It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

The Sword in the Stone at the Monte Siepi Chapel

page: 1
13
<<   2 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Feb, 14 2012 @ 02:41 PM
link   
The legend of King Arthur, and the story of The Sword in the Stone is thought by some to have been influenced from a 12th century sword buried in stone at what is now Monte Siepi Chapel, inside the San Galgano Abbey in Tuscany, Italy. The sword is said to have been placed there by Saint Galgano Guidotti around 1180ad.

historicmysteries.com...




The Sword in the Stone is a story with ties to Arthurian legend. It is the tale of the future King Arthur, who pulled the embedded sword from the stone when no other man could. It is a legend that displays the mythical qualities bestowed on Arthur — his ability to do the impossible — and it is not the only Arthurian legend involving the seemingly unlikely retrieval of a sword. Of course, there are other legends that display Arthur’s weaknesses — particularly, Guinevere and Morgan le Fay.

Judging by a real artifact, the sword in the stone legend may be partially based on true events. No one pulled a sword from a stone and went on to become a king, as far as we know. In fact, the sword that exists in reality rather than legend is still stuck in its stone. However, there is no denying that such a sword exists. The stone and sword in question are located at Monte Siepi Chapel in the San Galgano Abbey in Tuscany. The abbey is in Italy and the history of it has naught to do with England. However, it may be the inspiration for this popular story. After all, how many swords in stones can there possibly be?





San (Saint) Galgano Guidotti was born in 1148 is allegedly the man behind the real sword in the stone at Siepi Chapel. Guidotti was a knight that was far removed from the knights of Arthur’s Round Table. He was a brutal and cruel knight, but he turned his life around in the end and become a saint. At the age of 32, Guidotti saw the Archangel Michael, who told him that he must end his life of sin and showed him the path to god. The year was 1180.

Galgano Guidotti did not initially abide by the angel of Heaven. He did not do as the angel suggested and commit to god. It was not until he was out riding one day that he was faced with the place of his salvation — Monte Siepi. Monte Siepi did not include the impressive abbey and chapel that grace the landscape now when Galgano found it. In fact, it was just a hill with some bedrock in it. There, something — a voice from Heaven, perhaps — told him again that he had to change. He replied that it would be as difficult as “splitting rock with a sword.” He then tried to demonstrate the hopelessness of his situation, but instead of breaking, his sword went straight into the rock. The story goes that Galgano used the rock with the sword in it as an altar for praying from that day forth. He died roughly a year after sinking his sword into the stone at Monte Siepi.





Galgano Guidotti was canonized by Pope Lucius III in 1185. That is a rather quick achievement of sainthood by today’s standards, but he is still officially a saint. Starting the year of his canonization, monks built a chapel around his sword and stone altar. Today, it overlooks the ruins of San Galgano Abbey from its site on the hill. The chapel still contains the sword in the stone, though it is now encased in plastic so people will not try to steal it, break it or become King of England with it. Legend has it that one such fellow was set upon by a pack of wolves when he tried to take the sword. There is a pair of mummified hands in the chapel. They supposedly belonged to the would be thief.

While the sword may never have belonged to Saint Galgano Guidotti (this is still not entirely certain), one thing is certain, it dates from around his lifetime. If it did not belong to him, it belonged to someone else of his era. The mummified hands are from around that time as well. Therefore, there seems to be some truth to the story of the San Galgano sword in the stone.




It's an interesting tale, and it does sound like it could be linked to Arthurian legends. Has anyone else heard of this sword, St. Galgano, or other such tales that may be the roots of the legend of King Arthur?

www.myarmoury.com...
www.sangalgano.org...
atlasobscura.com...
www.charmingitaly.com...
edit on 14-2-2012 by isyeye because: (no reason given)




posted on Feb, 14 2012 @ 02:45 PM
link   
That's pretty cool!

I wonder if they let people try to pull it



posted on Feb, 14 2012 @ 02:48 PM
link   

Originally posted by calnorak
That's pretty cool!

I wonder if they let people try to pull it


Ixnay athay....hence the dome over it....



posted on Feb, 14 2012 @ 02:49 PM
link   
reply to post by calnorak
 


historicmysteries.com...

The chapel still contains the sword in the stone, though it is now encased in plastic so people will not try to steal it, break it or become King of England with it. Legend has it that one such fellow was set upon by a pack of wolves when he tried to take the sword. There is a pair of mummified hands in the chapel. They supposedly belonged to the would be thief.


No they don't......and judging from the quote, and how much I like my hands, I'm not going to try.

edit on 14-2-2012 by isyeye because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 14 2012 @ 02:50 PM
link   

Originally posted by calnorak
That's pretty cool!

I wonder if they let people try to pull it


Ron Paul could pull it out.



posted on Feb, 14 2012 @ 02:58 PM
link   
The thing to do is to trace back to the earliest mention of this item and incident in the literature. That will tell you when and if it actually dates from that era or is later example of 'pious fraud'.



posted on Feb, 14 2012 @ 03:08 PM
link   
While the legend is nice and all, looking at the sword, in the stone just makes me think about all the other items found in stone, coal and the like. Which all make me question our true history and/or ancient technology.
I just wish there weren't so many questions, with no answers.



posted on Feb, 14 2012 @ 03:16 PM
link   
reply to post by isyeye
 


Very cool...

Is it just me or does that sword kinda look fake?




posted on Feb, 14 2012 @ 03:23 PM
link   
reply to post by Akragon
 


I think the sword is probably authentic, but that doesn't mean that it's owner was St. Galgano

chivalrynow.createforumhosting.com...


Recent studies have shown the style and metal contruction of the sword is from the 12 century. The bottom half of the sword was uncovered and found to be of the same style and metal construction and that the broken edges matched. Some evidence suggests that Galgano may have been a Knight Templar


Another thing to note, is that this sword has been removed in the past.


Stories say the sword could be easily removed and replace and was actually broken on 1960 after such an attempt. It was also broken/stolen by vandels and was recovered. It was then set in place with motlen lead and concrete and protected by a barrier and plexiglas dome.


edit on 14-2-2012 by isyeye because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 14 2012 @ 03:38 PM
link   
reply to post by isyeye
 


Considering the number of wars and pillaging that have swept over this part of Italy. Multiple times since this incident I would suspect that that isn't the original sword or even the original stone.



posted on Feb, 14 2012 @ 03:41 PM
link   
reply to post by Hanslune
 


You have a good point. This is probably a case that can't really be verified. Even if the sword dates from the 12th century, that doesn't mean that it is the original. It could have easily been exchanged, or the original stolen and another put in it's place to cover the theft.
edit on 14-2-2012 by isyeye because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 14 2012 @ 03:48 PM
link   
Since the Arthurian tales are about the 5th century CE, I doubt this sword was an influence, unless the sword and stone was a later construct.

Years ago I read that the legend had its roots in the early iron age.
Back then, lumps of meteoric iron were the only really good sources of iron. The act of forging a blade from a lump of iron is known as drawing. Therefore, anyone who could draw a sword from a (stone) of meteoric iron would, with a half decent amount of swordcraft, be a formidable warrior and thus likely to become chief of the tribe.



posted on Feb, 14 2012 @ 03:51 PM
link   

Originally posted by isyeye
reply to post by Hanslune
 


You have a good point. This is probably a case that can't really be verified. Even if the sword dates from the 12th century, that doesn't mean that it is the original. It could have easily been exchanged, or the original stolen and another put in it's place to cover the theft.


Most probably, but It's kinda kewl anyway

Somewhat in the same line


This church has a long construction history that began in the 13th century. The church played a mayor role in the history of the County of Flanders. The church was situated within the domain of the Counts of Flanders which was, except the part along the River Lys, fully walled. The church was part of the first castle of Kortrijk.

After the Battle of the Golden Spurs in 1302, which took place nearby on the Groeningekouter, the Flemish people hung 500 Golden Spurs of killed French knights on the ceiling of the church. Mercenaries took them away, in 1382 after the Battle of Roosebeke. They were replaced by replicas which can still be seen in the church.


Yep and I saw them in 1980


edit on 14/2/12 by Hanslune because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 14 2012 @ 04:08 PM
link   
Athurian mythology has source in pre Christianity amongst Celtic peoples of Wales and Ireland.
The new always rewrites the old - The Knights Templar also are deeply connected.
The relic looks like a piece of artwork of it's time paying homage to the tale.

edit on 14-2-2012 by artistpoet because: edit

edit on 14-2-2012 by artistpoet because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 14 2012 @ 04:30 PM
link   

Originally posted by SprocketUK
Since the Arthurian tales are about the 5th century CE, I doubt this sword was an influence, unless the sword and stone was a later construct.

Years ago I read that the legend had its roots in the early iron age.
Back then, lumps of meteoric iron were the only really good sources of iron. The act of forging a blade from a lump of iron is known as drawing. Therefore, anyone who could draw a sword from a (stone) of meteoric iron would, with a half decent amount of swordcraft, be a formidable warrior and thus likely to become chief of the tribe.


Yes that is true - Forging metals was their technological breakthrough. way back in time. Drawing a sword from a stone is an art or science of initially drawing from stone the iron ore required and transforming it into a sword or other useful objects.



posted on Feb, 15 2012 @ 01:56 AM
link   

Originally posted by Hanslune
reply to post by isyeye
 


Considering the number of wars and pillaging that have swept over this part of Italy. Multiple times since this incident I would suspect that that isn't the original sword or even the original stone.


Could be, but sometimes the churches had enough time to hide their treasures or replace them with replicas. Maybe this one is a replica and the real one is still hidden away somewhere in the church waiting to be found someday... Uh oh, I think I just stumbled upon the plot to the next Dan Brown tale: The King Arthur Code!



posted on Feb, 15 2012 @ 04:20 AM
link   
Archivi della Compagnia di san Galgano

Worth reading the archives.



posted on Feb, 16 2012 @ 01:55 AM
link   
I dont think that Saint Galgano & his sword in the stone has anything to do with king Arthur & his sword in the stone.
The Chronology is different for both.

The earliest mentioned reference of King Arthur is from the Latin Text of Historia Brittonum of the 9th century AD. or if you consider the theory of Lucius Artorius Castus being the basis for the legend of King Arthur, he lived during the mid -late 2nd or early 3rd century AD.

But Saint Galgano lived from 1148 to 1181.

Saint Galgano repented for his sins and put his sword into the stone to show he was willing to mend his ways.

But King Arthur never did that. According to legend, its never clear as to who plunged the sword into the stone and there are arguments over whether this sword is the same as the Excalibur, which according to other myths was handed over to him by the lady of the lake.


edit on 16/2/12 by coredrill because: for typos



posted on Feb, 16 2012 @ 10:28 AM
link   

Originally posted by artistpoet


Yes that is true - Forging metals was their technological breakthrough. way back in time. Drawing a sword from a stone is an art or science of initially drawing from stone the iron ore required and transforming it into a sword or other useful objects.


Good point and a number of famous swords were actually made of meteor iron and were, for the time, far superior to the poorer quality of cast iron and steel swords. It is thought that this might be the reason behind legends of such swords being able to easily cut through their lesser brethen.



posted on Feb, 16 2012 @ 10:40 AM
link   
reply to post by isyeye
 


Interesting story..

In those days it was good for an abbey to have a (even false) holly relic. It brought people to town and the church..which made money.

Church hasn't changed that much and I bet that a lot of tourists still come to spent some money at that place....and to see the sword in stone ofcourse.


edit on 16/2/2012 by zatara because: (no reason given)



new topics

top topics



 
13
<<   2 >>

log in

join