The Secret of Freemasonry Seen in the Reflection of a Mirror - What do you see?

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posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 11:04 AM
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Originally posted by SuperiorEd
This is the trouble with pledging an association to an overall fraternity. The private association is a web to the overall leadership. The same holds true for a church.


Then by your reckoning the Westboro baptist Church (the 'God hates fags' people) are tarnishing the name of Baptists everywhere. Normal people can differentiate between the two, can you?


There are reformed lodges if I were guessing.


There are clandestine lodges which do not adhere to the same basic tenets and landmarks as regular lodges (admission of atheists, discussion of religion or politics, differing ritual, etc).


All Lodges practice different aspects of the Craft.


Most lodges practice nearly the same tenets and landmarks. The proportion of clandestine lodges is small when compared to Masonry on the whole.


Obedience to the top is required as I understand. Am I incorrect on this?


No. There is no 'top', each Grand Lodge is autonomous.




posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 11:04 AM
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reply to post by SuperiorEd
 


I deny it, vehiminetly.

The great work that masons speak of is a journey that you would never understand. It's has to do with building a temple, not made of stone. It's about helping those around you to the best of your ability, through charity, and truth. It's about becoming a better man.

That's the true quest. Know thyself.

But since that doesn't fit your model of Masonry, I'm sure another YouTube video is in order...

Fitz, I promise not to go down the rabbit hole on this one, good advice, Bro.



posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 11:08 AM
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Originally posted by SuperiorEd
You won't find a person on this board more versed in the subject than myself.


Anyone who claims to be the 'most anything' typically never is; more un-Christian behavior from the person who wants to 'save' everyone from themselves. Tame yourself before prosthelytizing to others.



posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 11:08 AM
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Originally posted by SuperiorEd
As an aggregate of production, what is the Masonic tradition doing to build America? A debt of 15 Trillion represent magic applied to law.

The cause of the debt cannot be laid onto the Masons. To say this just proves your irrationality.



posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 11:09 AM
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Originally posted by SuperiorEd

Originally posted by AugustusMasonicus

Originally posted by SuperiorEd
Aliester Crowley (Freemason)...


...of an irregualr lodge, who, upon trying to join the United Grand Lodge of England was denied membership and consequently did not become a recognized Mason. Try sticking to the facts when you launch into one of your religious sermons because liars and deceivers need to be saved before I do. Look in your own mirror and see that your unfettered zealotry has caused you to be duplicitous and perfidious.


I am not hiding behind my belief. Come into the light and reveal the secrets if they are true. Why put your light under a bushel? What is there to hide? I am merely showing you a mirror to look at. I am not coming to take anything from you. All the good that is done by way of giving can be easily achieved apart from private associations behind closed doors. I say come out of Egypt and roll the stone away. Reveal the truth instead of hiding it in a tomb.

edit on 13-2-2012 by SuperiorEd because: (no reason given)


Do you know what we do with powerful secrets?

We turn them into military weapons and blow everyone the # up.

Now, is it really the wise choice to let the government see everything there is to know about enlightened or "empowered" societies?



posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 11:14 AM
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reply to post by SuperiorEd
 



Incredulity is bias. I have not stood against anyone in my posts. On the contrary, I am trying to show you the way to true freedom. The path is narrow. Exoteric materialism is not the way. Essoteric mysticism is another broad path. The narrow path is between with truth.


You mean the path of God, where one misstep means you are encouraged to read the Bible for four hours then weep for mercy at the feet of your "Merciful Lord"?

Where you live in fear, despite the fact that fear is not synonymous with love, which is supposedly the rule of thumb with your god?

Your god is full of contradictions...sorry, but I choose the path of enlightenment, not the path of "Oh, that's just how it is. If it doesn't make sense, don't think about it, because it's God, and God can do anything."

Freemasons have done more good than any religious organization in the world, despite being the most persecuted by those same organizations...demonizations by which have continued to this day. What proof have you, that can discredit or shame any of the Freemasons?

Namaste



posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 11:17 AM
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These two quotes don't have any similarities in meaning. At all.


Originally posted by SuperiorEd
Aliester Crowley (Freemason) said, ""Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law"


This means to find your true will. Your goal and purpose. It means that, if you are following your true path, there are no other laws. To simplify, it means to find your meaning in life.



Originally posted by SuperiorEd
Jesus said, "So in everything, do to others what you would have them do to you, for this sums up the Law and the Prophets." Matt 7:12


This means to treat others how you would like to be treated. Not even close to the meaning of the other.



posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 11:23 AM
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Originally posted by KSigMason
reply to post by SuperiorEd
 

The world has been influenced by Masons, but its not a grand scheme as there is no single authority of all Freemasonry to do so. Every man goes out into the world to better it. There is no manipulation, that is your opinion.

Freemasonry would be the antithesis of tyranny as well as ignorance and fanaticism.


Do you deny that the Masons "Great Work" is to build the society of the NWO?

Yes.


All of us do this each day. Where is the root and division of association? Men or God? Gather together and better the world by works. This is a common theme for all churches. Who we serve reveals the root of the plant. Follow the plant to its root and decide if it's a weed or a flower. Both take up the soil together. One chokes the other out.

We can save the world by following the law or we can transmute the law to manipulate the world. Which is it with the Masons?

There is no need to practice ritual magic to find the Spirit that already exists with your soul. That spirit is ever-present. There is a spirit of the world that is the same. We associate with one or the other. 1 Corinthians tells this story clearly. LINK

I am not a Mason and I feed the hungry each week. I do all the good works that represent the fruit of my faith. Works do not save the soul. Faith in God saves the soul. The fruit of faith is the work. The work can be done apart form faith as well. Is there a difference?

The whole matter can be clarified by studying the Periphrases and the Sadducees. They were the manipulators of the law in the first century. Jesus had words for them in similar manner. His rebuke for them was for the same reason. They were suppressing the truth behind ritual and greed. They used their office of leadership to take instead of give. For this, John the Baptist said this:

7 But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees coming to where he was baptizing, he said to them: “You brood of vipers! Who warned you to flee from the coming wrath? 8 Produce fruit in keeping with repentance. 9 And do not think you can say to yourselves, ‘We have Abraham as our father.’ I tell you that out of these stones God can raise up children for Abraham. 10 The ax is already at the root of the trees, and every tree that does not produce good fruit will be cut down and thrown into the fire.

If you can see it in the Catholic Church and the Jesuits, then see it in the Masons as well. Where is the difference? Each is trying to subdue the world by private association and influence.

You are correct in your pledge to give to the poor and needy. This is the fruit of repentance. Apart from the repentance, the work is dead. Repent from what? Unbelief and Peganism. What else? Read the Old Testament. Ritual magic is paganism.


edit on 13-2-2012 by SuperiorEd because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 11:30 AM
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reply to post by SuperiorEd
 


I disagree with you there is no such thing as Freemasonry pushing for an agenda, there are maybe single people inside the Craft that have personal interests, I do not think it is more different than within any other group. Unfortunately I have also seen that the so called NWO,has used Freemasons among other groups to achieve historical influence, which in return was not proficient at all for Freemasonry (see prohibition of Freemasonry under the Nazi rule and within Communist countries (my great grand-dad and my grand-dad had to renounce Freemasonry, or go to the the forced labor camp!!!) Freemasons have never been accepted by tyrannical dictators), lately (starting 2006) I had the impression that deliberate campaigns against Masons have flourished, please do not be fooled by scapegoat tactics because the real reasons might escape you, the ability to learn from history is a good thing.



posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 11:30 AM
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Originally posted by Cuervo
These two quotes don't have any similarities in meaning. At all.


Originally posted by SuperiorEd
Aliester Crowley (Freemason) said, ""Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law"


This means to find your true will. Your goal and purpose. It means that, if you are following your true path, there are no other laws. To simplify, it means to find your meaning in life.



Originally posted by SuperiorEd
Jesus said, "So in everything, do to others what you would have them do to you, for this sums up the Law and the Prophets." Matt 7:12


This means to treat others how you would like to be treated. Not even close to the meaning of the other.



One is objectivism. The other is Altruism. Believe Ayn Rand if you like, but taking and giving are two different matters. If I smoke, I get cancer (Suffering). Take a reward and a debt is created. Compare this to the financial tables that have been turned in this century. If I suffer work to gain true reward, then the reward extends beyond me. Work at a job and get a paycheck. Suffer education and become educated. Reward follows suffering. Taking reward leads to suffering you would rather not experience.

Which prophet would you follow based on truth? The choice is Prophet or profit. Taking or giving. Following law or using law to transmute.

edit on 13-2-2012 by SuperiorEd because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 11:36 AM
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Originally posted by starseedflower
reply to post by SuperiorEd
 


I disagree with you there is no such thing as Freemasonry pushing for an agenda, there are maybe single people inside the Craft that have personal interests, I do not think it is more different than within any other group. Unfortunately I have also seen that the so called NWO,has used Freemasons among other groups to achieve historical influence, which in return was not proficient at all for Freemasonry (see prohibition of Freemasonry under the Nazi rule and within Communist countries (my great grand-dad and my grand-dad had to renounce Freemasonry, or go to the the forced labor camp!!!) Freemasons have never been accepted by tyrannical dictators), lately (starting 2006) I had the impression that deliberate campaigns against Masons have flourished, please do not be fooled by scapegoat tactics because the real reasons might escape you, the ability to learn from history is a good thing.


If you find a fire hydrant with a urine stain, do you say that anyone could have caused it? Possibly. Would it rather be obvious that a dog is somewhere nearby?

When you look at Washington DC, do you see a layout of random purpose, or do you see a urine stain from Freemasonry? Where has Washington taken us by ritual magic in these last days of the third age? You can call me a 'Fundie' or you can check the Bible and read all about it.



edit on 13-2-2012 by SuperiorEd because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 11:40 AM
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Originally posted by Starchild23
reply to post by SuperiorEd
 



Incredulity is bias. I have not stood against anyone in my posts. On the contrary, I am trying to show you the way to true freedom. The path is narrow. Exoteric materialism is not the way. Essoteric mysticism is another broad path. The narrow path is between with truth.


You mean the path of God, where one misstep means you are encouraged to read the Bible for four hours then weep for mercy at the feet of your "Merciful Lord"?

Where you live in fear, despite the fact that fear is not synonymous with love, which is supposedly the rule of thumb with your god?

Your god is full of contradictions...sorry, but I choose the path of enlightenment, not the path of "Oh, that's just how it is. If it doesn't make sense, don't think about it, because it's God, and God can do anything."

Freemasons have done more good than any religious organization in the world, despite being the most persecuted by those same organizations...demonizations by which have continued to this day. What proof have you, that can discredit or shame any of the Freemasons?

Namaste


If I were living in fear, I would be enjoying a snow day with a cup of coffee and a movie. Denial is fear. Emptiness is fear. I am full and deny only darkness. By "Your God" you are clearly differentiating this from another. Which other is that? You are coming out in support of a topic on ritual magic. Fill in a context so I can know your truth by comparison. If you are afraid to share, who is living in fear?



posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 11:41 AM
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Originally posted by SuperiorEd
When you look at Washington DC, do you see a layout of random purpose, or do you see a urine stain from Freemasonry?
Nope. Just you pissing yourself.



posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 11:43 AM
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reply to post by SuperiorEd
 




Freemasons have done more good than any religious organization in the world, despite being the most persecuted by those same organizations...demonizations by which have continued to this day. What proof have you, that can discredit or shame any of the Freemasons?

Namaste


Single acts of kindness are always a good focus for any organization. Manipulation of law is quite another story. There are more edges to examine than the giving Masons do to support the organization. Clearly, they do good work for others on the outside of the Temple. Does the inside of the cup reflect this?

Jesus never misses a chance to speak in these matters.

Blind Pharisee! First clean the inside of the cup and dish, and then the outside also will be clean. Matthew 23:26



posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 11:46 AM
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Originally posted by SuperiorEd
Come into the light and reveal the secrets if they are true. Why put your light under a bushel? What is there to hide?

Do not give dogs what is sacred; do not throw your pearls to pigs. If you do, they may trample them under their feet, and turn and tear you to pieces.
Matthew 7:6


But when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your Father, who is unseen. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you.
Matthew 6:6



posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 11:50 AM
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Originally posted by JoshNorton

Originally posted by SuperiorEd
When you look at Washington DC, do you see a layout of random purpose, or do you see a urine stain from Freemasonry?
Nope. Just you pissing yourself.


You do realize that the Masonic symbols are stamped on all the buildings and cornerstones in DC. There are 40 lodges in this one city alone. Washington was a Mason. Even the measurements of the Statue of Liberty in NY are masonic representations of symbolic numbers. Where can we go to see a town that was not a product of the craft? Salt Lake? Nope!



posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 11:51 AM
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reply to post by SuperiorEd
 



Manipulation of law is quite another story.


No laws are absolute. Their very nature requires manipulation. This is why we have lawyers, and judges, and juries, and bureaucrats involved with the law. No two scenarios are exactly the same, and therefore the law must be interpreted and manipulated for each unique circumstance.

I'm a firm believer in Natural Law, and Natural Consequences. This isn't a Masonic principle, but rather a personal principle of mine, and I believe it is a self-evident one, but apparently I'm not in the majority. I like bullies, and I like natural selection, and I like personal responsibility, and I like to see dumb decisions get consequences. I like the Darwin awards. I hate helmet and seatbelt laws. I think revenge is sometimes justified. I don't believe an eye for an eye leaves the whole world blind, because I believe people will start to butt out of one another's business, once we start poking each other in the eye!


So, as long as none of the law manipulation gets in the way of my idealistic natural law existence, then every thing will be fine, but once they butt up against one another, I believe my natural law will defeat man's law, and so I don't live with much stress over the issue.


Now, since I am a Mason, how does that equate with the Masonic agenda you have envisioned in your mind's eye? I can attest for about 80% of the people in my Lodge, and I can guarantee they have no interest in running the rest of the world, they just want the rest of the world to stay out of their yard!



posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 11:58 AM
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reply to post by SuperiorEd
 


Please do not be silly, you can take any city in the world and look at the architecture that has been adopted and you will soon find out that you need to use certain angles to properly build a house and and to lay out an efficient street plan, because it is the only possible logical way to do it and because... the how to do it is... way, way older than Freemasonry itself. Just research the oldest archaeological sites around the world and you will find out that Masons have just incorporated the best way to build it and not the other way round.



posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 11:58 AM
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reply to post by SuperiorEd
 



You do realize that the Masonic symbols are stamped on all the buildings and cornerstones in DC. There are 40 lodges in this one city alone. Washington was a Mason. Even the measurements of the Statue of Liberty in NY are masonic representations of symbolic numbers. Where can we go to see a town that was not a product of the craft? Salt Lake? Nope!


So, Washington was a Mason, and the winner of our Revolutionary war, and the first president of our country, and a town named after him has a lot of Masonic symbolism.
That seems like the most transparent conspiracy in the history of the world. What am I missing? Sam Houston is represented all over Texas, has a town named after him and a statue, but it just seems to make sense to me, it doesn't seem like a grand conspiracy. I suppose one could say the same for Johnny Appleseed, or Lewis and Clark,

Masonic principles are based heavily in geometry and architecture dating back to the Romans and Greeks, so it makes sense that any decent construction technique you might find in the world would share some of those same principles. It isn't a conspiracy, it is history.



posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 12:02 PM
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Originally posted by SuperiorEd

Originally posted by Cuervo
These two quotes don't have any similarities in meaning. At all.


Originally posted by SuperiorEd
Aliester Crowley (Freemason) said, ""Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law"


This means to find your true will. Your goal and purpose. It means that, if you are following your true path, there are no other laws. To simplify, it means to find your meaning in life.



Originally posted by SuperiorEd
Jesus said, "So in everything, do to others what you would have them do to you, for this sums up the Law and the Prophets." Matt 7:12


This means to treat others how you would like to be treated. Not even close to the meaning of the other.



One is objectivism. The other is Altruism.


I could argue the opposite, as well. "Do what though wilt" means to find your purpose which is often to help others or to be somebody else's object lesson. Quite altruistic.

"Do unto others as you would have them do unto you" can be a selfish act because many people only treat others well so they can get something out of it.

Honestly, both have the same degree of altruism and selfishness but, aside from that, they are completely different.



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