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CNN Arizona Republican debate tonight at 8pm ET

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posted on Feb, 23 2012 @ 08:55 AM
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reply to post by captainnotsoobvious
 


You obviously are SEVERELY lacking in knowledge of criminal justice/the justice system/legal system, sociology, and psychology.

I don't even know where to begin.





posted on Feb, 23 2012 @ 09:02 AM
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reply to post by captainnotsoobvious
 


That doesnt even make sense. Our Founding Fathers had freedom because they REVOLTED and broke free from England (The 'Oppresive Federal Government' of the time) and wanted to ensure we NEVER went back to a situation like that, yet here we are...taxed literally to death and over all paying about half of what we earn in the form of taxes either on income, sales, luxury, cell phones, gas, highways, food, water, everything has a tax. So yeah, the Founding Fathers did see a need and a purpose for a document to dictate that such a thing never happened again. WE HAVE FAILED OUR COUNTRY AND FOUNDING FATHERS in this respect. Sure we have made plenty of advancements and progressed as a society, but now we need to reign in some things, and maybe have a 'retirement' as the big bad trouble making, resource stealing country that we are today. Focus more on educating our nation about how to avoid situations where we are growing uncontrollably and not using our resources wisely.

In short we need some COMMON FREAKING SENSE

edit on 23-2-2012 by phishfriar47 because: ETA



posted on Feb, 23 2012 @ 09:37 AM
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reply to post by phishfriar47
 


This is you rewriting history.

The US had already beaten the Brits in the Revolutionary war. The US Constitution would NOT protect the US from being invaded. States could have simply passed states laws (like nations in Europe) and had no federal government.

Instead they chose to MAKE a federal government, with the Constitution.

The argument that the constitution was written to protect people from... the constitution... is on it's face absurd.

There was no Federal government of the people before they made one.

The US constitution created a federal government, but it also created a series of checks and balances to protect people from all levels of governmental abuse... state and federal. And it created a system to challenge laws and change the Constitution itself.

I'm starting to see why Paul holds such power of you guys, you don't know basic US history.

As far as your claiming to be taxed, "literally to death" I think you'd find that there's MANY places with higher standards of living, better education and healthcare, better infrastructure and more democratic governments that ALSO have higher taxes.

This whole, "taxes are the root of all evil" only really comes from America... it's also inaccurate. Taxes aren't bad, it's how they're spent. "No taxation without representation," not "no taxation".



posted on Feb, 23 2012 @ 09:39 AM
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reply to post by ltinycdancerg
 


riiiiiiight.

best to just ignore me then...



posted on Feb, 23 2012 @ 10:42 AM
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Seems like Ron Paul won the crap out of the debate. I'm really stoked about his chances now. Even the msm said he's #2 in delegates.

Santorum took such a beating his people are accusing Ron Paul and Romney of being in cahoots together. Because they are telling the truth about him lol. They even implied they might have a deal to split the ticket.

I'm getting a sense the msm are starting to take Ron Paul a lot more seriously. They're tone is changing from he can't win, to they can't win.



posted on Feb, 23 2012 @ 10:48 AM
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Originally posted by captainnotsoobvious
reply to post by phishfriar47
 


This is you rewriting history.

The US had already beaten the Brits in the Revolutionary war. The US Constitution would NOT protect the US from being invaded. #1 States could have simply passed states laws (like nations in Europe) and had no federal government.

Instead they chose to MAKE a federal government, with the Constitution.

The argument that the constitution was written to protect people from... the constitution... is on it's face absurd.

There was no Federal government of the people before they made one.

The US constitution created a federal government, but it also created a series of checks and balances to protect people from all levels of governmental abuse... state and federal. And it created a system to challenge laws and change the Constitution itself.

I'm starting to see why Paul holds such power of you guys, you don't know basic US history.

As far as your claiming to be taxed, "literally to death" I think you'd find that there's MANY places with higher standards of living, better education and healthcare, better infrastructure and more democratic governments that ALSO have higher taxes.

This whole, "taxes are the root of all evil" only really comes from America... it's also inaccurate. Taxes aren't bad, it's how they're spent. "No taxation without representation," not "no taxation".



How can a piece of paper stop a country from invading, that doesnt make any sense, after all its just a physical piece of paper with some ideals wrote down to follow. Also, how does OUR US CONSTITUTION have any power over any other country...France, England, Iran, Iraq, Japan, Etc....that paper means nothing to them other than an example of how a democratic republic SHOULD work, IF they are even interested in that.

I am not saying we dont need a federal government and neither has Paul, thats blatantly untrue. What we want is LESS, read that again so you understand LESS government, not NO government. We do need some structure to follow or then it really is just a free for all on who holds the biggest stick (Think pre-modern tribes and societies).

So what you are saying is we won our freedom from an oppressive force and then we should have just let it be. Thats insane, you leave the door open for any Tyrant to come trough and do what they want. Our FF's had the foresight to at least try and put forth the best document and system that they had knowledge of at the time and see how it went, and then the world over praised our effort at trying to create a truly free people and society.

What has happened is that we again have Taxation without Representation. Every presidential order that is signed without congress's approval, every tactical move we make without congress is exactly that. Taxation without any representation. Spending the peoples money and not asking us.

The Paul followers, like myself want a government that actually truly listens to the people, where there is very little if any at all corruption, the prospect of actually being able to find a real job and not just a service sector place of employment, we want freedom to choose what we can put in our bodies, we want the opportunity to voice our opinions and actually see something happen, we want less wars for NO REAL REASON, we want our personal liberties back.

What do you think is going to happen if Paul becomes president, we wont have ANY government, he couldnt accomplish that even if he tried. What he can do is attempt to straighten this country out with some common sense. His record shows that and the people are wanting some easy common sense solutions. Not more hiding behind 'experts' when the experts are causing this mess when the politicians dont even understand what the 'experts' are saying.



posted on Feb, 23 2012 @ 10:57 AM
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Originally posted by captainnotsoobvious
reply to post by phishfriar47
 


As far as your claiming to be taxed, "literally to death" I think you'd find that there's MANY places with higher standards of living, better education and healthcare, better infrastructure and more democratic governments that ALSO have higher taxes.

This whole, "taxes are the root of all evil" only really comes from America... it's also inaccurate. Taxes aren't bad, it's how they're spent. "No taxation without representation," not "no taxation".



Please source your MANY countries that have a better standard than we do, its not that i dont believe you, i just want to know which countries they are so I can research that angle further and debate the topic

where did I say 'taxes are the root of all evil', over taxing is a bad thing and I agree, spending the money inappropriately should be stopped and guess what, thats what Paul wants to do, slow inappropriate spending. For you to hate Paul so much, you sure are aligned pretty well with him politically.



posted on Feb, 23 2012 @ 11:29 AM
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Originally posted by TheAnswerTo1984
reply to post by captainnotsoobvious
 


Look, nobody is perfect. And people are going to differ when it comes to politics. It's always been this way. But when you look at the GOP field, what other option is there? Santorum is a clueless warmonger. Gingrich is, at best, a disgusting human being that walked out on his family, and Romney is a ruthless business man that does infact enjoy firing people (I'm not using his quote I'm basing this on his actions). Who else do we have then? Obama thinks he's a King. He goes to war without going to congress and walks all over the constitution likes it's a floor mat. The man should have been impeached months ago.

There is no other option. We have been given the worst of the absolute worst to choose from in one of the biggest times in our nation's history. When I say you have to be a moron or a shill not to vote Paul it's because we have no other choice. The Fedal Reserve shouldn't even exist. Our founders were strictly against a central bank. We should have troops on our border and not fighting wars for Israel. I can go on and on all day long here. It's not the repeat of BS it's the fact that we have no choice here. There is literally no alternative.
I couldn't agree more
Like I said before Ron Paul may not be perferct,nor do I see him as a savoir but he is the right man to put this country back on the right track.
Isn't it ironic that we are in such a mess that we are suffering as a country and a society,that a doctor is running for the gop,if ever we needed fixing it's now,and your right there is no other option.
One way or the other I feel we are on the precipice,we will completely fall or Dr. Paul will start us on the road to being the great nation we were at one time.

I've always been a proud American,in my worldly travels and couldn't wait to go home,but now all I feel is shame that our once great nation has become the worlds bully.Between congress and the white house and lets not forget the federal reserve,should be lined up and shot for the things they have done in the name of the U.S.A.

Lets see we have the choice of the plastic Romney,criminal Newt,naive Santorum,Obama the secret dictator and honest Congressesman Paul...isn't the choice obvious?



posted on Feb, 23 2012 @ 11:30 AM
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Originally posted by mrnotobc
Seems like Ron Paul won the crap out of the debate. I'm really stoked about his chances now. Even the msm said he's #2 in delegates.

Santorum took such a beating his people are accusing Ron Paul and Romney of being in cahoots together. Because they are telling the truth about him lol. They even implied they might have a deal to split the ticket.

I'm getting a sense the msm are starting to take Ron Paul a lot more seriously. They're tone is changing from he can't win, to they can't win.




I just wish that were truly the case pal. The media has always taken him seriously, that's why the lack of coverage or the negative coverage when they do cover him. If the major news networks lived up to their claims of "Fair and Balanced" or "The Most Trusted Name in News", then he might have already secured the nomination based on the popular vote.
The people at large follow the program laid out for them. To the victor (according to the latest news feed), goes all the spoils.



posted on Feb, 23 2012 @ 11:48 AM
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reply to post by primus2012
 


I've noticed that most people can't think for themselves, and are lead like sheep, but the republican ptb have a real problem. They can influence the popular vote in the primaries, but they can't seem to stop Ron Pauls army from taking all the delegates. I think that might be the reality they're finely waking up to.

They have no choice, but to start using their power to get the sheep to back Ron Paul now, not because they like him. Because if you can't beat them, join them. If Ron Paul wins without them, they become like poop on a shoe, but if they back him at least they keep some power, better than nothing.



posted on Feb, 23 2012 @ 11:51 AM
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One thing that makes me think the tide is turning is the way the crowd was responding to Ron Paul, and the way the mods were forced to respond to it in the debate, and on national tv.



posted on Feb, 23 2012 @ 12:24 PM
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Originally posted by Raelsatu
Wow awesome response by Paul right there. He wins the economic argument no-doubt, and as for the moral one the crowd doesn't seem too keen on....


One Libertarian and three Neo-Conservatives have a debate...Not a true conservative to be found.

The audience repeatedly cheered bombing Iran, Paul recieved largely silence, plus a few boos when talking about the lunacy of a pre-emptive military docterine.

In short, Paul looked to be the sanest man in the room, audience included.



posted on Feb, 23 2012 @ 12:53 PM
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Originally posted by Indigo5

The audience repeatedly cheered bombing Iran, Paul recieved largely silence, plus a few boos when talking about the lunacy of a pre-emptive military docterine.

In short, Paul looked to be the sanest man in the room, audience included.


I try not to hold that against them. Most people are working so hard to survive they don't have much time to study politics. With the msm feeding them lies daily it's natural for them to think we need to bomb Iran. i used to be the same way.



posted on Feb, 23 2012 @ 03:06 PM
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Originally posted by mrnotobc

Originally posted by Indigo5

The audience repeatedly cheered bombing Iran, Paul recieved largely silence, plus a few boos when talking about the lunacy of a pre-emptive military docterine.

In short, Paul looked to be the sanest man in the room, audience included.


I try not to hold that against them. Most people are working so hard to survive they don't have much time to study politics. With the msm feeding them lies daily it's natural for them to think we need to bomb Iran. i used to be the same way.


The natural response to "let's go bomb something" should be "why" not "oke ^.^".

Just sayin.



posted on Feb, 23 2012 @ 03:46 PM
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This was a poll I just took on yahoo.

Who can beat Obama in November?

Mitt Romney 22%

Rick Santorum 15%

Neither 63%

Thank you for voting

This is why Romney will be vp, and Ron Paul will be president. He can't beat Obama, but Ron Paul can. Romney gets to go along for the ride.

Maybe our country has a chance after all.



posted on Feb, 23 2012 @ 05:01 PM
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reply to post by mrnotobc
 


Serious?

A Paul/Romney ticket?

They would shoot Paul in the head ten seconds after the inauguration speech and
celebrate with French champagne, Beluga caviar, Cuban cigars and DC hookers.

RIP Ron Paul if this is the GOP ticket...



posted on Feb, 23 2012 @ 05:43 PM
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reply to post by rival
 


That's funny, I said the same thing about Oboma lol.



posted on Feb, 23 2012 @ 06:03 PM
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Originally posted by phishfriar47
Please source your MANY countries that have a better standard than we do, its not that i dont believe you, i just want to know which countries they are so I can research that angle further and debate the topic


You will find many of the nordic countries to be superior than the west in most ways, and the population is quite happy (and gainfully employeed)

Look around Denmark, Sweden, Belgim, Netherlands, Norway, Finland, etc...that general area.

here is a good cheat sheet:
Happytown

As you can see, the US ranks number 23
(but at least we are above them brits!
)



posted on Feb, 23 2012 @ 06:06 PM
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reply to post by SaturnFX
 


Wow Canada made top 10?



posted on Feb, 23 2012 @ 06:17 PM
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Originally posted by TheAnswerTo1984
reply to post by SaturnFX
 


Wow Canada made top 10?

Appears so
Despite Celine Dion





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