards, we should ensure that environmental policy meets the needs of localities, and environmental policy should focus on achieving results processes." Whereas some republicans do not believe that Global Warming is happening and that it is a global tax scheme

Freedom, Immigration, Wars

Republicans support the freedom of Gun Rights and the freedom to come to America legally. Republicans also support the right to worship how you please and the right to say whatever you want! Republicans support a strong military defense and offense.Republicans believe if you have the biggest army no one will think about attacking you for even a second

Libertarians Believe

Economy

In line with the Republican Party

specifically, advocating for lower taxes at every level of government, a reduction in the level of spending in the federal budget, easing the burden of federal regulations on business interests, the reform of the entitlement system, and ending or making significant cuts to the welfare state. They also want to end the federal reserve but what system will replace the federal reserve?

Health Care

Not In line with the Republican Party

Libertarians believe in personal responsible Health Care. Ironically they also call for the deregulation of medical research & marketing as well as ending medical monopolies. Republicans do not believe this, they believe in the current insurance based Health Care system with few government regulations. Libertarians need to ask themselves, what system will replace Health Care if there are no insurance companies?

Personal Responsibilities

Somewhat In line with the Republican Party

Libertarians believe that people should have the freedom to do whatever they want whenever they want as long as you don't hurt others. Hurting others will also be impossible to define under libertarian rule. People should be looking for change all the time. Change the status quo but try not to get corrupt while doing this. (which is impossible) Just look at Facebook they changed the status quo on the internet and Marketing and look how corrupt they are.

As stated clearly above in the Republican section, Republicans want to maintain the status quo which has worked out well for America for the past 250 years!

Environment

Not in line with the Republican Party

Libertarians believe in complete private market solutions to the energy crisis. While Republicans believe that Government should cooperate and not overreach in their power to control the energy companies. Libertarians also believe in the crazy notion that pollution of other people's property is a violation of individual rights.

Immigration/Wars

Not in line with the Republican Party

Libertarians know that we are all immigrants. Each on of us can trace our roots back to a different country. However, while advocating ideas of non-interventionism in war they want to open all of the borders and allow everyone to become a citizen who came here illegally. Libertarians need to ask themselves how would this influx of people be controlled. While this sounds good, it is not in line with how the world works. We need controls in immigration especially when immigrants from the countries that are our enemies come here. Libertarians believe that all war is evil and infringes on the rights of people all over the world. They believe war is a burden on society and the economy. They support pulling out of all bases and shrinking our military to defense only!

So I hope that it is clear that these libertarians while having a FEW similarities with the Republican Party. In reality, the libertarians are really their own entity and shouldn't be injecting themselves into the Republican Party.

Please keep the discussion civil and we are not discussing policies that have been enacted by each party. We are talking about their ideals.

Originally posted by jjf3rd77
It appears that many people are thinking these days that libertarians are republicans, when this is far from the case.

Then what does that make Ron Paul? A libertarian or a Republican?

reply to post by jjf3rd77


This is exactly why the GOP is working so diligently, using every dirty trick in the book, to keep Dr. Paul from winning the popular vote, and coercing delegates to withhold their support. Congressman Paul is a Libertarian, not a Republican. They know this, and they know that he would destroy the stranglehold that their party has on this nation if he were to be elected.
I'm not so sure that spreading this information will help the Doctor. I can certainly foresee it causing die-hard Republicans to fear the fall of the party that they've sold their souls to.

Edit to add: I believe much of what was written in your OP was a bit biased. There were many negative undertones about the Libertarian ideal. One example is the blatant falsehood that Libertarians believe that "all war is evil". You might want to correct that by saying that Libertarians believe that all illegal, unconstitutional, unprovoked wars, fought solely for financial gain and power grabs, are evil.

Originally posted by Southern Guardian

Originally posted by jjf3rd77
It appears that many people are thinking these days that libertarians are republicans, when this is far from the case.

Then what does that make Ron Paul? A libertarian or a Republican?

He is clearly a libertarian who has switched sides. Trying to get republicans to believe in some of the more "crazy" to them libertarian ideas.

Originally posted by Q:1984A:1776
reply to post by jjf3rd77

 

Congressman Paul is a Libertarian, not a Republican. They know this, and they know that he would destroy the stranglehold that their party has on this nation if he were to be elected.

I'm not so sure that spreading this information will help the Doctor. I can certainly foresee it causing die-hard Republicans to fear the fall of the party that they've sold their souls to.

So the republicans know what they are but fear themselves? I dont think so. I think most republicans know what they are. Libertarians are only aligned with republicans on economic issues. The rest of their agenda if anything is more liberal and republicans hate that!

I was just merely spreading information. I have no agenda on this thread.

Originally posted by Southern Guardian

Originally posted by jjf3rd77
It appears that many people are thinking these days that libertarians are republicans, when this is far from the case.

Then what does that make Ron Paul? A libertarian or a Republican?

He's a libertarian Republican. The lower case "l" is a philosophical stance, while the upper case would be party affiliation. At least that's how I've heard the difference explained. I call myself an independent libertarian as I don't believe in party affiliations.

/TOA

You said that LIbertarians want to deregulate the health industry. Then you said Republicans don't want to regulate it.

Libertarians should not be for excessive regulations....
But some Libertarians are really liberals in sheeps clothing.

Originally posted by The Old American

He's a libertarian Republican. The lower case "l" is a philosophical stance, while the upper case would be party affiliation. At least that's how I've heard the difference explained. I call myself an independent libertarian as I don't believe in party affiliations.

/TOA

As you just mentioned philosophy matters much more to libertarians than party or policies that work in the real world. He is only on the Republican ticket to steal votes away from actual republicans.

Originally posted by jjf3rd77

Originally posted by Southern Guardian

Originally posted by jjf3rd77
It appears that many people are thinking these days that libertarians are republicans, when this is far from the case.

Then what does that make Ron Paul? A libertarian or a Republican?

He is clearly a libertarian who has switched sides. Trying to get republicans to believe in some of the more "crazy" to them libertarian ideas.

But he is registered under the Republican party regarless. He may have different motives, but he represents the republican party at the end of the day. There are many libertarians whom are republican supporters, infact I'd say there are more republican registered libertarians than there are libertarian party registered Libertarians.

As for their differences, the only aspect I see that seperates libertarians from your typical republican bunch is foreign policy, the domestic policies might as well be identifical. Most Paulers would point to the federal reserve as another defining difference between them and the rest of conservatives, but most conservatives outside of those of Ron Paul supporters are not all that concerned about Paul's plans to eliminate the federal reserve, infact I think they'd more so support it.

Sean Hannity even likes Ron Paul's domestic plans, I doubt Rush would object all that much either:

Republican talk radio host Sean Hannity has endorsed Ron Paul’s Restore America Plan, which cuts US$1 trillion in federal spending and balances the budget by the third year of a Paul presidency.

“I like your plan,” Hannity told Paul during a radio interview on Monday. The talker went on to compare Paul’s proposal to the Mack-Penny Plan, which would balance the federal budget within 8 years,

www.therightperspective.org...

The only thing that Ron Paul scares them on is his foreign policy, this is at core the problem here.

Originally posted by ThirdEyeofHorus
You said that LIbertarians want to deregulate the health industry. Then you said Republicans don't want to regulate it.

Exactly. Republicans don't want to regulate the industry but they realize that SOME regulation is needed. Libertarians don't want any regulation, in any market.

But some Libertarians are really liberals in sheeps clothing.

I agrees!

Originally posted by Southern Guardian
But he is registered under the Republican party regarless.

I'd say there are more republican registered libertarians than there are libertarian party registered Libertarians.

As for their differences, the only aspect I see that seperates libertarians from your typical republican bunch is foreign policy

Clearly there are more differences between republican and libertarian as my OP proves. And if there are so many registered libertarian republicans why are they hiding behind the republican ticket? Why not give more power to their party?

Originally posted by jjf3rd77

Originally posted by Southern Guardian
But he is registered under the Republican party regarless.

I'd say there are more republican registered libertarians than there are libertarian party registered Libertarians.

As for their differences, the only aspect I see that seperates libertarians from your typical republican bunch is foreign policy

Clearly there are more differences between republican and libertarian as my OP proves. And if there are so many registered libertarian republicans why are they hiding behind the republican ticket? Why not give more power to their party?

Yes, there are differences. I agree with you that Ron Paul should be a registered libertarian- but he isn't. I say this as a registered libertarian, who recognizes that I do lean more to the left than the typical republican. I probably am on par with quite a few liberals out there, truth be told. Really, I don't see myself as either liberal or conservative, but rather as a true moderate.

Shame I can't vote in the primary here in my state, cause I'd be out full force for Dr. Paul otherwise!

reply to post by jjf3rd77


You're right, "Libertarians are not Republicans"...... Well not the Republicans that have evolved to what they are today. I used to be a Republican when I joined the US Air Force 12 years ago. Even though I am still serving, I have changed to Independent since I realized how much the Republicans have strayed from their original values as well as the Democrats. They are both very progressive and neither hold the values of the "Founding Fathers" which were the true Libertarians of their day. They fought for less government and giving power to the States.

You want to be a true conservative, follow the Constitution, the Libertarians.....Ron Paul!

reply to post by iwan2ski


As a real conservative REPUBLICAN. I think that needs to be stressed I clearly see the differences between my republican beliefs compared to those of the libertarian side. To me, the libertarian side makes no sense in the real world, it's too ideological, and that's not just foreign policy. It's funny but I think Libertarians are more liberal.

reply to post by jjf3rd77

Libertarians are not Republicans!

Duh... that's why we belong to the Libertarian Party and not the Republican Party.............

They also want to end the federal reserve but what system will replace the federal reserve?

A Free Market? You know.. one where banks don't regulate banks and end up looting the Tax Payers for every penny (and trillions more) they've got?

Libertarians need to ask themselves, what system will replace Health Care if there are no insurance companies?

A cheap one? You know.. one where a Fascist government doesn't force us through a middle man to fleece us of our money while holding our lives over our heads in the name of corporate profits?

As stated clearly above in the Republican section, Republicans want to maintain the status quo which has worked out well for America for the past 250 years!

Learn history. There is no such thing as an American "status quo" outside of the society we live in today. 2012 is not the same nation it was in 1800, and 1800 was nothing like 1776. What's "worked" for America .. since WWI anyways.. is suppressing other nations militarily, plundering them, destroying them, then loaning them the money to rebuild and shipping supplies of war to them.

Libertarians also believe in the crazy notion that pollution of other people's property is a violation of individual rights.

It's not?

However, while advocating ideas of non-interventionism in war they want to open all of the borders and allow everyone to become a citizen who came here illegally. Libertarians need to ask themselves how would this influx of people be controlled.

WTF?

Libertarians believe in Isolationism .. the Party stands by closed-borders and most Libertarians also believe in limiting legal immigration as well. The model favored is that used by Japan actually.

In reality, the libertarians are really their own entity and shouldn't be injecting themselves into the Republican Party.

WE don't interject ourselves into the Republican Party.. There ARE such things as Libertarian Republicans .. but usually it's REPUBLICANS pretending to be Libertarians (Tea Party anyone????)

Originally posted by Southern Guardian

Originally posted by jjf3rd77
It appears that many people are thinking these days that libertarians are republicans, when this is far from the case.

Then what does that make Ron Paul? A libertarian or a Republican?

Ron Paul had a falling out with Libertarian Party leadership .. personally I think it had far more to do with the fact that he is a Congressman for a straight-ticket Republican district in Texas. If he were a Libertarian candidate he'd probably get voted out by sheer accident because the voters pick the guy with the (R) by his name.

reply to post by ThirdEyeofHorus

But some Libertarians are really liberals in sheeps clothing.

Duh. What do you get when you have a Liberal who doesn't like the Government? A Libertarian.

And while Libertarians might be Liberals.. Republicans are downright Fascist. A form of Socialism. Strong centralized government mandating social, economic, military and health policy through corporations.

Yeah ... I'll stick with being called a "Liberal" over that garbage any day.

The reason the libertarian party cannot get powerful is because it's totally against their philosophy. They don't like the two party system. They believe that even stealing 10-20% of the vote which is where the libertarian guy is polling nationally now is "shaking up the system" and "waking people up." But they can't possibly get larger because then they would actually have to participate in dirty politics and go against their very beliefs.

There is no conspiracy behind the two party system except for the fact that the Libertarians themselves, don't actually want to try and become powerful because that's against their beliefs. Furthermore, Libertarian's may feel betrayed by Paul and his campaign because of how powerful he has become. I have never heard of a libertarians besides his son say that they like him. Not one in power anyway. Although I may be wrong about that because I don't keep one eye locked on his campaign.

Its when you compare the Libertarians to the democrats that you see the real differences

This is why you see many Libertarians vote for republicans and rarely see them vote for democrats.

This is also why the republicans try to get there votes. Its a lesser of two evils.

I vote ether republican or Libertarian and it would be a cold day in hell before i would vote for a democrat.

I am anti organised religion and don't care for the religious right, But i have so many things more i hate about the democrats that i can not count them all.
But i also know that a Libertarian can not get voted in as president right now, So i have to vote for a republican or take the chance that Obama will get voted back in

reply to post by jjf3rd77

They believe that even stealing 10-20% of the vote which is where the libertarian guy is polling nationally now is "shaking up the system" and "waking people up."

The reason many Libertarians don't switch from the Republican Party is that they may perhaps still believe in the ultimate aims of Republicans over Libertarianism. Members of the Libertarian Party are the "extremist" of the "right wing" .. obviously not all Libertarians are extremist.. and may feel better connected to the Republican Party.

The Republican Party is so large it has numerous factions within it (just like the Dems).. sometimes you see factions like the "Tea Party" target their own members for failure because they belong to another faction (Like RHINO's, Neocons, Evangelicals)

But they can't possibly get larger because then they would actually have to participate in dirty politics and go against their very beliefs.

I've never heard a Libertarian ever say they didn't like the Republican Party because of "dirty politics" ... and we don't grow larger (ahem.. even though we are the fastest growing party) because Libertarianism is a FRINGE political belief. You know.. the crazies.

Libertarian's may feel betrayed by Paul and his campaign because of how powerful he has become.

OK .. well HI .. I'm Rockpuck. I'm a registered Libertarian. I like Ron Paul.

Ron Paul has done a great job at displaying the corruption in the political system .. comparing him side by side to other candidates shows how fake and molded they are. It's waking people up to the idea that you don't have to follow the Neocons (Romney) or the Evangelicals (Santorum) or even the rhino's (Newt) .. that there are other options that the GOP despises that you can follow.

If the Libertarian Party could come up with a Ron Paul substitute the party would explode in ranks.