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US, Israeli cyber attack on Press TV fails

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posted on Feb, 21 2012 @ 04:18 AM
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reply to post by InfoKartel
 


Iran in the whole equation is the only one who is invoking religion and Armageddon while calling for Israel's destruction. The only people at fault for the ratcheting up of tensions is Iran and no one else.

Again I will point out that in threads where Iran seems to have done something right, people support them regardless, and in threads where they have done something wrong, the apologists come in and turn it into some damn conspiracy where Iran and Israel are somehow one in the same.

The same arguments are made with Hamas, when the kill adults its all good, when they intentionally target Israel school buses, people make excuses and blame Mossad as being the controlling party of Hamas.
edit on 21-2-2012 by Xcathdra because: (no reason given)




posted on Feb, 21 2012 @ 04:46 AM
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reply to post by THE_PROFESSIONAL
 



oh no you can only watch state sponsored BBC, CNN, etc.


The UK gets RT news and Al jazeera on free to air tv. I like a bit of RT i must admit.

Iran blocks bbc , voice of america & dutch news from broadcasting in iran.
edit on 21-2-2012 by yeti101 because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 21 2012 @ 03:56 PM
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post removed because the user has no concept of manners

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posted on Feb, 21 2012 @ 04:00 PM
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reply to post by Xcathdra
 



Iran in the whole equation is the only one who is invoking religion and Armageddon while calling for Israel's destruction. The only people at fault for the ratcheting up of tensions is Iran and no one else.




So I guess that video doesn't exist...ow wait, but it does?! WHAT?!


the apologists come in and turn it into some damn conspiracy where Iran and Israel are somehow one in the same.


First of all, watch your tongue, I'm no apologist for the Iranian regime. Second of all, I'm pretty much the only one saying they are one and the same from the start of it, you have a problem with that statement? CHALLENGE IT. Because so far the rich in both Israel and Iran have gotten richer and the poor...you guess.


The same arguments are made with Hamas, when the kill adults its all good, when they intentionally target Israel school buses, people make excuses and blame Mossad as being the controlling party of Hamas.


I've got a hard time bringing up sympathy for murderers, but that subject literally has nothing to do with what you and I are talking about. This is about Iran.
edit on 21-2-2012 by InfoKartel because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 21 2012 @ 05:48 PM
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The Jewish messiah is nothing to do with making the rest of world convert to Judaism - a subtle difference usually lost on antisemitic Iranian apologists.



posted on Feb, 21 2012 @ 07:49 PM
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Originally posted by Xcathdra

Originally posted by Dimitri Dzengalshlevi
That's you're idea of the big picture?

My perception of the bigger picture involves the conflict for global hegemony among the major powers of the world. Iran is one of a few countries who are targets because they are obstacles, not bridges, to the desired agenda.


For Iran yes.. They are acting like they are more important than they actually are. As for your excuse of obstacles you are ignoring the fact several countries who are not friendly towards the US has nuclear weapons. The US does engage them in diplomacy and does not threaten them with war.

That is because those countries are constantly on TV threatening to blow other countries off the face of the earth, as Iran does every other day. If Iran, who likes to point out how old and mature their country is, would act like an adult and not a spoiled child, they may actually get somewhere.

However, in order to move forward they need to get rid of the top turbins and ahmadenijad, who are in fact obstacles.


Ever been to Iran? Ever been to North Korea?

How do you know what they think or aspire to do? All you know is what you are told to know. Even if you employed logic in assuming that they happen to be people, just like you or me, you would realize that they are not some blindly violent states that should be stopped by the actual violent states.

And Iran isn't important? They have a significant portion of the world's known fossil fuel resources. Iran is a geopolitical pivot. They are much more important that you think.



posted on Feb, 21 2012 @ 08:13 PM
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reply to post by InfoKartel
 


wow....

Props for obfuscation... When you get around to reading all of the information, as I stated before, let us know so we can actually have an informed debate. Let me help you out some...

The Ayatollah from 1979 created the doctrine calling for the destruction and removal of Israel from the map. He also stated Jews should be killed wherever they are in the world.

Ahmadinejad has given many speeches that quote the Ayatollahs doctrine, as he did when he stated Israel should be wiped off the map. The IRIB, Iranian State Media, are the ones who translated his speech, including the wipe Israel off the planet comment.

So based on what your saying, the Iranians, from Ahmadinejad down to the flunkies who work for the IRIB don't know their own language well enough to get the translation right?

The current Ayatollah has called for Israel to be cut out like a cancer..

Ahmadinejad in 2007, while addressing US college students, stated Iran does not have any gays. At the time he stated it I guess it could have been accurate since Iran has gone on a homosexual killing spree since Mr. Peace himself, Ahmadinejad, was voted in as President.

The IRIB / ISNA / FarsNews / PressTV have ALL carried stories about people sentenced to death for being gay.

When confronted by the accusations, a spokesperson for Ahmadinejad said he misspoke. That seems to be a reoccurring theme for the Iranian President.

Using the extremely lame excuse of Farsi is just sad. Is that the best you can do? really?



posted on Feb, 21 2012 @ 08:15 PM
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reply to post by InfoKartel
 



Wipe Israel off the map...



The Nazi move near the end was a bit over the top however it does a nice job of portraying Ahmadinejad in the proper context and captures nicely how the world views him. Fundamental / Radical Islam has picked up where the Nazis left off.

Even the propaganda that Hamas has put out is directly from the Nazi era, with the names changed.


edit on 21-2-2012 by Xcathdra because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 21 2012 @ 08:27 PM
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Originally posted by Dimitri Dzengalshlevi
Ever been to Iran? Ever been to North Korea?

Nope - I don't need to be shot either in order to know its dangerous and I wouldn't enjoy the experience. Props for completely ignoring your own post though. Typical when you get called out on a position you can't defend, you try to change the channel.


Originally posted by Dimitri Dzengalshlevi
How do you know what they think or aspire to do?

Here in the West we have whats called a free media. That means I am free to read the news and then do my own research, including sources from countries whom we have no relations with, like Iran. We know what they think and aspire to do because the idiots go on tv and actually tell us. Or do you not understand Farsi when it comes to death to America and Death to Israel?

Keep up the apologizing... Iran needs all the spin they can get since its apparent their own people can't get it right, including accurately quoting their President.


Originally posted by Dimitri Dzengalshlevi
All you know is what you are told to know. Even if you employed logic in assuming that they happen to be people, just like you or me, you would realize that they are not some blindly violent states that should be stopped by the actual violent states.

This is where your argument, and many others on this site, fail. My issue is not with the Iranian people. Its with their government and the top Turbins. Again learn what a free press is and what that entails before lecturing anyone on knowing only what they are told.

In the US I can access Iranian State Media sources...
In Iran, they cannot access Western Media (unless they are on the governments payroll to go from site to site pushing the propaganda).


Originally posted by Dimitri Dzengalshlevi
And Iran isn't important? They have a significant portion of the world's known fossil fuel resources. Iran is a geopolitical pivot. They are much more important that you think.

Actually no, Iran is not important. No matter how loud they scream and throw temper tantrums in order to gain world attention, they are not important. So long as the current Iranian government is in power, they will never be important.

The Iranian people deserve better...

Again, props for bringing up one issue after another. A truly superb demonstration of how to raise issues, be shot down on those issues, and move into the next area without even acknowledging you are wrong. As I stated before, its a typical maneuver by people who don't know the facts or understand how those facts fit into the over all situation.

Your goal in this thread, as well as others on topics like this, are to run everyone around in circles until they tire and just leave, giving you the false sense of proving your point. Your argument style is exactly what the Iranian regime has been doing since 1979.
edit on 21-2-2012 by Xcathdra because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 22 2012 @ 12:52 AM
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reply to post by Xcathdra
 



My issue is not with the Iranian people. Its with their government and the top Turbins


Racist slur?


Actually no, Iran is not important. No matter how loud they scream and throw temper tantrums in order to gain world attention, they are not important.


Quite contradictory how you say that Iran is so irrelevant, yet you're always jumping up and down about how deadly dangerous the "top Turbins" will be when they get their nuclear weapons.

As for Iran being an important country? They are a top producer of non-renewable resources, the very same non-renewable sources that industrialized society is addicted too. Strait of Hurmuz, which is under their borders, control one fifth of daily oil trade. And basically anybody with any geopolitical standing, including politicians/advisors/intelligence officers/military brass/religious fundamentalists/scholars all realize how important Iran is. You seem to be the minority in this equation.

Oh, and as you constantly point out, they are indeed an Islamic theocracy. So please explain what you think will happen if the leading Shia theocracy is invaded by jewish and christian crusaders? They'll just role over and take it up the arse because that is what you think the Iranian people want?


The Iranian people deserve better...


Do you support sanctions against Iran? Because the entire point of placing sanctions against a country is to force their population into such a submissive state that they will attempt regime change on their own in order to improve their lives. It's called "soft power".


Again, props for bringing up one issue after another. A truly superb demonstration of how to raise issues, be shot down on those issues, and move into the next area without even acknowledging you are wrong. As I stated before, its a typical maneuver by people who don't know the facts or understand how those facts fit into the over all situation.


Let's analyze your tactics- you provide me with your opinion and then you state in your conclusion that, since my opinion does not register with your opinion, that I must be wrong. My opinions are based off of the facts that I come across. In real studies and academia and beyond, I have never come across any realist (even on the rival side) who agrees with the low level stuff that you persist about.

But then again, that is the whole point of ideology. Ideology is provided by the leaders in geopolitics to gain support from their following; but the leaders play a whole different game and believe entirely different things. It's the exact same as how organized religion works. The zealots are an important process because they perpetuate the story devised by the leadership. If the leaders really believed in the same stuff that you do, then they would probably be on the front lines. But they have people to fight for them, both on the ground and in the mind.


Your goal in this thread, as well as others on topics like this, are to run everyone around in circles until they tire and just leave, giving you the false sense of proving your point. Your argument style is exactly what the Iranian regime has been doing since 1979.


My goal in this thread, just like in any other thread, is to post my opinion where I feel like I should post it. I don't have some overlaying agenda with a plan on what to post and where to post it.



posted on Feb, 22 2012 @ 03:13 AM
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reply to post by Xcathdra
 


Really now...you're comparing a person with the powers of a mayor to Hitler who was sponsored by American contractors and the Bank of England?

Seriously, your propaganda is futile as I am opposed both to the ISLAMIC REGIME and the ZIONIST REGIME.

The youtube vid that says "Marg bar Israel" - literal translation "Death to Israel", but that is the LITERAL translation, it could mean a million things metaphorically and you're never certain until you ask the person making the statement, and this is how the West is being trolled by words. They've been chanting "Marg bar America" for decades but do you think they really want to kill America or Americans? Of course not. I dare you to travel to Iran and say you are from America, see how they treat you like royalty. Would they do that if they wished actual DEATH upon you? No.


In my opinion they should throw both groups on an island and have them battle it out while the rest of us sane people progress as a species.

PS.

I see you have no argument to the youtube video that I posted, is that because you did not know of this video or because you don't want to recognize that both sides are equally retarded(okay, Islamic regime is a bit more retarded I'll give you that one).



posted on Feb, 22 2012 @ 03:20 AM
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reply to post by Aloysius the Gaul
 


Irrelevant. It has to do with apocalyptic scenarios ie. Nuclear bombs. If you can't discuss something on subject don't try and play with ad hominems. And name who you're talking about instead of cowering away because you know you'll get corrected. FYI; raised by and as Christians I can tell you that there are no people as tolerant as Christians but by god they don't stand up for themselves or their brothers and sisters. Muslims are very valiant in this and that pisses off a lot of people, including you. However I still am of the opinion that religion sucks major #.



posted on Feb, 22 2012 @ 04:51 AM
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Originally posted by Dimitri Dzengalshlevi
Racist slur?

No, Top Turbin.


Originally posted by Dimitri Dzengalshlevi
Quite contradictory how you say that Iran is so irrelevant, yet you're always jumping up and down about how deadly dangerous the "top Turbins" will be when they get their nuclear weapons.

You are confusing the view the Iranian government / military have of themselves when it comes to confronting a modern military and their chances of winning (which is why Iran is irrelevant) and the danger of the Iranian leadership being so detached from reality that they would be stupid enough to use a nuke.

Iran with nukes would be the equivalent of a 5 year old running around the house with a machete.



Originally posted by Dimitri Dzengalshlevi
As for Iran being an important country? They are a top producer of non-renewable resources, the very same non-renewable sources that industrialized society is addicted too.

Actually Iran is not the top producer of non renewable resources. As far as needing their oil you need to quit reading PressTV articles. Contrary to that propaganda Iran is not the king of oil and they are not as relevant as they like to think they are.


Originally posted by Dimitri Dzengalshlevi
Strait of Hurmuz, which is under their borders, control one fifth of daily oil trade.

The straights are not owned by Iran, as its an international water way. The only portion Iran controls is the part that falls into their territorial waters, just like the other countries that border the gulf. 1/5 of the worlds oil traverses the straight and is not under the control of Iran..

again a prime example of Iranian spin by apologists who think Iran is relevant when in fact they aren't. If anything they are like a 5 year old with chest hair - An adult acting like a spoiled brat because they aren't getting their way.


Originally posted by Dimitri Dzengalshlevi
And basically anybody with any geopolitical standing, including politicians/advisors/intelligence officers/military brass/religious fundamentalists/scholars all realize how important Iran is.

Again you should stop reading PressTV and actually do some independent research. While countries around the world are encouraging a diplomatic solution, they aren't stating the talks are required because of Iran's importance.


Originally posted by Dimitri Dzengalshlevi
You seem to be the minority in this equation.

Actually im not.. I just happen to be one of the few people in the forums that is crazy enough to engage in a debate / discussion with people who ignore facts. On a world stage feel free to do some homework to see what countries support Iran and their nuke program.


Originally posted by Dimitri Dzengalshlevi
Oh, and as you constantly point out, they are indeed an Islamic theocracy. So please explain what you think will happen if the leading Shia theocracy is invaded by jewish and christian crusaders? They'll just role over and take it up the arse because that is what you think the Iranian people want?

Again I see your just making it up as you go along. Missile strikes on nuke sites is not a ground invasion, and again if you spent time learning you would know that western militaries are in fact made up of Christians, Jews, Buddhists, Muslims etc etc etc..

Again you really need to stop with putting words in peoples mouths. I understand thats the way its done in countries with no independent media, however, it doesn't work here in these forums. As I stated before time and again, which you ignore, the issue is with the Iranian government, not her people.


Originally posted by Dimitri Dzengalshlevi
Do you support sanctions against Iran? Because the entire point of placing sanctions against a country is to force their population into such a submissive state that they will attempt regime change on their own in order to improve their lives. It's called "soft power".

Actually the purpose of sanctions is to get a countries government to comply with treaty obligations. Trying to blame the current plight of Irans people on the sanctions is another fine example of blame everyone else instead while ignoring the fact Irans government is responsible for their current situation.



Originally posted by Dimitri Dzengalshlevi
Let's analyze your tactics- you provide me with your opinion and then you state in your conclusion that, since my opinion does not register with your opinion, that I must be wrong. My opinions are based off of the facts that I come across. In real studies and academia and beyond, I have never come across any realist (even on the rival side) who agrees with the low level stuff that you persist about.

Yes we all know you like to make continual claims and argue certain points, as do I. The difference between you and I is I actually supply links / sources to support my argument, where as you do not. You just make the claim, and when called out, you do everything in your power to change the topic of conversation, as you have done a few times in this and other threads now.


Originally posted by Dimitri Dzengalshlevi
But then again, that is the whole point of ideology. Ideology is provided by the leaders in geopolitics to gain support from their following; but the leaders play a whole different game and believe entirely different things. It's the exact same as how organized religion works. The zealots are an important process because they perpetuate the story devised by the leadership. If the leaders really believed in the same stuff that you do, then they would probably be on the front lines. But they have people to fight for them, both on the ground and in the mind.

Iran's ideology is a fraud and nothing more. The Iranian government will blame anyone and everyone for their own stupidity, and people will by it hook line and sinker.



Originally posted by Dimitri Dzengalshlevi
My goal in this thread, just like in any other thread, is to post my opinion where I feel like I should post it. I don't have some overlaying agenda with a plan on what to post and where to post it.

Then you should really think about the wording of your posts, in addition to looking at the tone / context of those posts. It has been death to America / Israel all the time, constantly blaming other countries when Iran does something wrong.

A country like Iran, with their current government, has no business building a nuclear power program, let alone possess nuclear weapons. For a country / culture that has been around a long time, one would expect them to be wise and act in an adult manner.

That last part continues to elude them.
edit on 22-2-2012 by Xcathdra because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 22 2012 @ 05:22 AM
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Originally posted by InfoKartel
Really now...you're comparing a person with the powers of a mayor to Hitler who was sponsored by American contractors and the Bank of England?

As I have stated in other posts, making claims like the one above without absolutely nothing to support that claim, does not make the claim true.

What is ironic is your comment.. Like Hitler, and the Iranian government, you just blamed the US for Hitlers actions.



Originally posted by InfoKartel
Seriously, your propaganda is futile as I am opposed both to the ISLAMIC REGIME and the ZIONIST REGIME.

Yet you accuse me of putting out propaganda, even though I cite my sources, while you supply none of your own while parroting the Iranian position.

. Speaking of propaganda...


Originally posted by InfoKartel
The youtube vid that says "Marg bar Israel" - literal translation "Death to Israel", but that is the LITERAL translation, it could mean a million things metaphorically and you're never certain until you ask the person making the statement, and this is how the West is being trolled by words. They've been chanting "Marg bar America" for decades but do you think they really want to kill America or Americans? Of course not. I dare you to travel to Iran and say you are from America, see how they treat you like royalty. Would they do that if they wished actual DEATH upon you? No.

You and a few others just do not get it. You guys really need to read the posts.. As I have stated time and time again, the issue is not with the Iranian people, its with the Iranian government. Americans no more want to kill Iranian citizens than Iranian citizens want to kill Americans.

Although holding mass rallies where the people scream Death to America / Israel it does make one wonder about their intent towards Americans / Israelis. I don't see Israeli / American citizens at government rallies screaming death to Iran do you?

As far as your comment about translations - Its and old and overused tactic. Its almost as if Ahmadinejad needs a permanent spokesperson who follows him around and says "What Ahmadinejad meant was".



Originally posted by InfoKartel
In my opinion they should throw both groups on an island and have them battle it out while the rest of us sane people progress as a species.

We either advance or decline as a whole.



Originally posted by InfoKartel
PS.

I see you have no argument to the youtube video that I posted, is that because you did not know of this video or because you don't want to recognize that both sides are equally retarded(okay, Islamic regime is a bit more retarded I'll give you that one).


There is no context for me to review the video in. This is exactly what I am talking about. Posting information with nothing that places it into context, no sources as to where it came from, location and year of the video etc.

The manner in which you and some other present information is like citing by example.

The presentation of your info would be like saying - Juliette on the balcony.

Without any reference to place the saying in context, people won't understand the point. In the example those familiar with Romeo and Juliette would get the reference and understand its place in the conversation. Without that knowledge the phrase is meaningless.



posted on Feb, 22 2012 @ 08:58 AM
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reply to post by Xcathdra
 



What is ironic is your comment.. Like Hitler, and the Iranian government, you just blamed the US for Hitlers actions.


I did no such thing. Certain companies, profiteered off Hitler and in that way, gave him what he needed. You can't blame the US for Hitlers actions, just as I can't say that you are responsible for what I'm typing now.


You and a few others just do not get it. You guys really need to read the posts.. As I have stated time and time again, the issue is not with the Iranian people, its with the Iranian government. Americans no more want to kill Iranian citizens than Iranian citizens want to kill Americans.


And time and time it has been said that these hostilities towards the government of Iran are HURTING IRANIANS. So foreign powers are supplying the Iranian regime with "reasons", and the Iranian regime uses this to galvanize the people behind their religious idiocracy.


Although holding mass rallies where the people scream Death to America / Israel it does make one wonder about their intent towards Americans / Israelis. I don't see Israeli / American citizens at government rallies screaming death to Iran do you?


Yes but you would have to understand that most of them shouting those things are dumb as hell. Some don't have a choice and have to eat... but most because they've been hit over the head by Mullahs since the day they were born...religious government...oh the joys...




As far as your comment about translations - Its and old and overused tactic. Its almost as if Ahmadinejad needs a permanent spokesperson who follows him around and says "What Ahmadinejad meant was".


It's not that, I'm not disputing it here, I even translated it directly for you. But there are several factors in play here...remember that dumb as hell crowd from before? The ones who are ignorant about many things but follow the crowd? Well, if you were giving a speech to dumb folks, you'd need to keep the sentences as short as possible and as close to the intended sentiment as possible. As far as my personal opinion regarding this? Meh, do away with the religious government and people who shout this on the streets will be regarded as "special" cases...like they used to before Khomenei(and co) messed Iran up.


We either advance or decline as a whole.


I respect that sentiment, but people who stone women for adultery...I don't want to be near 'em let alone advance with them.



There is no context for me to review the video in.


The context is this thread...these government big heads bowing to the religious crowd? No? It's the same as you posting a video of a bunch of -60 IQ religiously indoctrinated idiots chanting a disgusting sentence for pay or because they simply don't know better. Quid pro Quo.



posted on Feb, 22 2012 @ 09:03 AM
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Originally posted by THE_PROFESSIONAL
This is similar to the British blocking Presstvs satellite signals and now they are attempting to try to silence presstv.


The Brits took down PressTV because PressTV didn't follow the rules like everyone else.
Considering this is PressTV claiming a cyber attack ... do we even know it actually happened?
Afterall .. they are the propaganda mouthpiece of the nutty Iranian regime.

Since we are talking cyber attacks ...
Iranian Cyber-Attack Plot against U.S. Exposed in Mexico



posted on Feb, 22 2012 @ 09:07 AM
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reply to post by THE_PROFESSIONAL
 


Do you really believe they blocked it.


Mooooohaaaaaaaaaa. For real.


We are talking about the best hackers in the world in the CIA and MOSSAD.

Come one guy.... For real...


Lets dig back in our memory banks shall we.


remeber not to long ago when we unleashed STUXTNET on them.

Do you remeber.

What was ther first responce.

Oh yes we were attacked but we have recoved and we adverted diasaster.

But what really happen. We blew all the centrafuges tubes to # when they spun out of control. Well.

Do you think they just made some new tubes up real quick.


The high quality aluminum and the very tight tolerance on there is niot easy to reproduce at all.

Just like this little event.


They come out and say they foiled and attach.


Are you kidding me.

They were in and time is ticking until it is unleashed on there network infurstructure.


This is the begining of what is taking place we are hacking them daily trying tio disrupt our systems.

Just like they are daily plannning and executing attack plans on out troops in Iraq and Afganastan. And planning attacks in isreal and egypt and thoughout the middle east and abroad.



posted on Feb, 22 2012 @ 02:56 PM
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Xcathdra- No, Top Turbin.


When you posted the phrase "Top Turbin" last night, it was unfamiliar to me. In fact, it seemed to be a misspelling of "turban". I even tried looking up "turbin" on the internet to find what you are referencing to, with zero success. I even looked through the index of an intensive Iran textbook that I have, with no "turbin" in it.

I just looked online again, and the only other place online that seems to have the phrase "Top Turbin" is a blog from 2007 stating that "Is Iran's Top Turbin dead?".

So I still fail to understand where this phrase comes from. Perhaps you can enlighten me.


Iran with nukes would be the equivalent of a 5 year old running around the house with a machete.


When invaders are running around his house with machineguns



Actually Iran is not the top producer of non renewable resources. As far as needing their oil you need to quit reading PressTV articles. Contrary to that propaganda Iran is not the king of oil and they are not as relevant as they like to think they are.


I never said that they are "the top producer". I said they "are a top producer".

And who said I got those facts from PressTV? I actually used the CIA World Factbook when I once wrote a report on this very subject.

CIA World Factbook: Iran is fourth of the world in oil production, fifth in natural gas production (2nd in proven reserves).

You're trying to tell me that being in the top five of around two hundred countries isn't significant?


The straights are not owned by Iran, as its an international water way. The only portion Iran controls is the part that falls into their territorial waters, just like the other countries that border the gulf. 1/5 of the worlds oil traverses the straight and is not under the control of Iran..


Ever seen the Straight of Hormuz at its tightest point? You can see right across it.

And regardless of what you think, this point is in Iran's hands. You can talk about how other countries also share it, but what you fail to say is that they are irrelevant because it is the Americans who assume control over it above all others. This has already been asserted countless times with the American navy patrolling it to tell Iran that Iran doesn't have the same primacy in the Middle East as American imperial forces.


again a prime example of Iranian spin by apologists who think Iran is relevant when in fact they aren't.


Your inability to see how significant Iran is, is not my problem. Iran could be number #1 in oil production and you would still find some way to call them insignificant.

The very fact that Iran is an energy exporter, while the US is dependent on energy imports, shows a serious strategic advantage that has always been in Iran's favor. Why do you think your country installed a brutal tyrant in Iran for 20+ years? He killed and tortured his population under a doctrine of western development, just to sell the oil to your country. And you sit there all smug, crying about how bad Iran is now and how much those Iranians need to be liberated again



Again you should stop reading PressTV and actually do some independent research. While countries around the world are encouraging a diplomatic solution, they aren't stating the talks are required because of Iran's importance.


Diplomatic... you mean like using proxy militias and intel agents to conduct sabotage and assassinations within Iran?


Actually im not.. I just happen to be one of the few people in the forums that is crazy enough to engage in a debate / discussion with people who ignore facts. On a world stage feel free to do some homework to see what countries support Iran and their nuke program.


I already do exactly that. I think that you're accusing me of your faults.


Again I see your just making it up as you go along. Missile strikes on nuke sites is not a ground invasion, and again if you spent time learning you would know that western militaries are in fact made up of Christians, Jews, Buddhists, Muslims etc etc etc..


Missile strikes will solve everything? What a fool.

And what you think your religious denominations are, means nothing. Your country is Christian; your children and presidents and judges swear allegiance under God. Just as you see Iran as a bunch of violent muslims, they see the US as a bunch of violent christians.


Again you really need to stop with putting words in peoples mouth


And I did this how?


As I stated before time and again, which you ignore, the issue is with the Iranian government, not her people.


Yet you gladly condone soft power tactics against the Iranian people in order to indirectly attack the Iranian government.


edit on 22-2-2012 by Dimitri Dzengalshlevi because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 22 2012 @ 03:11 PM
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reply to post by Xcathdra
 



Actually the purpose of sanctions is to get a countries government to comply with treaty obligations. Trying to blame the current plight of Irans people on the sanctions is another fine example of blame everyone else instead while ignoring the fact Irans government is responsible for their current situation.


And what treaty obligations has Iran not complied with?


Yes, Iran is so responsible. Must be easy to make that claim when your nation's forces surround it on three of four fronts.


The difference between you and I is I actually supply links / sources to support my argument, where as you do not.


First of all, this is bullsh*t. I infact do supply links if I happen to get my facts from them.

But unlike you I actually study this stuff on a level that puts your little internet research capability to shame. I've put up my significant sources before, many times actually... but since they are books, which require some effort to actually look into, they are often ignored.

And quite frankly, the bulk of my knowledge comes from direct lectures by professionals, including scholars, politicians and even book authors and journalists themselves. What do you expect me to do, pick my mind to write an exact quote that I once heard and then write who told me it, when and where? Get real.


Iran's ideology is a fraud and nothing more. The Iranian government will blame anyone and everyone for their own stupidity, and people will by it hook line and sinker.


Look up the definition of Straussian and then look at your own government after Bush took power.

And since you won't since you only like facts that are handed to you on a platter, I'll explain it to you. A Straussian practices their power by employing an inferior argument against a rival. If the rival falls for the inferior argument, then the rival is inferior. When the American people fall for the immediate threat of bin Laden's terrorism, Saddam's WMD, and Ahmadinejad's nukes, then that is because they are too inferior to understand the bigger picture. This is how elitist mentality works.


Then you should really think about the wording of your posts, in addition to looking at the tone / context of those posts. It has been death to America / Israel all the time, constantly blaming other countries when Iran does something wrong.


Let me get this straight.

no, no, lets just think about this for just a brief moment...

I post my opinion based on my knowledge based on my training and experience.... and my opinion is of a different perspective of the status quo... and my opinion describes imperialist tactics and geopolitics instead of irrational fears...

And somehow my opinion translates to "death to America" and "death to Israel"?

You are seriously screwed in the head if you believe this.


A country like Iran, with their current government, has no business building a nuclear power program, let alone possess nuclear weapons.


A country like the US, with a massive nuclear program and extensive nuclear arsenal, has no business telling another country that it cannot develop a nuclear energy program. What is even more ironic is that it was the Americans who started the Iranian nuclear energy program under the Shah, but back then Iran was an American client state so it was all acceptable.

A country like Israel, that has ignored the NNPT and has, in fact, proliferated nuclear weapons into a very capable arsenal, has no business telling Iran anything about nuclear issues.

Oh wait, I think I just posted "death to America" and "death to Israel" in the American language. But I can't be sure, because I am not an American



posted on Feb, 22 2012 @ 03:18 PM
link   

Originally posted by InfoKartel
reply to post by Aloysius the Gaul
 


Irrelevant. It has to do with apocalyptic scenarios ie. Nuclear bombs.


The Jewish messiah is not an apocolyptic scenario - he heralds a time of peace and plenty for Judaism and all mankind!!

The motto here is deny ignorance - not display it!!



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