Originally posted by MathiasAndrew
reply to post by Annee
I can only call it like I see it.
Truthfully, I'm bored with this topic.
Currently the laws in the United States and the majority of citizens agree with me.
I have not seen a valid poll that shows a majority of Americans are pro same sex marriage.
Good luck trying to change the laws.
I'll check back later and will only respond to coherent, intelligent posts or questions.
Originally posted by SteveR
Marriage is not a right. Why? Because it wasn't bestowed at birth, it is not god-given or otherwise attributed to your person. Marriage is conferred by the state or church through law. Marriage is a lawful tradition with clear definitions. It's original purpose was to be the union of a man and woman and to be the foundation of a family. Homosexual couples are incapable of creating a biological family alone therefore the term homosexual marriage is an oxymoron and subverts the purpose and meaning of the tradition. A relationship between consenting adults is a right, and you should not have to hide in this respect. Marriage is not a god-given right, nor is stealing traditions clearly meant for very different purposes. Just because you could theoretically do such a thing does not mean it is the right thing for you to do, either.
edit on 2012/2/16 by SteveR because: (no reason given)
Originally posted by Sigismundus
reply to post by zerimar65
Hi Zerimar -
My point is : What is the basis for your jejune stance on the definition of 'marriage' being between ONE woman and ONE man?
In other words, is your opinion on this (e.g. what you wrote " if gays wanted to get married they should have been born straight" or other such jejune nonsense) based on anything 'biblical' i.e. from the post exilic priestly writings from the cults of the post-exilic clan god of the Jews (the YHWH of the 'bible') or are you attempting to base your ignorance on 'nature' alone (forgetting or just not knowing that homosexuality is absolutely RAMPANT in the animal kingdom from doves to rams 'getting it on with the same sex')?
If your silly statements are based on a pseudo-biblical stance you're in for a BIG surprise - especially when you bother to take the time closely to read the mangled paleoHebrew texts of the 'holy' scriptures of the Jews - and discover - oh the shock and awe ! - that persons like 'David' about whom is written such garbage as 'behold David my servant, a man after mine own heart saith YHWH' - not only had a blatant homosexual affair with another male - his boy toy Jonathan about which was made the most outrageous homosexual accusations (1 Sam 18:1-4, 1 Sam 20:30, and also the love poetry Daviid wrote for him 2 Sam 1:24-26)
As well as having numerous wives (can you say: polygamy ? what about ONE man and ONE woman?) but also was a cold blooded Murderer (he killed Uriah the Hittite) and an Adulterer (with Bath-Shebiti, ('bathsheba') the Jebusite wife of Uriah the Hittite).
David was also a Defector against Yisro'el (he in fact spent a few years living amongst his former 'enemies' the Filistin / Phlistines, who had rival anti YHWH cult temples all around the area of present day Gaza - all busilly worshipping the bearded man-fish-god 'Dagon')
Technically, David was also a Blasphemer (being of the tribe of Judah (and not LEVI) who dared to dance NAKED in front of the Ark of the Covenant - something only the priestly LEVITES of the cult of YHWH were ever able to approach, let alone dance naked in front of - !!)
And last of all - but certainly not least, David was (through his grand-mother Ruth) racially speaking, a 'Moabite', and therefore NOT an 'Israelite' at all, at least according to the Torah ('no Ammonite OR Moabite shall ever enter the Assembly of YHWH not even beyond the 10th Generation', says the book of 'Deutero-nomy' part of the supposedly ancient Torah of the Jews).
Not that you'd know any of these little factoids or anything.
Also, if your stance on 'heterosexual marriage only' is in any way 'biblically based' in the 'christian fundamentalist sense'I sure hope, yes sir, that there is no DIVORCE any where in your family - like there was among the family of Anita Bryant - otherwise according to R. Yehoshua bar Yosef the Galilean Nazir (Gk ho 'Iesous'), and also to Saul of Tarsus, the purported founder of 'Pauline Christianity' in the NT 'epistles' bearing his name, there are charges of 'ADULTERY' that MUST be laid against any divorced perpetrators - and we all know what stoning to death for Adultery meant in those days !!
So what DO you base your ignorant assumptions on anyway? Something your mommy once told you about the 'sanctity of marriage' when you were little ?
edit on 14-2-2012 by Sigismundus because: a stuttering coooommmputtterrrrrr keyyyyboardddddd
Originally posted by zerimar65
If the gays wanted to get married, they should have been born straight.
But marriage licenses were not required until after the civil war. Marriage licenses from their inception have sought to establish certain prohibitions on the institution of marriage. These prohibitions have changed throughout history. In the 1920s, they were used by 38 states to prohibit whites from marrying blacks, mulattos, Japanese, Chinese, Indians, Mongolians, Malays or Filipinos without a state approved license. At least 32 nations have established significant prohibitions on same-sex marriage en.wikipedia.org...
Opinion polls in the U.S. distort the truth about public opinion. They cover up the truth about the number of undecided voters and distort the perception of which policies people support. Thats according to David Moore former senior editor of Gallup Poll, a world renowned polling agency.
We are bombarded with poll results daily during this election season. What do polls really represent? The news media always uses percentages to report results. What do those percentages actually represent? Polls are based on a sample population. How many people are in the sample? There are over 140 million registered voters in this country. Are we being deceived by the media? What is your opinion?
It's not unusual that polls conducted in roughly the same time period will conflict with each other, though such conflicts are still treated as aberrations. Usually, one can attribute the apparent contradictions to different interviewing dates or to dissimilar question wording. And, of course, there is always the possibility that one poll was just plain wrong, an explanation most likely to be heard if one of the polling organizations has a poor reputation anyway.
The conflicting results by Gallup and Pew, however, could not be explained away by any of the usual excuses. These were two titans in the polling industry, both highly respected among the news media, and neither poll could be immediately dismissed out of hand. Moreover, the dates of interviews for both surveys were almost identical, and there was no issue of question wording because each poll included the industry's standard question about which candidate a respondent would vote for if the election were held "today."
Originally posted by MathiasAndrew
reply to post by MrXYZ
I absolutely know about polls and statistics.
You obviously are a sheeple and believe everything you are told.
It is estimated that around 10% of the population is gay. There are 300 million people in the U.S., so there would be 30 million gay people.