Caterpiller Workers - Time to call in the Army

Originally posted by DrunkNinja
reply to post by Radekus

 

You must have missed the part of the chart that states "All numbers in thousands" You also took the numbers from 2008, and not 2011, not that it matters.

2011 operating income 7,153,000. Add 3 zeros as all numbers in thousands, and you get $7,153,000,000, that's 7 billion. Before you accuse someone of playing with the numbers learn to read what you cite as evidence against them.

Ah, yes, I have missed that in thousands, sorry about that.
This is why I posted a link to my data after all...

Where do you see the date being 2008?

I got " PERIOD ENDING 12/2011 "

Total Net Income 4,928,000 (so add those zeroes and you get)

4,928,000,000

almost 5 billion, impressive.

By the way, why are you looking at operating income?

reply to post by Radekus


Definition of 'Operating Income'

The amount of profit realized from a business's operations after taking out operating expenses - such as cost of goods sold (COGS) or wages - and depreciation. Operating income takes the gross income (revenue minus COGS) and subtracts other operating expenses and then removes depreciation. These operating expenses are costs which are incurred from operating activities and include things such as office supplies and heat and power. Operating Income is typically a synonym for earnings before interest and taxes (EBIT) and is also commonly referred to as "operating profit" or "recurring profit".

reply to post by ballisticmousse


As much as I dislike Unionists, Caterpillar's behavior does not conform to the triple bottom line.
What ever happened to society? If what LeBombDiggity says is true, then there is no
doubt that all Caterpillar cares for is money, and they don't mind scamming governments
and their employees to get it.

reply to post by ballisticmousse


I'm shocked to see these comments from a Canadian.

You should be ashamed of yourself making such comments. If you think that organized workers are scum at the bottom of the barrel, you should see the owners and executives of these companies. They make a lot more for doing a lot less.

Who's the real scum here? It's not the organized workers!

Originally posted by Radekus
reply to post by ballisticmousse
If what LeBombDiggity says is true, then there is no
doubt that all Caterpillar cares for is money, and they don't mind scamming governments
and their employees to get it.

There is an old saying, "You can't scam an honest man".

If Governments weren't strung up with socialist scams and handouts and workers weren't constantly thinking that they were "entitled" to be on the gravytrain for life, none of this would happen. Sure, the company might have slashed wages, but then people would have left to work elsewhere forcing wages back up again.

I had a friend who worked at Safeways in the UK in the 1980's. They tried to scam their staff by laying off all their managers and rehiring them at a lower wage. When they went to rehire they found that they could not rehire enough managers and that most of the really good ones had taken the opportunity to jump shiop to higher paid jobs with their competitors, taking with them valuable info about their products and margins. Result? after being hammered by their competitors, six months later they were having to pay thier managers MORE than they did in the first place in order to attract the m back again.

Originally posted by The Sword
reply to post by ballisticmousse
I'm shocked to see these comments from a Canadian.

I am NOT Canadian. I am better than that. I am British and merely live here.

Originally posted by The Sword
You should be ashamed of yourself making such comments.

It's a sad world where we are supposed to be ashamed of the truth and have pride in Canadian style lies.

Originally posted by The Sword
If you think that organized workers are scum at the bottom of the barrel, you should see the owners and executives of these companies. They make a lot more for doing a lot less.

How can they be doing a lot less when the CAW folk can't even be bothered to turn up for work?

Originally posted by ballisticmousse
How can they be doing a lot less when the CAW folk can't even be bothered to turn up for work?

Please provide a source to support this claim.

I am NOT Canadian. I am better than that. I am British and merely live here.

Ignorant!

reply to post by ballisticmousse


Despite your nationality, your comments were mean-spirited and called for harm to these workers because they had the gall to skip work.

Digest that for a moment.

reply to post by DrunkNinja


So you don't take into account:
- depreciation expense
- Interest expense
- income taxes

Net income is what the company has at the end to play with,
a percentage is given to shareholders, a percentage is kept known as retained earnings.

As was mentioned by fenceSitter,
The CEO's pay is deducted in the operation phase,
albeit, do keep in mind that the CEO, along with
other upper management, also has shares.

Hence, upper management gets a piece of the money given out to shareholders.

What we get as information online regarding upper management income may be an understatement.

Originally posted by danwolf
reply to post by Wrabbit2000

 

Yes you are absolutely right... 8 billion dollars in unprecedented profits for Caterpillar this year is bordering on bankruptcy... We should all feel sorry for the poor suffering corporation and offer our services free to help them get up and running more profitably.... oh wait... thats what they insisted we do..

Welcome to Corporate Canada: with unlimited corporate welfare and where the peons are kept in their place.

www.lfpress.com...

Probably Caterpillar CEO James W Owens needs help making his house payment as his 4.3 million a year is barely sufficient.

www.forbes.com...

edit on 7-2-2012 by danwolf because: (no reason given)

Well, you see, it's like this. Profits or no profits, there is a simple fact the Unions would give the world twice over to help people forget. The United States was once the leading production nation in the world. Coming out of World War II especially, no one had more or did more. Period. Now Unions haven't ruined that for us...but they've damn sure contributed in major ways. The Car companies were broken almost entirely by the Union benefits and long term Union retirement packages simply adding up to more than GM, Chrysler or the others literally made.

I'd hope Canada stops..and puts an end to this. It's what has helped take the U.S. from number one producer to #1 consumer and that change is NOT a happy one. We're now the debtor to China and they own us. Don't be us.

Originally posted by fenceSitter

Originally posted by ballisticmousse
How can they be doing a lot less when the CAW folk can't even be bothered to turn up for work?

Please provide a source to support this claim.

THe sources are too numerous to quote. Here;'s just one confirming the CAW called a strike, that;'s right, they actually decided not to borther to turn up to work, even knowing that their jobs were in danger - one of the most supreme cases of bone idleness that I have ever encountered.

www.imfmetal.org...

reply to post by ballisticmousse


This is why you don't screw around with management

Workers can be replaced, managers... not so much.

Doesn't mean a company can't treat its employees with respect.
Granted, Unions do pose a problem, they have no care about
the goals and aspirations a company may have, they prefer hoarding as much
money as possible, they're a scam themselves to the workers they supposedly represent.
But do keep in mind, people reciprocate how they feel.
If people support a Union, then there is obviously something wrong with the company,
maybe the company doesn't put an emphasis on the most important stakeholder there is,
in other words, the worker?

It would be futile for me to discuss this topic without understanding the culture of the company,
and the history behind its actions. The only way to know for sure is to speak to both workers and management.

Originally posted by The Sword
reply to post by ballisticmousse

 

these workers because they had the gall to skip work.

If they are skipping work, they are NOT WORKERS, by definition. And now they want to just go in, openly burgularise and loot the factory and grab the assets of Caterpiller because they finally got kicked off the gravy train and can't live on Easy Street any more.

reply to post by ballisticmousse


I wonder how much it would cost to buy out the factory,
and if government would willingly subsidize that endeavor,
in loans if need be. See if the socialist government really cares about it's people

Originally posted by ballisticmousse

Originally posted by fenceSitter

Originally posted by ballisticmousse
How can they be doing a lot less when the CAW folk can't even be bothered to turn up for work?

Please provide a source to support this claim.

THe sources are too numerous to quote. Here;'s just one confirming the CAW called a strike, that;'s right, they actually decided not to borther to turn up to work, even knowing that their jobs were in danger - one of the most supreme cases of bone idleness that I have ever encountered.

www.imfmetal.org...

I call that source and raise you one.

Caterpillar sets new pay terms; CAW not striking

On a website dedicated to negotiations, Electro-Motive Canada said CAW workers commenced a strike, but a CAW official told Reuters that was untrue.

"We're not on strike," Bob Orr, the official, said in a telephone interview on Sunday. "We're asking our workers to report for duty on the next shift (and) we're asking the company to return to the bargaining table."

Maybe you have been had by corporate propaganda?

Originally posted by Radekus
reply to post by ballisticmousse

 

I wonder how much it would cost to buy out the factory,
and if government would willingly subsidize that endeavor,
in loans if need be. See if the socialist government really cares about it's people

Not a nickel. The workforce is riddled with socialist trouble-making thugs.. It's never going to be viable again. once socialism has got into the mind its like a brain cancer, there is very little that can be done. The man/woman infected is pretty much useless for any form of paid employment again.

Irony is that the best thing to do is to bring in Caterpiller bulldozers and flatten the site.

Originally posted by ballisticmousse


The Canadian Army should be immediately brought in and blow the heads off any of the lazy, greedy, theiving #s who try to get over the fence.

Should throw you in there as well for good measure.

Originally posted by fenceSitter

Originally posted by ballisticmousse

Originally posted by fenceSitter

Originally posted by ballisticmousse
How can they be doing a lot less when the CAW folk can't even be bothered to turn up for work?

Please provide a source to support this claim.

THe sources are too numerous to quote. Here;'s just one confirming the CAW called a strike, that;'s right, they actually decided not to borther to turn up to work, even knowing that their jobs were in danger - one of the most supreme cases of bone idleness that I have ever encountered.

www.imfmetal.org...

I call that source and raise you one.

Caterpillar sets new pay terms; CAW not striking

On a website dedicated to negotiations, Electro-Motive Canada said CAW workers commenced a strike, but a CAW official told Reuters that was untrue.

"We're not on strike," Bob Orr, the official, said in a telephone interview on Sunday. "We're asking our workers to report for duty on the next shift (and) we're asking the company to return to the bargaining table."

Maybe you have been had by corporate propaganda?

EXACTLY AS I SAID. In a place filled with unemployment, these CAW folk were actually offered good jobs for a good pay, but turned it down. Too lazy and proud to work as they are primadonnas who think that they are entitled to be on the gravytrain for life, whilst the Caterpiller managers have turned up to work every day and have to struggle with all the pain and misery that the CAW socialist scum cause. Boy, do the managers earn the paultry money they get for having to handle these CAW idiots.

Originally posted by ballisticmousse

Originally posted by The Sword
reply to post by ballisticmousse
I'm shocked to see these comments from a Canadian.

I am NOT Canadian. I am better than that. I am British and merely live here.

OK, I think I see the problem here. Just don't let the door smack you on the butt on the way out, eh?

Wow, OP... you're so ill-informed on this entire story it's not even funny.

Caterpillar is one of the wealthiest corporations worldwide with record net profits year after year.

The company is well known for how they buy up and/or merge with a smaller company, and once the documents are signed, they step in and demand massive pay cuts, slashes to benefits, and removal of pension plans to all of the employees. They've pulled this crap all across Europe and have put thousands upon thousands of people onto the street.

There's a reason why Caterpillar is in the top 200 of the wealthiest companies in the world.



Back story of what happened with this particular situation:

After the merger, a new employee collective agreement had to come back onto the bargaining table. The company demanded not only a 50% pay cut to all wages, they also demanded a huge slash to their health benefits plan, and a complete wipeout of their pension plan with absolutely no room allowed for negotiations, it was either "agree to our demands or we shut it down".

So we're talking about an employee going from $30/hour down to $15/hour, barely any medical coverage, and a total annihilation of their pension plan. Another words, they would be earning the same wage as an unskilled labourer working at Tim Horton's with no future of retirement pension, no nothing.

The union demanded that Caterpillar at least be willing to negotiate. The company said "screw you", and locked out the employees the next day.

Understand the difference between a Lockout and a Layoff:
A layoff allows the employees to collect EI. A lockout freezes the employee as "still employed by the company" and therefore cannot collect EI. The only pay they're able to receive then is paid to them by the union called "lockout pay" of around $100 - $150 per week.

After several months of these people being locked out, the company finally decided to officially shut it down and handed everyone their layoff papers. It's not until this point that the employees could finally apply for unemployment insurance.

I am no lover of unions myself, in fact I think unions should have gone by the wayside with the dinosaur years ago. However, this particular situation with Caterpillar was a dirty underhanded thing to do... to say the least.

This, my friend, IS a classic case of corporate greed to the 'enth' degree, and NOT one where the union was being ridiculously demanding (which is usually the case).

You've got this particular story completely backwards.