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Christianity: What's the 'catch'?

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posted on Feb, 12 2012 @ 01:54 PM
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reply to post by NOTurTypical
 



Then it's not a commandment.
Period. He is the Lord, what am I missing here?


We are not to follow just Christ's commandments only (you chopped your hand off lately?), we are to follow Paul's too. And if Jesus Christ ever contradicts Paul....We Christians are to follow Paul's teachings over Jesus'. I know it sounds bad, but if you are to rightly divide the scriptures, you must follow this rule.

Also, the Apostles gave plenty of commandments that Jesus Christ never did....
"Peter"
2 PETER 3:2
"That ye may be mindful of the words which were spoken before by the holy prophets, and of the COMMANDMENT of us the apostles of the Lord and Saviour:"

"Paul"
1 Tim 6:10-14
10 For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows.
11 But thou, O man of God, flee these things; and follow after righteousness, godliness, faith, love, patience, meekness.
12 Fight the good fight of faith, lay hold on eternal life, whereunto thou art also called, and hast professed a good profession before many witnesses.
13 I give thee charge in the sight of God, who quickeneth all things, and before Christ Jesus, who before Pontius Pilate witnessed a good confession;
14 That thou keep this COMMANDMENT without spot, unrebukable, until the appearing of our Lord Jesus Christ:

"John"
1 JOHN 2:8
"Again, a new COMMANDMENT I write unto you, which thing is true in him and in you: because the darkness is past, and the true light now shineth."


Period?




posted on Feb, 12 2012 @ 01:58 PM
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reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


P.s. How would you define Hebrews 10:25 if not as a commandment? Would you consider it a suggestion? Or a high recommendation? Or maybe a subtle hint? I just got back from church by the way




Hebrews 10:24-25
24 And let us consider one another to provoke unto love and to good works:
25 Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching.

edit on 12-2-2012 by KJV1611 because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 12 2012 @ 05:39 PM
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reply to post by KJV1611
 



And if Jesus Christ ever contradicts Paul....We Christians are to follow Paul's teachings over Jesus'. I know it sounds bad, but if you are to rightly divide the scriptures, you must follow this rule.


Ahem...

OH... MY...GOD...


My friend you can't be considered Christian if you follow paul... you are now a paulian... Along with many of the others that feel this way as well... Justs myt opinion of course... It is called "Christianity"... though i would say many follow paulianity, perhaps even more follow paul then Jesus...

So sad...


edit on 12-2-2012 by Akragon because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 12 2012 @ 06:17 PM
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reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


21 “Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ 23 And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’


You said:

Jesus isn't talking about Christians in this passage.

Uh, yeah, he is.
He is talking about people who behave only to impress others, or to impress God. Those who go through the motions, and put on the prescribed actions, and speak the prescribed words, but don't really mean it. When they're alone they are indifferent to anyone else's suffering, and all about themselves. They do those things only if it takes nothing away from their selfish comfort, and makes them feel like they 'toed the line.'

You've conveniently left out the part about caring for others, feeding and clothing the needy, etc....when he said "Inasmuch as you did not do those things for the least of your brethren, you did it not for me also."
Or some such translated paraphrase.

In other words, modern lingo:
"You gave me some lip-service, and went through some motions, but you did NOT do so for the right reasons. You're a poser. So get lost."



edit on 12-2-2012 by wildtimes because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 12 2012 @ 07:21 PM
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reply to post by NOTurTypical
 

"that if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved;"

The point Paul was making when he said that was it did not matter if you are a gentile because the body parts involved in salvation are your heart and mouth, not your foreskin.
Read the next verse where he says, leading to righteousness.
You have been told this over and over and I will keep repeating the same explanation as long as you persist in your religion of 'sin all you want'.
edit on 12-2-2012 by jmdewey60 because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 12 2012 @ 10:40 PM
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reply to post by Akragon
 



My friend you can't be considered Christian if you follow paul... you are now a paulian... Along with many of the others that feel this way as well... Justs myt opinion of course... It is called "Christianity"... though i would say many follow paulianity, perhaps even more follow paul then Jesus...


Of course I am "Paulian"....whatever the devil that means...but really now, you saying you don't follow Paul over Jesus? If you don't then you are not saved and you will not go to Heaven. Why? Jesus never once taught salvation by grace through faith. Paul did,

Jesus taught keep commandments and works based salvation (Matt 5-7, etc.) Paul taught pure faith through grace. (Eph 2:8-9)

Matter of fact, Christianity is based SOLELY on Paul's writings. I have noticed a lot if you guys don't understand this. Let me make it clear....if you follow Jesus Christ's teachings ONLY, then you will end up in Hell. Why? Because you must believe the Gospel to be saved. Soooooo what is the Gospel? (1 Cor 15:1-4) Its the death, burial and resurrection of Jesus Christ. So how you going to believe the Gospel of Grace reading ONLY the Gospels?!?! The gospel of grace does not even appear!! I challenge you, show me where the gospel of grace appears in the 4 gospels. (Now Jesus did mention it, but only to His apostles, He never preached it (Rom 10:9-17))

P.s. You are COMMANDED to be a follower of Paul according to the Holy Scriptures.
1 Cor 4:16 "Wherefore I beseech you, BE YE FOLLOWERS OF ME. "
Keep reading....you will catch up one day (I hope
)



posted on Feb, 12 2012 @ 11:18 PM
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reply to post by KJV1611
 


Im sorry, i can't even comment on that...

Thank God im not Christian...

Paulus Christ your lord?


edit on 12-2-2012 by Akragon because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 12 2012 @ 11:42 PM
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reply to post by KJV1611
 



The gospel of grace does not even appear!! I challenge you, show me where the gospel of grace appears in the 4 gospels. (Now Jesus did mention it, but only to His apostles, He never preached it


Jesus taught it to His disciples in the temple when He addressed the Pharisee and the Publican, and alluded to it in the Parable of the Prodigal Son when preaching. (private/public)



posted on Feb, 12 2012 @ 11:51 PM
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Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by NOTurTypical
 

"that if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved;"

The point Paul was making when he said that was it did not matter if you are a gentile because the body parts involved in salvation are your heart and mouth, not your foreskin.


No, actually Paul makes his point in the next verse:

"For with the heart one believes and is justified, and with the mouth one confesses and is saved."

Which coincidentally, is exactly what happened with the theif on the cross. He believed and confessed with his own mouth.


Read the next verse where he says, leading to righteousness.


No, you chew on the verse above for a minute, I don't need you to explain exactly what Paul meant in verse 9 when Paul tells me in verse 10.


You have been told this over and over and I will keep repeating the same explanation as long as you persist in your religion of 'sin all you want'.


Lol, "told"? By whom? You? Last time I checked we weren't married nor do I call you dad, and your signature isn't at the bottom of my paycheck. As long as you keep repeating that lie above, I'll keep calling you out on it. When you're lost you are a slave to sin JM, when you are saved you don't want to sin anymore. God's goodness leads a person to repentance.




edit on 12-2-2012 by NOTurTypical because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 12 2012 @ 11:54 PM
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reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


yep, just as I said in the parenthesis. Paul is where we go for all doctrine. Any answer to what you consider Heb 10:25? Is it a commandment or not?



posted on Feb, 12 2012 @ 11:55 PM
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reply to post by wildtimes
 



Uh, yeah, he is.


Un, no, He isn't. He closes with "I never knew you", meaning He never knew them ironically.



posted on Feb, 12 2012 @ 11:58 PM
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reply to post by KJV1611
 



Is it a commandment or not?


No, Christ only gave 2 commandments. Don't take a blessing and make it a commandment. It edifies us to fellowship with other believers, it's for our growth and spiritual protection. Jesus is Lord, He only gave two commandments.



posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 12:14 AM
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reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


So Hebrews 10:25 would be an "edifies" then. Well, at least you came out and said what you were thinking. I'm still not sure "edifies" is what Heb 10:25 is "telling" us to do..... but to each his own!! I guess the problem here is with terminology and not context since you and I both know, Jesus gave quite a few more technical commandments than just two. The two you are referring too are the two GREATEST....they are hardly the only two Jesus gave.....



posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 12:29 AM
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God is dead. Grow up and take responsibility for your own actions. Stop blaming all the bad stuff on the devil and all the good stuff on god. It's us. It's all about us. We create the good and bad things that happen in this world (when it's in our control and more often than not it is.).

Here's one for ya. God gave us free choice. We can choose to do as he asks us or... We burn in hell.

Some choice.

I like the christian god. He is a sociopath.



posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 12:50 AM
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Originally posted by KJV1611
reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


So Hebrews 10:25 would be an "edifies" then. Well, at least you came out and said what you were thinking. I'm still not sure "edifies" is what Heb 10:25 is "telling" us to do..... but to each his own!! I guess the problem here is with terminology and not context since you and I both know, Jesus gave quite a few more technical commandments than just two. The two you are referring too are the two GREATEST....they are hardly the only two Jesus gave.....



Huh? Did you read verse 40? "On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets."

Paul repeats this in more detail:

"Let no debt remain outstanding, except the continuing debt to love one another, for he who loves his fellowman has fulfilled the law. The commandments, "Do not commit adultery," "Do not murder," "Do not steal," "Do not covet," and whatever other commandment there may be, are summed up in this one rule: "Love your neighbor as yourself." Love does no harm to its neighbor. Therefore love is the fulfillment of the law" Rom. 13:8-10

And:

"For the whole Law is fulfilled in one word, in the statement, "You shall love your neighbor as yourself." (Galatians 5:14)



posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 01:45 AM
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Originally posted by hudsonhawk69
God is dead. Grow up and take responsibility for your own actions. Stop blaming all the bad stuff on the devil and all the good stuff on god. It's us. It's all about us. We create the good and bad things that happen in this world (when it's in our control and more often than not it is.).

Here's one for ya. God gave us free choice. We can choose to do as he asks us or... We burn in hell.

Some choice.

I like the christian god. He is a sociopath.


Lewis writes about not believing in God and paradoxically hating Him.



posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 01:45 AM
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Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by KJV1611
reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


So Hebrews 10:25 would be an "edifies" then. Well, at least you came out and said what you were thinking. I'm still not sure "edifies" is what Heb 10:25 is "telling" us to do..... but to each his own!! I guess the problem here is with terminology and not context since you and I both know, Jesus gave quite a few more technical commandments than just two. The two you are referring too are the two GREATEST....they are hardly the only two Jesus gave.....



Huh? Did you read verse 40? "On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets."

Paul repeats this in more detail:

"Let no debt remain outstanding, except the continuing debt to love one another, for he who loves his fellowman has fulfilled the law. The commandments, "Do not commit adultery," "Do not murder," "Do not steal," "Do not covet," and whatever other commandment there may be, are summed up in this one rule: "Love your neighbor as yourself." Love does no harm to its neighbor. Therefore love is the fulfillment of the law" Rom. 13:8-10

And:

"For the whole Law is fulfilled in one word, in the statement, "You shall love your neighbor as yourself." (Galatians 5:14)





Grrr...

i gotta star that...

paul has his moments...



edit on 13-2-2012 by Akragon because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 05:40 AM
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reply to post by NOTurTypical
 

No, actually Paul makes his point in the next verse:
Paul's point is Christ is the end of the law. How that applies to the audience of the letter, the gentiles in Rome, is the point of verse 12, where he says,

For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek; for the same Lord is Lord of all, abounding in riches for all who call on Him;

Where the distinction that was being made by the Jews was based on whether they were circumcised or not. This is why in verse 10, Paul is describing the body parts involved in salvation, being the heart and mouth, and not the part that gets circumcised by the Jews as the sign of their keeping the Law. Paul explains they really did not know the Law, so were just doing the outward things that they could read in a book and had missed the true Law which comes through faith in Christ, which has an effect on the heart because Christ gives us a spirit of Christ which dwells in us and creating a law within us so we can be truly righteous and not just in an outward 'observing the letter' sort of righteousness.

"For with the heart one believes and is justified, and with the mouth one confesses and is saved."

Which coincidentally, is exactly what happened with the theif on the cross. He believed and confessed with his own mouth.
The Jews would indicate a desire to keep the Law and to be righteous, so they would perform the circumcision and that stood as the sign of what that desire was earlier.
That system was something that though it showed promise for the person, was never quite actualized because they were not able to get to a point of righteousness that God really wanted and it took Jesus and what he offered, to make the difference and it was something which could exist outside the old written Law.
The new system for righteousness is of Faith which stands in the place previously held by Law.
Believing in Jesus is something which affects the heart which changes how we act, one of those new ways of acting is expressing verbally that belief, and so becomes the outward sign of the effects of our earlier decision, replacing the sign of the earlier system, circumcision.

edit on 13-2-2012 by jmdewey60 because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 06:07 AM
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reply to post by KJV1611
 



Jesus never once taught salvation by grace through faith. Paul did,

Jesus taught keep commandments and works based salvation (Matt 5-7, etc.) Paul taught pure faith through grace. (Eph 2:8-9)

Matter of fact, Christianity is based SOLELY on Paul's writings. I have noticed a lot if you guys don't understand this. Let me make it clear....if you follow Jesus Christ's teachings ONLY, then you will end up in Hell.


What??
So you worship Paul, who makes it easier to get into heaven. No need for good deeds, just faith, all alone.
What a load of crap.
I think I'll go with what the man himself said, that being the guy known as Jesus Christ.

Honestly, I can't believe you just said that; I'm pretty sure in some circles that would be called blasphemy. Wow.



posted on Feb, 13 2012 @ 06:16 AM
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reply to post by NOTurTypical
 



"For the whole Law is fulfilled in one word, in the statement, "You shall love your neighbor as yourself." (Galatians 5:14)


CORRECT!
You finally got something right!
The GOLDEN RULE is the only rule we need.
Too bad so many of you who call yourselves Christian simply don't do it. But you believe that if you just say you believe, it's all neatly wrapped up. Done. Next!




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