The Devil's Chord: The conspiracy to open the portal of consciousness and mystery of the octave

reply to post by DenyObfuscation


Thanks for repeating it because what I wrote is what I meant.

A secret? Yes.

A secret.

Has the secret been revealed?

Yes. haha.

The song evoked the 7 hertz drum frequency. That is the secret of that song.

Did the song literally have a 7 hertz drum? Probably not.

It's like yeah -- this song has a secret it's not like this song has literally such and such.

If you don't get it by now you probably never will.

Nice double entendre there with the ensare word as in the....

snare drum.

reply to post by UncleV


If a grandma can do the bunny hop then she'll get the secret of this thread.

The one simple sentence is:

Silence as the Sigh-Lens.

Deep breathing as the sigh through silence has the diaphgram activate the vagus nerve to sublimate the reproductive energy up into the brain to activate the pineal gland to create the lens as light energy consciousness.

If a person wants to understand then this thread is the place to go.

If a person doesn't want to understand then no one can make them understand -- that is the beauty of free exchange of information without censorship.

Sure it ticks off the people who'd like to censor ideas that they personally fine upsetting. haha.

You've missed the point. I am not upset at all about your ideas, it has absolutely NOTHING to do with your ideas somehow going against anything I hold dear.

Do you know how I know this? Because, you have never, not once made your ideas clear. How could anyone be upset at your earth shaking revelations when even you have no idea what they are? I have a great interest in sound's effects on people, I am a music industry veteran for over 30 years, a musician for 37 and involved in sound therapy for over 10 years. I so wanted to understand if you have stumbled onto anything of value and gave you many, many chances to break it down to something understandable. And here it is...

"Silence as the Sigh Lens"......

Did everyone get that? Read the first post and apply Silence as the Sigh Lens....clear as crystal to quote Mr. Wonka.

Nonsense.

reply to post by UncleV






I'm here to say: Yes it is real. I have done the training and the energy was electromagnetic and very strong. The brain is permanently magnetized with bliss -- the pineal gland. This is about nonwestern trance music and how the paradoxes in Western music are the gateway to nonwestern trance music that creates paranormal energy from consciousness.

So then if people can get past all of that then they can actually get on to actually practicing the nonwestern trance music mind-body transformation.

The secret of nonwestern music is to create light energy -- that sound turns into light by internal listening.

So the practice is simple tai chi movements and then the "small universe" exercise or also called the microcosmic orbit and then the advanced practice is the simplest - the full lotus meditation.

It's very simple -- people just do the exercises and it works. Yep -- the Emptiness is not something to "know" but it's an eternal process of listening. We can all listen. So yes there is music therapy and then there's learning to play an instrument and making sound and then there's mind-body resonance as a deeper listening process.

Magic Numbers, Planetary Tones and the Body: The Evolution of Daoist Inner Alchemy into Modern Sacred Science by Michael Winn pdf original paper given at the International Daoism Conference at Boston University in 2003

O.K. Michaell Winn is a very well-known qigong teacher and this pdf corroborates this whole thread -- Michael Winn repeats what I have discovered on my own. Did he read my research? Maybe -- doesn't matter -- because this knowledge can be found by anyone if they search properly.

On the continuous roundtrip journey between Creation and Origin an adept cannot “see” in the darkness of the primordial Origin (hundun). Vision must be abandoned when returning to the Dao; any light seen is from the lower astral planes. The adept can only navigate this dark primal ocean with the faculty of inner hearing, using the Spirit of the Kidneys, the guardian of Primal Water that generates the fundamental tone within the body.

The internal alchemist does the same thing through a dynamic meditation process that attunes to many different “wave frequencies” or octaves in Nature....The non-tempered scale causes the listener to be musically more alive and alert to the shifting and sometimes disharmonious tonal force-reality about him. The listener must reconcile the dissonance internally, as if forced to bring the slight dissonance between the left brain and right
brain tones (that might be half a note off from each other) into balance in the center of their brain. That musical process is inherently alchemical in nature, in the sense of transmuting two disharmonious forces into a third tone-entity by internal centering.

There are numerous methods of Hindu meditation that focus on inner listening to the “shabd” or sound current, sometimes called Nada Brahma, the sound of the creator. One major difference between Daoist inner alchemy and these practices is that Daoists train to listen from the whole body, and especially from the low resonance centers of the belly or lower dantian. In the Daoist view, starting meditation from the upper dantian or third eye, as most Indian methods do, produces a kind of enlightenment but not immortality. For that, the listening must also occur at the mingmen, between the kidneys, where prime matter (yuan jing) is converted into the breath of life, qi and thence into spirit, shen.

The geometric shape of the vesica piscis, when transposed into musical ratios, creates a tonal ratio of 2:3, the width : height ratio of the oval of the mysterious female. This is again the ratio of the harmonic fifth used in China’s pentatonic scale. 2:3 is also the ratio used by Pythagoras to create a tonal zodiac of 12 notes spread out over seven octaves of “fifths”, and 2/3 is the only fraction for which the Egyptians had a glyph. (Schneider) The alchemical vesica piscis also embodies the holy Daoist trinity of Numbers, cited in verse 42 of the Daodejing, The One (fundamental tone1:1) generates the original Two female and Three male, that collectively birth the ten thousand things from the tonal womb of the mysterious female.

Multiple nested vesica piscis as series of 2:3 expanding harmonic ratios of pentatonic fifths. These fifths emanate from the 1:1 fundamental tone, creating an infinite number of possible other musical ratios. For example, a scale of rising perfect fifths can be notated by a mirror image scale of descending perfect fourths – the same notes, but placed on different rhythmic scales. (Source: Schneider, 1994)

Originally posted by fulllotusqigong

. . . produces a kind of enlightenment but not immortality.

Please define “immortality” used in that context.

reply to post by fulllotusqigong

Thanks for repeating it because what I wrote is what I meant.

I believe you meant what you wrote, at the time.

But you did write

Nice -- I would say the secret of that song is that the drum frequency is 7 hertz

And now

The song evoked the 7 hertz drum frequency. That is the secret of that song.

Did the song literally have a 7 hertz drum? Probably not.

Then why say it?

reply to post by DenyObfuscation


Why say something is a secret?

It's like the reply -- ah but it's not a secret anymore!

In other words why call something a secret if it is now explained. haha.

The secrets of this and the secrets of that --- explained. Such a book title contradicts itself.

That's why I said it -- precisely so you or anyone else would want to know the secret.

All I can do is thank you for giving me the opportunity to present all those wonderful 7 hertz tribal drums.

The success of that Tool song imo is that it evokes the power of that low heart frequency as the heart-mind EEG frequency.

So when I posted the bit about the heart beat pulse music at 60 beats per minute -- a very slow rate -- this is the pulse that creates the alpha waves in the brain.

I had an eeg done once and the nurse exclaimed -- wow you have really strong alpha waves! I knew it was from having practiced the 2nd movement of Bach's Italian Concerto which is 60 bpm. I had memorized that Italian Concerto but the 2nd movement was by far my favorite.

So the alpha brain waves are 8 to 12 hertz. The Theta are below that for the dream hynogogic trance state.

So this is what I pointed out that rhythm is actually slowed down frequency -- the two translate into each other.

Yes there are 7 hertz drum heads but also more commonly there's 7 beats per second rhythm for trance music.

But also the slow 1 beat per second then slows down the heart to that rate which then translates to the brain frequency of the alpha range -- so the pulse is a subharmonic of the brain waves.

I think you had wondered if it meant 240 hertz? So hopefully that clarifies things for you. haha.

The frequency beat of 60 beats per minute music has been found beneficial to brain synchronization as the music assists the brain in going into the alpha wave state. Scientists have shown that increases in alpha brain waves precede peak performance.

Notice this vid says it's 10 hertz frequency but if you listen to it it sounds like ten beats per second as rhythm.

reply to post by Mary Rose


Ah good question.

As the book "Taoist Yoga: Alchemy and Immortality" indicates -- if you read that book that is the end of the training: immortality.

So I've studied that book -- what precisely did it mean? Actually it's the electromagnetic fields as qi energy that enable immortality.

So you have shen energy as light spirit astral energy -- but shen on it's own becomes a ghost at death. There has to be stored up electromagnetic energy as qi or prana to enable immortality so that a person can then use their electromagnetic intention to guide the shen or spirit outside the body.

So in Taoism the energy is holographic with external as internal -- so the intention is the color blue as the pancreas energy to then guide the mind as spirit energy. The pancreas is normally the organ of worry from too much left brain thinking caused by too much sugar or glucose -- the insulin levels of the pancreas create fat from the sugar -- the secret cause of obesity in the U.S. is from sugar.

Anyway so the key is to take that beta brain sugar rush which then peaks as worry energy and then bottoms out as the insulin spike -- instead to use lots of vegetables in the diet to even out and increase the serotonin levels for alpha brain wave good intentions. The spectogram of serotonin is blue so a healthy pancreas as good intentions is the color blue.

Qigong master Chunyi Lin calls this the Bermuda Triangle of the body -- the connection of the pancreas to the liver (the green wisdom energy from the anger energy). There has to be a cleansing of the liver -- and then the kidney as the yellow fear energy turned into black will power energy.

So the secret of immortality in Taoism is storing up the qi electromagnetic energy in the lower tan tien (energy field or center). This is a secret tantra meaning as field is from farming so that the field is plowed by the male sex energy - the field as female. This is also the same tantra meaning from the Sumerian myths.

O.K. so the lower tan tien is this lower vagus nerve connection to the reproductive organs -- and so it is below and behind the navel -- just in front of the small of the back. there is a rule in Taoism to not drink icy cold liquids because it destroys this lower tan tien energy. Or as the Bushmen females practiced -- if the male trance dance healers instead were going into astral travel the females would throw cold water on the males to bring them back - to lower the level of their energy so that the males instead focused on healing the females.

So for real astral travel as immortality the electromagnetic energy has to be stored up as yang chi energy. This yang chi is the iron from the blood -- so is it the black energy of the kidney combined with the white Tiger yin energy of the reproductive fluids. The blood iron energy is the Dragon yang chi energy of the heart.

So it's said that males are female yin chi inside since the focus of males is the white tiger reproductive fluid while females are yang chi inside as the focus of females is the Dragon red blood iron chi energy.

That's why males have to learn to store up the white Tiger yin chi reproductive fluid energy and then convert or purify or ionize it through the heart yang chi energy. This is what John Chang refers to in his youtube video -- the yang chi and the yin chi -- when they combine there is an explosion.

So the water as yin chi is what Michael Winn refers to as the focus of immortality in Taoism. The more this is stored up then the more immortality is created until finally there is a "yang spirit" created from the yin spirit which is the yellow astral form spirit. The yang spirit is bilocation of another physical body.

This is difficult to believe but bilocation of another physical body has been recorded in detail in mysticism -- you can read some good accounts of it in the modern context in the biography of H.W.L. Poonja -- Nothing Ever Happens by David Godman -- Poonjaji was the energy master student of Ramana Maharshi --



So as Michael Winn stated that in India there is a different focus on what immortality means -- even though both Poonjaji and Ramana Maharshi created the "yang spirit" -- creating multiple other bodies -- there focus was not on the chi or prana build up to power the shen or shakti spirit.

Instead the focus of Poonjaji or Ramana Maharshi is the focus on what Taoist Yoga: Alchemy and Immortality called "eternal nature" or the Taoists call the Emptiness or Ramana Maharshi calls Awareness as the formless source of light energy.

So that the spirit or shakti or shen holographic light energy comes out of the Emptiness as formless awareness that can not be seen. This is called eternal listening to silence as a process of energy creation -- Mouna Samadhi. The OHM of the heart from the kidney energy converted to qi.

reply to post by fulllotusqigong

All I can do is thank you for giving me the opportunity to present all those wonderful 7 hertz tribal drums.

Were those 7 Hz drums in the recording studio? Irrelevant to your defense.

The success of that Tool song imo is that it evokes the power of that low heart frequency as the heart-mind EEG frequency.

How would it do that? You have equated beats per minute with pulse rate. Not low freq.

When in tachycardia - heart rate that exceeds the normal range for a resting heart rate -cardiac patients were able to reduce their heart rates to 50-60 beats per minute when listening to music that was exactly 50-60 beats a minute.

O.K. so it is the heart beat -- that's the same as pulse right -- yeah so that's what I was thinking.

Yet you refer to the 7 beats per second drumming in the song which is why I asked about a pulse rate of 420 not

I think you had wondered if it meant 240 hertz? So hopefully that clarifies things for you. haha.

So if clouding the issue means clarifying things then yeah, you've done that. haha.

Jumping into the Tool song - 7hz topic.

How did you arrive at 7hz? Being below the threshold of both hearing but the capturing/playback threshold of the equipment used to record and hear it, where is the 7hz? In other words, even if it existed during the performance, technically it would not be picked up by microphones, almost all of which (I'd say ALL but I don't know if that is 100% correct) used would not 'hear' it and if by chance it did, the recording gear and playback speakers wouldn't reproduce it anyway.

Rhythmically, 7hz or 7 pulses a second is indeed in the brain wave spectrum but where is this 7hz pulse coming from? Doubtful the drums would be creating it as their attack and decay is too short. Boom....note over. Whereas, two identical guitars tracks (or keyboards, etc.) with one being detuned by 7hz would create that pulse if panned in stereo.

By the way, being bigger does not automatically make an instrument produce lower notes. What I mean is a large drum still isn't going to be tuned to 7hz, for one, it can not be heard and two, the size it would need to be to produce 7hz cleanly would be enormous. What it does more of is give the lower notes more strength, the fundamental is stronger. Yes, lower notes need the size to be reproduced, but let's say a note of 50hz is still 50hz, the fundamental has greater strength, the lower order harmonics have greater strength. Companies like Bose get their sound by removing the fundamental and more or less tricking our ears because we hear the next harmonic up, the octave, and 'fill in the blank'. That's how they can use small speakers.

reply to post by UncleV


Yeah this was pointed out way back earlier when the Tool song was first mentioned and I responded about the "secret" of the song being the drum is 7 hertz. haha.

Of course I meant "the" drum -- as in "the" huge tribal war drum that I later demonstrated.

So I'm going by the reports of the people who attended the huge tribal war drums as I quoted them -- that they felt it in their chest and in their gut. Then I quote the testimonies of people who experienced a 7 hertz and describe the same symptoms of their chest and gut. This is a well-known symptom of the infrasound to cause people to lose control of their bowels, etc.

So yeah I know people want to fixate on Tool -- most likely because their stuck in their Western techno-schtick.

On the creation of "beats" -- yes this is a good point.

So we have three ways of creating the 7 hertz -- from a polyrhythm, from a sound frequency, from the subharmonics of frequency differences.

This is what I meant by "evoking" -- not in a literal technical left-brain fashion but that the "secret" of the song is something not necessarily found directly in the song.

Yes I meant a "secret" and again the secret was the nonwestern tribal war drum.

People can disbelieve that I really meant the Tool song had a secret of something not directly in the song -- but then the word "secret" can contain a lot. haha.

Obviously there is some denial going on here.

The most common means of achieving this 7 hertz synchronization is through polyrhythm -- John Chernoff's work with the dagomba was my first real exposure to this.

So he talks about the space between the notes being more important -- the Emptiness -- and I think this is really the "beats" concept in action as you have pointed out.



Now this is really thick polyrhythm and the training is very strict for each drummer to learn their part.

As John Miller Chernoff writes, 'While in Western music, certain kinds of musical themes may suggest images or feelings, the astounding fact is that in traditional African music, the rhythms themselves are a specific text. When the earliest European travellers described drum-signalling between villages, they assumed that the beating was a kind of code. In reality, the drums actually speak the language of the tribe.' (Miller, 1979, 75) Read more at Suite101: Dagomba Drumming: Instrumentation |

Closing comments on the drummed proverbs Speech surrogate drumming in Dagbon has a rich history and a thriving present. An important part of the drummers' repertoire is the appellations for important people. These drummed proverbs teach truth to the community, focus public attention on particular patrons, and provide income for the drummers who are charged with remembering them all. At a market, the drummed proverbs are the means for a certain type of social interaction; at a dance they also provide some of the music necessary for the event to be successful. They are heard at all of the major events in the life cycle of the individual and annual cycle of the community. Life in Dagbon is really unthinkable without them. Each drummed proverb ties together linguistic, musical, personal, and metaphorical relations into a memorable sound pattern that is meant to move one's feet, one's mind, and one's wallet.

Pressing patrons with proverbs: Talking drums at the Tamale markets1 by Paul Neeley and Abdullai Seidu

So Westerners really have no idea just how amazing drumming is in Africa.

For the Dagbamba drummer, it takes equal parts of "what you know" and "who you know" to be successful. The drummer must not only memorize the drum patterns and verbal bases for many proverbs, he must also be able to use them correctly to get his tips, or "dash." This expertise depends on his recognition of many people in his area of Dagbon. People's faces and who they are related to must be memorized just as much as the tonal-rhythmic patterns and underlying texts.

This reminds me of when I learned the polyrhythm of "4 against 3" as the phrase "Pass the Goddam Brownies." So I never realized that playing that phrase at 1 meter a second equals 7 hertz -- I tap this out with my hands easily. Well I guess it's 6 hertz since "Pass" has both the start of the 4 and the 3. So six syllables.

Many African societies have a special word for this concept of poise and an inner silent space within the general hustle-and-bustle of everyday life. The Yoruba refer to it as Itutu, the Akanas Bokoor, the Ga as Bleoo, the Dagomba as Baalim, the Ewe as Dododo, the Mandinke as Suma, the Tiv as Kundu-Kundu, and the Mbuti Pygmies as Ekimi. African American jazz musicians know it as “Daddy Cool”. Almost invariably there is a word for its opposite. Yirin for the Dagombas, Basa-Basa for the Akan,Gidi-Gidi for the Ga people and Gonni for the Mandinka; all of which imply becoming obsessed with and fired up by the ever-changing material world: or what the Mbuti pygmies call “akami” (noise) and Ghanaians the “skin-pain” of inter-personal friction. In this distracted state one becomes disoriented and unable to react thoughtfully to any given situation. To prevent this one has to cultivate emptiness and “cool the heart” as the American musicologist John Chernoff (1979) was told by his Dagomba drum teacher Alhaji Ibrahim Abdulai

The dynamic impulse provided by irregularity is actuallydepicted in some African and other ancient circular mandalas,for it is their very lopsidedness that represents propulsive drive.One example is the Chinese Yin and Yang sign in which the twopolar principles are not quite exact mirror-images of each other,because of their infinitely receding dots within dots within dots.Another is the left-handed spin of the ancient Tibetan Swastika(which Hitler turned clockwise). African instances include theanti-clockwise spin of the Akan Gye Nyame design and Foncelestial serpent Ayido Hwedo depicted earlier. Another is theparticular handedness of the corkscrew motion of the doubleentwined snakes on Zulu staffs.

Wow I actually have that Akan design from a Ghanian wood carver I knew -- awesome scribd book here

Complete bull#.
The vedas discussed the "Pythagoras teachings" thousands of years before pyth even existed.
Also dan greens work is a hoax, you do know this right, he even states his work is fiction.

I believe what you say are half truths mixed in with bs.

reply to post by ultimatefighter2014


There is the spiral of fifths scale long before Pythagoras but the Brahmins and Zoroastrians used it as a "divide and average" system that contained infinity through materialist geometry.

The older system in India is the three gunas which is the original 1-4-5 music intervals as complementary opposites, not a divide and average math.

This complementary opposites teaching is the secret teaching found within the "divide and average" teaching.

Originally posted by fulllotusqigong
The song evoked the 7 hertz drum frequency. That is the secret of that song.

That's gotta be the cr@ppiest cop-out I've seen in the past year. You can't explain why and what
exactly exists, therefore you resort to saying that it's evoked. Splendid! Zero responsibility
for what one is saying. Same as saying that if you eat three quarts of Baskin-Robbins, you'll
evoke a cure for cancer. Or an interdimensional portal to planet Umo. And that would be the
secret of that ice cream recipe.

reply to post by fulllotusqigong

There is the spiral of fifths scale long before Pythagoras but the Brahmins and Zoroastrians used it as a "divide and average" system that contained infinity through materialist geometry.

So they used this system long before Pythagoras but you blame it on Archytas?

Is the infinite length of a diagonal of a square whose sides are one unit in length an example of this infinity contained by materialist geometry?

reply to post by DenyObfuscation


Archytas and Eudoxus invented irrational numbers as the solution to incommensurability. This was covered in great detail earlier in the thread. So math professor Luigi Borzacchini points out how the earlier "divide and average" math did not have this irrational solution. Borzacchini then argues that music logos or ratios provides the model to create the irrational number. So there were music ratios before that were a Pythagorean system but that is still a "divide and average" system -- not the Pythagorean Tetrad. It's the difference between Orthodox Pythagoreans who used only the Tetrad and then the Babylonian influence that Archytas used from the "divide and average" system.

My music-math research was originally inspired by musicologist Ernest McClain who focused on the secret role of Pythagorean music ratios in Platonic philosophy. In his “Music Theory and Ancient Cosmology” article McClain states that “The spiral of fifths (and derivative fourths) is the most widely known tuning order documented to old Babylon (c. 1800 to 1600 BC).”198

Assistant Professor John Curtis Franklin, in response to my email, has clarified this ancient origin of the Pythagorean tuning stating that the Pythagorean tuning based on the 4ths and 5ths, almost certainly, goes back to at least 2100 BCE, based on the Sumerian musical terms of some of the cuneiform texts.200

198 “For Plato’s influence on Pythagoreanism, Burkert 1972. Despite my best attempts to follow McClain 1976, there appears to me still no conclusive evidence for the musical ratios in cuneiform sources – although I would be hardly surprised if it emerges.” Professor John Curtis Franklin, “The Wisdom of the Lyre: Soundings in Ancient Greece, Cyprus and the Near East,” 2000, Symposium on the International Study Group on Music Archaeology. Footnote 10.

200 John Curtis Franklin, email communication, April 12, 2011.

Indeed the Pythagorean music interval “spiral of fifths” scale has now been documented to an even much older date out of China: Regardless of the antiquity of these nine-thousand-year-old instruments, tonal tests indicate that they can play pitches that coincide closely with those of the modern musical scale. Comparing the notes of a twelve-tone scale in equal temperament with those produced by the bone flutes, one finds that the discrepancies are minor. That is to say, if one were to use the bone flutes to play modern music, the audience might not be able to detect the difference....Tonal tests indicate that the intervals are approximately 100 cents in size, that is a semitone relationship between neighboring holes....This discovery endorses the idea that the people in the Huai river valley had developed a cognitive system of music no later than the sixth millenium BC.203

203 Juzhong Zhang, Xinghua Xiao, and Yun Kuen Lee, “The early development of music. An analysis of the Jiahu
bone flutes,” Antiquity Journal, July, 2005.

So the Sumerian tuning is not based on the cuneiform text -- despite Ernest McClain making that claim -- but rather on the instruments reconstructed.

Here's some speculation on Sumerian texts about using the 12 notes of the scale based on the Fifths/Fourths with the goal of equal-tempered tuning

Ernest McClain (first in _The Myth of Invariance_, and in more depth in _The Pythagorean Plato_) makes a case for the Greeks having calculated 12-tET, and of course I think it can be shown that, just as the Babylonians took over the Sumerian culture as their own, much of the Greek music-theory, science, math, mythology, etc., was taken from the Babylonians and thus goes back to Sumerian roots. So more analysis there. Again the key point is that the irrational number was not known nor used in the older math before the Greek Miracle. So that is all the "divide and average" math. My point is that there is a simpler yet more radical meaning to the Perfect Fifth/Perfect Fourth relation based on the Pythagorean Tetrad as the Tai-Chi symbol and the three gunas of India. A big part of this is the switch from a right-brain dominant culture to a left-brain dominant culture -- so these early civilizations were still in the transition from right brain dominance of shamanism.

This period of Gods as ratios is the transition to phonetic writing for Solar Dynasties since accounting for the difference between the Sun and Moon calendar (365-354) is tedious using right-brain ideograms.

So the music ratios were actually Gods and Goddesses as Ernest McClain emphasizes.

The 60-based number system was originally tied to rightbrain ideograms (and the harp lyre as a memory recording device), relying on the ritual sacrifice shaman-priests.

However, you know there is one kind of chord that works at any distortion level: exactly, the powerchord. And here's why:
In a perfect fifth, the frequencies have a ratio of 2:3. So if you play a two-stringed† powerchord, you have those frequencies in the original signal:...You see what's going on here: we're getting components with half the original fundamental frequency! Subharmonics. And those are in fact the reason why powerchords sound so fat.

So the power chord based on the Perfect Fifth is the easiest way to create subharmonics

reply to post by buddhasystem


Okay, then does it utilize that frequency? Not evoke, but utilize.

Sound is the most powerful stimulant in existence.

reply to post by fulllotusqigong

Two simple questions I asked, zero answers to those questions I received.

I will try it like this, is the square root of two an example of infinity contained by materialist geometry? There's no need to muck this up with an irrelevant verbose diversion.