Let's Cut to the Chase - Iran Must Be Stopped

Originally posted by Xcathdra
reply to post by MagnumOpus

 

Please point out what your post has to do with Iran?
Its not adifficult concept to understand that Iran is the topic of conversation, regardless of how many times you are going to cowardly attempt to shift discussion away from them.

Its simple.. you are incapable of defending Irans position, so you are desperately trying to shift the topic.. Typical and an old tired excuse used on this site.

Please, defend Iran and their quest for nuclear weapons.

Hmmm...I don't know.

I have continuously illustrated why it's a MUCH better idea to have a nuclear Iran than an invaded Iran. Everytime I provide the links to source material you request you simply ignore the post and ask the same rhetorical questions.

If you don't want the answer...stop asking the question.

Originally posted by milominderbinder
If you don't want the answer...stop asking the question.

The questions deal with Iran, not Israel or the US. No matter how much you and others are trying to shift the topic, its still the same - Iran.

Its evident you and others dont like the question by the number of desperate attempts to ignore it / attempt to shift focus.

The topic is Iran, not Israel or the US. Its calling into question the need for Irans nuclear program to expand into the weapons portion and their rationale for it, which is to say there is no rationale for Iran.

Originally posted by Ben81
Flags dont lies !

Wow.... that says so much about your position and beleifs its not even funny. Its also where I stopped reading as it was yet another sign of your inability to discuss the issue, while trying to change the topic.

Originally posted by Xcathdra

Originally posted by Ben81
Flags dont lies !

Wow.... that says so much about your position and beleifs its not even funny. Its also where I stopped reading as it was yet another sign of your inability to discuss the issue, while trying to change the topic.

edit on 5-3-2012 by Xcathdra because: (no reason given)

I take it more like a Poll

If they would do a massive American Poll (no fraud this time)l
you would see how many americans DONT WANT AN IRAN WAR

Stop twisting the truth and changing the subject
it starting to be a little annoying

Again Iran is the topic here ... theres nothing to stop in Iran
are they murdering people in the street like Syria is right now ? NO
you dont have any reason to support the argument that Iran needs to be stoped

Stop trolling around spreading disinfo
this thread should go into the SKUNK WORK

Israel's parnoia on even Iran learning how to build a nuke. Every nuclear physicist knows how to build one.

It is spherical shape charge high velocity explosive lenses detonated at multiple points (18 pts) with exploding wire detonators hooked to hydrogen thyratron connected to a special high joule capacitor. Then a nice little D-T neutron generator flash tube. It isn't that difficult. Fusion--add some lithium deuteride and make a big cigar hydrogen bomb. Pretty simple physics.

As best I can tell even the Mafia has nuclear bomb plans for sale as some drug junkie from a weapons lab pulled the design plans out on the thumb drive for long term drug supply deal. So, the know how for a nuke bomb is all over the place out there.

Isreal is playing games on what all nuclear physicists all know how to do:

====

www.cnn.com...

Obama and Netanyahu focus on Iran's nuclear program

While Obama's statements are consistent with his past pronouncements, his specific reference to preventing Iran from developing a nuclear weapon -- rather than the capability of building a nuclear weapon -- maintained what some consider to be a difference between his and Netanyahu's position.

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www.legitgov.org...

Alan Colmes Blasts Pro-Israel Media Pushing for Iran War

======

I wonder where I've heard this before-----oh yeah----right here on this thread !!!

It appears some silly people think it possible to only talk about Iran, when the issue of Iran goes well beyond just Iran. For Instance:

====

freebeacon.com...

Netanyahu to Obama: Israel ‘reserves the right’ to strike
Netanyahu: 'MY SUPREME RESPONSIBILITY AS PRIME MINISTER OF ISRAEL IS TO ENSURE THAT ISRAEL REMAINS THE MASTER OF ITS FATE'

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www.algemeiner.com...#

Israel’s Channel 2: U.S. Officials Believe Netanyahu Has Already Decided to Strike Iran

“A senior official stressed in a conversation with News 2 there is a dispute between Israel and the United States on the question of ‘day after’, which means the price of attacking Iranian nuclear facilities,” Channel 2′s report says.

American officials have warned their Israeli counterparts about a regional war in the region following an attack on Iran, along with the collapse of Israel’s stock market and an arms race in the Middle East, according to the report.


====

Looks like the "Day After" issues might well be that Israel won't be there anymore. imho

It will become most interesting----with some 100,000 rockets around Israel and Iron Dome won't sustain that. Plus, some Russian Bears with Rotary Launchers will be around the corner.

my father believed...

that man, by nature,
was a dang mess...

and that only by picking up
God's rhythms...

were we able to regain
power and beauty.

To him, all good things, trout as well
as eternal salvation, come by grace.

And grace comes by art,
and art does not come easy.

Originally posted by milominderbinder

Ummmm...you and Hospitallers are the ones invoking Israel as a justification to suck the U.S. into yet another war. You guys brought up Israel...not me.

That's not just a lie - it's a DAMN lie, and this is the second time you've told it without bothering to even attempt to back your claim up. It's against ATS T+C to knowingly post false information, and the thread is right here to provide the evidence. Put up or shut up. Show me the post where I initiated the conversation on Israel .

In regards to Iran's response to the IAEA...what's the problem? I just don't get it.

That has been patiently explained to you, repeatedly. If you "don't get it", that's no one's fault but your own.

1. I am perfectly comfortable with a nuclear Iran. In fact, I think it may serve to even tone down our wanton policies of agression and destabilization in the middle east.

It's not about your personal comfort.

2. Why do we care that Iran is doing the exact same thing Israel did in 1969?

Because Iran is not doing "exactly the same thing", as has been repeatedly pointed out.

3. WHY DOES IRAN FEEL LIKE THEY NEED NUKES TO BE HEARD?? Is it perhaps a product of our 59-year and counting persistant attempts to keep Iran in chaos?

No reason for them to feel that way, at all. They are being heard on a daily basis, even without a bomb - not our problem if they are ranting instead of rational. That fact alone - that they are already being heard on a daily basis - would indicate that is not their reason for wanting a nuke...

4. So...the "solution" to get Iran to back down on it's nuke program is to park a couple of nuclear capable carrier battle groups off their shore and destroy their economy with harsh sanctions? That's IDIOTIC.

No, that's "strategy". Break their bank, and they'll have less money to pour into nukes. If sanctions "destroy their economy", that's no one's fault but their own for ignoring them.

History tells us that the most dangerous adversary in warfare or negotiations is ALWAYS the one who feels that they have nothing to lose. When backed into an inescapable corner, your adversary always has an EASIER time recruiting troops and gaining support at home...and the troops that do come out will almost ALWAYS fight harder and longer and more successfully.

That's a rather deep and involved discussion, but if you really want to have a discussion on the relative strategic merits of backing an adversary into a corner, we can do that. The short version is that what you say here is so, as far as it goes. the problem is it doesn't go far enough.

Besides...as we know from Iraq #2 opening up for inspections and being in compliance doesn't mean a damn thing, right? Remember when UN inspector Hans Blix turned Iraq upside down and said they don't have any WMD's?? What good did cooperation do the Iraqi government or the couple of hundred thousand civilians we have killed there?

Ask Baghdad Bob, not me. he had an amusing way of demonstrating "cooperation". From the outside looking in, it looked more like "delusion".

And if they refuse to comply...what? We bomb them and hope like hell that Russia and China don't side with them?

Not my first choice of solutions, but do what you've gotta do.

Bomb them so that we can be absolutely sure they launch that first nuke just as soon as it's ready? Let's face it...given how incompetent our intelligence agencies performed in locating WMD's and finding Bin Laden there really isn't anything to say that they don't already have 10 or 20 of them, right?

Wait... WHAT? Aren't you the one who's been going along denying they are intent on producing nuclear weapons? Why the about face?

What if we go play cowboy and we find out the hard way that Iran has a couple of HUNDRED of Soviet surplus nukes? Remember....there are THOUSANDS of them that are "missing". Wouldn't that be cute...we start a full blown nuclear war to stop Iran from getting what they already have.

Oh, they'd get "stopped" alright - brought up hard against a glowing wall, with nothing but oblivion on the other side of it.

IT REALLY DOESN'T MATTER IF IRAN IS IN EITHER IN OR OUT OF COMPLIANCE, IS THREATENING ISRAEL...OR IS THREATENING US FOR THAT MATTER. IDEALS ARE IRRELEVANT IF THEY CANNOT BE ACTUALIZED.

Refusal to comply is not an "ideal", it's an action. Action... doesn't that come from the same root as "actualize"?

...but we are going to kill a couple hundred thousand Iranian civilians who "get in the way", disarm Iran...and that will be what makes them want Starbucks, rock music, and an NFL team?

That is INSANE.

Yes, it is. Why in the hell would we care if they want Starbucks, rock music, or an NFL team? Hell, they'd probably just publicly execute them any how.

Originally posted by Ben81


If they would do a massive American Poll (no fraud this time)l
you would see how many americans DONT WANT AN IRAN WAR

You're right - we don't want an Iran war. we want a safe Iran. If it takes a war to make that happen, that would be a function of Iranian intransigence.

Originally posted by Ben81


I take it more like a Poll

If they would do a massive American Poll (no fraud this time)l
you would see how many americans DONT WANT AN IRAN WAR

Stop twisting the truth and changing the subject
it starting to be a little annoying

I am also sure,that if they were to do a poll in Iran (no fraud this time),The Iranian people would have free elections,not mandated by a Supreme Leader. I also believe they wouldn't want a War with Israel or America.I would even bet they would let Inspectors do their job,and would vehemently abhor their Government,if they found that those who rule in Iran are indeed gearing up to build Nuclear weapons.

See,the American public,and the Iranian public probably agree more then their own Governments.

Originally posted by MagnumOpus
It appears some silly people think it possible to only talk about Iran, when the issue of Iran goes well beyond just Iran.

And it appears that other silly people think IRAN is spelled I-S-R-A-E-L, as often as they attempt to intrude it into the conversation. The issue does NOT go beyond Iran, since no one else is violating the NPT for them, They're doing that all of their own volition.

Darrrn, the News Media can't seem to leave off Isreal when speaking of Bombing Iran. I know that must have your Tammuz Tidy Whities in a real bind and you are having major problems delivering that Istar Easter Egg to hatch up some Satan plans. I know that has to be causing a real back up with that kind of blockage that you have and everyone in the media ignores you.

Relax, Obama will insure that Israel attacks Iran. Remember, you are not in charge. The US won't have to lift a finger, when this other sly gang has their own nukes. Then we get to play out Revelation with all those people from the North tired of the sly Ishtar gang. Your Ishtar Egg hatching will have to wait....

====

www.haaretz.com...

Romney: Iran will obtain a nuclear weapon if Obama is re-elected

Republican presidential candidate Mitt Romney said Sunday that if U.S. President Barack Obama is elected to a second term in the White House, Iran would surely become nuclear, AFP reported.

"It's pretty straightforward in my view. If Barack Obama is re-elected, Iran will have a nuclear weapon and the world will change if that's the case," AFP quoted Romney as saying to supporters in Atlanta, Georgia.

====


www.guardian.co.uk...

Israel 'not rushing into Iran war'Shimon Peres to tell Aipac conference what analysts also suggest is the case – that Israel is in no hurry to attack Iran

====


Isreal's Paranoia of how they did sly things to get some nukes will always pull them down. Outsmarting Albert Pike's games for WWIII is highly desirable. Leave the Christian elements to watch how fast Zionists convert.

Originally posted by Xcathdra

Originally posted by milominderbinder
If you don't want the answer...stop asking the question.

The questions deal with Iran, not Israel or the US. No matter how much you and others are trying to shift the topic, its still the same - Iran.

Its evident you and others dont like the question by the number of desperate attempts to ignore it / attempt to shift focus.

The topic is Iran, not Israel or the US. Its calling into question the need for Irans nuclear program to expand into the weapons portion and their rationale for it, which is to say there is no rationale for Iran.

edit on 5-3-2012 by Xcathdra because: (no reason given)

See the previous post:

"I have continuously illustrated why it's a MUCH better idea to have a nuclear Iran than an invaded Iran. Everytime I provide the links to source material you request you simply ignore the post and ask the same rhetorical questions."

reply to post by Ben81


Such a weak response.. I see now why you wanted to obfuscate and disucss something else.

It doesnt remove the fact that Iran is not complying with their IAEA / NPT requirements, so again, Iran needs to be stopped. If they cant be truthful about what they are making, why should we beleive them when it comes to things like not sentencing the preacher to death because of his religion but because he was a "security" issue?

Or when they say they have no gays in their country? I assume its because they ahve killed them all without trial / due process.

Or how the Iranian government locked down on media outlets during this last election so they could better control the fraudulent outcome of their elections?

Iran needs to be stopped.... Especially before the "child" reaches the "knife" and begins to run around the middle east with it.

Originally posted by nenothtu

Originally posted by MagnumOpus
It appears some silly people think it possible to only talk about Iran, when the issue of Iran goes well beyond just Iran.

And it appears that other silly people think IRAN is spelled I-S-R-A-E-L, as often as they attempt to intrude it into the conversation. The issue does NOT go beyond Iran, since no one else is violating the NPT for them, They're doing that all of their own volition.

Once again...

It was the Royal Order of the Hospitallers & Xcathdra that kept pounding Israel INTO the equation because "Iran is threatening Israel!!!" about 400 times until you both got a little history lesson and realized that Israel really is the biggest threat to stability in the Middle East.

It's all in the posts, guys. You can't run away from it just because the factual data doesn't support your opinion.

It's not a big deal guys....changing your opinion based upon new data is generally referred to as "learning". There really is no shame in it.

Originally posted by Xcathdra
reply to post by Ben81

 

Such a weak response.. I see now why you wanted to obfuscate and disucss something else.

It doesnt remove the fact that Iran is not complying with their IAEA / NPT requirements, so again, Iran needs to be stopped. If they cant be truthful about what they are making, why should we beleive them when it comes to things like not sentencing the preacher to death because of his religion but because he was a "security" issue?

Or when they say they have no gays in their country? I assume its because they ahve killed them all without trial / due process.

Or how the Iranian government locked down on media outlets during this last election so they could better control the fraudulent outcome of their elections?

Iran needs to be stopped.... Especially before the "child" reaches the "knife" and begins to run around the middle east with it.

FOR THE 100TH TIME...NOBODY IS SAYING THE IRANIANS AREN'T NUTS!! THEY ARE!!

They're just not any MORE nuts than our own religious zealots and militant fascists who ALSO deny science, history, a basic understanding of statistics and quantifiable data, and due process.

RELIGIOUS LOONS ARE RELIGIOUS LOONS whether it's Khamenei, Bin Laden, Bandar, Netanyahu, Santorum, Romney or lil' Bush.

Same difference!!! Sure the specific NUANCES of the rhetoric are different...but all of the aforementioned think that a magical entity named "God" is talking to them and they use this as a justification for killing people.

THEY ARE ALL INSANE!!!

The point is that THE UNITED STATES HASN'T DONE A DAMN THING RIGHT IN DECADES. WE ARE INCOMPETENT. A NUCLEAR IRAN MIGHT BE A GOOD THING IF DETERRED US FROM MEDDLING IN MORE MIDDLE EASTERN REGIME CHANGE THAT HAS BEEN BACKFIRING ON US FOR 60+ YEARS.

Originally posted by MagnumOpus
Darrrn, the News Media can't seem to leave off Isreal when speaking of Bombing Iran. I know that must have your Tammuz Tidy Whities in a real bind and you are having major problems delivering that Istar Easter Egg to hatch up some Satan plans. I know that has to be causing a real back up with that kind of blockage that you have and everyone in the media ignores you.

Relax, Obama will insure that Israel attacks Iran. Remember, you are not in charge. The US won't have to lift a finger, when this other sly gang has their own nukes. Then we get to play out Revelation with all those people from the North tired of the sly Ishtar gang. Your Ishtar Egg hatching will have to wait....

====

www.haaretz.com...

Romney: Iran will obtain a nuclear weapon if Obama is re-elected

Republican presidential candidate Mitt Romney said Sunday that if U.S. President Barack Obama is elected to a second term in the White House, Iran would surely become nuclear, AFP reported.

"It's pretty straightforward in my view. If Barack Obama is re-elected, Iran will have a nuclear weapon and the world will change if that's the case," AFP quoted Romney as saying to supporters in Atlanta, Georgia.

====


www.guardian.co.uk...

Israel 'not rushing into Iran war'Shimon Peres to tell Aipac conference what analysts also suggest is the case – that Israel is in no hurry to attack Iran

====


Isreal's Paranoia of how they did sly things to get some nukes will always pull them down. Outsmarting Albert Pike's games for WWIII is highly desirable. Leave the Christian elements to watch how fast Zionists convert.

edit on 5-3-2012 by MagnumOpus because: The Istar Egg hatching will have to wait---kackling!!

You notice how nobody wants to "talk about Israel" anymore ever since I provided the link to the CIA report that shows that Israel did the same damn thing in 1969 that Iran is doing today...only to have us respond by REWARDING Israel for their non-compliance?

How long do you think it will take before anybody admits that they didn't really understand the history of the region.

reply to post by MagnumOpus


The onlything we have going in our favor is the level of stupidity Iran is showing. They are certainly giving the Nazis a run for their money when it comes to stating one thing while doing something completely different.

At least Iranian scientists (the ones who are left unfortunately) are at least smarter than their Nazi counterparts by actually taking protective precautions before doing their explosives tests. The Nazis almost learned that lesson the hard way, lucky for them they didnt get the reaction needed to set the bomb off.

Arab countries ahve tried time and time again to remove Israel through direct military actions, combined direct military actions, covert military actions, and to date, have all failed. The last step is a nuclear weapon, and the wingnuts in Iran have been beating the exterminate Israel drum for about 30+ years now while working on their nuke program, the very same one the Aytaollah in 1979 ended.

I guess this is their last chance to prove themselvs men by developing a nuclear weapon to use on Israel? You know Israel, the very same country Iran states time and again is no threat to them and no match to them in military comparison.

If Iran feels that way, why the onstant need to destroy them?

Or is that from the fact that Arba countries had their asses handed to them so many times in the past that Iran wants to make up for it?

If Israel is not a threat, then why does Iran fixate on them?
If Israel is no threat then why does Iran need a nuclear deterent against them?
If Israel is no threat, why doesnt Iran allow IAEA inspectors into their nuke facilities?
If Israel is no threat, then why does Iran tuck tail and scream for Russia to help them?

Case in point -

ATS Thread - Iran tested nukes in north korea

Originally posted by MagnumOpus
Darrrn, the News Media can't seem to leave off Isreal when speaking of Bombing Iran.

The news media is not this thread, nor is it bound by the topic of this thread.

I know that must have your Tammuz Tidy Whities in a real bind and you are having major problems delivering that Istar Easter Egg to hatch up some Satan plans. I know that has to be causing a real back up with that kind of blockage that you have and everyone in the media ignores you.

1) It's "tighty whities" I don't live near an ocean, care nothing about tides.

2) Unless you are Jewish, call me by my right name, not the Jewish bastardization of it. It's "Dumuzi", not "Tammuz".

3) I don't recall asking the media to pay any attention to me.

Relax, Obama will insure that Israel attacks Iran. Remember, you are not in charge. The US won't have to lift a finger, when this other sly gang has their own nukes. Then we get to play out Revelation with all those people from the North tired of the sly Ishtar gang. Your Ishtar Egg hatching will have to wait....

The words "Obama" and "insure" are a real sore spot with me when placed in juxtaposition with one another,

"Revelation" played out a long time ago, as it was being written. You're reading too much into it.

www.haaretz.com...

Romney: Iran will obtain a nuclear weapon if Obama is re-elected

Republican presidential candidate Mitt Romney said Sunday that if U.S. President Barack Obama is elected to a second term in the White House, Iran would surely become nuclear, AFP reported.

"It's pretty straightforward in my view. If Barack Obama is re-elected, Iran will have a nuclear weapon and the world will change if that's the case," AFP quoted Romney as saying to supporters in Atlanta, Georgia.

American political posturing in an election season. Whod've thunk it? is there some particular reason I should care what Romney has to say about anything at all?

I left out the last comment you made - it was all "Israel" and "zionist", and so had nothing whatsoever to do with the topic. Therefore, it neither required nor warranted any response.

Originally posted by milominderbinder

Once again...

It was the Royal Order of the Hospitallers & Xcathdra that kept pounding Israel INTO the equation because "Iran is threatening Israel!!!" about 400 times until you both got a little history lesson and realized that Israel really is the biggest threat to stability in the Middle East.

It's all in the posts, guys. You can't run away from it just because the factual data doesn't support your opinion.

It's not a big deal guys....changing your opinion based upon new data is generally referred to as "learning". There really is no shame in it.

Yes, "once again"... and STILL not a single link to a single post supporting that blatant lie.

Do you know what they call someone who habitually, repeatedly, and intentionally lies? Seriously - there is a word for that sort of person that describes that condition and only that condition.

I'll wait right here for that history lesson - assuming you can manage to find one.