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Shocking Annoucment about Chemtrails on MSM

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posted on Feb, 24 2012 @ 06:20 PM
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reply to post by Alchemst7
 


I think a fine line needs to be drawn as to what is being interpreted as chem trails. From what I inderstand it as, the actuall exhaust of the jet engine has higher levels of sulfur dioxide which is intently increased to creat the little mirrors as the video is explaining to help reflect the sun light. The sulfur dioxide in the exhaust lingers in the atmosphere for up to 2 years, thats why the con/chem trail seems like it is blanketing the sky.

I see only one problem with that statement:
You present it as if it is actually happening, yet your source is only a possible proposal.

This is from YOUR source. You must have missed:

As for the sulfur in fuel option, current jet fuel sulfur levels are around 400ppm, mostly due to the removal of sulfur by use of hydroprocessing to meet other parts of the jet fuel specification or the fact that low sulfur feedstock is available (27-29). Jet aircraft have a specification limit of 3000ppm in their fuel in the U.S. and similar elsewhere, so the level could be increased by a factor of almost 8 without any modification to the specifications (30).

The refiners would have to reformulate the fuel, but ironically, since their recent problems have largely been how to remove sulfur, this would require modifying their refining process to add more, a job that might take 5 years or so to complete (31, 32) or reverse, locking in the strategy. Thus, if this strategy were to be adopted, it would have to be continued for some time, even if the results were unacceptable.

Effects of the higher sulfur content on corrosion of turbine blades and other engine parts would need to be understood. Also, since jets only fly in the lower stratosphere about 80% of the time (not sure if time is equivalent to fuel usage and 80% is my estimate), consideration would have to be given to environmental impacts during the takeoff and landing phases as well as to how much sulfur is actually burned while the aircraft are in the stratosphere.

The above is certainly NOT A CONFIRMATION!


The other theory out there is that there are other metalic particles being added to jet fuel for a dual purpose. For instance Stadis-450 is added to jet fuel as a static dissipator. This additive ingredients is a trade secret and is not disclosed but is assumed to contain either barium salts or alluminum or thorium oxides.

Not quite true. Here is the Safety Data Sheet for "Stadis-450". There are only two "trade secret" ingredients involved:
1) A polymer containing sulpher

2) A polymer containing nitrogen

As you may have noticed, "barium salts or alluminum or thorium oxides" are NOT among the ingredients.


There are many additives added to jet fuels which can explain the con/chem trails coming from the jets

Then what are they? As for me, I'm going with:
Water vapor produced by the combustion process!

See ya,
Milt




posted on Feb, 24 2012 @ 06:22 PM
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reply to post by Phage
 




Yes, it looks like clear skies. No clouds anyway. No contrails. It could be hazy though. Is it unusual for Texas to be windy? Doesn't wind kick up dust? Doesn't dust make things hazy.

I will answer all of your elementary questions.
No, not clear skies, Phage.
No contrails in your photographs, but me saying they continued doesn't mean anything to you, huh?
Yes, it is hazy, and it will stay that way as long as they are spraying.
Not unusual to be windy, not unusual for it to not be windy, what difference does that make?
Yes, wind can kick up dust, are you being facetious? Or, are you just trying to put some doubt into the minds of those that don't really think? It is not dry, Phage, but the air is.
Dust makes things hazy, yes. Good job.



posted on Feb, 24 2012 @ 06:22 PM
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Originally posted by ThirdRock69
reply to post by Human_Alien
 





I'm lost in your analogy. Can you elaborate a bit more? Thanks


I think they are saying that the solution is worse than the problem.

It's the old story, a farmer wants to get rid of mice eating his wheat in the barn so he gets a cat. Then the cats become a problem so he gets a dog. After the dog gets rid of the cats he wants to get rid of the dogs so he gets a lion. Then to get rid of the lion he gets an elephant. Finally to get rid of the elephant he gets a mouse.




Oh. Thank you. That's what I THOUGHT the message was. Wasn't sure though.

But like I just posted, these people here on this thread aren't the problem. Not in the scheme of things. Do you think the people with money and resources, who are trying to get answers about this aerosol spraying care about the likes of the Chads in the world? Nah.

There's enough of us behind and onto this to try to demand answers.
And at worse?......we'll have an entire planet, dying.



posted on Feb, 24 2012 @ 06:24 PM
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reply to post by Human_Alien
 


Do you think the people with money and resources, who are trying to get answers about this aerosol spraying care about the likes of the Chads in the world? Nah.


And yet, in spite of that money and those resources, they have produced nothing but speculation after the years of "research". Not one shred of evidence of spraying.

So demand those answers! Get on it! Do something!
edit on 2/24/2012 by Phage because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 24 2012 @ 06:31 PM
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I have a proposal:

There are many members of ATS with strong feelings about the trails that form behind airplanes. There are also a good number of pilots on the ATS website; some of whom surely fall into both camps. I would like to suggest forming a committee from both sides of this issue's fence; a committee to perform an in depth scientific investigation of the trails that form behind airplanes.

This committee would create a test which would sample the suspicious trail's contents "in situ" while they are still freshly formed. The committee would oversee the testing procedure with all members present to insure the validity of the samples.

The samples would be hand carried by the committee in its entirety to a lab to perform the various tests (gas chromatograph and such) needed to ascertain the contents of the samples. The committee would physically monitor and document every single step of testing and every single interaction with the sample to insure no errors or substitutions were made.

The committee would be informed of the results together as a group and be provided with exact duplicate copies of the test results. The integrity of the duplicate reports would be examined together by those on the committee at the time of receipt to insure that all the reports were indeed true duplicates. Once verified the reports could then be freely distributed by each member of the committee however they see fit.

The process would undoubtedly have a cost attached to it to cover the plane rental and testing of the samples. We could reduce this expense by utilizing the resources available on ATS to help secure both the plane and the testing facility. ATS may even wish to sponsor the test so that the site can claim the honor of performing such a strictly monitored scientific test and the resulting publicity that goes along with it.

What do you guys think of my proposal? Under these circumstances listed above could we not once and for all put to rest the question of what those trails behind airplanes are composed of?



posted on Feb, 24 2012 @ 06:40 PM
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Originally posted by Dilligaf28
I have a proposal:

There are many members of ATS with strong feelings about the trails that form behind airplanes. There are also a good number of pilots on the ATS website; some of whom surely fall into both camps. I would like to suggest forming a committee from both sides of this issue's fence; a committee to perform an in depth scientific investigation of the trails that form behind airplanes.

This committee would create a test which would sample the suspicious trail's contents "in situ" while they are still freshly formed. The committee would oversee the testing procedure with all members present to insure the validity of the samples.

The samples would be hand carried by the committee in its entirety to a lab to perform the various tests (gas chromatograph and such) needed to ascertain the contents of the samples. The committee would physically monitor and document every single step of testing and every single interaction with the sample to insure no errors or substitutions were made.

The committee would be informed of the results together as a group and be provided with exact duplicate copies of the test results. The integrity of the duplicate reports would be examined together by those on the committee at the time of receipt to insure that all the reports were indeed true duplicates. Once verified the reports could then be freely distributed by each member of the committee however they see fit.

The process would undoubtedly have a cost attached to it to cover the plane rental and testing of the samples. We could reduce this expense by utilizing the resources available on ATS to help secure both the plane and the testing facility. ATS may even wish to sponsor the test so that the site can claim the honor of performing such a strictly monitored scientific test and the resulting publicity that goes along with it.

What do you guys think of my proposal? Under these circumstances listed above could we not once and for all put to rest the question of what those trails behind airplanes are composed of?


I wish you guys would catch up we already determined that all you would have to do is, run tests on aircraft cabin filters that have already flown threw the trails left by the aircraft ahead of them.
Simple, cheap and right to the point.



posted on Feb, 24 2012 @ 06:46 PM
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reply to post by Human_Alien
 


Local news station confirms barium in chemtrails

Nope! Not at all! They only confirmed that there were high levels of barium in Bill Nichols samples. And... that there are many who CLAIM that these high levels of barium come from "chemtrails".

Orange you glad I'm back?


See ya,
Milt



posted on Feb, 24 2012 @ 06:51 PM
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reply to post by Dilligaf28
 


How in the world are you going to authenticate a 'pilot' on a conspiracy forum? So far all I see are arm-chair 'know it alls'.
It's very easy to pretend to be someone you're not here on the world wide web of lies.

For instance, I don't believe for a moment, Weed is/was a pilot. I will spare my suspicions for I don't want this post confiscated due to ill-manners.

The rest?....well, if they didn't sign up using their real names, with a traceable ISP address from the get-go then, who they claim they are now is irrelevant and a waste of bandwidth.

But I like your idea
. However, near impossible to prove I'm afraid.



posted on Feb, 24 2012 @ 06:54 PM
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reply to post by Gmoneycricket
 



Just get on board a plane?.......and sample the air? Really?

How would you know which plane to board? Your idea sound superficially unrealistic.

This is real life. Not a Wile E Coyote cartoon.


edit on 24-2-2012 by Human_Alien because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 24 2012 @ 06:55 PM
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reply to post by Human_Alien
 





Do you think the people with money and resources, who are trying to get answers about this aerosol spraying care about the likes of the Chads in the world? Nah.



The problem with getting answers that are sufficient to prove these spray programs are happening is a difficult one. The difficulty lies in the techniques they use to "spray". I have a few theories and will try to explain why it is so difficult to obtain substantial evidence.

First, I think that the planes involved in the programs are military or private jets hired by the military. They fly routes that are restricted to other aircraft during the course of it's mission. So no one will be allowed to fly behind a spray plane or near it's path close enough to sample it's chemtrail.

Second, the spray material is either a special additive mixed into the fuel or it is injected into the hot exhaust vapors. Another possibility is that they are using a technique of flight that intentionally creates thicker contrails. A pilot can slow it's air speed by applying the wing flaps and they can adjust the fuel consumption to burn rich. Which causes extra CCN in the exhaust vapors. All these would make it very hard to tell the difference between a normal contrail and a chemtrail, even if you were able to obtain a sample.

I completely disagree with Phage's assesment




Not one shred of evidence of spraying.


The problem is that the evidence is not conclusive or irrefutable. That absolutely doesn't mean there isn't evidence. Quite a big difference between "no evidence" and inconclusive evidence. Even he knows that and is purposefully misleading the facts by his statement above.



posted on Feb, 24 2012 @ 07:03 PM
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reply to post by ThirdRock69
 


Even he knows that and is purposefully misleading the facts by his statement above.

I will repeat it. There is no evidence.
There is only speculation. Speculation based mostly on ignorance.



posted on Feb, 24 2012 @ 07:07 PM
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reply to post by Human_Alien
 


So you believe that air comes from a different source then the outside air, as they fly on passenger planes?




posted on Feb, 24 2012 @ 07:08 PM
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reply to post by Human_Alien
 


I'm not sure what more anyone needs.

Just a little evidence would go MUCH further than your worthless claims of:

It's confirmed, it's acknowledged, it's reported, it's investigated, it's seen, it's researched, it's collected, it's obvious



I have to conclude that many here on these forums are government shills, here to muddy the waters or.....we have a strand of denial-DNA never before seen.

Very, very, impressive! That fits right in with all of your other conclusions... total crap! At least you're consistent.

See ya,
Milt



posted on Feb, 24 2012 @ 07:11 PM
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reply to post by ThirdRock69
 


Thank you for posting that well-thought out post



As Clifford Stone once so eloquently stated about UFO's is:
The absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.
So because we can't tangibly hold this doesn't absolve or abscond from the problem.

This aerosol program is well outside our reach to do much about. Much like any covert program. However, this one is blatantly in our face though.

It's okay that we have people who want to bash us. It doesn't dissolve the problem. They try with all their might a character assassination coupe but no one cares what these anonymous people have to say about me or us.

One must don tough skin to go against the government, science, history, religion and all that's been taught and those we have trusted. But I'll tell you this though, it's getting easier and easier to go against the establishment with each passing year!



posted on Feb, 24 2012 @ 07:13 PM
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reply to post by merkej23
 


I really wish the pilots would grow a pair and come out and tell us (at least to what they know about it)

They have, and they ARE, but "chemtrailers" tend to be too damn paranoid to listen!

See ya,
Milt
edit on 24-2-2012 by BenReclused because: Typo



posted on Feb, 24 2012 @ 07:13 PM
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reply to post by Human_Alien
 





There's enough of us behind and onto this to try to demand answers.


No, there really isn't......you are a silly minority, the vast majority of people are capable of critical thinking and common sense, these people are not "asleep", they are not "shills" nor "sheep" they are awake!......and they live in the real world!.......you might want to try it some time.

It wasn't too long ago that you were claiming to be half alien..........you might want to join us in the real world from time to time......science and common sense aren't your enemy you know!



posted on Feb, 24 2012 @ 07:16 PM
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reply to post by Gmoneycricket
 





So you believe that air comes from a different source then the outside air, as they fly on passenger planes?



No need to argue about certain details that can easily be verified.

I don't think you will be able to obtain a passenger ticket on a chemtrail spray mission


www.airspacemag.com...

Today all airliners are pressurized, and although the details vary among them, the basic elements of cabin pressurization systems are almost universal.

Air is pressurized by the engines. Turbofan engines compress intake air with a series of vaned rotors right behind the fan. At each stage of compression, the air gets hotter, and at the point where the heat and pressure are highest, some air is diverted. Some of the hot, high-pressure air, called bleed air, is sent to de-ice wings and other surfaces, some goes to systems operated by air pressure, and some starts its journey to the cabin.

The cabin-bound air has to be cooled first in an intercooler, a device like a car radiator that sheds the heat to the ambient air scooped aboard for that purpose. From there the air travels into the airplane’s belly, where air packs cool it further using air cycle refrigeration. An air cycle cooler is perhaps the simplest air conditioner ever invented, because it doesn’t need a refrigerant as an intermediate fluid to dump heat. The air packs compress the incoming air to heat it before sending it to another intercooler to dump the heat to the outside. The air then expands through an expansion turbine, which cools it the way blowing with your lips pursed results in a cool flow of air. (Test the principle by blowing with your mouth wide open to see how warm the air would be if it weren’t compressed and then allowed to expand.)

Now the air is ready to mix with air from the cabin in a mixer, or manifold, that adds the new air to the recirculating cabin air, which is moved by fans. To maintain a comfortable temperature for the passengers, automatic systems regulate the mixture of heat from the engines and cold from the air packs. To maintain the pressure in the cabin equal to that at low altitude, even while the airplane is at 30,000 feet, the incoming air is held within the cabin by opening and closing an outflow valve, which releases the incoming air at a rate regulated by pressure sensors. Think of a pressurized cabin as a balloon that has a leak but is being inflated continuously.



posted on Feb, 24 2012 @ 07:16 PM
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You don.t need no stinking committee, run up a bill, common sense says you breath the air at 30,000 feet if you are on a plane, heated or cooled but its outside air pumped in.
People would be getting sick in the aisles if the outside air was toxic or sulfur,etc
The answer you seek is in the trash cans at hangers,
as they change and discard filters as maintenance.
You can ask the contrailers
I fought them until my own little brain kicked in and no one was dieing or sick in flight from the air.



posted on Feb, 24 2012 @ 07:19 PM
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reply to post by ThirdRock69
 





The problem is that the evidence is not conclusive or irrefutable. That absolutely doesn't mean there isn't evidence. Quite a big difference between "no evidence" and inconclusive evidence. Even he knows that and is purposefully misleading the facts by his statement above.


But you would have to agree that there is conclusive and irrefutable evidence that it is possible for a persistent contrail to form......yes?



posted on Feb, 24 2012 @ 07:22 PM
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Originally posted by ThirdRock69
reply to post by Gmoneycricket
 


I don't think you will be able to obtain a passenger ticket on a chemtrail spray mission



So on chemtrail flight paths they divert all other air traffic away?

edit on 24-2-2012 by Gmoneycricket because: (no reason given)




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