The Devil's Chord: The conspiracy to open the portal of consciousness and mystery of the octave

reply to post by fulllotusqigong


I have no need to watch your video. I did not ask the question. I don't care to hear some strangers explanation that the sounds are hoaxes, I know first hand some are not. I have many friends who have now heard them too. when something is as loud as thunder, and 'comes towards you' like the source is of 'earthquake sized' dimensions, but the earth does not shake, it is hard to call that an auditory hallucination.

-TF

P.S) now if you want to talk about 'artificial' sounds being broadcast in such a way as to trick a large amount of people spread across a large distance into thinking they're hearing things in their immediate vicinity that are actually very far away, and that in of itself an auditory hallucination.. then asides from that being a completely different ballgame all together, you might be onto something. At this point we don't know. I do know that the sounds are real in that they have been heard and there's been legitimate encounters with it including my own.

Originally posted by fulllotusqigong

Chaotic dynamics’ sensitivity to initial conditions poses a problem for those who try to take advantage of it. Minor effects that are often ignored in conventional trajectory design, such as solar wind and atmospheric models, must be taken into account when using chaotic dynamics or else the trajectory can quickly diverge. “This stuff gets—gee, annoying isn’t the word,” Folta said, “but after running many, many simulations, trying to come up with the right trajectory, it does become annoying.” To grapple with all those effects, Folta and his Goddard colleagues have developed models that take all those possible perturbations into account in trajectory analysis. “Our models are the best we can possibly get to at this point,” he said. Those models include high-precision gravitational models for the Earth and Moon, solar radiation pressure, and the solar wind. “It’s even to the point where the software includes relativistic effects.”

that's science drew, and an extension of my own discussion of elements of the universe vs. the energy you are trying to understand/manipulate. and theres nothing chaotic about it, we're just ignorant of its order. There is no such thing as 'truly random'...

I could continue but I'm bored again. You don't explain things, quoting massive and largely irrelevant external chunks of text to acquire the one or 2 in-context sentences required is lazy.

I note you are putting sources and that's an improvement but you should really be explaining the concepts in plain English in your own words. I don't know how you can claim to be so educated when your presentations are sloppy and lazy.

Your other quotes go on to explain more and more about the chaotic nature of the universe without ever actually calling any of it 'chaos' just that we perceive it as such due to our ignorance. big deal. whatever. We learn more tomorrow and suddenly its not chaotic at all, it makes perfect sense. I'm sure one day in the past a man thought a potato was chaotic.

Peace Drew, good luck with your crazy methodology,
I hope it leads to a good place.
-TF


ETA: I see you replying already, I need a break, I'll come back to this tomorrow night when I have time. Peace.

Originally posted by ThoughtForms

how is this so. If the clock on your wall ticks forever, then time is infinate.

Right the real clock on the wall is a spiral that goes into the formless -- a good example of this is the Klein Bottle which is four dimensional so it can not be visualized in space -- we can make models of it but it's still not the real thing. The Klein Bottle is also the double torus or double scroll ring as a chaotic singularity of time and it's also the full lotus yoga position as the complementary opposites of time-frequency uncertainty.

you tell me there's a wave, a moving force, force=energy, energy moving makes a 'wave'. You tell me its made on consciousness. But why is it called a 'pilot wave' where did that term come from and what does it mean???

The term comes from De Broglie and David Bohm - as I went into before in great detail. So let's quote more of De Broglie:

Must we suppose that this periodic phenomenon occurs in the interior of energy packets? This is not at all necessary; the results of §1.3 will show that it is spread out over an extended space. Moreover, what must we understand by the interior of a parcel of energy? An electron is for us the archetype of isolated parcel of energy, which we believe, perhaps incorrectly, to know well; but, by received wisdom, the energy of an electron is spread over all space with a strong concentration in a very small region, but otherwise whose properties are very poorly known. That which makes an electron an atom of energy is not its small volume that it occupies in space, I repeat: it occupies all space, but the fact that it is undividable, that it constitutes a unit.

So this occupation of all of space by an electron is not energy but instead phase as time:

If, at a given moment in time a fixed observer considers the geometric location of the centre of mass of the various weights, he gets a cylindrical surface in a horizontal direction for which vertical slices parallel to the motion of the disk are sinusoids. This surface corresponds, in the case we envision, to our phase wave, for which, in accord with our general theorem, there is a surface moving with velocity c b parallel to the disk and having a frequency of vibration on the fixed abscissa equal to that of a proper oscillation of a spring multiplied by 1  1  b2. One sees finally with this example (which is our reason to pursue it) why a phase wave transports ‘phase’, but not energy.

To emphasise one last point: the rays of the wave at the instant t are the envelopes of the velocity of propagation, but these rays are not the trajectories of energy, which are rather their tangents at each point. This fact reminds us of certain conclusions from hydrodynamics where flow lines, envelops of velocity, are not particle trajectories if their form is invariant, in other words, if movement is constant.

So the superliminal consciousness is a velocity signal - information signal - but not the energy of the signal.

One should not overlook that it is not a question regarding velocity of a phase wave, which is always above c , but of energy transport detectable experimentally.

For very high frequencies, p would always equal1 giving for isolated photons WIEN’s Law for black body radiation and the formula: b  1 m0c2 hn  2 for the energy transport velocity. For low frequencies, p is always very large, photons are found always in numerous ensembles allied with the same phase wave; black body radiation follows RAYLEIGH’s Law, and the transport velocity goes to c as n V 0. This hypothesis undermines the simplicity of the concept of “photon”, but this simply can not be maintained and still reconcile electrodynamics with discontinuous photoelectric phenomena. Introducing f p  , it seems to me, reconciles photon population idiosyncrasies with classical wave notions. In any case, the true structure of radiant energy remains very mysterious.

De Broglie gives the goods

Originally posted by ThoughtForms

that's science drew, and an extension of my own discussion of elements of the universe vs. the energy you are trying to understand/manipulate. and theres nothing chaotic about it, we're just ignorant of its order. There is no such thing as 'truly random'...

A chaotic circuit for truly random number generation

Chaos inherently limits predictablity in science

Truly random number generators based on non-autonomous continuous-time chaos

Chaos again produces a true random number generator

In the present paper we discuss a new phenomenon: the fact that unperturbed physical systems can produce truly random dynamics. Of course, one of the applications of this phenomenon is random number generation.

Chaos-induced true randomness

Originally posted by ThoughtForms
reply to post by fulllotusqigong

 

I have no need to watch your video. I did not ask the question. I don't care to hear some strangers explanation that the sounds are hoaxes, I know first hand some are not. I have many friends who have now heard them too. when something is as loud as thunder, and 'comes towards you' like the source is of 'earthquake sized' dimensions, but the earth does not shake, it is hard to call that an auditory hallucination.

-TF

P.S) now if you want to talk about 'artificial' sounds being broadcast in such a way as to trick a large amount of people spread across a large distance into thinking they're hearing things in their immediate vicinity that are actually very far away, and that in of itself an auditory hallucination.. then asides from that being a completely different ballgame all together, you might be onto something. At this point we don't know. I do know that the sounds are real in that they have been heard and there's been legitimate encounters with it including my own.

edit on 27-2-2012 by ThoughtForms because: (no reason given)

edit on 27-2-2012 by ThoughtForms because: (no reason given)

Yeah it's not my video -- it's a video on youtube made by a computer electric engineering college student who analyzes the "strange sounds in the sky."

As I mentioned the "root" or fundamental frequency is not the "magic" frequency that people have clung onto -- whatever frequency that may be. haha.

Also the pattern of the "strange sound" is nonlinear noise after some of the octave harmonics are induced.

So as I posted in my reply this pattern is best fit by 1/f noise which is chaotic and very common for bizzare natural phenomenon.

Whether it has a paranormal nature or not probably depends on the person experiencing the sound -- whether the sound is from technology or not -- probably depends but it can also be chaotic.

The video in part 2 then proves that one of the main "strange sounds in the sky" recordings was then used for half a dozen other "strange sounds in the sky" recordings -- which means that there was one real recording that was copied and claimed to be from other locations as a hoax.

So he proves that "a lot" of the strange sounds in the sky recordings are from one previous recording and therefore a lot of them are hoaxes.

Does that mean all are hoaxe? Nope because the hoax was based on a real original recording. Does that mean there are no other real original recordings? Nope but probably not nearly as many as claimed since there are more hoaxes than real ones on youtube.

Too bad you've chosen the path of "willful ignorance." haha.

You have recommended for someone to do a frequency analysis of the strange sounds in the sky.

I posted a video of this frequency analysis of half a dozen strange sounds in the sky videos.

One of those videos was real and the rest were hoaxes. The one that was real did not have the "magical" frequency that people were looking for. haha. It did have nonlinear noise.

I think I explained this well in my original reply to the person asking about "strange sounds in the sky."

Again sorry it wasn't the answer you were looking for. haha.

I know you absolutely don't want to watch the frequency analysis video of the strange sounds in the sky -- which is hilarious considering you recommended that someone do a frequency analysis of the strange sounds in the sky. haha.

The frequency analysis was already done. The answer you were looking for was not found.

I'm sorry about this for you. Good luck going through your denial about this.

Originally posted by ThoughtForms
You keep jumping from the lego land of building blocks and quantum happenings, and relating that to music and qi gong. but the time-scale is different. the transfer rates are different. You cannot instantaneously think something into existence. it takes time and may not happen at all. on EVERY level the observer is many, your will not surpass others and probably wont. What applies to the smaller scale may not apply to the larger scale, and really, it bears very little influence on the larger scale as imposed by an individual.

Scientific American: Quantum mechanics is not just about teeny particles. It applies to things of all sizes: birds, plants, maybe even people By Vlatko Vedral

When this molecule absorbs visible light, the electrons get enough energy to separate and become susceptible to external influences, including the earth’s magnetic field. If the magnetic field is inclined, it affects the two electrons differently, creating an imbalance that changes the chemical reaction that the molecule undergoes. Chemical pathways in the eye translate this difference into neurological impulses, ultimately creating an image of the magnetic field in the bird’s brain.

According to calculations that my colleagues and I have done, quantum effects persist in a bird’s eye for around 100 microseconds—which, in this context, is a long time.

In a quantum world, a particle does not just have to take one path at a time; it can take all of them simultaneously. The electromagnetic fields within plant cells can cause some of these paths to cancel one another and others to reinforce mutually, thereby reducing the chance the electron will take a wasteful detour and increasing the chance it will be steered straight to the reaction center. The entanglement would last only a fraction of a second and would involve molecules that have no more than about 100,000 atoms. Do any instances of larger and more persistent entanglement exist in nature? We do not know, but the question is exciting enough to stimulate an emerging discipline: quantum biology

Originally posted by ThoughtForms
frequency is not wrong drew you are. look at the scillia mechanism.

Our results suggest that the three ultrasound-detecting species have converged on small-scale functional modifications of the basilar papilla (BP), the high-frequency hearing organ in the frog inner ear. These modifications include: 1. reduced BP chamber volume, 2. reduced tectorial membrane mass, 3. reduced hair bundle length, and 4. reduced hair cell soma length. While none of these factors on its own could account for the US sensitivity of the inner ears of these species, the combination of these factors appears to extend their hearing bandwidth, and facilitate high-frequency/ultrasound detection. These modifications are also seen in the ears of O. chloronota, suggesting that this species is a candidate for high-frequency hearing sensitivity. These data form the foundation for future functional work probing the physiological bases of ultrasound detection by a non-mammalian ear.

This is how ultrasound hearing works

So my model is based on ultrasound acoustic cavitations producing sonoluminescence and sonofusion.

Humans can hear ultrasound -- only are not aware of the sound -- it just sounds like the highest pitch overtone harmonic -- a ringing in the ear. But the ultrasound is perceived by humans and this induces high frequency electromagnetic fields that then ionize neurohormones -- allowing serotonin to bypass the blood brain barrier.

So practicing qigong relies on the piezoelectric ultrasound of collagen in the body -- creating a nonlinear resonance feedback.

ELF waves and ultrasound both have nonlinear feedback for alchemical resonance.

We proposed brain ultrasonic demodulation as the means of place-mapping ultrasound on the first few millimeters of the basilar membrane. We present modeling and psychoacoustic data in support of this theory.

In the case of the deaf, a low-frequency cortical site for ultrasound was observed [6]. In contrast, this suggests an apical cochlear site or other noncochlear acoustic site that is activated in the presence of severe deafness. The implication is that different sites on the inner ear’s basilar membrane are activated, depending only on the proportion of hair cells present. In 1954, Deatherage et al. [7] were the first to warn of the potential damage (highfrequency hearing loss and tinnitus) of listening to very intense, head-coupled ultrasound; however, their studies resulted in two key observations. The pitch of the ultrasound corresponded to the highest audio frequency measured audiometrically by air conduction and the same ultrasonic tone could give rise to different pitch perception in each ear (i.e., diplacusis), if there was a hearing difference between ears. Taken together, these findings suggest the absence of a specific place of ultrasonic frequency mapping on the cochlea but a dynamic mechanism that is a function of remaining hearing or hair cells and intensity of the ultrasonic stimulation.

The dynamic aspect of ultrasonic pitch suggests that the ear may not be directly stimulated but rather that an intermediary structure may be involved. Three lines of evidence suggest that the resonance of the brain is critical for an audible ultrasonic experience. Support for a brain ultrasound demodulation theory stems from spherical models of brain and psychoacoustic metrics of masking audio frequencies by ultrasonic noise and by matching the pitch of audible ultrasound with conventional air conduction sound.

O.K. so not only can humans hear ultrasound but it resonates the brain as a whole, as I referenced, Dr. Hammerof -- Stuart -- stating that quantum microtubules are activated by ultrasound for quantum consciousness.

If the ultrasonic frequency does not determine the perceived pitch but rather the resonance of the brain, how is the reported pitch discrimination in the ultrasonic range possible [3,5], or is it absent [24–26]? Note in Figure 1 that a change in the center frequency of the noise, even at a constant intensity (5 dB SL), results in a different frequency or place spread of activation. The change in the area activated and the subsequent neural coding likely contributed to crude detection of pitch change. Further, the multiple coupled resonances of the brain and skull can yield subtle intensity cues [27,28] but, in any event, changes of perhaps 10% of the frequency are required in the ultrasonic range to be detected as a pitch shift [3].

Originally posted by ThoughtForms

How does the airborne ultrasound get into the ear to create such polaropposite human effects? Surprisingly, ultrasound passes first through the eyes; thus, the eye becomes but another window into the inner ear.

Nonetheless, this sampling rate of 44.1 kHz introduces highfrequency distortions (i.e., quantizing granularity) detectable by some listeners, which could be eliminated by sampling at 96 kHz/24 bit. In effect, the conservative estimate of 20 kHz as the upper range of hearing has resulted in a too-slow digital sampling to support high fidelity without distortions. If frequencies higher than 20 kHz are audible or useful, clearly sampling at 96 kHz is a necessity for true high fidelity. The question can be asked another way: Does the ear run out of musicality at 20 kHz? Many instruments produce energy well beyond 20,000 Hz at high levels [10]; even the human voice is capable of ultrasonic output if sufficient vocal effort is mustered (personal observation, 1990). Further electroencephalographic and positron emission tomographic changes were documented when frequencies beyond 22 kHz were presented along with conventional audio frequencies [7,8] to human listeners. No ultrasonic route to the ear was proposed in these studies, but certainly possible is that the ultrasonic energy in music-and for that matter, industrial noise-could pass through the eye and be detected by the ear.

Musical airborne energy beyond 22 kHz has been shown to alter the electroencephalogram and evoke physiological activity in the brainstem and thalamus but only when ultrasonic musical frequencies are combined with the musical spectrum below 22 kHz. The effect is based on the combination of two coherent acoustic routes, one conventional and one solely ultrasonic [7,8]. Each signal stimulates a separate area on the basilar membrane that would be integrated into a whole as any conventional complex auditory pattern. A case is made here for a separate airborne ultrasonic input, but the final pathway is the same because ultrasound activates the auditory cortex in normal-hearing and deaf listeners. Clearly, the eye, with its ultrasonic passband of 25-60 kHz, could transmit energy from instruments with ultrasonic energy (e.g., cymbals) to the ear and would activate both the auditory thalamus and the other nuclei in the auditory pathway. Very-high-frequency recordings (6-21 kHz) have activated the thalamus and other regions in the brain [28] in patients who have high-frequency tinnitus; thus, the thalamus plays a role in high-frequency and ultrasonic hearing. Musical instruments that have high-frequency and ultrasonic components are, for the most part, percussive; thus, the high audio and ultrasonic spectra would complement conventional audio frequencies consistent with the findings that the full spectrum is a better activator of the auditory system than is the ultrasound alone [7,8]. Ultrasound may contribute to pitch perception by extending the spectrum upward in frequency and by enhancing temporal cues. A simple test of the eye window's role in concert music would be to assess music quality with and without goggles. Goggles, as used as a control in this study, eliminated the eye window for airborne ultrasound.

The frequency to which the neuron is most sensitive is the center frequency. Stimulation of high frequencies outside the frequency response has been shown to cause some neurons to fire. The stimulation in this case is in a form of AM that is a process in which one sound is multiplied by another. One sound is termed the carrier (C) and the other the modulator (M). The product of the multiplication is the carrier, the carrier plus the modulator (C + M), and the carrier minus the modulator (C-M). Simply put, three tones beyond the frequency range of some auditory cortical neuron will cause it to fire. AM stimulation may not be necessary to obtain this effect; it was merely the mode of stimulation in our study. Musical harmonic information is coded by place both on the basilar membrane and temporally in neural firing. Ultrasound might contribute to the musical harmonic structure but may just provide more high-frequency energy to emphasize the treble in such instruments as the cymbals, triangles, trumpets, violins, and oboes (see Fig. 5B).

Yeah so it's not just the inner ear cochlear basliar membrane cilia -- but also brain resonance demodulation via the eye.

Originally posted by ThoughtForms
So hence, I cannot understand how

Frequency is zero when time is infinite

makes sense.

-- that is the Law of Phase Harmony --

well I still don't get it whatever you want to call it, frequency can still be measured if time is infinite.

and it means a superliminal

what is superliminal

The term h m is measured in electron diffraction, but equating it to wavelength leads to an infinite phase velocity of the wave associated with an electron at rest. Indeed, for an electron at rest, we have frequency velocity = 0 , wavelength = infinity

O.K. you say this is impossible but it's not impossible it is due to quantum time-frequency uncertainty -- it's inherently uncertain by science but physically real

In fact, we may sum up the foundations of the quantum theory as the combination of the Planck- Einstein quantum hypothesis, and the de Broglie-Heisenberg uncertainty relations. Uncertainty is a fundamental property of the quantum theory.

reply to post by fulllotusqigong


There is also the testimony of Ralph Ring, who worked with Tesla protegé Otis T. Carr.

I remember hearing Ring say that he operated a craft with consciousness.

Originally posted by Mary Rose

Right - the De Broglie Law of Phase Harmony has been called a "pilot wave" as consciousness since it is superliminal -- but it's modeled by Planck's equation and Einstein's equation - so mainstream science does not consider this possible and instead assumes it has to be an electromagnetic wave.

The two are not mutually exclusive because as I've emphasized -- consciousness is the process of complementary opposites -- so like De Broglie said it's not energy but instead a signal or information but also it's a process of time and frequency as complementary opposites.

This goes back to the racemization issue and the Frank Close book I cited -- on the inherent asymmetry of reality.

These quantum gravity models rely on the key aspect of the noncommutative quantum logic: Peter Woit's book Not Even Wrong provides the best expose of theoretical physics and emphasizes how the “mirror-asymmetric nature” of the left-handed weak field has messed everything up.397

397 Peter Woit, Not Even Wrong: The failure of string theory and the search for unity in physical law (Basic Books, 2006), p. 154.

So there's no technological fix to reality -- quantum physics means that technology is inherently interactive with our consciousness and so the more we rely on technology the more we transform who we are as humans -- we become controlled by the Matrix -- by the machines taking over our consciousness.

As I stated before science is left-brain and right hand dominant while Nature is left-handed dominant and right-brain (quantum shamanic) dominant.

So the original humans -- the Bushmen culture for 90% of human history from 100,000 BCE to 10,000 BCE were right-brain dominant and worked in harmony with left-hand dominant ecology (carbon-based molecules).

The modern humans are a "vanishing mediator" to a machine culture that is right-handed (against ecology) and left-brain dominant -- so it's controlled by the "music logarithmic spiral" of symmetric mathematics that are secretly not symmetric.

Tesla was right-brain dominant as was Einstein. So Tesla relied on creating the mathematics later on after he visualized his inventions in working detail -- in motion -- designing them. Tesla also had paranormal powers so he was a hermit and a clean freak and this goes back to his brother being killed in a freak accident when Telsa was a child -- so Tesla took on the blame and went into an interior right-brain dominant Nature-oriented reality.

An idea I’ve always found appealing is that this spontaneous gauge symmetry breaking is somehow related to the other mysterious aspect of electroweak gauge symmetry: its chiral nature. SU(2) gauge fields couple only to left-handed spinors, not right-handed ones. In the standard view of the symmetries of nature, this is very weird. The SU(2) gauge symmetry is supposed to be a purely internal symmetry, having nothing to do with space-time symmetries, but left and righthanded spinors are distinguished purely by their behavior under a space-time symmetry, Lorentz symmetry. So SU(2) gauge symmetry is not only spontaneously broken, but also somehow knows about the subtle spin geometry of space-time. Surely there’s a connection here… So, this is my candidate for the Holy Grail of Physics, together with a guess as to which direction to go looking for it.398

398 Nigel Cook, “Quantum gravity and the mainstream misunderstanding of electroweak gauge theory,” Quantum
Field Theory

The error of Maxwell's mathematics due to his force-fitting his speed formula to Michael Faraday's 1846 paper “Thoughts on Ray Vibration”, in which Faraday thought that light was electromagnetic. He was right, but Maxwell got the maths wrong by taking a short cut assumption about what the speed represented, before he even knew the speed of electricity!!! The (1) numerical value and (2) invariance of the 1/(root of product of electric and magnetic constant) formula in Maxwell's derivation in its modernised form led to the unproven assertion that this is the speed of light, which is always invariant. In fact, the speed 1/(root of product of electric and magnetic constant) is actually the speed of the vector sum
of electron spin and perpendicular-to-spin propagation, not the formula for light.
Only the speed of the electron spin and propagation vector sum is invariant at
300,000 km/s. The speed of light is not invariant. So we must accept relativity
only as applying to matter not to light, hence the time-dilation of material clocks,
length contraction, mass increase, e=mc2...

431 Nigel Cook, “Quantum gravity and the mainstream misunderstanding of electroweak gauge theory,” Quantum
Field Theory and Nigel Cook, “Electromagnetics Theory and the Foundation of Physical Science,” The General
Science Journal.

Drew I read your responces, you showed that nature can easily make chaos and that we have better models to replicate that now so yes we can produce authentic randomness. I was under the impression we could only mimic it, that only nature knew the math, I'm assuming thats changed.

Also when you say 'going through extensively' it actually just means posting ex tagged giant paragraphs everywhere. I've researched complicated concepts before and always managed to present them in a clear concise and easy to understand manner, its not impossible.

You tried to talk about superliminality and pilot waves and I didn't get it, dejargon, I don't have all the time you spent intially learning this stuff to go learn it myself, thats where you come in buddy you post a thread on a site saying here everyone look at this amazing stuff I've discovered and completely fail to explain it to anyone, actually being a dick about most of it.

I just want to make good music. Thats my motivation, I don't know why you think I'm fixated with the fundamental tones of the 'strange sounds' other then that you're not paying attention to what I'm actually saying. I don't know what you're point is drew, what is the point of what your telling everyone...

the ultrasonic thing is cool, I didn't know that and I will start upsampling my mixes, I'll also keep using A=432hz from time to time because I believe that if it produces more audible harmonics then 440, then it would do so in the ultrasonic range too. Regarding that, frequency measures from force energy, through sound and light, up to gamma rays etc. Its just an arbitrary measurement system just like any other.

is that the point of this whole thread? you suggest a better system? or just that the current one isn't perfect? coz its pretty bloody good really and certainly does the job where our current understanding of music is.

anyway as I've determined that I can reach all my goals without your help I will be doing that. AGAIN I say good luck and farewell.

Peace,
-TF

Originally posted by fulllotusqigong
I know you absolutely don't want to watch the frequency analysis video of the strange sounds in the sky -- which is hilarious considering you recommended that someone do a frequency analysis of the strange sounds in the sky. haha.

I recommended that the person find out for themselves, you linked a youtube video. Thats the difference. Its not my question its theirs. I was saying it could have been answered better by you. and it could have been you are terrible at answering simple questions.

The frequency analysis was already done. The answer you were looking for was not found. I'm sorry about this for you. Good luck going through your denial about this.

drew, I don't care. I never did. I just think you suck at explaining things and that if anyone fails to get your theories its your own damned fault.

-TF

Originally posted by ThoughtForms

I recommended that the person find out for themselves, you linked a youtube video. Thats the difference. Its not my question its theirs. I was saying it could have been answered better by you. and it could have been you are terrible at answering simple questions.

Yeah someone already answered the question -- so I gave them the link to the answer. The video is done by an electrical engineer. If the person asking the question is an electrical engineer then they probably wouldn't need to watch the video. haha.

drew, I don't care. I never did. I just think you suck at explaining things and that if anyone fails to get your theories its your own damned fault.

-TF

edit on 28-2-2012 by ThoughtForms because: (no reason given)

Right -- I'm not giving a theory -- I'm promoting a practice for experiential knowledge as the gateway to consciousness. Anyone can do this practice - it's easy!!



So here's the practice once again:

1) Simple standing Tai-Chi exercises

2) The Small Universe meditation while sitting in a chair

3) the Emptiness or Self-Concentration meditation while in half or full lotus.

Pretty simple. No theory needed.

Now if a person is wondering why the above practice works then the answer is nonwestern music based on the 1-4-5 music intervals as complementary opposites resonating through all forms of energy.

That's very simple.

Does the practice work? Yep -- I've shown the Mayo Clinic and University of Minnesota research proving that "external qi" is real and it heals serious diseases.

So you

1) know how to do the practice.

2) Know it works.

The question remains why not practice it? The answer is this thread.

There's no need to know why -- if you know how and that the practice works.

Why is just extra explanation and so that's what this thread is about.

1) Science is not the answer.

So that takes a lot of unlearning. Why is science not the answer. Chaos theory and quantum physics inherently limits science. Chaos theory means no technology can predict a nonlinear system that goes random. Quantum physics means that there are inherent limits to the origins of measurement -- there's a technological limit that creates uncertainty.

2) Consciousness is the answer.

What is consciousness -- it is the process of complementary opposites as natural resonance that goes into the Emptiness. What does this mean -- it means the source of sound is from listening and this process of listening is infinite as time-frequency uncertainty. It is the inherent asymmetry to number. Western science is based on symmetry. Nonwestern music is based on noncommutative logic.

So the number 1 is male and the number 2 is female. The Perfect Fifth ratio as 2:3 resonates infinitely due to the complementary opposite and noncommutative relation to 3:4, the Perfect Fourth. This means mathematically the Perfect Fifth will never ever line up with the Octave.

So that is the Mystery of the Octave as the gateway to Consciousness.

It means the source of sound is consciousness. It is not measured by Western science.

3) This has been covered up as a conspiracy. The conspiracy can be revealed at the extreme edges of science -- the origins of science in Archytas and Plato and the latest research in science in quantum chaos and quantum relativity and sonofusion.

This conspiratorial cover-up means mind control that also means the transformation of Earth into a machine-controlled reality with the mass sacrifice of humans and the destruction of ecology.

What remains in this conspiracy? Consciousness only -- that's why conspiracy secretly means "spiral unity."

So as the Universe is accelerating in spatial expansion with a slowing down of time there is as the complementary opposite an acceleration of spatial contraction on Earth with a speeding up of time on Earth.

4) Reality is holographic due to the secret of complementary opposites.

If we practice natural resonance as the source of sound as consciousness then we can go the opposite way of the conspiratorial coverup -- we can slow down time on Earth to live longer and we can speed up time in the Universe -- we can expand our spatial awareness on Earth and contract the spatial distance of the Universe.

Originally posted by ThoughtForms
I just want to make good music. Thats my motivation, I don't know why you think I'm fixated with the fundamental tones of the 'strange sounds' other then that you're not paying attention to what I'm actually saying.

If you want to make good music I already have recommended the music examples from the blog book Sounding the Depths. All those examples from that book are examples of "good music" that are based on the secret of this thread. How to Make Good Music based on complementary opposites of the 1-4-5 nonwestern music intervals -- Sounding the Depths blogbook with audio examples

Regarding that, frequency measures from force energy, through sound and light, up to gamma rays etc. Its just an arbitrary measurement system just like any other.

It's not an arbitrary measurement -- it is by definition not measurable. Consciousness can not be measured but can be logically inferred. The secret of sound is that it resonates to consciousness through nonwestern music intervals.

is that the point of this whole thread? you suggest a better system? or just that the current one isn't perfect? coz its pretty bloody good really and certainly does the job where our current understanding of music is.

I am not promoting a system -- consciousness is non-local which means we exist within it. There's no escape. It's the truth of reality. We can choose to resonate with it but it can only be logically inferred. We can't see it. It's not thoughts, nor is it words and we can't measure it so it's not a system.

We can listen to consciousness as the resonance of sound through noncommutative or complementary opposite number. The source of sound is consciousness that is formless and this process of listening to the source of sound through complementary opposites then transforms our body and mind into spirit reality.

We can then stop the left-brain dominant mind control that cuts us off from the whole body perception creating spirit reality in harmony with ecology and the universal love energy -- our natural state of humanity is euphoria and bliss and this is the secret of nonwestern sound.

Originally posted by ThoughtForms

the ultrasonic thing is cool, I didn't know that and I will start upsampling my mixes, I'll also keep using A=432hz from time to time because I believe that if it produces more audible harmonics then 440, then it would do so in the

Typical for Baroque is a low tuning, A = 415-420Hz, which is about one semitone below 440, but higher seemed to have happened as well. However, the rest of the octave was tuned differently as well.

Historically, from the Baroque to the Romantic period there was a general tendency to keep pushing A=415 (Baroque average) higher and higher, even up to about 452 Hz (in the late Romantic Vienna Philharmonic, for example) because the musicians discovered that the higher tunings made the instruments sound more brilliant overall, which enhanced their acoustics in live performances.

Of course, like every other "standard" in existence, everyone has proceeded to disregard it and to set their own fundamental, as Theo points out, anywhere from 430 Hz to 445 Hz today, for the most part, although there are significant deviations even now. Many groups today, do, however, use A=415 when performing Baroque pieces. It does not really matter today, in live performances, where the tuning frequency is set, as long as it is used consistently among an organization or group of performers and agreed upon ahead of time.

So 432 tuning is nothing special - it's just one other tuning in the Western music system

An ideal tuning would be one in which the i,j entry only depends on |i-j|—each entry is equal to an ideal interval. In the ideal interval matrix, values on the diagonals are constant and equal to the ideal ratio. The ideal interval matrix is equivalent to the interval matrix only in ET [Equal Temperament -- using logarithms]. Any unequal interval propagates itself through the matrix, causing irregularity.

So this thread is about the irregularities -- not a symmetric measurement system

His history and theory are admirably accurate, and he gives perhaps the simplest exposition I’ve seen of the 18th-century theory of dividing the octave into 55 parts, using a minor half-step of four units (C to C#) and a major half-step of five units (C to Db). We know for a fact that’s the intonation Mozart taught, folks, and as Duffin adds: Are modern practices better than what Mozart had in mind? I don’t think so, and I don’t think most musicians would deliberately go against the expectations of a composer like Mozart if they knew what those expectations were. And even though the sound of lower sharps and higher flats is likely to be unfamiliar to many musicians, I think Mozart’s endorsement makes it worth trying… and trying very seriously. [Ellipsis in the original]

I am perfectly aware that what I am suggesting is a radical idea for musicians and that it is likely to be met with reluctance, resistance, and even scorn in some quarters. Some musicians will be convinced by my arguments but may still view unequal tuning as a Pandora’s box to be opened carefully or not at all; others will scoff at the long historical pedigree of extended meantone as irrelevant; still others will find both the harmonic and melodic intervals strangeand “out of tune.” At least that’s how it may seem to some the first time they hear it or try it. But my experience has been that an hour or so of experimenting over two or three sessions is all that’s necessary to help musicians begin, at least, to appreciate what non-ET tuning has to offer from a musical point of view…. [T]he testimonials of Bach and Mozart have to count for something. What makes it worth trying is that it makes the music sound better. And remember, I’m not saying that harmonic intonation should replace ET entirely and substitute its own tyranny; only that ET is not necessarily the best temperament for every single musical situation….

How Equal Temperament Ruined Harmony (and Why You Should Care) (Norton). It’s by Ross W. Duffin

I've been reading the blog Secrets in Plain Sight, and a passage made me think of this thread for some reason:

I had always associated synchronicity with Carl Jung but recently rereading Lama Anagarika Govinda’s The Inner Structure of the I Ching I was reminded that as a mode of thinking it is profoundly Chinese. Govinda writes: “All our reasoning is based on the law of cause and effect operating as a sequence. The Chinese do not reason so much along this horizontal line from past, through present to future; they reason perpendicularly, from what is in one place now to what is in another place now. In other words, they do not ask why, or from what past causes, a certain set of things is happening now; they ask, ‘What is the meaning of these things happening at this moment?’ The word Tao is the answer to this question. The present situation within and around oneself is Tao, for the present moment is life. Our memory of the past is contained in it as well as the potentiality for the future.”

Is there a relationship?

reply to post by Mary Rose


That blogpost on the Tao and Greek mathematics -- it makes the most common mistake in the New Age scene which is confusing three types of philosophy. The Greek Miracle is based on irrational magnitude through proof by contradiction -- this created the Golden Ratio. There is no Golden Ratio in Egyptian mathematics. So before Greek mathematics the math is "divide and average" mathematics. This is the early stages of Freemasonry -- the attempt to "square the circle." Those earlier civilizations are based on the Solar Dynasties -- with plow-based farming and using geometry in an attempt to "contain infinity." So the precession of the equinox as Platonism -- this is based on a Solar religion of "divide and average" math.

The I Ching is built on yin and yang so it does not attempt to contain infinity -- it is an open process of complementary opposite resonance. Qigong master Chunyi Lin said the only way to do a proper I Ching reading is to have the third eye fully open and this is a very rare ability. Taoist master Ni, Hua-Ching details how there's a lot of "folk Taoism" based on superstition without any real abilities in meditation.

So we need to be careful of any attempts to equate the I Ching with a Western math system that is either "divide and average" or using irrational magnitude.

As I've stated there are a plethora of supposed "secret" music harmonic systems but none of them question the "divide and average" or commutative mathematics which are still using Freemasonry based on mass ritual sacrifice.

Plato and the supposed secret 432 hertz connection to the precession of the equinox is a Freemason scam because Plato was promoting that each citizen should compromise themselves for the good of the State Imperialism -- using mass ritual sacrifice.

This is the same as the Brahmin priest caste system and also the Inca Solar priests and even the Mayan Solar priest pyramid system.

So the original pyramid power is also the highest level of Freemasonry in France -- to sit in full lotus and to open the third eye but this is also why the cap stone is not placed on the top of the Pyramid. Because infinity can not be contained.

Consciousness is not Emptiness (Chaos) -- because of the complementary opposites. We each have an I-thought -- a sense of I. So that is the number One that is not a number. The I-thought does not have a signifier and signified relationship in linguistics.

Dan Zahavi writes on this in phenomological philosophy -- the source of the I-thought is never ending and so the capstone of the pyramid can never be finished -- consciousness of the I-thought eternally goes into the Emptiness as Nuit -- the Egyptian Cosmic Mother Goddess of nothingness. Apeiron in Ancient Greece.

The Western esoteric New Age scene is constantly being bombarded with Freemason CIA propaganda disguised as "liberation" and "freedom." This is because there are no real yoga masters in the West as it takes a lot of intensive training through the lineage of other real masters. Since yoga is not a culture of the West this lineage was lost.

This new focus on music as a justification for cold calculating reason and empire is also the point of Professor Michael Hudson’s essay, “Music as an Analogy for Economic Order in Classical Antiquity” in Jürgen Backhaus (ed.), Karl Bücher. Theory, History, Anthropology, Non-Market Economies (Marburg:Metropolis Verlag, 2000): pp. 113-35: Pythagoras became the patron saint of the most anti-democratic clubs. They used the principles of musical harmony as a patina of pseudo-science to give intellectual legitimacy to a movement whose worldly consequences were anything but harmonious. The Pythagorean clubs became a network of civic cults rising above the local sphere to which most clubs related. There seems to have been some connection with the Delphi temple (the name Pythagoras means “voice of Pythia,” the snake-goddess of Delphi and its oracle). They have been likened to the Free Masons, in that they served as a kind of Council of Foreign Relations or New World Order…. Archytas developed the musical scale into a political metaphor for the scales of justice. What gave music this imagery of social balance and just proportion was the ability of its mathematics of harmonic (“geometric”) proportions to serve as an analogy for how inequities of wealth and status rendered truly superior men equal in proportion to their virtue — which tended to reflect their wealth. By this circular logic the wealthy were enabled to rationalize their hereditary dominance over the rest of the population.

So we have been deeply brainwashed. The only way to find out the true meaning of the I Ching is to seek out a real qigong master who does the shen or laser holographic third eye transmission. Effie P. Chow; Wang, Liping; Master Zhang; Chunyi Lin -- very few are for the public.

Originally posted by 00bil
reply to post by fulllotusqigong

 

Thanks for your post - sadly I'm in work and the prooxy server automatically blocks anything youtube (although seems to consider ATS to be fine!) so I couldn't get access to your link!

O.K. to build on your tritone explanation -- let's return to the Tritone Paradox and paradoxes of pitch perception.

Paradoxes of Pitch: Certain series of tones appear to ascend or descend infinitely in pitch by Diana Deustch

This is an excellent article on the earlier discussion of the Tritone and Semitone Paradox which is revealed as determined by the direction of the "circle of fifths" tone circle. So if you create the tone circle of fifths and then play notes that are across from each other on the circle and then reverse the direction then the perception of ascending or descending in frequency becomes ambiguous. Jean-Clade Risset is given as an example.



So as Diana Deutsch explains -- she realized that the visual clock face presented a paradox of absolute pitch that solved the Tritone Paradox. In other words if the Tritone is going clockwise on the clock face say C to F# then it is perceived as descending but it if is going "up" the clock as in F# to C then the tritone is perceived as going up in frequency -- even though the actual frequency is reversed.

So then the perception of the "Circle of Fifths" pitch will be inverted with a transposition of the key. What had previously been perceived as an ascending frequency was now considered a descending frequency.

Debussy's Nocturnes is given as an example of a composition based on these pitch paradoxes:



So then Deutsch notes that the perception of the pitch class was linked to the dialect of the language spoken with a consistent difference between England and California -- relating to the Tritone Paradox. Deustch considers this based on emotional syntax of the language creating a perception bias and says it's also related to the octave range of the voice and also which hand the person is -- left or right handed.

So clearly "frequency" is not an evenly divided octave experience -- the change in amplitude and phase also changes the determination of frequency -- and the circle of fifths is not "closed." In the natural harmonics the circle of fifths is an infinite spiral of fifths.

Thus, instead of a neverending "line" or "spiral" of fifths, a fixed pitch instrument would use a truncated version - the "circle of fifths", perhaps by tuning six fifths up and five fifths down (creating C G D A E B F# forwards, and C F Bb Eb Ab Db backwards). With this arrangement, the interval between F# and Db is known as the 'wolf' note or interval, being slightly flatter than a true fifth (1.4798, or 678.49 cents wide). Suffice to say that other nearby intervals (such as Ab to B in this arrangement) also feel the knock-on effect. The 'better' intervals would be the ones which don't travel so far from the 'flat side' to the 'sharp side'. With non-fixed pitch instruments however, or dynamic 3-limit just intonation, the effect is lessened somewhat, since a true spiral of fifths can be obtained, allowing double flats and sharps if needed.

Then what of the fifth and fourth, are they complementary of each other? The fifth I submit as the major interval and the fourth as the minor interval in an original archetypal type sense. Their different qualities of “archetypal contraction and expansion” are subtle but clear. The perfect fifth is expansive and stable whereas the perfect fourth is contracting and unstable.

The prime-octave Polarity.

A tone when experienced as a prime will unfold a gravitational pull in an “inward central” direction. A tone embodying the power of the octave will unfold a levitational pull from “the periphery” which we can feel to be an expansive force. And yet by virtue of an octave’s ability of becoming a prime (and vice versa), we can have the feeling of expanding downward towards the prime and indeed contracting upward towards the octave. Thus polarity and paradox are married in this relationship of two different experiences, which are often mistaken as being synonymous! The fundamental and its first overtone, the octave, embody the closest relationship two pitches can have to one another. This fact is perhaps the reason for why the difference between the two is often overlooked.

So from the perspective is listening to music we have the truth of the infinite spiral of fifths -- not a "closed" circle of fifths. The octave is not just a doubling and the commutative property is wrong.

reply to post by fulllotusqigong


I will reply to your replies to my posts but first I wanted to ask about this one...

you say about egyptian-mason squaring the circle. Suggesting it bypassed Greek knowledge? they didn't share information through history?

theres stories of the "assasins" (asia) and the "templars" acutally exchanging secrets at one point and theories of how the covenant of the ark could have been used to build some of the crazy churchs the templars threw up at the time....

you mention that in greece the 432hz plato connection was a mason conspiracy against the public to get them to sacrifice themselves... what literally kill themselves because they used the 432hz tuning system?

that seems absurd Drew, mozart used it, most egyptian instruments found are said to have used it, and a few others around the place, ancient people used this tuning - and yes there were many others used too and I agree that you can have different tunings for different purposes (i read some of what u linked so far) and in fact wish to compose an album of 9 songs with tunings appropriate for the planets in our solar system, based on their resonance or dimensions...(or maybe both). I listened to the classical composers microtonal songs he had available free mp3, can't say I enjoyed it, probably the best microtonal thing I ever heard was this its a beautiful instrument, I think you'll like this video -

Back to your post tho, you said infinity cannot be contained - are you specifically talking about how (apparently) everything is exponential and nothing can be measured in equal steps, be that geometric designs or musical ones.... is that correct??

because the difference in mason 'math' vs. I-ching and chinese 'math' would surely affect the end results of their architecture projects and buildings. We have mysteriously built mason churchs and temples that should be fairly impossible to have built, and likewise beautiful chinese buildings etc that I don't know the details of but at the least are still standing strong.

if their math was flawed, trying to contain infinity, and then their geometric calculations and architectural designs were also flawed, how could they have built anything that would last until today? and how would *replacing* the capstone that *apparently* used to be there, would cause any problems? I mean its just a building...

I don't get it.

-TF