It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Christianity: What's the 'catch'?

page: 7
7
<< 4  5  6    8  9  10 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 05:31 PM
link   
reply to post by NewAgeMan
 


And if he was Lord, while a human being, then it certainly doesn't belittle us at all as his followers who are meant to grow in stature, and mind, and soul, until Christ himself (although the student can never be as great as the master).

I put forward that Jesus also represents not JUST salvation, but an evolutionary principal for the human being.

As crazy as that sounds, you are correct.....in a weird hippy, new age type of way

You may not know, but as Christians, we will one day get a body just like Jesus Christs with all the power it held (Universal flight, immortality, immunity, can eat, can pass through walls, can shape shift.....) But in order to obtain this "evolutionary" step....you must FIRST take the first and most important step....to accept Jesus Christ as your own personal sacrifice for the sin you were born into, and the sins you committed. If you want to know more, message me or visit this link.

The Free gift of Eternal Life
edit on 13-2-2012 by KJV1611 because: link




posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 05:41 PM
link   

Originally posted by wildtimes
reply to post by KJV1611
 


Those who would be saved later on (His followers) called Him LORD. Jesus was not a religious teacher..

Okay, you DO realize that the King James Version of the Bible, on which you portray a crown, was translated during the feudal time of people in England (where he lived) who referred to their superiors as "Lord"....right?

What? What in the sam hill are you talking about when you say "He was not a religious teacher"?
He taught the Golden Rule. He disputed the status quo. He taught the truth. The TRUTH, that if you live loving God, and loving your neighbor as yourself, you will reunite with the Divine after several go-rounds here on earth as a mortal, having been "Born Again" time after time while you learn the lessons via experience.

He also put a heck of a bind on everything that was "not good", and then got to laugh his ass off (Ho Ho Ho) all the way to heaven as the devil's expense, to me, that's just frick'n AWESOME, to possess such utter genius, to get to "have his cake and eat it too!" You gotta love him, whether God, Godman, or even as a man perfected in the image of God.



posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 05:48 PM
link   
reply to post by Akragon
 



IF that was the case... (him being God) why would you follow paul?

You make my head hurt my friend..


I follow Paul because he follows Jesus..... 1 CORINTHIANS 11:1 "Be ye FOLLOWERS OF ME, even as I also am of Christ."

I'm going to try and make this quick....you personally cannot follow Jesus Christ my friend. You can't do it. Why?
1. Jesus is in Heaven, you are on earth with other humans.
2. Christ said to "take up your cross and follow me" to His apostles!!! Not to you! His apostles did just that...and guess what? Just as Jesus Christ did, they to all DIED a horrible death following in Jesus footsteps. You done that lately?
3. You can follow Paul though, as he was a missionary and a soul winner.
4. You are not suppose to act the way Jesus did. Jesus was a Jew, you are a gentile. Jesus was GOD, you are man. If you tried to imitate or follow Jesus, you would be doing just as the coming Anti-christ will do.....imitating God.
5 And the biggest reason. Jesus did not teach salvation by Grace through faith in HIS shed blood...why? Because He had YET TO SHED IT!!! Hints why AFTER the fact of the passion of Christ you needed PAUL to tell the old story, of Jesus and His love. The Gospel.

Once again, if you follow only what is documented about Jesus Christ by His biographers (Matthew, Mark, Luke and John) then you will die and spend forever in Hell......when all you needed to do was flip the pages of the book just a few more turns.... Why read a book (the Holy Bible) without finishing it?

You don't read any other book half way through and stop in the middle thinking you have full knowledge of that book do you? Then why treat the Holy Bible this way? (enter the attack on the bible via Catholics wrote it, its a mistranslation, Paul is plagiarized...etc, etc, yadda, yadda yad.) Psalms 12:6-7 Believe God or don't. You can't have it both ways.
edit on 13-2-2012 by KJV1611 because: spelling



posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 05:53 PM
link   
reply to post by KJV1611
 


I've got some news for you my friend...

I have never once claimed to follow Jesus... and i will not follow paul... as a matter of fact paul makes me laugh... And i have no use for his words...

IF you follow... You're subject to other followers words... That is not my ditch, so i will jump over instead of following the blind into their whole...

Jesus walks with me every day of my life... i do not follow him...

And i will not land in your hell either... IT only exists IF you chose to believe IT does... And i do not...




posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 06:01 PM
link   
reply to post by KJV1611
 

To be baptised is to be baptised into the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ, and that's following him, and to follow him is to find the narrow gate that leads to a life of freedom, set free to freely love as we are loved, to follow Jesus Christ is to be liberated, and be with him where he is, which is a state of joy and happiness even though he may be in the domain of light and love of which the creation is a reflection, and to have life to the full even to overflowing.

Yours is the sin of bibliolatry, where the letter of the word kills.

I have the life of Christ with me, and "we" were even buried and resurrected together, just last month truth be told, actually it was through the winter solstice during this past Christmas, to be exact.

You know the Bible like the back of your hand, but you don't seem to know the living Christ very well at all, you're what I call a "dry" Christian, spiritually, and I feel sorry for you, because once in your condition, it's not easy to liven you up, not easy at all.

You will not be able to refer to the Bible when God reads your heart, and he reads it all the time, and knows us through and through, better even than we know ourselves.

Don't follow Christ, but follow Paul instead - don't be absurd!

Your use of the Bible separates you from Christ, and others from Christ, I realize that sounds harsh, but it's true.


edit on 13-2-2012 by NewAgeMan because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 06:09 PM
link   
reply to post by NewAgeMan
 


You know the Bible like the back of your hand, but you don't seem to know the living Christ very well at all, you're what I call a "dry" Christian, spiritually, and I feel sorry for you, because once in your condition, it's not easy to liven you up.
So I should be a blubbering wreck crying wet Christian instead? Just so you know.....The only reason you know anything AT ALL about Jesus Christ is because of the Bible you so carelessly make light of. What? , if I started waving my hands in the air, dancing around praising a mythical "Yahwuah" and talking in tongues like a lunatic would that make me less "dry". You need to separate your facts from your emotions dealing with Christianity bud.....

edit on 13-2-2012 by KJV1611 because: more sarcasm



posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 06:16 PM
link   
reply to post by NewAgeMan
 



Your use of the Bible separates you........and others from Christ, I realize that sounds harsh, but it's true.

That is the purpose of the Holy Bible....you did know that right? The HOLY Bible isn't used so we can all get together and hold hands as a big fat family with God as our father and us man in a brotherhood. No, the Bible is used to CUT and SEPARATE Christians from the world. We Christians are segregationists at heart and are not to be found living "worldly" Matter of fact, we are to hate this world. It was God's job to LOVE it John 3:16, not ours.

Hebrews 4:12
"For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart. "



posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 06:22 PM
link   

Originally posted by KJV1611
reply to post by NewAgeMan
 



Your use of the Bible separates you........and others from Christ, I realize that sounds harsh, but it's true.

That is the purpose of the Holy Bible....you did know that right? The HOLY Bible isn't used so we can all get together and hold hands as a big fat family with God as our father and us man in a brotherhood. No, the Bible is used to CUT and SEPARATE Christians from the world. We Christians are segregationists at heart and are not to be found living "worldly" Matter of fact, we are to hate this world. It was God's job to LOVE it John 3:16, not ours.

Hebrews 4:12
"For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart. "


I believe THAT is the truest statement i've ever heard from you my friend...

A star for you...





posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 06:27 PM
link   

Originally posted by KJV1611
You need to separate your facts from your emotions dealing with Christianity bud.....

edit on 13-2-2012 by KJV1611 because: more sarcasm

Can't, because I fell in love with Christ, who came through the frame to great me, and who is alive, no longer words on a page, not part of some study guide.

After all, that's the kind of relationship I do believe he's after, as a true friend.

You would be well served to have a "wet" experience, yes, because even your reply tells me that I was right.

But don't be jealous, just find him and marry him as well, because if I'm a "bride of Christ", I can't be the ONLY one, no the Christian experience of the living God in Christ Jesus isn't unique to me, but I don't think it's as common as many "evangelicals" would have us believe either.

The Biblical words, that was just step one - what about meeting him for an embrace..?


edit on 13-2-2012 by NewAgeMan because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 06:31 PM
link   

Originally posted by KJV1611
reply to post by NewAgeMan
 



Your use of the Bible separates you........and others from Christ, I realize that sounds harsh, but it's true.

That is the purpose of the Holy Bible....you did know that right? The HOLY Bible isn't used so we can all get together and hold hands as a big fat family with God as our father and us man in a brotherhood. No, the Bible is used to >>snipped for brevity



posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 06:48 PM
link   
Oh well, where one gathers by the same voice, and shows the way to the gatefold (which is Christ himself at the door) into new pasture (freedom), another is sure to be found scattering (although dressed in sheep's clothing) employing the Bible itself as either a sword or a blunt instrument, but the true sheep, they hear the voice nevertheless, and freely enter in under the protection and care of the Lord God Almighty.



posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 06:52 PM
link   
reply to post by NewAgeMan
 



Oh really eh, it's not to redeem God's creation, for a new heaven and a new earth which includes the brotherhood of man in a family framework, when God comes to live with his people and be their God..?

oh man, I wish you hadn't said that
Your statement is true in a sense....but do you have ANY idea HOW God brings about this scenario? By CUTTING, KILLING, and completely destroying over 4 billion people on this earth....and that is just during the tribulation and second advent! DO you have any idea what takes place when God destroys this world and creates a new one? What exactly do you think happens to the people still on this planet when God is ready to make a new one after the millennium....? I'll give you a hint: ZECHARIAH 14:12 and 2 Peter 3:10-12


It's to tear us all apart and make us hate the world (even the creation), while waiting anxiously to DIE, ok, whatever you say Bible dude.
The Bible isn't to tear Christians apart...its to tear NATIONS apart. Why you think the Bible is banned in so many different nations. Heck, there is a whole government form (Communism) based on getting rid of anything to do with the Bible. Our government has followed suit through out the 60's till now. But I'll leave you alone if you are really a Christian. I don't want you to get over loaded. Keep feeding on milk for now my friend. Come back for meat when you are ready.

1 PETER 2:2
"As newborn babes, desire the sincere MILK OF THE WORD, that ye may grow thereby:"

If people really knew what was in the Bible and what was about to happen....everyone would go stock crazy mad. Men's hearts would fail them from fear just thinking about it. It terrifies me to be honest.
Thankfully I will not be earth bound when this takes place.



posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 06:56 PM
link   

Originally posted by NewAgeMan

Originally posted by KJV1611
reply to post by NewAgeMan
 



Your use of the Bible separates you........and others from Christ, I realize that sounds harsh, but it's true.

That is the purpose of the Holy Bible....you did know that right? The HOLY Bible isn't used so we can all get together and hold hands as a big fat family with God as our father and us man in a brotherhood. No, the Bible is used to >>snipped for brevity



posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 06:57 PM
link   
reply to post by NewAgeMan
 



....and shows the way to the gatefold (which is Christ himself at the door)
Jesus Christ is NOT "at the door" as you said, Christ IS THE DOOR. And you must enter in THROUGH HIM to be saved. There is a HUGE difference. Your way teaches religion gets you to heaven. Mine teaches salvation is in a PERSON.

John 10:7 "Then said Jesus unto them again, Verily, verily, I say unto you, I am the door of the sheep."

Of course you might have just made a small typing error, or lacking Biblical knowledge. I hope....



posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 07:14 PM
link   
reply to post by jmdewey60
 



.Jesus did not have to. Grace had to be taught to the gentiles to explain their calling. The Jews needed no such instruction since they firmly understood their election as being through their forefathers.

One more thing bud...Jesus never taught the Gospel of Grace. You know what He taught? He taught the GOSPEL OF THE KINGDOM! Which involves WORKS FOR YOUR SALVATION. This is why you MUST follow Paul and his Gospel of the Grace of God, given directly to him from Jesus Christ Himself.

Matthew 4:23
"And Jesus went about all Galilee, teaching in their synagogues, and preaching the gospel of the kingdom, and healing all manner of sickness and all manner of disease among the people."

The Gospel of the Kingdom involve healing, gifts, and other SIGNS giving to the JEWS. The Gospel of Grace involves believe WITHOUT SIGHT, as Jesus alluded to with Thomas the doubter. "blessed are those who have not seen yet believe..."

So in conclusion, these two Gospels are not the Same. This is why many of you guys are confused. Its understandable though!

It is also why you cannot follow Jesus. Can you do the miracles He did? Of course not. But those He commanded to follow Him could, His apostles. You are not them,
edit on 13-2-2012 by KJV1611 because: more



posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 07:44 PM
link   
reply to post by Akragon
 


Hello Akragon....
Haven't talk to you in a very long time. AND I haven't been on here much in the last few months. But I must say:

Talking religion is like Tic Tac Toe.. Win a few, lose a few, but mostly no one wins, for every action there is a reaction.
With over 30, 000 religions structured on the Bible, I am sure there is one that may be suitable for every one's belief. If not..there will be a new one made. 30,001, so to speak.
People quote the bible as they understand its interpretation. Another sees it differently....hence..30,000 different structured religious views!!
I must say, I do find this bit of scripture very interesting.

Isaiah 45:7...KJV.....I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things.

I suppose there is 30,000 different ways to interpret that too.



posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 08:13 PM
link   
reply to post by KJV1611
 

If you follow your mythical "golden rule", you will simply enter into Hell as a good person.

And I suppose you believe there will be bad people in heaven.
So nice word view you have: good people go to Hell,
while bad people go to heaven.
I doubt that is the way it works.
Good New Testament theology would be that without the Christ spirit that is given to us by grace, we can not be as good as we should be. I don't think there is much of a requirement for receiving it other than probably at some point actually believing such a thing exists. Whether a person is good or not would be the easiest way to tell if someone has received that spirit from Jesus.



posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 08:32 PM
link   
reply to post by KJV1611
 

Are you just making this stuff up on the go?

It's called theology and I make it pretty clear where I get my ideas from by posting my reading list on my profile comments section. For this particular thought, see:
Justification and Variegated Nomism: The Paradoxes of Paul, Carson, D. A.
That is a collection of essays on the concept of nomisn, as the title would suggest and the issue is if salvation has to do with works, and was it understood that way in Palestinian Judaism in the time of Paul. This is one book on the subject but it analysis a lot of other books that have been published in the last 25 years on the subject. Specifically it has to do with a calling or election to join in a covenantal relationship with God, and whether it is different from that of the Jews from the gentiles, meaning, if both are through grace. The second aspect is if there is the idea within these systems, of doing works to stay within the covenant relationship.
So what I was vaguely alluding to was the commonly held view that Israel's election can be thought of as Grace. If so, the Jews of Palestine in the days of Jesus would have viewed themselves as the special recipients of Grace by their calling as God's chosen people.
Now contrasted to this is how the gentiles would understand how they could also find themselves in a covenantal relationship with God, and this was something Paul had to teach them, and how to understand what Grace was.
edit on 13-2-2012 by jmdewey60 because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 08:44 PM
link   
reply to post by KJV1611
 

. . . otherwise known as Humanism, which God hates.

How do you know that?
Ever heard of an ancient ethical tradition of the Greeks?
Paul was a Hellenized Jew and understood that tradition as well as the Jewish tradition he was born into and there is evidence of that understanding by Paul in his writings. It is not "secular humanism" because there was no such thing as a secular version of humanism back then and that is a modern invention.
To find out where I get that idea, read:
Paul and the Stoics, Troels Engberg-Pedersen

edit on 13-2-2012 by jmdewey60 because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 08:59 PM
link   
reply to post by KJV1611
 

....to accept Jesus Christ as your own personal sacrifice for the sin you were born into, and the sins you committed.

The method by which "the sins you committed" are forgiven, according to the New Testament is by God forgetting them. There is no place in the Bible that says Jesus died for our personal sins. If anything it is a corporate thing that involves every person who has ever lived on this earth and somehow his death was an integral part of introducing a new system through which we gain salvation. By some mechanism, involving Jesus' life of righteousness, and his death, Jesus broke through some sort of barrier to where he went to a place and vanquished whatever was there that only he could deal with, and in terms understandable to us, he defeated death, and thus paved the way to life, and that involves a new thing Jesus spoke about and was explained by Paul which is a spirit Jesus gives us to enable us to live lives pleasing to God.



new topics

top topics



 
7
<< 4  5  6    8  9  10 >>

log in

join