Originally posted by CosmicEgg
Seems pretty obvious to me. Religion has always been about controlling the masses, unifying them under fear of punishment and retribution, convincing them they are impotent and sinners. Psychic mediums tell you what they are hearing from those not currently in material form. When they speak of the love and freedom and lightness of being, how is that controlling and manipulative? Isn't that more something to look forward to? If you knew that no matter what happens in your life, that at the end of it - whenever that might come - that you will be in a safe and loving place, would that make you live differently? There is no human "authority" that wants you to feel safe and loved. They want you to feel weak and vulnerable. They want your lifelong obedience and subjugation.
I have written this before here in this forum. My grandmother was a very devout Christian. From about 1990 onward she was completely senile and didn't even remember who I was. She died several years later. Since I live halfway around the world, I hadn't seen her since 1991. I am not close with my family in the US. On Boxing Day, I had the breath knocked out of me as I was making the evening meal. For about two minutes I simply could not breathe. My only thought was "Grandmother". I felt that she was there with me, leaving something of great value inside me. After that two minutes, I felt a huge pull and somehow "saw" a bright light fly quickly out of the window beside me. I went to the bedroom and said to my then-husband that I think my grandmother had died. He only said that if she had, the phone would ring. It never did. But that following year, I got a letter from my aunt-by-marriage informing me that she didn't know if anyone had told me but my grandmother had died on Boxing Day the previous year. That letter dropped through the mail slot on my grandmother's birthday.
I know we don't die. Our souls are eternal, just as all energy is eternal. Our physical bodies die but that is not us.
Originally posted by Big Chief
I was inspired to create this thread based on some things I've seen on many message boards. To me, it seems that psychic mediums and religious beliefs run contrary to each other on the view of the afterlife. It seems like there are 2 totally different beliefs by 2 totally different sources. Psychics claim to get their information about the afterlife from 1st hand experience by talking to their "spirit guides" and other spirits while religions claim to get their information from God's prophets, messengers and angels from God. Who is right and who is wrong?? Religions say to trust no mediums or psychics and psychics say that religion is not true and there is no such thing as hell or a vengefull/judgemental God. Who are these separate entities getting their info from. Are psychics really getting their info from spirit guides and spirits? Are religions really getting their info from the "Word of God"?
Who do we believe or do we believe neither? What's your opinion on this? I'll be back later to post my views.
Originally posted by Tayesin
reply to post by Big Chief
As a sweeping generalisation, we could say one major difference exists between the two groups you mention, and that is, one relies on BELIEF for their 'knowledge', while the other relies on EXPERIENCE.
And a massive gulf MUST exist between the two for that one reason.
It's fair to say that not all Psychics get info from the sources they claim, and some to work with a client's higher-self.. the thing that represents the Soul and is often misconstrued as their "Spirit Guide". This is not including Helper guides.
Without wishing to offend any Believers.. ALL Belief has Limitations that are inherent in the System. For clear psychics, there are also Limitations based on their strength and levels of Belief... which is to say that a good psychic will have No Beliefs at all.. ever. Instead they will only operate on their direct experiences which change as one works .. hence why for a good, clear psychic, their understandings about everything are only their Current Understandings... has ot be that way or they too fall into the Trap of having and attaching to Beliefs.
Why does religion say not to trust psychics, etc?
My answer, based only on my experience, is so that FOLLOWERS DO NOT look at anything other than what they have now, so that they CANNOT learn how to connect directly to 'god' and know how far from the Truth man's Limiting BELIEFS really are.
There are a quite a few very good spiritual councellors around the planet, and many more Helpers in the various realms the new age speaks of.. something you don't find with Religionists because they are warned away from such life-works in order to ONLY Believe and Follow.
Many times over the long years of my membership here, I have written for all readers about my direct experiences working with the dead, what happens to them, what they experience after death... and all only shared from Experience.
Had I not followed my gut instincts and thus fearfully stayed within the Limitations decreed by our Indoctrination, and Religion, then I would have never discovered the bigger picture of Simplicity, of knowing what we are and why we are here in this Now... and more importantly I wold never have learned easy methods for most people to have their own direct experience for their own growth out of Limitations of Beliefs.
Lastly, to me.. religionsists, followers of any Belief System.. are okay where they are now.. it is how it should be for now.. I see them all as equal human beings with equal potential.
What I also see is that we have been indoctrinated into Believing Truth must be difficult to attain, any methods to arrive at truth HAS to be Hard, it has to be Complex and has to take a lifetime of effort to reach, etc. And it is these exact limitations within Belief that cause us to experience that as a reality.. as we struggle to know anything.
The outcomes of the search for Complexity blinds us to the most Simple of things.. hence why so many simply do not "get it" yet.. it's not what most are looking for, so they overlook the simplicity as having no value because it is too simple to be true.
And that is indoctrinated Belief-System Limitation right there.
Everyone will slowly wake up in their own time, dependant only their own efforts to do so.. and it is all as it should be in this timeframe.
Originally posted by Wandering Scribe
reply to post by Big Chief
Don't believe in either. Neither psychics, nor gods, know the whole scope of what is really happening. The "spirits" that a psychic convene with are only privy to information they can ascertain during the seance, or summoning. Likewise, a deity can only offer input on the information occurring after its own conception.
What do I mean?
Well, next time that you go to see a psychic, or a medium, or any divination expert, don't ask personal questions. Instead, ask the spirits to explain some cosmological constant, or to discuss quantum mechanics with you. Bring up topics in psychology, or Egyptian history, or advanced mathematics. Watch as the medium and their "spirits" squirm and struggle to explain these things.
Concerning deities, we know that all of the "big Gods" like Yahweh, and Buddha, and Brahma, have finite existences. Regardless of what is said in the Bible, the Dhammapada, the Rigveda, or other texts. We can trace, with certainty, the origin of these beings. For example, Yahweh is a composite deity of Judaic tribes from the Levant. The Rigveda was composed between 1700-1100 BCE. So, no god can have the full story, as they are cultural responses to particular time periods.
The hundreds of thousands of years occurring before the deities of Mesopotamia came about are unknown to these gods. Just as the occupants of Mesopotamia, ancient Egypt, ancient Persia, and the Arabs are not known to Yahweh. Likewise, Brahma, the Buddha, Allah, Jesus Christ, Mithra, Zeus, and all of their divine brethren also only had knowledge of their particular culture and time-period.
Don't trust in religion, or psychics. Neither are connected to The Truth, because The Truth does not exist. As a species, we fear death and nonexistence more than anything. It is only natural, then, that we would seek comfort from this concept in the act of creating permanence beyond mortal death.
Primitive man feared death, so the spirit world came to be, accessible through dreams, visions, and drugs. Communication with ancestors, and the spirits of nature became possible as a source of comfort, and a promise that we would not simply end, and cease-to-be upon death.
The people of Mesopotamia feared death, so they told stories (see: the Epic of Gilgamesh, and Ut-Napishtam from the Chaldean Flood Tablets) where-in they would be rewarded with eternal life if they performed predetermined deeds properly.
In Egypt the fear of death and nonexistence was so great that entire gods existed just to banish it. Also, their entire culture, rituals, ceremonies, and activities were based around prolonging their life, and securing their own permanence and immortality. Such fear of death gave rise to mummification, the early prototypes to modern medicine, the afterlife, ghosts, souls, and the like.
In India this fear was so great that they invented varying Heavens, and an assortment of Hellish locations so that no one would ever fully perish from existence into nonexistence.
The promises of the psychic are no different. Instead of a god who guides us to eternal life, we now have psychics and spirits who guide us to eternal life beyond death. Same concept, different costume. Instead of priests, shamans, and prophets we now have psychics, sensitives, and spiritualists. It really is just the reverse side of the same coin, and when the penny drops we'll most likely see a resurgence in gods and prophets again.
They're all useless to you in the end though.
~ Wandering Scribe
Originally posted by intelligenthoodlum33
What are your thoughts on Franz Bardon's, Initiation into the Hermetics? I've just started it myself.