400 Chernobyls: Solar Flares, EMP, and Nuclear Armageddon

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posted on Feb, 15 2012 @ 11:10 PM
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Heard the author Matt Stein on a podcast & it was an eye opener. Did you know that if a major solar flare hit earth or an EMP attack knocked out the power grid these reactors could start melting down within 1 week of the event? Did you know that NRC requires that nuclear power plants have 1 weeks worth of diesel fuel to run their back-up generators - 1 week??? Congress is well aware of the problem & as yet has done nothing about it.

Great read & not a sky is falling scenario!

whentechfails.com...




posted on Feb, 15 2012 @ 11:15 PM
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Originally posted by BABYBULL24
Heard the author Matt Stein on a podcast & it was an eye opener. Did you know that if a major solar flare hit earth or an EMP attack knocked out the power grid these reactors could start melting down within 1 week of the event? Did you know that NRC requires that nuclear power plants have 1 weeks worth of diesel fuel to run their back-up generators - 1 week??? Congress is well aware of the problem & as yet has done nothing about it.

Great read & not a sky is falling scenario!

whentechfails.com...

i have yet to experience a major solar flare hitting the earth and knocking out anything, i dont think i have ever even heard it happen in history.







posted on Feb, 15 2012 @ 11:23 PM
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If I may help with a voice of calm here... As far as I understand it, you're right about the potential for nuclear calamity. After all, the tidal wave didn't case Fukushima. The Earthquake didn't cause Fukushima. It was literally the lack of electricity to a power plant when the tidal wave obliterated the backup power systems to 1, 2, 3, and 4. 5 and 6 were elevated and not damaged the same way. They could probably still function today....in other circumstances of course.

Now..why would I not worry too much? Well.. Fukushima had minutes to understand, fully grasp and then react to a situation that would have taken hours to properly prepare the plant for by losing outside and internal power. Things like the 1859 event, on the other hand, take a fair amount of time to get from the Sun to here. With the GOES/SOHO observation platforms, we'd know the second such an event began and so gain even more time.

All that time should make for plenty to properly shut things down or be prepared to do it in a very VERY short period of time if they don't want to go all the way without knowing it's needed. Although if it's an X-40 + as 1859 is guesstimated to be by many experts, we'd know that immediately too. So...with all that advanced warning, there is no possibility of an EXTREME Geostorm causing the planetary nuclear calamity a SUDDEN disaster is capable of.



posted on Feb, 15 2012 @ 11:28 PM
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reply to post by BABYBULL24
 


Our biggest danger from a solar flare is not nuclear but geothermal. A powerful flare could cause super volcanoes to erupt and three of the worlds seven super volcanoes are in the US. It's been estimated that Yellowstone alone could be a life-ending event.



posted on Feb, 15 2012 @ 11:28 PM
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Good find!
I'm very concerned about EMPs, and my mom actually (bless her soul) loaned me a book to read recently called One Second After by William Forstchen (fiction) that deals with exactly this scenario. But the main problem I had with the book was the fact it didn't address the issue of nuclear power plants. Other than that it was useful and eye opening, like this link is.

Thanks for this info!



posted on Feb, 15 2012 @ 11:30 PM
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reply to post by BABYBULL24
 


if this did happen where in the world is safe and what should we do? can anyone answer that>?



posted on Feb, 15 2012 @ 11:35 PM
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Not only does congress not do anything about it, they just approved the building of another nuclear power plant.



posted on Feb, 15 2012 @ 11:41 PM
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reply to post by BABYBULL24
 


I really don't think we are close to adequately prepared for such events. I really think nuclear power if not nuclear war is going to be the end of us. It's mind blowing how much nuclear power has grown without being able to control it in an emergency situation. We're going to be f'd at some point if it continues the way it has. Imagine 400 at Fukushimas at once. Bye bye.
edit on 15-2-2012 by colbyforce because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 15 2012 @ 11:46 PM
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reply to post by Thisbseth
 


The Hopi Indians claim to have access to an underworld entrance. I'm not sure what they mean by it, but they claim that when the medicine man dances without a mask, or removes his mask, it's time to go inside. The Israelis are told through prophecy to go to the safe place, presumably a deep underground bunker or cave system. Our government has made certain that the government will survive, but I don't know about anything done to preserve the population. They got a bad rep with us, it's a chance for them to start with a new group of citizens maybe. But seriously, who would even want to survive a global event when the earth will be reeking of radiation for many years?



posted on Feb, 15 2012 @ 11:49 PM
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Hey guys... I thought I'd come back and offer something which may help. This is a list of just about every geomagnetic storm of significance for effects or widespread reports with descriptions of what happened. It runs from the 1859 Carrington event to fairly recently. It ought to help show what the storms can and can't do at the higher levels......

Personally..I won't even get excited about a threat, based on this list and much more work I did researching this a few months ago, until I hear X-10 as a minimum. X-20?....I'm checking data to see how long I have to get my disaster plan in motion.


1st person, contemporary reports and descriptions of the 1859 Storm/ Carrington Event

and the whole list:

1859 Carrington Event and most others to recently

Hope that helps!



posted on Feb, 15 2012 @ 11:59 PM
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so in regards to this... is there anything we can do in this scenario?
buy baked beans and bottled water to last forever...?

thank you Wrabbit for offering your insight and knowledge, good to know that we would become aware of a solar storm before it would hit us and have time to shut down the nuclear plans

but there is still the issue of super-volcanoes as magnificent brought up which could still be a game ender
should be interesting at least to see the grid go down, from my own research i learned at the very least this year is supposed to be some sort of peak in solar activity so things should get interesting

remember to meditate when its all goin down
edit on 16-2-2012 by trust_no_one because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 16 2012 @ 12:07 AM
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Originally posted by trust_no_one
so in regards to this... is there anything we can do in this scenario?
buy baked beans and bottled water to last forever...?
seems like this would have the potential the be a game ender if either nukes went off or supervolcanoes erupted

remember to meditate when its all goin down


"ok you do that"

"Will it help?"

"nope".

Goodbye and thanks for all the fish......



posted on Feb, 16 2012 @ 12:23 AM
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Normally are the NPP's "hardened" against EMP and Solar Flares!

But the danger is there, no doubt!



posted on Feb, 16 2012 @ 12:26 AM
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Hey you want some more good news...there is an electrical transformer shortage worldwide due to lack of raw materials. So if we get hit with something major & the transformers start popping like Coca Cola - we don't have the transformers to get the power grid back up and running anyway - so 1 week or 1 year of diesel fuel ain't gonna matter much anyway w/these nukes.

www.tradenewswire.net...

Wrabbit - I'd investigate 1921 - they are 100 year events - don't think they were running cable in 1859.

Peace

edit on 16-2-2012 by BABYBULL24 because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 16 2012 @ 01:21 AM
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This has been a long time realized catastrophe for me. There are a FEW reactors that use steam turbines to spin up Cooling pumps, Great backup but its only good for the initial Scram and shutdown, and 120 hours or so roughly as the reactor cools down, after that there's diesel backup for a week at best. After that its scramble scramble. There should be other systems and backups in place for such events, but as well all know there are not. Reactor designs make a huge difference in this area. BWR(Boiling water reactors) reactors are by far the most troubled in this situation. CANdu reactors and pebble beds are a bit more forgiving when it comes to a scram, cooling and cold shutdown. It's a shame that here in the US were still stuck with BWR dinosaurs. There have been vast improvements in reactor designs since the Nuclear act was put in place in the late 70's.

We do face a vary dangerous situation in the event of a mass EMP, Massive CME blast and or catastrophe that would render the power grind and generating and Transmissions stations go down.

As for the year 1859 that was the year of the Carrington event. Their were telegraph lines up in that time. and their was massive Inductance in them lines. In comparison to today with the Power grid being what it is, the outcome would be on a unimaginative scale. There were reports of telegraph shacks burning down, stray currents being generated on these lines,

Think of them as an antenna, what we have now in respect to lengths compared to them days is huge. The end result would be catastrophic.

There are some safeguards in place, but not effective enough to protect the grid, transfer stations and End users(home owners, Business owners).

As for Nuclear plants being Hardened against this kind of thing, its hard to say how they would actually react. all the following systems would need to be hardened including the circuits between components. The important components ie, Alternators(generators), Transfer switches, transformers, Pumps, Automated Control systems although there are manual overrides in the instance automated systems fail to switch power over. If their are weak spots in the hardening of these systems there will be massive spikes of energy entering the entire system.

God(higher power, etc) help us when and if we are faced with this crisis on a mass scale.



posted on Feb, 16 2012 @ 03:44 AM
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Originally posted by Raivan31
"ok you do that"

"Will it help?"

"nope".
That's the first comment shown on this video on the youtube page:


Originally posted by Thisbseth
if this did happen where in the world is safe and what should we do? can anyone answer that>?
This video shows you what to do:

Duck and Cover:

Or as we used to call this film in school, "bend over and kiss your a** goodbye".

Seriously though, there should be time to replenish fuel supplies for the backup generators of the nuke plants in a week. One reason the tsunami was so bad in Japan is it made it difficult to get emergency vehicles to the affected area.

We would be able to get fuel delivery vehicles to the fuel tanks for the backup generators within a week, I suspect. So it's not really the same as a tsunami.



posted on Feb, 16 2012 @ 10:01 AM
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reply to post by definity
 


How far do you think the documented history goes back in time atleast when it comes to Solar Flares?


It is only natural if you have not heard since I'm not sure how many astronomers were able to observe the Sun like SOHO.



posted on Feb, 16 2012 @ 03:13 PM
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Originally posted by BABYBULL24

Wrabbit - I'd investigate 1921 - they are 100 year events - don't think they were running cable in 1859.

Peace

edit on 16-2-2012 by BABYBULL24 because: (no reason given)

Thank you, I haven't looked at that one in particular and will check it out.


1859 did have telegraph lines..and I know that is pretty weak for comparison to modern technology, but what it DID do to those is downright scary to consider. The telegraphs ran better with NO power source connected than with the batteries hooked up...such was the degree of energy they were absorbing from the air.
Sparks and arcing off those lines also caused scattered brush fires all over the place by reports.

Indeed... We have reason to worry, if the sun pops a *BIG* one off.

Grats on bringing up the shortage or outright logistical nightmare of replacing some of the big electric infrastructure parts.

G. Gordon Liddy wrote a book in the 1990's that laid out a VERY detailed war game scenario for how just a few squads of well trained terrorists could cripple the U.S. in less than 24 hours..and keep it crippled for the better part of a year or more. ONE of the parts for that scenario was the overloading and destruction of key parts of the electrical grid. The point they were making was that some of these things HAVE no spare parts due to their size and nature...and replacement could take months. The lights go out in the mean time.



posted on Mar, 11 2012 @ 10:15 AM
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reply to post by Pegasus2000
 


I know this is an old thread but I dont think a lot of us think about the fact that if a solar flare takes out the grid the meltdowns will be the worst thing that could possibly happen. Radiation poisoning to me is the scariest aspect out of all the scenarios that could happen to the world. I hope for everyones sake that if something like this happens there will be people that take initiative and get the plants shut down. I'm not a big fan of the Hills Have Eyes Lifestyle.



posted on May, 8 2012 @ 03:06 PM
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reply to post by BABYBULL24
 


Even as of May 8, 2012, the OP story from Matthew Stein is the best overall view of the problems with solar storms and also with EMPs. Stein also has the most comprehensive and authoritative set of references in this article. In addition, he went beyond compiling existing references when he interviewed several experts (Arnie Gundersen, John Kappenman, etc.) in order to add a depth of understanding I still don't see (3 months on) matched elsewhere online on these topics.

One of Stein's references, for example, is to the analysis of the solar storms problem by the noted documentary filmmaker, author, health researcher, radio host and public speaker, Gary Null, PhD with Jeremy Stillman:

www.garynull.com...

At the end of the Gary Null article, check out the NASA references, especially. Those are important articles which are not included in Matthew Stein's list of references, which is otherwise excellent.

I also recommend his book of the same name (When Technology Fails) copyright 2008, the revised and expanded edition. Do yourself a favor, though, and buy a hard copy. Your e-book reader is not the device you want to rely on when there is a focused (EMP scenario) or widespread (major solar storm) loss of grid electricity.

edit on 5/8/2012 by Uphill because: (no reason given)
edit on 5/8/2012 by Uphill because: Added analysis.





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